From randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu Tue Aug 1 03:05:37 2006 From: randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu (randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu) Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 23:05:37 -0400 Subject: illegal attribute name In-Reply-To: <44CE6C2A.2010900@robertdoerr.de> Message-ID: Hello all, I think that these "keywords" may not be an exhaustive list. I find that I can declare "a," "b," or "d" as a variable. But if I try to use "c" as a variable name I get an error. --Richard Anderson ---------Included Message---------- >Date: 31-Jul-2006 16:48:21 -0400 >From: "Robert D�rr" >To: >Subject: Re: illegal attribute name > >> I couldn't find a complete list of attribute names that are not >> allowed.... >You can find such a list in the E-Basic Help, topic 'Keywords'. > >Robert > > > ---------End of Included Message---------- - Best regards, Richard Anderson From kebir_oussama at yahoo.fr Tue Aug 1 06:30:33 2006 From: kebir_oussama at yahoo.fr (kebir oussama) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 08:30:33 +0200 Subject: about error message when install e prime "key too long for register" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: IT WORKS THANKS Paul Gr a écrit : Just try to install the lates HASP drivers from aladdin before installing eprime: http://www.aladdin.com/support/hasp/hasp4/enduser.asp paul >From: kebir oussama >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Subject: about error message when install e prime "key too long for >register" >Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 19:07:43 +0200 (CEST) > > > Hi, > > I encountered a problem when I tried to install e prime; an error >message appears and contains information that can be understood like "key >too long for register" > > > is there a solution ? > > Oussama KEBIR > Hopital Razi > Tunisia > > >--------------------------------- > Découvrez un nouveau moyen de poser toutes vos questions quelque soit le >sujet ! Yahoo! Questions/Réponses pour partager vos connaissances, vos >opinions et vos expériences. Cliquez ici. --------------------------------- Découvrez un nouveau moyen de poser toutes vos questions quelque soit le sujet ! Yahoo! Questions/Réponses pour partager vos connaissances, vos opinions et vos expériences. Cliquez ici. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From beamgau at gmx.de Tue Aug 1 11:25:10 2006 From: beamgau at gmx.de (Felix Fischer) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:25:10 +0200 Subject: nested lists Message-ID: hi everybody, i got a new problem. ;-) my experiment contains three factors: distance, size and angle. i want to use nested lists to combine every distance with every size with every angle. how to do this? at the moment i've got list1 contains attribute size, then nested list2 with attribute distance and then nested list3 containing different angels. the problem is, that not every combination is presented, but some more than one time. i think, i also tried with three (distance, size, angle) lists nested under one, and got the same problem. thank you for your support f.fischer From anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Tue Aug 1 13:24:00 2006 From: anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com (Tony Zuccolotto) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:24:00 -0400 Subject: nested lists In-Reply-To: <44CF3A16.3000504@gmx.de> Message-ID: Felix, If you want to assure a full & controlled crossing of those factors then you should do the full crossing in a single list and not use nesting. With nesting, each list is sampled independently so (depending on when reshuffles/resets occur within the sampling) you cannot guarantee that all combinations of attributes will be hit. I recommend you take a look at the Factor Table Wizard spreadsheet that is located in the E-Prime program group on the Start menu. Using this utility you can define each factor and its levels independently and then have the wizard do the full crossing for you. You can then copy/paste the cells from the spreadsheet into a List object within E-Prime. This process will save you a lot of typing and potential errors when you have a lot of factors or factors with a lot of levels. Hope that helps, Tony Anthony P. Zuccolotto President and Chief Executive Officer Psychology Software Tools, Inc. 2050 Ardmore Boulevard Suite 200 Pittsburgh, PA 15221-4610 Phone 412-271-5040 FAX 412-271-7077 Email anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Internet http://www.pstnet.com > -----Original Message----- > From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf > Of Felix Fischer > Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 7:25 AM > To: EPRIME at MAIL.TALKBANK.ORG > Subject: nested lists > > hi everybody, > > i got a new problem. ;-) > > my experiment contains three factors: distance, size and angle. i want > to use nested lists to combine every distance with every size with every > angle. > > how to do this? > > at the moment i've got list1 contains attribute size, then nested list2 > with attribute distance and then nested list3 containing different > angels. the problem is, that not every combination is presented, but > some more than one time. > > i think, i also tried with three (distance, size, angle) lists nested > under one, and got the same problem. > > thank you for your support > f.fischer From leisha at decisionresearch.org Tue Aug 1 16:06:00 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:06:00 -0700 Subject: illegal attribute name In-Reply-To: <44CE6C2A.2010900@robertdoerr.de> Message-ID: Thank you, that's good to know. Leisha Robert Dörr wrote: >> I couldn't find a complete list of attribute names that are not >> allowed.... > > You can find such a list in the E-Basic Help, topic 'Keywords'. > > Robert > > From leisha at decisionresearch.org Tue Aug 1 16:38:07 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:38:07 -0700 Subject: illegal attribute name In-Reply-To: <1154401537-1639.022.36-smmsdV2.1.2@smtp.bgsu.edu> Message-ID: Yes, because c is the context! People at the maillist helped me figure that out, but it isn't very evident from the available Help. Leisha randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu wrote: >Hello all, > >I think that these "keywords" may not be an exhaustive list. I find that I can declare "a," "b," >or "d" as a variable. But if I try to use "c" as a variable name I get an error. > >--Richard Anderson > >---------Included Message---------- > > >>Date: 31-Jul-2006 16:48:21 -0400 >>From: "Robert D?rr" >>To: >>Subject: Re: illegal attribute name >> >> >> >>>I couldn't find a complete list of attribute names that are not >>>allowed.... >>> >>> >>You can find such a list in the E-Basic Help, topic 'Keywords'. >> >>Robert >> >> >> >> >> >---------End of Included Message---------- > >- >Best regards, > >Richard Anderson > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wjhall at email.unc.edu Tue Aug 1 17:19:41 2006 From: wjhall at email.unc.edu (Will Hall) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:19:41 -0400 Subject: remove from list Message-ID: I would like to get removed from the E-Prime listserv. Thanks. Will Hall Social Research Assistant Healthy Study School of Nursing University of North Carolina CB #7460, 3600 