1947 citing in Archie Comic of "butthole." What did it mean? (UNCLASSIFIED)

Jonathan Lighter wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM
Tue May 8 23:05:18 UTC 2012


Personally, I'm throwing "dead-end" out of court.  Nothing Archie goes on
to say supports the contention that he thinks his job is long-term and
without the chance of promotion. Nor could it "get" that way "sometimes."

It's just plain boring.

JL


On Tue, May 8, 2012 at 6:21 PM, Baker, John <JBAKER at stradley.com> wrote:

> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       "Baker, John" <JBAKER at STRADLEY.COM>
> Subject:      Re: 1947 citing in Archie Comic of "butthole." What did it
> mean?
>              (UNCLASSIFIED)
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Actually, my view is that Bob Montana most likely intentionally wrote
> "butthole," having in mind some innocuous meaning that is opaque to us.  I
> meant that, if there were vandalism, it would have been by his letterer;
> vandalism at the syndicate is unlikely, and vandalism at the newspapers
> themselves has been ruled out.
>
>
> John Baker
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: American Dialect Society [mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf
> Of Victor Steinbok
> Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 5:50 PM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> Subject: Re: 1947 citing in Archie Comic of "butthole." What did it mean?
> (UNCLASSIFIED)
>
> I'm going to have to assume that you know this stuff, because I'm still
> puzzled as to why a lettering vandalism would have been required if the
> meaning was slangy but benign. I'll have to defer to your superior
> knowledge of the situation, but as an average user, I would not have it
> as my top choice of an explanation.
>
> On a related note, I wanted to make an observation that all early
> instances of "butthole" (so far) appear to imply a hole *with* a
> butt--or a butted hole--*not* a hole *in* a butt. This would be
> consistent with the interpretation of Montana's use as "dead-end" or
> "bottom-of-the-barrel" job. An existence of an identical scatological
> term (butt, not butthole) would not necessarily be seen as blocking the
> ordinary use--or we would never have see another kid named John, Richard
> or William since each has a variant that is used in a vulgar sense.
> Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
>
>     VS-)
>
> On 5/8/2012 4:32 PM, Baker, John wrote:
> >          Note that, if there were vandalism by a letterer, which is the
> current theory, that would be reflected in the original art, so examining
> it wouldn't tell us anything.  The family might know if Bob Montana used a
> letterer, as opposed to lettering the strip himself.
> > ...
> >
> > John Baker
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: American Dialect Society [mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On
> Behalf Of sclements at NEO.RR.COM
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 1:38 PM
> >
> > ...
> > I'm of the opinion that contacting the family to see if they still have
> the original for that date might be the only way to find out if the
> newspaper copies were vandalized(which is my current leaning).
> >
> > Sam Clements
>
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