Coney (Re: sea cunny)

[Benjamin Barrett]

Having never heard the word pronounced, I assume it's the latter. Wiktionary agrees with me for US English but not BrE. BB

On Jul 28, 2014, at 6:20 PM, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU> wrote:

> Ah, but do we think of those as roasted /k^ni/ (as in "honey" and =
> "money"), or roasted /koni/ (as in "phon(e)y" and "pepperoni")? I rest =
> my case.   As for the "sea cunny/conny", I love the OED's etymology of =
> it as an apparent "perversion" of Pers. sukka:ni.  I reckon a perversion =
> is an even more mortal etymological sin than a mere corruption is, =
> although lexicographers should feel free to set me straight.
> 
> 
> On Jul 28, 2014, at 8:56 PM, Benjamin Barrett wrote:
> 
>> I suspect Tolkien's use of "coney" when Frodo and Sam are in Ithilien =
> ensured its survival, particularly for fantasy use.
>> =20
>> Searching on things like
>> =20
>> "roasted coney" -"coney Island"
>> "baked coney" -"coney island"
>> =20
>> yields a modern few hits on GB--I searched only for books from 2005 =
> on.
>> =20
>> Benjamin Barrett
>> Formerly of Seattle, WA
>> =20
>> Learn Ainu! https://sites.google.com/site/aynuitak1/home
>> =20
>> On Jul 28, 2014, at 5:44 PM, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU> =
> wrote:
>> =20
>>> Much less ribald than it would appear.  So while "coney" /'k^ni/ =3D3D =
> =3D
>>> 'rabbit' was taboo-avoided into non-existence when it wasn't tortured =
> =3D
>>> beyond recognition in "Coney Island" (and Fr. "connil" suffered an =3D
>>> identical fate for essentially the same reason), "sea cunny" has =3D
>>> somehow, as you note, thrived (or perhaps thriven) as an every-day =3D
>>> expression.  Preserved by the saltiness, no doubt. =3D20
>>> =20
>>> LH
>>> =20
>>> On Jul 28, 2014, at 5:35 PM, George Thompson wrote:
>>> =20
>>>> Here's an antedating by nearly a decade of a word we all use just =3D
>>> about
>>>> every day.  And a couple of post-datings thrown in.
>>>> =3D20
>>>> OED:  sea-conny, n.  Forms:  Also seacunny, sea-cunny, seconny, =3D
>>> seacony,
>>>> sea-connie, secunnie.
>>>> =3D20
>>>> A steersman or quartermaster in a ship manned by lascars.
>>>> 1801   *Asiatic Ann. Reg. 1800: Chron.* 21/1   A =
> Frenchman..concerted =3D
>>> a
>>>> plan with a Spaniard and four of the seacunnies, for murdering the =3D=
> 
>>> officers
>>>> and seizing the ship.
>>>> 1801   in A. Duncan *Marin. Chron.* (1804) II. 355   Leaving Captain
>>>> Porter, who, with six Manilla seconnies, remained on board the =
> wreck.
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  Bombay Gazette, Feb. 2.  Mallawans.
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  ***  [pirates seize a ship]  Happy it would have been, had the
>>>> business rested here; in the course of their plundering, some of =
> them
>>>> attempted to strip one of the Seacunnys, who not relishing such a
>>>> procedure, made resistance and knocked one of them down. . . .
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  Daily Advertiser (New York City), September 7, 1793, p. 2, col. 3
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  =3D46rom a Calcutta Paper of December 15.  [report of a mutiny]  =3D=
> 
>>> [The
>>>> captain] was then between the wheel and the cuddy door, when the sea =
> =3D
>>> cunny,
>>>> who suffered on Saturday, instantly plunged a crease into his heart. =
> . =3D
>>> . --
>>>> he had wounded one of the sea cunnies, but being pent under the =
> poop, =3D
>>> he
>>>> had not sufficient room to wield his sword in his defence.
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  Morning Chronicle (New York City), June 11, 1806, p. 2, col. 5
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  Pulo-Penang, April 3, 1819.
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  Extract of a letter, dated Coast of Pedier, 15th March, 1819.
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  "I am now enabled to give you a circumstantial account of the =3D
>>> Massacre
>>>> of Capt. Onetta, his Wife, and the Officers of the *Wilhelmina*: it =
> =3D
>>> appears
>>>> that the subject was proposed by a Seacunny of the name of Jem, to =
> the
>>>> Syrang, who, together with the Crew, immediately entered into his =3D
>>> views o
>>>> hearing there was money on board. . . .
>>>> =3D20
>>>>  Carolina Sentinel (Newbern, S. C.), October 9, 1819, p. 1, col. 3
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>> GAT
>>>> =3D20
>>>> =3D20
>>>> --=3D20
>>>> George A. Thompson
>>>> Author of A Documentary History of "The African Theatre", =
> Northwestern
>>>> Univ. Pr., 1998, but nothing much since then.
>>>> =3D20
>> =20
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> 
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