Carrington Hall Chapel Hill, NC 27599-7460 (919) 966-3610 phone (919) 966-8564 fax wjhall at email.unc.edu From nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca Tue Aug 1 21:07:58 2006 From: nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca (EJ Nikelski) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 17:07:58 -0400 Subject: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object In-Reply-To: <6E3FDD28350CF344AC283906612E40C3682231@ex2.casl.umd.edu> Message-ID: Hi Susan, Yup, that's exactly what I was looking for. One can even use Edit:Experiment:Startup to set a file extension type (e.g. FileExt = .wav or .bmp) and then use [PathName][SoundFileName][FileExt] so that one doesn't need to code the file type in the trial list (important for me, as I present the same stimuli using different modalities). Thanks again. -Jim Susan G. Campbell wrote: > Have you considered setting the path as an attribute as well? That way > you could set the path separately in the list or, say, in the Edit: > Experiment: Startup Info screen. > > I tried setting the SoundOut Filename to [PathName][SoundFileName] and > E-Prime interpreted it correctly, where PathName was the constant > C:\\stimuli\whatever\ and SoundFileName was the name of the wav file. > You could also just put the whole path in SoundFileName, but that could > be problematic if you ever wanted to move the experiment to another > directory. > > Hope this helps, > Susan Campbell > Graduate Research Assistant > University of Maryland > Center for Advanced Study of Language > > -----Original Message----- > From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On > Behalf Of EJ Nikelski > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 5:21 PM > To: Subject: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object > > Hello List, > > I'm a new user, and I've run into a problem that must have a simple > solution ... although I haven't been able to find it. Specifically, I am > > using a SoundOut object to play a wav file for each trial; the wav file > to be played is defined as a trial attribute in the trial list. If I set > > the SoundOut object Filename field to [prime], there is no problem. > > However, when I place my wav files in a separate directory, and I > set the SoundOut Filename to something like > "C:\stimuli\auditory\[prime]", I get a compile error at the following > line: > > primeSoundBuffer.Filename = C:\\stimuli\\auditory\[prime") > > > Note that the line of code has been corrupted (double backslash on > the end missing, double quote inserted, square bracket changed to right > parenthesis). I've tried a few variations on this, but the only thing > that I have gotten working is (1) a completely fixed path wav filename, > and (2) using only the attribute -- which forces all of the wav files to > > be located in my experimental directory. > > I've run out of ideas. Any help would be very appreciated. > > > Thanks, > > > -Jim > > From epetersen99 at hotmail.com Wed Aug 2 00:22:04 2006 From: epetersen99 at hotmail.com (Eric Petersen) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 19:22:04 -0500 Subject: Please remove me from the E-Prime listserv. Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From k.jansonius at planet.nl Wed Aug 2 07:55:44 2006 From: k.jansonius at planet.nl (k. jansonius) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:55:44 +0200 Subject: No subject Message-ID: Please remove me from the talkbank! Thanks in advance! Kino Jansonius -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Wed Aug 2 08:18:21 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:18:21 +0200 Subject: how to unsubscribe from list In-Reply-To: <003801c6b609$0eae6970$4001a8c0@Headstart> Message-ID: if you would like to be removed from the EPrime list you should visit this page: http://step.psy.cmu.edu/eprime.html >From: "k. jansonius" >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 09:55:44 +0200 > >Please remove me from the talkbank! Thanks in advance! > >Kino Jansonius From wendy_davidson79 at hotmail.com Wed Aug 2 10:09:15 2006 From: wendy_davidson79 at hotmail.com (Wendy Davidson) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:09:15 +0100 Subject: specific angles in canvas Message-ID: Hello all, I was hoping someone could help me with my latest problem! I have managed to use the canvas object to design an experiment in which a dot travels along the screen, 'disappears' then reappears following a delay. The subject then indicates whether the dot is following the same trajectory. I want to alter the trajectory by varying levels of difficulty (i.e 30% difference in angular trajectory to 5% difference). So far I can only figure out how to change the x and y coordinates. Is it possible to convert this to angular differences? As usual any help would be gratefully appreciated. Wendy Davidson University of Aberdeen From dhair at wfubmc.edu Wed Aug 2 16:35:59 2006 From: dhair at wfubmc.edu (David Hairston) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:35:59 -0400 Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses Message-ID: I would like to get an externally triggered record of a keyboard press for use with an MEG system. Is there a way to get a time-locked onset signal or "trigger" of a keyboard/mouse response at the time it is made, similar to the .OnsetSignalEnabled property for runnable objects, even if the current object is still executing? Ideally I'd like to have access to the accuracy of said response, evaluate it and send an external digital signal signifying this... but just getting a signal out at all would be workable. I know it can be done easily AFTER the target object has occurred, for example something like "if rresponse.ACC = 1 then WritePort &378, 1". However, this is only (relatively) time-locked w/ the response in the case where the response terminates the object; in the case of a fixed-duration with recorded response, the evaluation/trigger would not occur until afterwards, and hence somewhat later than the actual response time. Does anybody have some insight on a trick to get this? Thanks W. David Hairston, Ph.D. ANSIR Lab Dept of Radiology Wake Forest University School of Medicine Medical Center Blvd Winston-Salem NC 27157 (336) 716-7160 (Offiice) (336) 716 0798 (Fax) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psudevan at uwsp.edu Wed Aug 2 16:56:17 2006 From: psudevan at uwsp.edu (Sudevan, Padmanabhan) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:56:17 -0500 Subject: General Question on Porting E-Prime experiments In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello all, I have a general question on porting a run-time version of an E-Prime experiment. I am giving a talk next week at a conference and, along with the usual information given in a talk about experiments, I would like to have available a working version of the experiments on my Thinkpad laptop, so that I can show what the trials look like, or have colleagues try their hand at the experiment after the talk if they wish to do so. My talk is PowerPoint-based. Now, my plan is to treat the laptop like another subject station machine and load the Run version of E-prime on it, with the hardware key in the laptop for this initial loading. Will this work? Or do I need to have the entire E-Prime software suite on my laptop? Once this is