<html><body><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><font face="Tahoma"><font size="2">Thanks to all who have replied so far. I'm totally amazed by the sophistication of your suggestions and explanations. The reason of my question is that I'm presently working on Mi'gmaq place names related to early PEA migrations into the Gaspe Peninsula and Atlantic Canada. The more I read in archaeology, the more I wonder about the cultural contacts that might have taken place when the PEA arrived in these territories. Except for Peter Denny, no archaeological writings seem to advocate for such contacts. All they say is that the Planos arrived ca 9,000 BP and the PEA ca 3,000-4,000 BP. Nobody (to my candid knowledge) talks about possible encounters between the two groups. And none talks about the disappearance - or not- of the Planos. Once again except Peter Denny. On the other hand, my readings, so far, seem to indicate a complete separation between archaeology and linguistics. Which is corroborated by David W. Anthony. 1990. Migration in Archaeology: The Baby and the Bathwater.</font> </font><span style="font-family: Times; font-style: italic;">American Anthropologist; </span><span style="font-family: TimesNewRoman;">Dec 1990; 92, 4;<font size="2"> </font></span><div><font face="TimesNewRoman" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font size="2"><font face="Tahoma">From this</font>, <font face="Tahoma">a new question arising in my mind: did someone ever tried to compare John Hewson's Dictionary of Proto-Algonquian with a Mi'gmaq dictionary to try and list the Mi'gmaq words that do not belong to PA; and then to analyze these words and try to draw a kind of phonetic/phonological sketch of a possible (dead) loaning language of some kind ?</font></font></div><div><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><br></font></div><div><font size="2" face="Tahoma">If Peter Denny's hypothesis is correct, and if Fiedel 1987 is correct that Mi'gmaq shares only 50 percent of its lexicon with other Central and even Eastern Algonquian languages, this should be feasible. In comparison, if French had disappeared from the records, one should be able to deduce its phonological patterns by analyzing all the words that English doesn't share with any other European languages, More or less.</font><br><div style="font-size: 13px; font-family: Tahoma;"><div><br></div><div>Am I too far gone ?</div><div><br></div><div>Danielle</div><div><br><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><div>Dr. Danielle E. Cyr, Senior Scholar at York University</div><div>339, boul. Perron ouest</div><div>New Richmond, QC, <span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre;"> </span>G0C 2BO</div><div>dcyr@yorku.ca - 418.392.7271</div></font><br><blockquote style="border-left: solid 2px #000000; margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px">---- Original Message ----<br><b>From</b>: David Costa <pankihtamwa@earthlink.net><br><b>To</b>: "Danielle E. Cyr" <dcyr@yorku.ca><br><b>Cc</b>: "John Steckley" <John.Steckley@humber.ca>, "ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG" <ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG><br><b>Sent</b>: Wed, Nov 19, 2014, 5:18 PM<br><b>Subject</b>: Re: [Algonquiana] Prehistoric Language contact ?<br><br>What lexical borrowings are you trying to account for?<div><br></div><div>Dave</div><div><br></div><div><br><div><blockquote type="cite"><div><font face="Tahoma" size="2">John and Arok,<div><br></div><div>Thanks for your quick reply. Researching phonetic similarities would be a great start. I was rather thinking of lexical borrowings but your insight widens my interest !</div><div><br></div><div>Danielle<br><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><div>Dr. Danielle E. Cyr, Senior Scholar at York University</div><div>339, boul. Perron ouest</div><div>New Richmond, QC, <span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre;"> </span>G0C 2BO</div><div><a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:dcyr@yorku.ca">dcyr@yorku.ca</a> - 418.392.7271</div></font><br><blockquote style="border-left: solid 2px #000000; margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px">---- Original Message ----<br><b>From</b>: John Steckley <<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:John.Steckley@humber.ca">John.Steckley@humber.ca</a>><br><b>To</b>: "Wolvengrey, Arok" <<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:awolvengrey@firstnationsuniversity.ca">awolvengrey@firstnationsuniversity.ca</a>>, "Danielle E. Cyr" <<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:dcyr@yorku.ca">dcyr@yorku.ca</a>>, "<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG">ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG</a>" <<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG">ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG</a>><br><b>Sent</b>: Wed, Nov 19, 2014, 4:29 PM<br><b>Subject</b>: RE: [Algonquiana] Prehistoric Language contact ?<br><br>
<div class="WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Danielle/Arok:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Wendat has a well-developed system of dual pronominal prefixes as agents (but not patients). Presumably St. Lawrence Iroquoian did as well. It would be interesting
to see whether some phonetic similarities appear between Mi'kmaq/Maliseet dual forms and those that Wendat has.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">John<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Algonquiana [<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:algonquiana-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org">mailto:algonquiana-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Wolvengrey, Arok<br>
