[Ads-l] "old boy" = the devil

Joel Berson berson at ATT.NET
Tue Sep 20 23:29:12 EDT 2016


For "crafter" instead of "craften":


How about La'y'amons Brut, or Chronicle of Britain, a poetical semi-Saxon ..., Volume 2By Layamon:  Glossary, p. 543.  craeft, craft:  craft, guile; pl. craften.  Perhaps the 1692 deposition is meant to be "crafter", guiler, deceiver, the Devil??  Or is this reaching at straws too?   Google Books, full view, (which I have not enlarged), https://books.google.com/books?id=bmQIAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA543&dq=craften&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiloYGdvp_PAhUj64MKHX3XD1QQ6AEITzAJ#v=onepage&q=craften&f=false


Joel

      From: Joel Berson <berson at ATT.NET>
 To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU 
 Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 11:09 PM
 Subject: Re: [ADS-L] "old boy" = the devil + OED antedating of "Old Roger".
  
Only if "craften" or "craffen" or "cratter" lead nowhere also.

Joel


      From: Robin Hamilton <robin.hamilton3 at VIRGINMEDIA.COM>
 To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU 
 Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 3:24 PM
 Subject: Re: [ADS-L] "old boy" = the devil + OED antedating of "Old Roger".
  
Could it be a mis-hearing on the part of the person writing the words down
originally?  Or am I grasping after straws?

RH.

> 
>    On 20 September 2016 at 19:24 Hugo <hugovk at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> 
> 
>    > The more I think about this, the more convinced I am that the term used
>    > was actually "cratter", and the sense was "old creature".
> 
>    > JB: I've looked only at the two 1890's transcriptions, and the
>    > manuscript Hugo provided to the list. But in the manuscript I did not
>    > look further than the portion that used "old man", and I don't know
>    > whether Hugo's scrap shows "cratten".
> 
>    http://salem.lib.virginia.edu/archives/ecca/medium/ecca1157r.jpg
> 
>    http://salem.lib.virginia.edu/texts/tei/swp?term=cratten÷_id=n69.5&chapter_id=n69
> 
>    It's the fourth line from the end, fourth word along (above "mother").
>    Looks like an "n" in the manuscript, and distinct from other "r"
>    letters. If not "cratten", it could be "craften" or "craffen", but I
>    don't think those are any more helpful.
> 
>    Hugo
> 
>    ------------------------------------------------------------
>    The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> 

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