done, can I avoid taking the hardware key ( just as in the lab machines )? Lastly, is this the best way to proceed, or is there some simpler way? Any advice will be welcome. P Sudevan Professor and Chair Department of Psychology University of Wisconsin-Stevens Point -----Original Message----- From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf Of Paul Gr Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 3:18 AM To: k.jansonius at planet.nl; eprime at mail.talkbank.org Subject: how to unsubscribe from list if you would like to be removed from the EPrime list you should visit this page: http://step.psy.cmu.edu/eprime.html >From: "k. jansonius" >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 09:55:44 +0200 > >Please remove me from the talkbank! Thanks in advance! > >Kino Jansonius From Don.Rojas at UCHSC.edu Wed Aug 2 17:30:41 2006 From: Don.Rojas at UCHSC.edu (Don.Rojas at UCHSC.edu) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:30:41 -0600 Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses Message-ID: David, We tried this in our own MEG system and were never successful with respect to accuracy. The keyboard itself is terrible enough with timing, but then the problems you mention emerge. What response device are you using? I'd think not an actual keyboard in the shielded room - perhaps you use the Lumitouch optical device that maps to the keyboard? If so, what we did was have our engineer directly map that device to the MEG external stimulus/response inputs, while preserving the keyboard mapping for eprime. I don't think you'll ever be able to achieve what you want while still preserving accurate timing, but let me know if you think of another clever solution. Don Rojas, Ph.D. Neuromagnetism Laboratory U. of Colorado Health Sciences Center Denver, CO 80220 -----Original Message----- From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf Of David Hairston Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 10:36 AM To: EPRIME at mail.talkbank.org Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses I would like to get an externally triggered record of a keyboard press for use with an MEG system. Is there a way to get a time-locked onset signal or "trigger" of a keyboard/mouse response at the time it is made, similar to the .OnsetSignalEnabled property for runnable objects, even if the current object is still executing? Ideally I'd like to have access to the accuracy of said response, evaluate it and send an external digital signal signifying this... but just getting a signal out at all would be workable. I know it can be done easily AFTER the target object has occurred, for example something like "if rresponse.ACC = 1 then WritePort &378, 1". However, this is only (relatively) time-locked w/ the response in the case where the response terminates the object; in the case of a fixed-duration with recorded response, the evaluation/trigger would not occur until afterwards, and hence somewhat later than the actual response time. Does anybody have some insight on a trick to get this? Thanks W. David Hairston, Ph.D. ANSIR Lab Dept of Radiology Wake Forest University School of Medicine Medical Center Blvd Winston-Salem NC 27157 (336) 716-7160 (Offiice) (336) 716 0798 (Fax) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Wed Aug 2 17:56:40 2006 From: anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com (Tony Zuccolotto) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:56:40 -0400 Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses In-Reply-To: <4CCFAF32FB7B2C449A189C82198E426510963AF3@EXCHVS1.medctr.ad.wfubmc.edu> Message-ID: David, In some experiments you can get reasonable results if you happen to be terminating your stimulus on a key press and then immediately using WritePort as you have described below (whether or not this approach is feasible depends on the nature of your specific paradigm). Another approach you could use would be to set a different duration for the Duration property and the Time Limit property (e.g. 0 for the Duration and 5000ms on the Time Limit). This way you can get into Inline script immediately after the stimulus is presented and then you can poll the Stimulus.InputMask(1).IsPending method to determine when the response is logged and then use WritePort at that time. A more advanced way of getting into an Inline script immediately after the stimulus is displayed is to set your PreRelease property equal to the Duration of the object, e.g. this will allow the current object to display its stimulus, enable any response, and then move on. Overall though I would say the most generic and consistent approach would be to do this via hardware, i.e. take a trigger directly from your input device and give it to both E-Prime and whatever other hardware/software you need to send it to. You don't have many options if you are using a keyboard directly, but you do have options if you are using other types of input devices. PST has various button response system that are targeted at use in fMRI studies which, when used with E-Prime would provide the same accuracy of the PST Serial Response Box and also includes an external digital I/O port which you use to tap directly into the switch signal and provide it to another piece of equipment. Within E-Prime you should be able to add the device to your experiment and tell it to Emulate the Keyboard device and your experiment should continue running as is (but with more consistent timing accuracy than the keyboard can provide). Another alternative would be to create your own switch/input device and wire it up to either a PST Serial Response Box or connect it to the parallel port. You would then use either the SRBOX or Port device respectively in E-Prime, but because you are creating the switch you can take your own signal off the switch and send it to other equipment as needed. Hope that gives you some options. Tony Anthony P. Zuccolotto President and Chief Executive Officer Psychology Software Tools, Inc. 2050 Ardmore Boulevard Suite 200 Pittsburgh, PA 15221-4610 Phone 412-271-5040 FAX 412-271-7077 Email anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Internet http://www.pstnet.com ________________________________ From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf Of David Hairston Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 12:36 PM To: EPRIME at mail.talkbank.org Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses I would like to get an externally triggered record of a keyboard press for use with an MEG system. Is there a way to get a time-locked onset signal or "trigger" of a keyboard/mouse response at the time it is made, similar to the .OnsetSignalEnabled property for runnable objects, even if the current object is still executing? Ideally I'd like to have access to the accuracy of said response, evaluate it and send an external digital signal signifying this... but just getting a signal out at all would be workable. I know it can be done easily AFTER the target object has occurred, for example something like "if rresponse.ACC = 1 then WritePort &378, 1". However, this is only (relatively) time-locked w/ the response in the case where the response terminates the object; in the case of a fixed-duration with recorded response, the evaluation/trigger would not occur until afterwards, and hence somewhat later than the actual