Dear Friends,
I'm a Hungarian teacher, Gabor Szántai. Presently I'm working on the first Irish-Hungarian dictionary - it's a hard work, I tell you. The good news is that I have a publisher.
I would also like to learn this wonderful language - I guess You have already encountered many similarities between the Hungarian and the Irish history - and now I've come across a book published in Hungary that is dealing with some possible relationship between the Irish and the Hungarian. Even if I accepted the alternative approach that Irish perhaps is not an Indo-European language - I would be dubious about the relationship. ( Here I must admit that I like the conception that denies the Hungarian-Finno-Ugrian theory. ) Of course, some kind of relationship would make me extremely glad.
Anyway, I have taken out some extracts from the above mentioned book and I am sending it over to you: perhaps it is just another misconception.
Best regards,
Gábor
Here it is: ( Please, do something with the file in order to be readable !! )
SIMILARITIES WITH THE IRISH LANGUAGE
The following examples are given to illustrate some relationship between our languages -- the Irish and the Hungarian. These are from the book of " The Celtic Hungarians ", written by Timaru-Kast Sándor. The author explains his concept based on the alternative Hungarian origin research which says that Hungarians ( "Magyars" ) are descended from somewhere the Caucasus Mountains and states that we aren't Finno-Ugrians as Irish aren't Indo-European, either. I am not intending to tell about the rich and interesting historical reasoning of his, merely I would like to point out some really interesting connections. Is the whole thing just a coincidence ? In some ways Hungarian pronunciation is close to Irish. We are pronouncing the highlighted sounds the same: ( with the same, or very close meaning ) roGile -- raGYogó
éiDe -- eGYen ( ruha ) /uniform ainTin --- ánGY baiN -- báNYa sáibLe -- szabLYa Similarities in grammar: "THE" (Welsh) ar
yfank = az ifjonc /the youngster (W) ar ysgol = az iskola /the school (W) ar ysbata = az ispotály /the hospital AN, A = A, AZ / the (old Irish) sa, se = az, ez (o.I.) os = s, és /and IS, S = és, s, is / and, too MÉ = én TÚ, TÉ = TE É, Í = õ MUID = mi FUIR-im = VÁR-om / I wait BEIR = BÍR / we don't mark the third person M-ATHAIR = APÁ-m, ATYÁ-m / my father D-ATHAIR =APÁ-d, ATYÁ-d / your
father A-ATHAIR = AP-ja, ATY-ja / his
ATHAIR-NA = ATY-ánk / our
CHAN = se, sem / either ní, neamh (breton NE, Nam ) = ne, nem ná = ne /don't ! ACH = ha /if dá = de /but ámh = ám /but, though go = hogy dá bharr = debar mar = mer(t), már /because,already FARA = féle / kind, sort of NÍ = ami, mi/ that, what NA = -nak (-nek) / to, for CÚ-N = KU-tyá-Nak / to the dog ciapath-A = csapás-É AG = -nak AR = -RA AR-chúl = hát-Ra / back
