[Ads-l] "All art is propaganda."

Jonathan Lighter wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM
Sun Nov 16 20:53:00 UTC 2014


Nice finds, Garson, esp. 1918.

Am I alone in thinking that this ex., like Sinclair's, is a
quasi-metaphorical (but now established) sense of "propaganda"?


JL

On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 1:12 PM, ADSGarson O'Toole <
adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:

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> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       ADSGarson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: "All art is propaganda."
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Random House Webster's Quotationary" has an interesting citation for
> Orwell after Sinclair.
>
> [ref] 2001, Random House Webster's Quotationary, Editor Leonard Roy
> Frank, Topiv: Art, Quote Page 44, Random House, New York. (Paperback
> edition; Verified on paper)[/ref]
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> All art is propaganda. . . . On the other hand, not all propaganda is art.
>
> GEORGE ORWELL (1903-1950). "Charles Dickens" (5), 1940,The Collected
> Essays, Journalism and Letters of George Orwell, vol. 1, ed. Sonia
> Orwell and Ian Angus, 1968
> [End excerpt]
>
> Garson
>
> On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 1:02 PM, ADSGarson O'Toole
> <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Here is a precursor to Upton Sinclair's statement in 1918 expressed
> > tentatively instead of emphatically.
> >
> > Issue Date: February 1918
> > Periodical: Arts & Decoration
> > Article: Notes of the Studies and Galleries,
> > Star Page 165, Quote Page 165,
> > Publisher: Dexter W. Hewitt at Adam Budge, Inc.
> > Database: Google Books Full View
> >
> >
> http://books.google.com/books?id=hhbnAAAAMAAJ&q=%22if+all+art%22#v=snippet&
> >
> > [Begin excerpt]
> > Yet we sometimes wonder if all art is not propaganda--political or
> > spiritual and always egotistic.
> > [End excerpt]
> >
> > Garson
> >
> > On Sat, Nov 15, 2014 at 8:03 PM, Jonathan Lighter
> > <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com> wrote:
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> >> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> >> Subject:      Re: "All art is propaganda."
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> That occurred to me too, but I don't see a ref. in GB or Hathi.
> >>
> >> Prob. Marx said something more prolix.
> >>
> >> JL
> >>
> >> On Sat, Nov 15, 2014 at 6:13 PM, Joel S. Berson <Berson at att.net> wrote:
> >>
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> >>> -----------------------
> >>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>> Poster:       "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET>
> >>> Subject:      Re: "All art is propaganda."
> >>>
> >>>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> At 11/15/2014 04:57 PM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
> >>>
> >>> >Not in YBQ, but it gets 30,000 raw Googlits.  I recently read it in a
> >>> movie
> >>> >review.
> >>> >
> >>> >1925 Upton Sinclair _Mammonart_ (Pasadena: pub. by the author) 9: All
> art
> >>> >is propaganda. It is universally and inescapably propaganda; sometimes
> >>> >unconsciously, but often deliberately, propaganda.
> >>> >
> >>> >Rather a dilute meaning of "propaganda," wouldn't you say? The
> relevant
> >>> OED
> >>> >def. is
> >>> >
> >>> >"The systematic dissemination of information, esp. in a biased or
> >>> >misleading way, in order to promote a political cause or point of
> view.
> >>> >Also: information disseminated in this way; the means or media by
> which
> >>> >such ideas are disseminated."
> >>> >
> >>> >Sinclair seems to mean rather that all art exerts some influence on
> >>> >beliefs, willy-nilly.  As dothose who repeat the assertion (usu.
> without
> >>> >attribution).
> >>>
> >>> Sinclair was a utopian, left-wing, progressive Democrat, Socialist,
> >>> Wobbly-supporting pinko, wasn't he?  "All art is propaganda" is
> >>> something I could imagine said by Karl Marx.
> >>>
> >>> Joel
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> >Factoid:  Wackipedia calls the book-length essay _Mammonart_ a
> "novel."
> >>> >
> >>> >JL
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >--
> >>> >"If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> >>> truth."
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> truth."
> >>
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> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
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