response time. Does anybody have some insight on a trick to get this? Thanks W. David Hairston, Ph.D. ANSIR Lab Dept of Radiology Wake Forest University School of Medicine Medical Center Blvd Winston-Salem NC 27157 (336) 716-7160 (Offiice) (336) 716 0798 (Fax) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbedwell at mail.ucf.edu Sun Aug 6 23:01:39 2006 From: jbedwell at mail.ucf.edu (Jeffrey Bedwell) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 19:01:39 -0400 Subject: Eprime Digest - 08/06/06 (out of office) Message-ID: I will be out of the office until 8/10 and may not be able to reply before that time. -Jeff Bedwell >>> eprime 08/06/06 19:00 >>> Eprime Digest - Sunday, August 6, 2006 Re: illegal attribute name by "Robert Dörr" Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object by "EJ Nikelski" RE: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object by "Susan G. Campbell" Re: illegal attribute name by "randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu" RE : RE: about error message when install e prime "key too long for regis by "kebir oussama" nested lists by "Felix Fischer" RE: nested lists by "Tony Zuccolotto" Re: illegal attribute name by "Leisha Wharfield" Re: illegal attribute name by "Leisha Wharfield" remove from list by "Will Hall" Re: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object by "EJ Nikelski" Please remove me from the E-Prime listserv. by "Eric Petersen" (no subject) by "k. jansonius" how to unsubscribe from list by "Paul Gr" specific angles in canvas by "Wendy Davidson" online trigger of keybaord responses by "David Hairston" General Question on Porting E-Prime experiments by "Sudevan, Padmanabhan" RE: online trigger of keybaord responses by RE: online trigger of keybaord responses by "Tony Zuccolotto" From debbie.gilkey at pstnet.com Mon Aug 7 14:50:34 2006 From: debbie.gilkey at pstnet.com (Debbie Gilkey) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 10:50:34 -0400 Subject: PST Job Opportunity Message-ID: Dear Forum Members, PST is looking for a motivated individual to add to our tech support and research development teams. The Technical Consultant position is full time with benefits at our Pittsburgh, PA office. For more information about this position, please browse to http://www.pstnet.com/info/jobs.htm. All interested applicants should send their cover letter and resume to jobs at pstnet.com. Debbie Gilkey Human Resources Administrator ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Psychology Software Tools, Inc. 2050 Ardmore Boulevard Suite 200 Pittsburgh, PA 15221-4610 USA ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit our Web Site for the latest information: > E-Mail: info at pstnet.com Voice: (412) 271-5040 x223 Fax: (412) 271-7077 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From joseph.williams at utoronto.ca Wed Aug 9 12:00:54 2006 From: joseph.williams at utoronto.ca (Joseph Williams) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:00:54 +0200 Subject: Displaying and collecting responses from two objects at the same time Message-ID: I am modifying an experiment where two objects are used at the same time. One is a soundout object that plays a tone and then collects the timed response to that tone (it lasts for about two seconds). The other is either a textdisplay or slide object that shows a word for 200-500 msecs. The way the program is set up now it's not possible to show the text (using either a textdisplay or a textdisplay on a slide object) and play the tone (using a soundout object), at exactly the same time. For the tone to collect a response over a period of 2000 msecs it seems that the duration of the soundout object has to be set to be 2000 msecs (I may be wrong here), so if the tone is played first the textdisplay will only be shown after 2000 msecs. Similarly if the textdisplay is loaded first (e.g. for 200 msecs) the tone is delayed by 200 msecs. If the textdisplay is loaded on a slide (with duration 0 msecs) and then the tone is loaded as a soundout object at the same time, there isn't a way to clear the text from the screen after 200 msecs. If I put both the textdisplay and the soundout object in the same slide, I could use the slide to collect the response to the tone, except that then there's no way to clear the word after 200 msecs. There are some ratches I tried to get this to work, but they're not completely satisfactory. It seems to be a natural thing to use two objects at the same time or to use two objects in overlapping time intervals, without having to load them sequentially- the sequential loading means that an object cannot be loaded while another object is still in action. Is there a way to use both a soundout object and a textdisplay (or slide) object at the same time, without forcing the loading of one of these objects to wait until the other's duration has been completed? Thanks in advance, Joseph Williams -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dap at wjh.harvard.edu Wed Aug 9 23:59:14 2006 From: dap at wjh.harvard.edu (Diego Pizzagalli) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 19:59:14 -0400 Subject: Away from my mail Message-ID: Thank you for your message. Please note that I will be out of the office until August 22 and will not be checking email regularly. For urgent matters, please contact Elena Goetz (egoetz at wjh.harvard.edu) or Jeffrey Birk (birk at wjh.harvard.edu), (617) 384-9841. From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Fri Aug 11 07:58:53 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:58:53 +0200 Subject: Displaying and collecting responses from two objects at the same time In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Joseph, I think this should be possible though. To start with, you could place the sound object before the stimulus object and set the duration to zero. You would also have to set the ‘stopafter’ property to ‘no’ to prevent immediate termination of the sound itself. Then add an input object such as a keyboard and set the time limit to the duration of the required time window (i.e. 2000). You can add the stimulus object (with duration 200) and an empty text object (duration 1800) after the sound object. That should do the trick. There is only one thing that could be a bit tricky: By default the end action property of the input object is set to ‘terminate’. This could be a problem because only the active object will be terminated. If the response occurs during playback of the stimulus (rt<200), then only the stimulus will be terminated and the second object (empty screen for 1800ms) will be played as usual. A bit of scripting could solve this. best, Paul >From: "Joseph Williams" >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Subject: Displaying and collecting responses from two objects at the same >time >Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:00:54 +0200 > >I am modifying an experiment where two objects are used at the same time. >One is a soundout object that plays a tone and then collects the timed >response to that tone (it lasts for about two seconds). The other is either >a textdisplay or slide object that shows a word for 200-500 msecs. The way >the program is set up now it's not possible to show the text (using either >a >textdisplay or a textdisplay on a slide object) and play the tone (using