NÁ = -NÁL NÁ-an-fear = a férfi-NÁL INNIU = INNEN / from here UAINN = ONNAN / from there THALL = TÚL, ÁTAL /over, beyond an taobh thall den ghleann = a táj túl a kalántól Ó = -ból ( in old Irish "Ó" was a suffix ) /from LE- = -val, -vel /with MAILLE = MELLÉ / next to NÓ = NO, NOHA
Ó = ÓTA /since NUIGE = MÍG /while ATH- = ÁT- /across Word-building: sábh - ÁIL = szab - DAL BAI = BÁJ bá-CH = báj-OS meirg - EACH = mérg - ES /angry
diail - ACH = dali - ÁS neamh - OIL = menny - EI /heavenly cal - AOIS = csal - ÁS asarl - AÍ = varázsl – Ó /magician robál - AÍ = rabol – Ó /robber
tógál - AÍ = tákol - Ó buaite - OIR = bát – OR /brave - AOS = -ÁSZ, - ÉSZ AOS dána = dan-ol-ÁSZ AOS ceird = gyárt-ÁSZ fála - IGH = fal(az) – Ik /he makes a wall borr - IGH = forr – IK /it boils tana - IGH = tûn – IK /it disappears serr-IN = zár -NI /to close terr - IN = tör -NI /to break (breton suffix :NI) Unlike English, we also have so-called "productive prefixes" : AG ithe = MEG eszi
/he eats it AD-bail = MEG-hal AR = EL- AR-fog = EL fog, (neki fog ) LE- = LE- /down -AR = -ÉR(T) -LA,-LE = -VAL, -VEL LE-M = VELEM /with me After numbers we don't put the nouns in plural, either. And we don't have modal verbs nor "to have". (Welsh, breton ) TEC-AFF = TECC- ÕBB /nicER (W,B) oss - OC = õz(i) - KE /small deer gránna = fránya obair = ipar tar = tér
/comes NÍ = -NÉ ( NÍ Szántai = Szántainé = Mrs. Szántai ) NIL = NINCS Future: -fidh ----- FAIGH = FOG CEAL = KELL /have to CÉ = KI /who At questions: AN = -É ? Like in Hungarian , ( sipít - sikít /screams ) , in "Celtic" languages certain changes can be observed, when sounds systematically change. Using this as a rule, the following changes can be made between Irish and Hungarian sounds: B > P caBáiste = káPoszta /cabbage oBair = iPar /industry, craft
P > B (breton) Peo'ch = Béke ( basque: BAKE ! ) /peace B > F Baile = Falu /village Balla = Fal Beir-igh = Forr-ik Borr = Forr F > B Feirc = Bérc F > V Fiata = Vad P > F (breton) Pobet = Fõzet /soup made of grass, kind of tea M > N, NY MaMó = NaNó NeaMh = MeNNY N > M Nuige = Míg
G > K Gabh = Kap /gets (old irish:) Goba = Kovács /smith Gort = Kert /garden G > ZS Geir = ZSír K > H Caith = Hajít Cath, (Welsh) Cad = Had Corr = Horog /hook C > CS Cath, (W) Cad = Csata /battle Ceal-g = Csal /cheats Circe = Csirke /chicken ( "CS" like in "cheat" ) SK > SZ Scológ = Szolga /servant D > T aDha = aTya
T > D alTa-igh = álD D > G, GY = aeD = éG Diolaim = Gyülem raD = rúG /kicks L > R faoLchú = faRkas /wolf foLt = füRt Léana = Róna saiL = sáR/mud G > F, V Genau = Fenyõ /pine tree
