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    <font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Ok, but they don't quote
      empirical evidence that contradicts the Hart & Risley data, do
      they? And they don't mention Gordon Wells's large-scale research
      project in Bristol (England) which did find vocabulary differences
      correlating with social class. Here's what I said about it in my
      1996 Sociolinguistics (2nd edition):<br>
      <br>
      <img src="cid:part1.04060609.01090605@ucl.ac.uk" alt=""><br>
      Here are the references:<br>
      <img src="cid:part2.03090708.04090903@ucl.ac.uk" alt=""><br>
      <br>
      Well worth exploring! <br>
      <br>
      Dick<br>
      <br>
    </font><br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 16/09/2015 15:42, Daniel Ginsberg
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAMsRtf=UY95Y8QnwCbksWmvQX=pf6NLyc_0JOhszUwxHBbvrdA@mail.gmail.com"
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        <div>I think they'd question the empirical basis for that claim.
          It's usually cited to Hart & Risley 1995, which as I
          mentioned is a highly flawed piece of work. Here's a thorough
          critical response to it: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
            href="http://academic.evergreen.edu/curricular/med/LangPoor.pdf">http://academic.evergreen.edu/curricular/med/LangPoor.pdf</a>
          There's a lot there in a relatively short article, but here's
          a key quote for this discussion: <br>
        </div>
        <br>
        <blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px
          solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class="gmail_quote">Many
          educational researchers and policy makers have generalized the
          findings about the language and culture of the 6 welfare
          families in Hart and Risley’s study to all poor families. Yet,
          Hart and Risley offer no compelling reason to believe that the
          poor families they studied have much in common with poor
          families in other communities, or even in Kansas City for that
          matter. The primary selection criterion for participation in
          this study was socioeconomic status; therefore, all the 6
          welfare families had in common was income, a willingness to
          participate in the study, race (all the welfare families were
          Black), and geography (all lived in the Kansas City area).
          Families living in poverty are, however, an ethnically,
          linguistically, and racially diverse group (US Census Bureau,
          2003). Strong claims about the language and culture of
          families living in poverty based on a sample of 6 Black
          welfare families living in Kansas City are unwarranted. (p.
          364)<br>
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          <div class="gmail_signature">
            <div dir="ltr">
              <div>--<br>
                Daniel Ginsberg<br>
                Doctoral candidate, Linguistics<br>
                Georgetown University<br>
              </div>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                href="http://georgetown.academia.edu/DanielGinsberg"
                target="_blank">http://georgetown.academia.edu/DanielGinsberg</a><br>
            </div>
          </div>
        </div>
        <br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 4:22 AM,
          Richard Hudson <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:r.hudson@ucl.ac.uk" target="_blank">r.hudson@ucl.ac.uk</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> <font face="Times
                New Roman, Times, serif">Hello again Daniel. Thanks for
                the interesting link. Would you agree that even these
                researchers accept that poor children reach school with
                fewer words than rich children?<br>
                <br>
                Dick Hudson <br>
                <br>
                <br>
                <br>
                <br>
                <br>
              </font>
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                <div class="h5"><br>
                  <div>On 15/09/2015 21:51, Daniel Ginsberg wrote:<br>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote type="cite">
                    <div dir="ltr">There was an invited forum in Jnl
                      Ling Anth earlier this year that debunked a lot of
                      this "word gap" discourse. I would love to see
                      more public awareness of this, and less uncritical
                      citation of the highly flawed Hart & Risley
                      study.<br>
                      <br>
                      <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jola.12071/full"
                        target="_blank">http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jola.12071/full</a><br>
                    </div>
                    <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                      <div>
                        <div>
                          <div dir="ltr">
                            <div>--<br>
                              Daniel Ginsberg<br>
                              Doctoral candidate, Linguistics<br>
                              Georgetown University<br>
                            </div>
                            <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                              href="http://georgetown.academia.edu/DanielGinsberg"
                              target="_blank">http://georgetown.academia.edu/DanielGinsberg</a><br>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                      <br>
                      <div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at
                        7:27 AM, Francis Hult <span dir="ltr"><<a
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:francis.hult@englund.lu.se"
                            target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:francis.hult@englund.lu.se">francis.hult@englund.lu.se</a></a>></span>
                        wrote:<br>
                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0
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                              <p>[Moderator's note: I post this story
                                because it relates to a discourse that
                                is gaining public traction.  I am
                                reminded of an article that was recently
                                posted to Edling:</p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p>Johnson, E.J. (2015) Debunking the
                                “language gap”. <em>Journal for
                                  Multicultural Education, 9</em>(1),
                                42-50.</p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p>I wonder what perspectives list members
                                working in different research traditions
                                have on this topic.  What additional
                                research findings and ideas should we be
                                getting out to the public and how? 
                                FMH] </p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p>The Atlantic</p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p>Why Boosting Poor Children’s Vocabulary
                                Is Important for Public Health</p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p>Re­search sug­gests that poor chil­dren
                                hear about 600 words per hour, while
                                af­flu­ent chil­dren hear 2,000. By age
                                4, a poor child has a listen­ing
                                vocab­u­lary of about 3,000 words, while
                                a wealth­i­er child wields a 20,000-word
                                listen­ing vocab­u­lary. So it’s no
                                sur­prise that poor chil­dren tend to
                                enter kinder­garten already be­hind
                                their wealth­i­er peers. </p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p>But it’s not just the poverty that
                                holds them back—it’s the lack of words.
                                In fact, the single-best pre­dict­or of
                                a child’s aca­dem­ic suc­cess is not
                                par­ent­al edu­ca­tion or
                                so­cioeco­nom­ic status, but rather the
                                qual­ity and quantity of the words that
                                a baby hears dur­ing his or her first
                                three years.</p>
                              <p> </p>
                              <p>Full story:<br>
                                <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2015/09/georgias-plan-to-close-the-30-million-word-gap-for-kids/403903/"
                                  target="_blank">http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2015/09/georgias-plan-to-close-the-30-million-word-gap-for-kids/403903/</a></p>
                            </div>
                          </div>
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                          <br>
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</pre>
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                  <br>
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              <span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
                  <pre cols="72">-- 
Richard Hudson (<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://dickhudson.com" target="_blank">dickhudson.com</a>)</pre>
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      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
Richard Hudson (dickhudson.com)</pre>
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