a >soundout object), at exactly the same time. > >For the tone to collect a response over a period of 2000 msecs it seems >that >the duration of the soundout object has to be set to be 2000 msecs (I may >be >wrong here), so if the tone is played first the textdisplay will only be >shown after 2000 msecs. Similarly if the textdisplay is loaded first (e.g. >for 200 msecs) the tone is delayed by 200 msecs. If the textdisplay is >loaded on a slide (with duration 0 msecs) and then the tone is loaded as a >soundout object at the same time, there isn't a way to clear the text from >the screen after 200 msecs. If I put both the textdisplay and the soundout >object in the same slide, I could use the slide to collect the response to >the tone, except that then there's no way to clear the word after 200 >msecs. > >There are some ratches I tried to get this to work, but they're not >completely satisfactory. It seems to be a natural thing to use two objects >at the same time or to use two objects in overlapping time intervals, >without having to load them sequentially- the sequential loading means that >an object cannot be loaded while another object is still in action. Is >there >a way to use both a soundout object and a textdisplay (or slide) object at >the same time, without forcing the loading of one of these objects to wait >until the other's duration has been completed? > >Thanks in advance, > >Joseph Williams From nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca Tue Aug 15 14:40:34 2006 From: nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca (EJ Nikelski) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 10:40:34 -0400 Subject: Response times on the USB bus Message-ID: Hi All, I believe that I have a very simple question, although a search of the E-Prime Knowledge Base (and and this List's archive) could not provide me with an answer. The question is one relating to using a USB mouse as a response device; specifically, can we? I am asking the List, as I would like to get the opinions of researchers who (1) are using various response devices - and therefore have likely given this some thought, and (2) do not have an interest in trying to sell me a button box. The PST User Guide appears clear on this (page A-16), noting that the approx. 100 ms response delay in addition to a std dev of 8 ms, makes a mouse inappropriate when ms accuracy is required. I see a few problems here: (1) I believe that the 100 ms delay is of little concern to many researchers, as long as the delay is constant -- it's the 8 ms SD that is of concern, as it adds unwanted noise to the signal. (2) PST used a PS/2 mouse in their tests -- most modern mice (mouses?) use USB. How does a USB mouse perform? If you take a look at the Lancaster University web site (www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/research/reactionTimes/input.html) they seem to suggest that USB mice will produce a variance in RT ranging from 0 to 8 ms, which is a direct result of the 125 ms polling interval used by Windows XP when sampling USB devices. This polling frequency can, however, be changed, as the USB standard allows for a 1 ms polling rate (1000 Hz) (apparently, some gamers do this). (3) PST got excellent results using a keyboard as a response device, which is surprising, as the sampling rate of a PS/2 keyboard is actually lower than that of a USB mouse (according to Lancaster University). In addition, as most modern keyboards now also use USB, I cannot see how the response time of a USB keyboard would be better than that of a USB mouse. (4) PST did all of their timing tests on Windows 98. The code base of Windows XP shares nothing in common at all with the old DOS-based Windows OSes (Win 98, 95, 3.1, etc). Timing values derived on these ancient OSes cannot be extended to Win XP. Sorry for the lengthy e-mail, but I wanted to present my question clearly. So ... what does the List think of using USB devices (including both mice and keyboards) for data collection? Is anyone changing their USB sampling rates prior to running subjects in order to address the 125 Hz default sampling-induced response variance? How are you doing this? Has anyone used some of the high-sampling-rate gaming mice (e.g. the Logitech Laser mouse G5can sample at 500 Hz)? Any ideas and/or suggestions would be welcome. -Jim -- Jim Nikelski, Ph.D. Postdoctoral Research Fellow Bloomfield Centre for Research in Aging Lady Davis Institute for Medical Research Sir Mortimer B. Davis - Jewish General Hospital McGill University Tel: (514) 340-8222 x 2298 Fax: (514) 340-8295 From leisha at decisionresearch.org Tue Aug 15 15:40:34 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:40:34 -0700 Subject: Response times on the USB bus In-Reply-To: <44E1DCE2.2050703@bic.mni.mcgill.ca> Message-ID: I'm also interested in the responses you get to this question. Input devices & timing are ongoing questions. Thanks, Leisha EJ Nikelski wrote: > Hi All, > > I believe that I have a very simple question, although a search of > the E-Prime Knowledge Base (and and this List's archive) could not > provide me with an answer. The question is one relating to using a USB > mouse as a response device; specifically, can we? I am asking the > List, as I would like to get the opinions of researchers who (1) are > using various response devices - and therefore have likely given this > some thought, and (2) do not have an interest in trying to sell me a > button box. > > The PST User Guide appears clear on this (page A-16), noting that > the approx. 100 ms response delay in addition to a std dev of 8 ms, > makes a mouse inappropriate when ms accuracy is required. I see a few > problems here: > > (1) I believe that the 100 ms delay is of little concern to many > researchers, as long as the delay is constant -- it's the 8 ms SD that > is of concern, as it adds unwanted noise to the signal. > > (2) PST used a PS/2 mouse in their tests -- most modern mice (mouses?) > use USB. How does a USB mouse perform? If you take a look at the > Lancaster University web site > (www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/research/reactionTimes/input.html) they seem to > suggest that USB mice will produce a variance in RT ranging from 0 to > 8 ms, which is a direct result of the 125 ms polling interval used by > Windows XP when sampling USB devices. This polling frequency can, > however, be changed, as the USB standard allows for a 1 ms polling > rate (1000 Hz) (apparently, some gamers do this). > > (3) PST got excellent results using a keyboard as a response device, > which is surprising, as the sampling rate of a PS/2 keyboard is > actually lower than that of a USB mouse (according to Lancaster > University). In addition, as most modern keyboards now also use USB, I > cannot see how the response time of a USB keyboard would be better > than that of a USB mouse. > > (4) PST did all of their timing tests on Windows 98. The code base of > Windows XP shares nothing in common at all with the old DOS-based > Windows OSes (Win 98, 95, 3.1, etc). Timing values derived on these > ancient OSes cannot be extended to Win XP. > > > Sorry for the lengthy e-mail, but I wanted to present my question > clearly. So ... what does the List think of using USB devices > (including both mice and keyboards) for data collection? Is anyone > changing their USB sampling