[Ads-l] Modern Proverb: A good loser is no good (Robert Zuppke Nov 6, 1924) (UNCLASSIFIED)

Sun Jun 30 17:23:35 UTC 2019

1907, by sports columnist, Jim Nasium, responding to a recent article 
about sportsmanship and the value of being a "good loser."

[Begin Excerpt]
You often hear a guy say of another, "Well, anyway, he's a good loser."  
But if you look up his record you'll find that the "good loser" is 
blamed seldom any old kind of winner.
[End excerpt]

Pittsburgh Press, June 23, 1907, page 37, column
------ Original Message ------
From: "ADSGarson O'Toole" <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com>
To: ADS-L at listserv.uga.edu
Sent: 6/29/2019 7:28:34 PM
Subject: Re: Modern Proverb: A good loser is no good (Robert Zuppke Nov 
6, 1924) (UNCLASSIFIED)

>---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
>Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>Poster:       ADSGarson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at GMAIL.COM>
>Subject:      Re: Modern Proverb: A good loser is no good (Robert Zuppke Nov 6,
>               1924) (UNCLASSIFIED)
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Statements that fit the template "Show me an X, and I'll show you a Y"
>were circulating in the 1600s. George Herbert's compilation
>"Outlandish Proverbs" appeared posthumously in 1640, and it contained
>the following statement (modified to use modern spelling): Show me a
>liar, and I will show thee a thief.
>
>Year: 1640
>Title: Wits recreations. Selected from the finest fancies of moderne muses
>Author: Herbert, George, 1592-1637., Marshall, William, fl. 1617-1650, engr=
>aver.
>Title: Wits recreations. Selected from the finest fancies of moderne muses
>Section: Outlandish PROVERBS.
>Publication info: London : Printed by R[ichard] H[odgkinson and Thomas
>Paine] for Humphry Blunden at the Castle in Corn-hill
>Database: Early English Books Online
>
>[Begin excerpt]
>652. Shew me a lyer, and ile shew thee a theefe.
>[End excerpt]
>
>H. L. Mencken (and another reference) give earlier citations in the
>1600s, but I do not know the precise spelling and phrasing. Mencken
>seems to give a modernized version.
>
>[Begin excerpt]
>Show me a liar, and I will show thee a thief.
>THOMAS ADAMS: Sermon, 1629
>[End excerpt]
>
>The 1673 citation below contains another phrase fitting the template.
>
>Year: 1673
>Title: Counsellor Manners, his last legacy to his son enriched and
>embellished with grave adviso's, pat histories, and ingenious
>proverbs, apologues, and apophthegms
>Author: Dare, Josiah, 17th cent.
>Publication info: London : Printed for Edward Gough and are to be sold
>by most booksellers in London
>Database: Early English Books Online
>
>[Begin excerpt]
>For as we say, Shew me a Lyer, and I will shew thee a Thief; so we may
>say, Shew me a common Swearer, and I will shew thee a common Lyer
>[End excerpt]
>
>I do not have access to the scans, so the data above is from the
>publicly accessible database.
>Garson
>
>On Sat, Jun 29, 2019 at 8:31 PM Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com> w=
>rote:
>>
>>  More:
>>  1855 _Hartford Daily Courant_ (Dec. 27)  2: "Show me a Loco, gentlemen,"
>>  said he, "and I'll show you a liar!"
>>
>>  1859 Ibid. (Oct. 31) 2: An exchange says it was a remark of Dr. Waddell,
>>  "show me a boy with a horse, dog and gun, and I'll show you a boy who wil=
>l
>>  never come to anything."
>>   JL
>>
>>  On Sat, Jun 29, 2019 at 5:39 PM ADSGarson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.=
>com>
>>  wrote:
>>
>>  > Here is a good precursor match for "Show me a good loser and I'll show
>>  > you a loser" that is a bit earlier.
>>  >
>>  > Date: April 2, 1963
>>  > Newspaper: San Francisco Chronicle
>>  > Newspaper Location: San Francisco, California
>>  > Article: Smile When You Call Him Sport
>>  > Author: Bob Stevens
>>  > Quote Page 44, Column 8
>>  > Database: GenealogyBank
>>  >
>>  > [Begin excerpt]
>>  > Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a consistent loser.
>>  > [End excerpt]
>>  >
>>  > Garson
>>  >
>>  > On Sat, Jun 29, 2019 at 5:07 PM ADSGarson O'Toole
>>  > <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:
>>  > >
>>  > > "Show me a good loser and I'll show you a loser" has matches in 1963
>>  > > as indicated in my previous message. When I explored the saying I did
>>  > > find a close precursor in 1960.
>>  > >
>>  > > The quotation below is from coach Carl Rees of the University of
>>  > Pittsburgh.
>>  > >
>>  > > Date: April 17, 1960
>>  > > Newspaper: The Pittsburgh Press
>>  > > Newspaper Location: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
>>  > > Article: Och Tires of Losing, Shot Records Suffer
>>  > > Author: Roy McHugh
>>  > > Section 3, Quote Page 3, Column 5
>>  > > Database: Newspapers.com
>>  > >
>>  > > https://www.newspapers.com/image/141354180/?terms=3Dloser
>>  > >
>>  > > [Begin excerpt]
>>  > > "Show me a good loser and I'll show you a guy who is going to lose
>>  > > most of the time," he volunteered.
>>  > > [End excerpt]
>>  > >
>>  > > Garson
>>  > >
>>  > > On Sat, Jun 29, 2019 at 4:50 PM ADSGarson O'Toole
>>  > > <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:
>>  > > >
>>  > > > Jonathan Lighter wrote:
>>  > > > > Of interest:
>>  > > > >
>>  > > > > 1969 _Springfield_ [Mass.] _Union_ (May 7) 12: Clue to Student
>>  > Anger: 'A
>>  > > > > Good Loser is a Loser' ... The [student] sign [at Princeton] said=
>,
>>  > 'Show me
>>  > > > > a Good Loser and I'll Show You a Loser.'
>>  > > > > . . .
>>  > > >
>>  > > > Thanks for your response, JL. Barry Popik has an entry on this gene=
>ral
>>  > > > topic. There are many variant expressions. I linked to Barry's piec=
>e
>>  > > > in my original ADS post and at the end of the QI article. (My QI
>>  > > > article was focused on the early Zuppke quotation.)
>>  > > >
>>  > > >
>>  > https://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/new_york_city/entry/show_me_a_good=
>_loser_and_ill_show_you_a_loser
>>  > > >
>>  > > > [Begin excerpt from Barry's article]
>>  > > > 21 June 1963, Life magazine, pg. 87, col. 2:
>>  > > > =E2=80=9CHell,=E2=80=9D he (Frankie Albert, an All-American quarter=
>back=E2=80=94ed.) says, =E2=80=9Cin
>>  > > > football we were out to kill the opponent. Show me a good loser and
>>  > > > I=E2=80=99ll show you a loser.=E2=80=9D
>>  > > > [End excerpt]
>>  > > >
>>  > > > Garson
>>  >
>>  > ------------------------------------------------------------
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>>  >
>>
>>
>>  --
>>  "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth=
>."
>>
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>
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