<b>Sent:</b> November 19, 2014 4:18 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Danielle E. Cyr; <a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG">ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Algonquiana] Prehistoric Language contact ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Hi Danielle,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">I'm not aware of anything actually written with regard to this, but there was some brief discussion at the recent Algonquian conference (or was it online???) about
the possible source or model for the introduction of the dual as a category in Micmac (and Maliseet?). Inuktitut could be one source, but Iroquoian was perhaps (?) favoured suggesting some contact in the (lower? south eastern?) Great Lakes area. Others far
more knowledgeable about the Eastern languages, please feel free to shoot these thoughts down as required.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size: 14pt;">ᐋᐧᐱ</span></b><b><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: 'Aboriginal Sans', serif;">
</span></b><b><span style="font-size: 14pt;">ᑭᐦᐃᐤ</span></b><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray">Arok Wolvengrey</span></b><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">Professor, Algonquian Languages and Linguistics and</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">Department Head of Indigenous Languages, Arts and Cultures</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">First Nations University of Canada</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">1 First Nations Way</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">Regina, SK S4S 7K2</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;"> </span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">phone: (306) 790-5950 ext. 3310</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">fax: (306) 790-5995</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">e-mail:
<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" x_onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" href="mailto:awolvengrey@fnuniv.ca">awolvengrey@fnuniv.ca</a></span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span style="">
<hr size="2" width="100%" align="center">
</span></div>
<div id="divRpF405486"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"> Algonquiana [<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:algonquiana-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org">algonquiana-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>]
on behalf of Danielle E. Cyr [<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:dcyr@yorku.ca">dcyr@yorku.ca</a>]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> November 19, 2014 3:05 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG">ALGONQUIANA@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Algonquiana] Prehistoric Language contact ?</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Hello All,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Beside
<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;text-align:justify">
<span lang="EN-US" style="">DENNY, Peter J. 2003. Early Signs of Eastern Algonquians.
<i>Essays in Algonquian, Catawban and Siouan Linguistics in Memory of Frank T. Siebert Jr.</i> Blair A. Rudes and David J. Costa. Winnipeg: Algonquian and Iroquoian Linguistics, Memoir 16, p. 15-36.</span><span style=""><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">does anyone know about literature discussing prehistoric language contacts between Proto Eastern Algonquian and other older languages ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Thanks in advance,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Danielle Cyr<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">___________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Dr. Danielle E. Cyr, Senior Scholar at York University<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">339, boul. Perron ouest<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">New Richmond, QC, <span class="apple-tab-span">
</span> G0C 2BO<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" x_onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" href="mailto:dcyr@yorku.ca">dcyr@yorku.ca</a> - 418.392.7271<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email and attached material are intended for the use of the individual or organization to whom they are addressed and may not be distributed, copied, or disclosed to other unauthorized persons. This material may contain confidential
and/or personal information subject to the provisions of the Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act, the Municipal Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act, and/or the Personal Health Information Protection Act. If you receive this
transmission in error, please notify me immediately and delete this message. Do not email, print, copy, distribute, or disclose this email or its contents further. Thank you for your co-operation and assistance.
</blockquote></div></font></div>
_______________________________________________<br>Algonquiana mailing list<br><a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:Algonquiana@listserv.linguistlist.org">Algonquiana@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/algonquiana<br></blockquote></div><br></div></blockquote><br></div></div></div></font></body></html>