rates prior to running subjects in order > to address the 125 Hz default sampling-induced response variance? How > are you doing this? Has anyone used some of the high-sampling-rate > gaming mice (e.g. the Logitech Laser mouse G5can sample at 500 Hz)? > Any ideas and/or suggestions would be welcome. > > > -Jim > > From mooreks at umich.edu Wed Aug 16 17:49:00 2006 From: mooreks at umich.edu (Katherine Sledge Moore) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:49:00 -0400 Subject: "sound device not set to open" Message-ID: Hi all, I am trying to use sound in my most recent eprime program, and when I try to generate the script, I get an error message that says, "A fatal error occurred while generating the initialization code for E-Object "ResponseClick": Cannot generate code due to sound device not set to open." Any thoughts on what I'm supposed to do to get the sound device to be set to open? I've used sounds in the past without a problem, so I don't know what is going on now. Thanks. Katherine Sledge Moore Department of Psychology PhD Student, Cognition and Perception http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Thu Aug 17 06:41:37 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:41:37 +0200 Subject: "sound device not set to open" In-Reply-To: <000c01c6c15c$42bfb5d0$2a04d38d@psycjjonides14> Message-ID: hi Katherine, This is exactly the same message EPrime will show when you didn't configure (and enable!) the Sound device yet. You can do this in Menu->Edit->Expiriments->Devices. Also make sure that the sound format (mono/stereo, sample rate and #bits) of the wave file(s) match the configuration of the Sound device. best, paul >From: "Katherine Sledge Moore" >To: >Subject: "sound device not set to open" >Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:49:00 -0400 > >Hi all, > >I am trying to use sound in my most recent eprime program, and when I try >to >generate the script, I get an error message that says, "A fatal error >occurred while generating the initialization code for E-Object >"ResponseClick": Cannot generate code due to sound device not set to open." >Any thoughts on what I'm supposed to do to get the sound device to be set >to >open? I've used sounds in the past without a problem, so I don't know what >is going on now. Thanks. > >Katherine Sledge Moore >Department of Psychology >PhD Student, Cognition and Perception >http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks > > > From n490b at unb.ca Thu Aug 17 11:35:26 2006 From: n490b at unb.ca (Jones, Stephanie) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:35:26 -0300 Subject: Question Message-ID: Hello, I was wondering if it is possible to instruct E Prime, running off of one hard drive, to display two different series of images at the same time, one series on one monitor and a second series on a second monitor? Thanks, Stephanie Jones University of New Brunswick, Saint John From brandon_cernicky at yahoo.com Fri Aug 18 10:31:46 2006 From: brandon_cernicky at yahoo.com (Brandon Cernicky) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 03:31:46 -0700 Subject: Response times on the USB bus In-Reply-To: <40401.41312@mail.talkbank.org> Message-ID: Hi Nick, The following is a reply to the questions you asked via E-Prime Web Support. Your questions appear to be identical to the ones you posted to the Talkbank forum with additional A/B/C questions posted only in Web Support (included below). I am responding to both Web Support and the Talkbank forum so that others may share in this information. PST cannot make a blanket statement that a PS/2 or USB device (keyboard, mouse, or otherwise) will perform adequately for a specific paradigm. In the Spring of 2006, PST conducted another batch of internal timing tests with a batch of responses devices we keep on hand. These devices were modified by the EE group at PST to be able to simulate a human response when triggered by a port (parallel, BBTK, etc). A short summary of the response device latency test can be viewed at http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/timing/. One can note that each device has its own timing characteristics depending on the machine class and operating system. Significant differences can be viewed between devices of the same class. For example, on a 3GHZ XP system, a modern Dell USB Keyboard has an average of 13.98 ms and a stddev of 0.74. On the same machine running a Belkin USB keyboard, the numbers reported increase to 39.84 average with a stddev of 8.30. The same differences can be viewed with USB mice of different manufactures and models. Response devices of the exact model (e.g. two MS Intellimouse Optical) may have different timing characteristics depending on lot number and other variations. A reference to these types of issues are discussed in the paper “How choice of mouse may effect response timing in psychological studies” (Plant, R. R., Hammond, N. V. and Whitehouse T. (2003), Behavior Research Methods, Instruments and Computers) There are a number of factors on how USB devices communicate in Windows. The operating system version, USB version (1.1, 2.0), the USB mode speed, and the device driver are all variables. The following is an edited summary from Andrew Sobotka, Computer Engineer, Electronics Engineer at Psychology Software Tools: USB 1.1 has low-speed and full-speed devices. Low- and full-speed devices can be polled at a maximum rate of 1 khz, but (reports indicate) that Windows XP caps low-speed HID at 125 hz (8ms). USB 2.0 supports low-, full-, and hi-speed devices. Low- and full-speed devices are still polled at 1 khz max, but a hi-speed device can be polled at 8 khz. Interrupt Endpoints are defined in USB that the device informs the host about how often it wants to be polled, at a minimum. This information comes from a descriptor which is stored locally in the device's memory. Therefore a gaming mouse will probably have much better performance, because its descriptors will specify a minimum polling rate of e.g. 500 hz. To achieve rates higher than 125 hz (8ms), the standard HID driver in Windows may not be able to be used and will require a custom driver offered by the manufacture of the device. A USB device (mouse or keyboard) with an interrupt endpoint will inform Windows about how often it wants polled. A USB Host Controller will make sure that there is bandwidth available for that packet at the requested polling rate, as that's what the rate is for. A USB keyboard could have a better response time than a USB mouse, because they use different descriptors which specify different polling times. Additionally, although the USB device is successfully sending data at the polling rate requested by the device, Windows may or may not process the data at the USB polling rate. For more information on what a HID is, please view http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_human_interface_device_class. Please note that a system that offers USB 2.0 ports and has a mixture of USB 1.1 and 2.0 compliant devices attached may perform differently when only USB 2.0 devices are attached than when USB 2.0 and USB 1.1 devices are attached since the USB host controller must adjust to the 1.1 specifications. Psychology Software Tools encourages researchers to conduct timing tests on the equipment (machine, device, etc) used in their paradigms