Hitler quote (UNCLASSIFIED)

ronbutters at AOL.COM ronbutters at AOL.COM
Thu Sep 22 03:11:00 UTC 2011

Yeah, and how long have we be hearing that Stalin was a Democrat? What is the "class warfare" slur but an absurd attempt to tie O'Bama et al. to Marxist-Leninist ideology?

Of course, purely political zingers are perhaps a bit outside the mission statement of ADS-L. Not that relevance to linguistic issues is of concern to a large portion of the postings here.

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 21, 2011, at 4:23 PM, "David A. Daniel" <dad at POKERWIZ.COM> wrote:

> Hear, hear. What he said.
> --
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> Beyond the scope--I can see that. Beneath the dignity? Not really. Note tha=
> t
> DAD did not refer to Republicans as Nazis--he said Hitler was a Republican.
> Perhaps it's subtle, but there IS a difference. Similarly, identifying
> someone's propaganda tactics as resembling those of Goebbels does not imply
> that there is an identification of the respective persons. Saying someone
> has a "Hitlerian appeal" is not saying that someone is Hitler--in fact, thi=
> s
> does not compare the ideologies in the slightest. The first time I saw a
> reference to "Hitlerian appeal" in the news was when a NH newspaper
> described Gary Hart's campaign. It was not meant to be a term of
> derision--but it did point out that Hart supporters were extremely devoted
> without really knowing why. When asked to describe what Hart stood for, mos=
> t
> floundered... or is it "foundered"?
> Interestingly, as a non-native speaker, for a long time I've been wondering
> if there is a difference between founder and flounder, as well as forms and
> derivatives. I've mostly used "flounder", considering "founder" to be
> /bookish/.  It's not an eggcorn--at least, not in at least 400 years, if yo=
> u
> believe the OED. But what is described there as foundering or floundering I
> would describe as thrashing [about]. When I hear flounder, I am not thinkin=
> g
> about a "violent stumble", but rather being lost, hesitant, obstructed in
> one's goals by own inability, ineptitude or indecision, progressing clumsil=
> y
> or not at all, failing to reach a goal and wandering aimlessly instead.
> Whatever it is, it does not sound "violent" to me. Is that a question of
> degree or there a more fundamental (etymological pun intended) difference.
> Macmillan D has more basic definitions that point that my understanding of
> f(l)oundering may be off:
> =E2=96=B8 verb:  stumble and nearly fall ("The horses foundered")
>> =E2=96=B8 verb:  sink below the surface
>> =E2=96=B8 verb:  fail utterly; collapse ("The project foundered")
>> =E2=96=B8 verb:  break down, literally or metaphorically
> AHD is similar:
> *  To sink below the surface of the water: The ship struck a reef and
>> foundered.
>> *  To cave in; sink: The platform swayed and then foundered.
>> *  To fail utterly; collapse: a marriage that soon foundered.
>> *  To stumble, especially to stumble and go lame. Used of horses.
>> *  To become ill from overeating. Used of livestock.
>> *  To be afflicted with laminitis. Used of horses.
> MWOLD is much more concise:
> : to become disabled; especially : to go lame
>> : to give way : collapse
> Going in reverse on "flounder":
> : to struggle to move or obtain footing : thrash about wildly
>> : to proceed or act clumsily or ineffectually
> So far, it looks like my personal usage fits "flounder" exactly and
> "founder" not at all!
> AHD:
> *  To make clumsy attempts to move or regain one's balance.
>> *  To move or act clumsily and in confusion. See Synonyms at blunder. See
>> Usage Note at founder1.
>> Probably alteration of founder1
>> Usage Note:
>> The verbs founder and flounder are often confused. Founder comes from a
>> Latin word meaning "bottom" (as in foundation) and originally referred to
>> knocking enemies down; it is now also used to mean "to fail utterly,
>> collapse." Flounder means "to move clumsily, thrash about," and hence "to
>> proceed in confusion." If John is foundering in Chemistry 1, he had bette=
> r
>> drop the course; if he is floundering, he may yet pull through.
> And Macmillan:
> =E2=96=B8 verb:  to feel confused and not know what to say or do next
>> Maureen floundered, trying to think of a response.
>> =E2=96=B8 verb:  to move with great difficulty and in an uncontrolled way
>> The horses were floundering in the deep snow.
>> =E2=96=B8 verb:  to experience difficulties and be likely to fail
>> The country=E2=80=99s economy is floundering and the future is uncertain.
> I don't see the OED making quite as radical a distinction. But that's not
> too surprising as the latest quotation between the two is from 1893.
> VS-)
> On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 3:10 PM, Mullins, Bill AMRDEC <
> Bill.Mullins at us.army.mil> wrote:
>> One doesn't have to be a Republican (and I'm not) to find DAD's comment
>> to be beneath the dignity of this list.
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: American Dialect Society [mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On
>> Behalf Of
>>> David A. Daniel
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2011 10:56 AM
>>> Subject: Re: Hitler quote
>>> -
>>> Hmph. Hitler was a Republican? Not a surprise.
>>> DAD
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