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<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>P.S.,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Hi again Anne,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>You wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>However, if the quest really is to find primitive
semantic traits, shouldn't there be a multilingual perspective? <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Previous recent discussions on this list convinced me that universal
primitives are to complex and diverse for the tools we have to study in all
languages. My approach is to find an adequate primitive vocabulary that
conveys the meaning within a class defined as extendable and with documented
extension, all in English. There is a better chance of finding an
adequate set of primitives in one precisely used language (i.e. in a recorded
patent document database available to the public). <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>In a multilingual view compounds are problematic
because they vary both semantically and in their construction type and thus do
not constitute a stable category of comparison ('ice cream' is a case in
point). <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Agreed, but using the frequent/rare/other classification based on claim
vocabulary histograms within previously annotated classes of a complete ontology
helps focus in on any specific class, any specific patent, for diversity of
ways in which the primitives are embedded in meanings exchanged by a diversity
of English speakers. That diversity of source documents, and the
negotiation of claim examiners with claim developers, provides a real knowledge
base of English usage in a fully public database of structured and unstructured
text columns. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>In my view, trying to find primitives by studying
compounds is risky, because compounds seem to depend strongly on a language's
morphology which should be considered arbitrary. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>I disagree on the arbitrariness. Consider a collection of corpora
from which the set of adequate primitives is to be extracted to form the
ontolgy. Every corpus is in one language, in this example, but diversity
of expression among phrase authors is more than adequate to provide good
evidence of how that one language is used for a variety of purposes. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Isn't it safer to study the collocational environment
of lexical units as a whole instead of restricting efforts to noun compounds?
One could, for example, construct a similar matrix for verbs that take 'ice
cream' as object or adjectives that combine with the word. But I am not sure
whether this is still the initial idea …? <st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Anne-Kathrin</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Schumann</st1:PlaceName>
<st1:PlaceName w:st="on">PhD</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">student</st1:PlaceName>
<st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:City w:st="on">Leipzig</st1:City>/<st1:place
w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Vienna</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>When are units enough to form a "whole"? I don’t see
a clear demarcation between too much and not enough, other than every person
and every language being represented in the sample database. That is
impractically large for a primitive discovery project in my experience, though
your application area may differ substantially from mine. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>-Rich<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Sincerely,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Rich Cooper<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>EnglishLogicKernel.com<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Rich AT EnglishLogicKernel DOT com<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>9 4 9 \ 5 2 5 - 5 7 1 2<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>-----Original Message-----<br>
From: corpora-bounces@uib.no [mailto:corpora-bounces@uib.no] On Behalf Of Anne-Kathrin
Schumann<br>
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 4:11 AM<br>
To: corpora@uib.no<br>
Subject: [Corpora-List] semantics and alchemy</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Hi, I am really interested in this experiment proposal by
Mr Amsler: "If we take the open compounds from a
machine-readable dictionary and split out of them two lists of first words and
second words, and then create a matrix with the first words as the x-axis and
the second words as the y-axis and the individual cells as a 1 or a 0 dependent
upon whether that compound exists in the dictionary/language or not... What
would a factor analysis of that very sparse binary matrix reveal? Could it
indicate the existence of primitive properties shared by groups of words? (Say
scalar traits for temperature words such as 'hot', 'cool',
'cold')." However, if the quest really is to find primitive
semantic traits, shouldn't there be a multilingual perspective? In a
multilingual view compounds are problematic because they vary both semantically
and in their construction type and thus do not constitute a stable category of
comparison ('ice cream' is a case in point). In my view, trying to find
primitives by studying compounds is risky, because compounds seem to depend
strongly on a language's morphology which should be considered arbitrary. Isn't
it safer to study the collocational environment of lexical units as a whole
instead of restricting efforts to noun compounds? One could, for example,
construct a similar matrix for verbs that take 'ice cream' as object or
adjectives that combine with the word. But I am not sure whether this is still
the initial idea …? <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Anne-Kathrin</st1:PlaceName>
<st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Schumann</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">PhD</st1:PlaceName>
<st1:PlaceName w:st="on">student</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType>
of <st1:City w:st="on">Leipzig</st1:City>/<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Vienna</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>___________________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Empfehlen Sie WEB.DE DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.web.de<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Corpora mailing list<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Corpora@uib.no<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>http://mailman.uib.no/listinfo/corpora<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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