and indicate information about those devices in the Methods section for replication of studies. A blanket statement cannot be issued for a specific response device, machine class, or operating system. Modern response devices when compared to the response devices collected in the circa 2000 E-Prime 1.0 documentation have a much lower average and stddev values, but also continue to have discrepancies between device class, operating system, and machine. The remainder of this text is in regards to replies to your specific questions (authored by Brandon Cernicky and AJ Sobotka of Psychology Software Tools): (2) PST used a PS/2 mouse in their tests -- most modern mice (mouses?) use USB. How does a USB mouse perform? If you take a look at the Lancaster University web site (www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/research/reactionTimes/input.html) they seem to suggest that USB mice will produce a variance in RT ranging from 0 to 8 ms, which is a direct result of the 125 ms polling interval used by Windows XP when sampling USB devices. This polling frequency can, however, be changed, as the USB 2.0 standard allows for a 1 ms polling rate (1000 Hz) (apparently, some gamers do this). [Brandon] The response devices and machine classes used in the E-Prime 1.0 Documentation were of circa 2000. Nearly all modern response devices and machines today outperform those numbers by an order of magnitude. The figures reported in the timing tests we conducted in Spring 2006 http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/timing/ show that it is possible to achieve a stddev of < 1 ms. (3) PST got excellent results using a keyboard as a response device, which is surprising, as the sampling rate of a PS/2 keyboard is actually lower than that of a USB mouse (according to Lancaster University). In addition, as most modern keyboards now also use USB, I cannot see how the response time of a USB keyboard would be better than that of a USB mouse. [Brandon] The type of results are device specific. A bargain keyboard purchased at a department store may have components that are not higher performance than one purchased from a PC manufacture. The speed of any keyboard relates to the circuitry on how quickly the devices receive the keys. A less efficient keyboard may scan each key. More modern keyboards use a matrix with higher speed integrated circuits. AJ Sobotka indicates that USB Keyboard replies are typically 10 bytes, depending on how they are built. (4) PST did all of their timing tests on Windows 98. The code base of Windows XP shares nothing in common at all with the old DOS-based Windows OSes (Win 98, 95, 3.1, etc). Timing values derived on these ancient OSes cannot be extended to Win XP. Furthermore, I understand that Win 2000 and 98SE polled the USB bus more frequently than Win XP currently does. Is this true? Would running Win 2000 with a USB high poll rate mouse provide less variability in the response times? [Brandon] Your observation about the different operating system architecture is accurate. To provide application threads more time, Windows 2000/XP do permit the operating system to take control for a larger time, but are overall/time can be more accurate because operating system communication like this may occur less often. Running the PST Refresh Clock Test experiment on the same machine running 98/XP will show in the resultant edat file that the XP will likely have more ticks in the lower bins but will have a few values in the higher bin counts. The figures reported in the timing tests we conducted in Spring 2006 http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/timing/ show that it is possible to achieve low average and stdev values for response devices. For example, using a parallel port as a response device in XP had an average and stdev response time latency values both < 1 ms. So, in sum, my (additional) questions are: (A) What is PST's current opinion with regard to using USB devices (including both mice and keyboards) for data collection? And why? [Brandon] Refer to the comments at the top of this text. (B) Has PST tech heard of anyone changing their USB sampling rates prior to running subjects in order to address the 125 Hz default sampling-induced response variance? How is this best done? [Brandon] We have had no reports about end users attempting to do this and at this time would not encourage this attempt as there are more straightforward routes (SRBOX, gaming mice, etc). (C) Can PST recommend any of the high-sampling-rate gaming mice? For example, the Logitech Laser mouse G5 can sample at 500 Hz. [Brandon] PST at this time does not recommend any mice. Besides the mouse you mentioned, there appears to be good information from the Razer Copperhead. http://www.everythingusb.com/razer_copperhead.html. If PST in the future obtains a high performance gaming mouse, it will perform timing tests on the device and report the results. -Brandon ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Brandon S. Cernicky Senior Software Engineer Psychology Software Tools __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From mooreks at umich.edu Fri Aug 18 13:52:29 2006 From: mooreks at umich.edu (Katherine Sledge Moore) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:52:29 -0400 Subject: setting procedure and weight attributes Message-ID: Is it possible to set the values of the procedure or weight attributes using in line code, the way you can for other variables? The problem I see is that inline code can only be used to modify the attributes of the current level, not the level below, but it's self-referential to modify the weight of the procedure you're currently operating on (or to set it to a different procedure altogether!) So, is there an exception built into Eprime wherein one can set these values using code at a level above? For my issue I am most interested in the weight setting, but I'm curious about the procedure setting as well. Katherine Sledge Moore Department of Psychology PhD Student, Cognition and Perception http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Sun Aug 20 13:09:08 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:09:08 +0200 Subject: setting procedure and weight attributes In-Reply-To: <000001c6c2cd$8ddf1750$6c01a8c0@psycjjonides14> Message-ID: hi Katherine, Because EPrime prepares List objects once before executing, it is not possible to change weight and procedure configurations on the fly. There are special functions which you can call to change those settings (List.SetWeight, List.SetProc, ...), but they should be called before the list is reset and activated. So, if you would like to change the trial order and run count (weight) while the list is already running, then you will have to implement some kind of workaround. One thing you could do is the following: Just create a List object for playing your trials (i.e. TrialList) and define one level with and a procedure called TrialProc. Then place a new List object (called CaseList for example) on the timeline of this TrialProc. This sub list will be used to select and play one of the possible trial types you are going to implement each time the TrialProc runs. Then add a new level to CaseList for each trial type and implement the procedures. In the attached example I’ve created only two types: Proc1 and Proc2. Now you will have