That's all I thought to be understandable to copy from the book concerning the grammar, and now here is a list of words: FEAR = fÉRJ, FÉRFI /husband, man ALLTA = ÁLLAT /animal FIÚNTACH = FONTOS /important ANU = ANYU, ANYA /mom ACHAIR = AKAR /wants AOIS = ÕS, ÕSZ /autumn ATÓIN = ZÁTONY (gall) AUDAX = ÁDÁZ BÁ = BÁJ BÁB = BABÁM BÁBÓG = BÁBU
BAC = BAK BAIN = BÁNYA /mine BALL = BEL (w) ADAR = MADÁR /bird (welsh) BAI = BAJ /trouble BAN = BANYA BATA, (w) BAT = BOT /stick BINE = BÛN /sin BÍS-igh = BASZ-ik /fucks (!) BÓ = BOCI /young cow BUABHAL = BIVALY BUACHA = BAKA BUAITEOIR = BÁTOR
CALL = KELL CARR = KÉREG CÁS = KAS CEO = KÖD CEANGALL = KENDÕ, KENGYEL CEANN = KÁN, KENDE /lord CHELL = CSEL CHÍCH = CSECSE, CSICS CISEÁN = KOSÁR /basket COIR, (w) CUR = KÓR COITIN = KÖTÉNY /apron CORR = KÖR /circle CORÓIN = KORONA
CÚ = KUTYA (w)CWPAN = KUPA /goblet DAIDEO = DÉDI, DÁDÓ DE = DÉL DEAS = DÍSZ (es) EARRA = ÁRU ÉICSE = ÉSZ ÉIR-igh = ÉR- ik FAIGH = FOG FÁL = FAL /wall FEAR = FÉRJ, FÉRFI GARLACH = GYEREK /child
GÚNA = GÚNYA GARMHAC = GYERMEK IARR = JÁR (neki) GEARR-c-ach = GYER-kõc ITH = ET(et) (welsh) IAWN = JÓ, JÓL ("jaún van) /well LAGA = LÁGY /soft (mannin) IU = IV(ás) /drink-ing (mannin) JYST = ÜST /cauldron LAIB = LÁP LAPA = LÁB /leg LAS-adh = LÁZ-as LEIAN = LEÁN(y) /maiden LOEN = LÉNY /being
LOG = LYUK /hole LÓTH = LÓ /horse (breton) MAEZ = MEZÕ /field MAELLANN = MELLÉNY /vest MAIRG = MÉREG /poison MEIRG-each = MÉRG-es /angry MAIRID = MARAD MART = MARHA MÉALA = MÉLA MEANDER = MINDJÁR (breton) MEZ = MÉZ /honey MIR = MÁR MUILEANN = MALOM MÚR =
MART (part) /bank MAOL = MÁLÉ NASADH = NÁSZ (welsh) OES = ÕZ /deer OGH = HÚG (scottish) OS, (irish) OIS / OSS = ÕZ RANGALAM = RÁGALOM RIAN = IRÁNY /direction REIC = REGE RIABH = ROVÁS (old irish) RIONN = RÓNI /to write/engrave with a knife on a stick RÍOG = RÁNG(ás) ROBÁIL = RABOL /he robs ROGILE = RAGYOG
SÁBH = SZAB SÁIBLE = SZABLYA TALAMH = TALAJ /soil TÁIRGE + (breton) TRA = TÁRGY THALL = TÚL TAR = TÉR TARR = TÖRZS TÁTAL = TÉTEL TÉAGAR = TAKAR /covers (breton) TERR-in = TÖR-ni /to break (br.) TU = ÚT /way TÚR = TOR-ony ÚLL = ALMA /apple
URRA = ÕR /guard URR-ad = UR-ad-alom URRA-igh = ÕR-iz /he guards URRÚS = ÕR-ség, ÕRS URRA = ERÕ /force, strength URRÚS-ach = ERÕ-S /strong URRA = ÚR /lord, gentleman EAS = ESÕ /rain FAI = FÁJ /hurts EOL = JEL /sign IB, IU = IV(ás) /drink-ing MÓ = MÉG
NÍ = AMI OIE = ÉJ /night RÉ = RÉ-g /old times ago ÚD = OTT, ODA /there UIRE-asa = ÜRES-(ség) /empty-ness NÓ = NOHA ÓR = AR-any TU = ÚT /way BARR-ógh = BIR-ok BEAR-ach = BORJÚ BOR = BOR-víz /sparkling-water LÁIB = LÁP
BORR-adh = FORR-ad-al-om LÁIB-ach = LÁP-os LUB-án = LABDA FAIR = VÁR FUAR-án = FÚR-ás FÁIL = FALU MIOL = NYÚL MEAR = MÁR-is MURA = MÁR PIOC = PICI /tiny BOOAG = BUGA FÁICH-ill = FIGYEL
