[Ads-l] odd sequence of tenses

[Jonathan Lighter]

"Probably would have won" is correct.

JL

On Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 9:07 AM dave at wilton.net <dave at wilton.net> wrote:

>
> I don't see anything odd at all, it's just the natural sequence of tenses.
> The superordinate verb is in the historical present, so the time frame of
> the entire sentence is the present. The lack of a pandemic in the
> subordinate clause would then normally be expressed in past perfect, as it
> is a "completed" action. (The fact that it didn't happen is over and done
> with.)
>
> "If there had not been a coronavirus in 2020, Trump probably won that
> election" seems odd to me, especially coming from Axelrod. Ending on
> "probably won" gives the impression that Axelrod thinks Trump should be
> president, which is clearly not the case. That's not literally what the
> sentence says, but ending on that note gives that impression especially
> when so many nutters are actually claiming he won.
>
> Removing the political considerations:
>
> "If the quarterback had not fumbled, the Jets probably won the game."
>
> Yep, that seems weird to me. "Win" is what I would say.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Jonathan Lighter" <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> Sent: Monday, October 11, 2021 7:09pm
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [ADS-L] odd sequence of tenses
>
>
>
> Superficially, but it's substituting for a conditional "would have," not a
> past "won."
>
> JL
>
> On Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 6:21 PM Barretts Mail <mail.barretts at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Isn’t that just the narrative present?
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_present <
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_present>
> >
> > Benjamin Barrett (he/his/him)
> > Formerly of Seattle, WA
> >
> > > On 11 Oct 2021, at 05:40, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > David Axelrod, former Obama official, on CNN:
> > >
> > > "If there had not been a coronavirus in 2020, Trump probably wins that
> > > election."
> > >
> > > Note the formality of "had not" before the weirdness sets in.
> > >
> > > JL
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >
>
>
> --
> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."
>
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>
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> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>


-- 
"If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."

------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org