[Ads-l] "Downsight"

Barbara Need bhneed at GMAIL.COM
Tue Dec 30 12:36:30 UTC 2014


Except that I have been hearing news with [s] on NPR in recent months.

Barbara

Barbara Need
Etna, NY

On 29 Dec 2014, at 10:50 PM, Herb Stahlke wrote:

> ---------------------- Information from the mail header  
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Herb Stahlke <hfwstahlke at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: "Downsight"
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Tom,
>
> Usually phonological alternations, like the American English dark
> (velarized) /l/ after vowels, what your system represents as "ool," I
> think, occur automatically.  It doesn't matter if they're in nouns  
> or verbs
> or a specific list of  words.  But the alternation we've been  
> discussing
> seems to occur only in the suffix -ese and nowhere else.  So, for  
> example,
> it doesn't occur in the plurals of vowel final nouns, like "toys."
>
> Herb
>
> On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 7:11 AM, Tom Zurinskas  
> <truespel at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> -----------------------
>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> Poster:       Tom Zurinskas <truespel at HOTMAIL.COM>
>> Subject:      Re: "Downsight"
>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Dear Herb=2C
>> Please(~z) excuse(~z) me but I surmise(~z) that I don't know what
>> seams(~z)=
>> to be the meaning of morphological restrictions(~z) for ending ~s  
>> sound
>> be=
>> ing said as ~z.
>>
>> Tom Zurinskas=2C Conn 20 yrs=2C Tenn 3=2C NJ 33=2C now FL 12.See how
>> Englis=
>> h spelling links to sounds at http://justpaste.it/ayk
>>
>>
>> =20
>> =20
>>
>>
>>> Date: Sun=2C 28 Dec 2014 23:05:56 -0500
>>> From: hfwstahlke at GMAIL.COM
>>> Subject: Re: "Downsight"
>>> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>>> =20
>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> -----------------=
>> ------
>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>> Poster:       Herb Stahlke <hfwstahlke at GMAIL.COM>
>>> Subject:      Re: "Downsight"
>>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------=
>> ------
>>> =20
>>> So we have final fortition=2C looking like final devoicing.  Are  
>>> there
>>> examples of it happening with /v=2C D=2C Z/ or /b=2C d=2C g/?  The  
>>> only
>> e=
>> xamples
>>> I'm familiar with are /z/ --> /s/=2C and it appears to be  
>>> morphologically
>>> restricted as well.  I don't hear "fleece" for "fleas" or /kars/ for
>>> /ka:rz/.  Are there examples beyond the -ese suffix?
>>> =20
>>> =20
>>> Herb
>>> =20
>>> On Sat=2C Dec 27=2C 2014 at 11:06 PM=2C Wilson Gray <hwgray at gmail.com 
>>> >
>> wr=
>> ote:
>>> =20
>>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>>> -----------------------
>>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>> Poster:       Wilson Gray <hwgray at GMAIL.COM>
>>>> Subject:      Re: "Downsight"
>>>>
>>>>
>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------=
>> --------
>>>>
>>>> On Sat=2C Dec 27=2C 2014 at 10:40 PM=2C Herb Stahlke  
>>>> <hfwstahlke at gmail.
>> =
>> com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> pronunciation of -ese words is a shortened vowel with a voiceless
>>>>> consonant=2C which makes the consonant sound like a fortis instead
>> of=
>> a
>>>> lenis.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> That's the pronunciation that I use. The consonant sounds like a  
>>>> fortis
>>>> because it *is* a fortis=2C in my idiolect=2C at least.
>>>>
>>>> I was in my 50's=2C before I finally flashed on the phonolonical
>> underp=
>> inning
>>>> of "heathen Chinee": a single member of the set=2C {heathen  
>>>> Chinee[z]}.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> -Wilson
>>>> -----
>>>> All say=2C "How hard it is that we have to die!"---a strange  
>>>> complaint
>> =
>> to
>>>> come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
>>>> -Mark Twain
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>>>
>>> =20
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>                                          =
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
>
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> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org

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