FIÓGH-ach = FOG-as /a kind of fish CAB = KAPU GABH = KAP GOBÁN = GÓBÉ CUN-ús = GON-osz /evil, wicked SANN = SZÁN SÉIMH-igh = SIM-ít SEINN = ZENE /music FUAD-ar = FUT-ás /running EADAN = EDÉNY NEM-ed = MEN-ed-ék /shelter FUIN = FON LUAD-ar = LÓD-ul
IARR = JÁR IMIGH (>MYND) = MEGY, MEND- SITH = SIET /hurries FUAD-ar = FUT-ás /running TANA-igh = TÛN-ik CAER = VÁR CAOR = KÖR, KARI-ka CARR = KAR-éj CEARR = KÁR CALL, CEAL = KELL GOURM = KOROM CORR = KEREK
CUR = KÖR CEAL-g = CSAL-ik /he cheats CAL-aois = CSAL-ás KOLL = KALL-ód-ik AIRIUC = ÖRÖK LOG = LYUK, LÉK CUD = KÁD RIK-kann = RIK-olt, RIK-kan(t) IAR, YAR = JÉRCE CÉAG = ÁG DÚID-in = DUDA DÚID-ir-eacht = DUD-ál-ás
SEK-ell = SZÉK-ely /soldier DRAOTA = (old, "pagan" Hungarian:) TORDA SYCH = SZIK-es THALLOO = TALAJ DÚR = DUR-va TERR-in = TÖR-ni /to break ALLAID = ÁLLAT TORR-ed = TÖR-ött ALTA-igh = ÁLD /belsses DÚIL = DOLOG TUIL = TÖLT, TELE DUAL-g-as = DOLG-os, DOL-g-oz-ás /worky, working ÉARD = ÉRT(-elem) LÚTH = LÓT, LÓD-ul
TÓRR = TOR OIREAD = ÁRAD SOITH = SZAJHA /bitch SÁIL = SZÁL (-fa) SCOL = SZÓL SÍR = SÍR /tomb SUTHA-in = SOHA /never LAS = LÁZ /fever (celt) BARR /surface = BÕR /skin TUIG = TUD /knows BRAT = BORÍT(ó) ÉIR-igh = ÉR-ik, ér, elér SÚIL = SZÁLL /flies
ÉIR-c = ÉRTÉ-k CAB = KIAB-ál AIR-igh = ÉR-ez /feels DEILÍN = DAL /song COGUAS = GÉGE, GIGA SCÓIG = SZEGY, SZÜGY TORC = TOROK, TORK-a /throath BARDA = BÖRDÖN, BÖRTÖN /jail PUTÓG = POCAK PIT = PITCSA, PICSA TORCHEAS = TERHES-ség /pregnancy GUAL-ainn = VÁLL /shoulder TORRACH = TERHES /pregnant
GUAILLE-áil = VÁLL-al CRÁG = KAR /arm CORRÓG = FORGÓ LAPA = LÁB SUAN = SZUNY-ad (breton) HUN = HUNY /sleeps ÉIGEAN = IGÉNY DÉAN = TEN-ni TOLL = TOL-d SLIM = SIMA AR MAOS = MOS /he washes FIGH -- FIONN = FON, FONNI
BAIN = BÁN-t TOLG = TOLONG SÉID = SZÍT TARLA-igh = TAR-ol, TAR-ló TÓRA-igh = TÚR CALAOIS = CSALÁS CEALG = CSALNI (old irish) CHELL = CSEL REAB = REP-ed LAGHDA-igh = LOHAD-ik MÉ = ÉN (welsh) MI, (mannin) MEE = ÉN MO = ENYÉM
AON = EGY (basque) HIRUR = HÁROM /3 ÉIGIN = EGYÉN / one person CÉAD = SZÁZ /100 -(o)CHA > fí-CHE, trí-OCHA = har-MINC /30 SUIM = SZÁM /number SUIM-igh = SZÁM-ol-ni SUIM-lú = SZÁM-la (old irish) ADHA = ATYA (welsh) OES = ÕS /ancestor FÓD = FÖLD /ground EAS = ESÕ /rain FÓD =
FÛ / grass (old irish) ROGILE -- RO(g)ÁILLE = RAGYOGÓ RÉgAL = REG-g-el (welsh) TARAN, (irish) TOIRN-each = DURRAN-ás FUA-cht = FAGY MAIG = MAG-as (old irish) FID = FA /tree, wood (o.i.) ÓL, (i.) LEÁ = LÉ ARDU(A)NA /goddess of forests = ERDÕANYA /forest-mother (breton) LOEN = LÉNY /being, creature EOCHRAI = IKRA (old irish) FIAD = VAD ALLAID = ÁLLAT BOAG = (old hungarian) BUGA
MART = MARHA (old irish) AG = (old hung.) ÁGAS /buck with antlers ADH-arc = AG-ancs BROC = BORZ CÚ = KU-tya LÓTH = LÓ /horse LACH = LAK-ós CISEÁN = KOSÁR MEADAR = VEDER FOTHRUCUD = FÜRDÕKÁD SEAC = ZEKE CABH-ail = KAB-át /coat SÁIGH = SZEG
(old irish) CALAG, COLG = KARD /sword (gall) VETU = VET /sows (welsh) YPED = IV-ás /drinking (old irish) GOIR = (old hung:) GÉRA /salt (o.i.) ARIUC = ÖRÖK SAONTA = ÕSZINTE /earnest OILBHÉAS = ALJAS /base BAIL = BÕ UIREASA = ÜRES(ség) /emptiness SÍOGAI = SZEGÉNY /poor GEARÚ = GYORS /fast LEASC = LASSÚ /slow BAOTH = BUTA /stupid
LEISCIÚIL = LASSÚL, LUSTA, LASSÚ AIRÍ = ER-ény (welsh) BARN = BÍRÓ /judge (o.i.) BRIOD = BIRTOK BEIR = BÍR BETH = BETÛ /letter TACAR = TÜKÖR /mirror NAS-adh = NÁSZ SÍ, (old irish) SIDH, (welsh) SÍR = SÍR /tomb
Finally, I would like to show you a "word-bush", to illustrate the difference between the Indo-European languages and the Celtic/Hungarian ones. CELT HUNG. ENGL. FRENCH GERMAN RUSSIAN CUR KÖR CIRCLE CERCLE KREIS KRUG CORR KEREK ROUND ROND RUND KRUGLEJ CAR KERÉK WHEEL ROUE RAD KOLJESZA CAOR KARIKA HOOP CERCLE
REIFEN,RING OGRUCS CEIRN-ín KORON-g DISC DISQUE SCHEIBE KROG CUIR KER-ing ROTATE TORN-er KREIS-en OKRUZSAT CARR KAR-éj,KÉR-eg CROUST CROÚTE KRUSTE ? CRÓ GYÛRÛ RING BAGUE RING KOLCA CRYCH GYÛRÛS CURLY BOUCLÉ LOCK-ig KUDRAVEJ CORRA KEVER STIR REMU-er BÜHR-en MJEZSAT CORR KER-ül
MOVE MOUVO-ir BEWEG-en DVIGAT CARR GÖRGÕ ROLLER ROULE-ment ROLLE KATUSKA COR CSÖR-öl REEL en-ROUL-er WICKEL-n MOTAT CAR FOR-(o)g TURN TOURN-er WEND-en POVORJACIVAT COR-adh FOR-dul-at TURN TOUR WENDE POVOROT CUAR KANYar, GÖRbe CURVE VIRAGE KURVE KRIVOJ CUAR GÖR-be BENT CROCHU KRUMM KRIVOJ CORR GÖR-bí-tett
CURV-ed COURBÉ ge-KRÜMM-t KRIVOJ CARR-sleamh-na KOR-cso-lya SKATE PATIN SCHLIT(-schuh) ? CORR HOR-og ANGLE CROC HAKEN KRJUG CORR-án SAR-ló SICKEL FAUCILLE SICHEL SZERP CRÚSCA KORSÓ UG, JAR POT KROG KRUSKA CLÍ-ath KER-et FRAME CADRE RAHMEN RAMA CLAÍ, CLA-wdd KER-ít-és FENCE ENCLOS ZAUN ZABOK GORT, GARTH KERT
GARDEN JARDIN GARTEN SZAD CRÓ KARÁM FOLD PARC SCHAUFHÜRDE ZAGON GREAN GÖRÖN-gy GRAVEL MOTTE (Erd-)KLUMPEN GLEJBA CUAR-d-ach KÖR-öz SEARCH RECHERCHES SUCH-en ISZKAT CRÓ CERU-za, KÖR-zõ PEN CRAYON BLEISTIFT KARANDAS CÓRE SZER TREATY TRAITÉ VERTAG DOGOVOR COROÍN KORONA CROWN COURONNE KRONE KARUNA CAER, KER VÁR
FORT FORT BURG GOROD VRAS VÁR-os TOWN VILLE STADT MESTO ( Highlighted words are to show similarities, by the author. ) It's too much coincidence. Too many similar words are between the first two languages and too few with the Indo-European ones. Did both of us take same words from the same source, somewhere in Asia ? Which language is older, the Celtic or the German ? Who borrowed words from who, then ?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/celtling/attachments/20050726/2547959e/attachment.htm>