to add some script to select one of the levels of the CaseList. To do this you should insert an inline script icon before in TrialProc before CaseList. The following code is an example for randomly selecting one of the two levels in the example script: Dim NextCase as integer NextCase = Random(1,2) Set CaseList.Order = OffsetOrder(NextCase) Set CaseList.TerminateCondition = Samples(1) CaseList.Reset The construction with CaseList is very similar to the ‘Case-Select’ construction of the Basic language (or the switch construction of C/C++): only one specific item of a given list will be selected at runtime for execution. You can use the ‘Exit list’ properties of TrialList to specify the termination condition as usual. However, if you also would like to have more control of the termination of the list, then you can use the Terminate function of TrialList to exit the list on the fly. For example, the following script will terminate the list as soon as trial type 1 is played 3 times: ' as an example, this experiment terminates as soon as trial type 1 is executed 3 times if NextCase=1 then ' TrialType1Count is a global variable (see User Section) TrialType1Count = TrialType1Count + 1 if TrialType1Count=3 then TrialList.Terminate ' stop when this trial has finished end if end if To prevent early termination, I've also set the exit list property (cycle count) to 1000. I’ve attached a simple example script. (This will probably be filtered out on the eprime list) Hope this helps, Paul Groot Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam >From: "Katherine Sledge Moore" >To: >Subject: setting procedure and weight attributes >Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:52:29 -0400 > >Is it possible to set the values of the procedure or weight attributes >using >in line code, the way you can for other variables? > >The problem I see is that inline code can only be used to modify the >attributes of the current level, not the level below, but it's >self-referential to modify the weight of the procedure you're currently >operating on (or to set it to a different procedure altogether!) > >So, is there an exception built into Eprime wherein one can set these >values >using code at a level above? For my issue I am most interested in the >weight >setting, but I'm curious about the procedure setting as well. > >Katherine Sledge Moore >Department of Psychology >PhD Student, Cognition and Perception >http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks > > > From jmrnak at siu.edu Thu Aug 24 18:05:07 2006 From: jmrnak at siu.edu (jmrnak at siu.edu) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:05:07 -0500 Subject: IAT in E-Prime? In-Reply-To: <97187.51812@mail.talkbank.org> Message-ID: Hello all, I am writing to inquire whether the Implicit Association Task (IAT) is currently in existence in E-Prime. I have run across some discussion of this very issue on the web back in October of 2003, but I've had no luck actually finding a script. I would greatly appreciate a copy of the EBS file, if anyone is willing to share, or any suggestions on where one may be found. Many thanks, Jennifer Mrnak, M.A. Doctoral Candidate Department of Psychology Southern Illinois University Carbondale 618-453-3585 jmrnak at siu.edu From leisha at decisionresearch.org Thu Aug 24 18:23:49 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:23:49 -0700 Subject: IAT in E-Prime? In-Reply-To: <1156442707-17514.00026.00035-smmsdV2.1.6@saluki-mailhub.siu.edu> Message-ID: I knew that was familiar! We looked at using IAT back in 2003. Dr. Greenwald has a site where you can learn all about it and try the test on yourself at http://projectimplicit.net/nosek/iat/. He's very helpful and friendly. Unfortunately for us E-Primers, he uses Inquisit. Leisha jmrnak at siu.edu wrote: >Hello all, > >I am writing to inquire whether the Implicit Association Task >(IAT) is currently in existence in E-Prime. I have run across >some discussion of this very issue on the web back in October >of 2003, but I've had no luck actually finding a script. I >would greatly appreciate a copy of the EBS file, if anyone is >willing to share, or any suggestions on where one may be found. > >Many thanks, > >Jennifer Mrnak, M.A. >Doctoral Candidate >Department of Psychology >Southern Illinois University Carbondale >618-453-3585 >jmrnak at siu.edu > > > > > > From nstrang at wisc.edu Fri Aug 25 20:17:23 2006 From: nstrang at wisc.edu (Nicole Strang) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:17:23 -0500 Subject: problem with c.GetAttrib function and RT data Message-ID: Hi all, I am trying to have a running average of a participants reaction time so that the duration of a trial can be adjusted based on a subjects performance. I think I know how to do this, however I am unable to get the RT data. One issue that I thought may be a problem is that the RT data comes from an object with an infinite duration, however when I look at a data file the RT data appears to be completely appropriate. What I have right now (although I have tried a number of different approaches) is in the user tab I define my variable dim nSingleRT as long 'In an inline prior to the beginning of the block nSingleRT=0 'In an inline at the very end of the trial nSingleRT=c.GetAttrib("Math.RT") Debug.Print nSingleRT In the debug tab I get all zeros. I have tried using the summation function, but had no more success. To try and better ascertain the nature of the problem, I replace Math.RT with MathList and the attributes were collected without any problem. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks very much! Nicole -- Nicole Strang Graduate Student Child Emotion Research Lab University of Wisconsin-Madison 1202 West Johnson St. Madison, Wisconsin 53706 Lab Phone: (608) 262-6647 Fax: (608) 262-4029 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From leisha at decisionresearch.org Fri Aug 25 21:21:42 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 14:21:42 -0700 Subject: problem with c.GetAttrib function and RT data In-Reply-To: <6924dfda0608251317q70d46decg195238d050fc4415@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Nicole, I think you may have a syntax problem. The RT is a number not a string, so you don't need the quote marks. I think that nSingleRT = Math.RT will do it. Leisha Nicole Strang wrote: > Hi all, > > I am trying to have a running average of a participants reaction time > so that the duration of a trial can be adjusted based on a subjects > performance. I think I know how to do this, however I am unable to get > the RT data. One issue that I thought may be a problem is that the RT > data comes from an object with an infinite duration, however when I > look at a data file the RT data appears to be completely appropriate. > What I have right now (although I have tried a number of different > approaches) is in the user tab I define my variable > dim nSingleRT as long > > 'In an inline prior to the beginning of the block > nSingleRT=0 > > 'In an inline at the very end of the trial > nSingleRT=c.GetAttrib ("Math.RT") > Debug.Print nSingleRT > > In the debug tab I get all zeros. I have tried using the summation > function, but had no more success. To try and better ascertain the > nature of the problem, I replace Math.RT with MathList and the > attributes were collected without any problem. Any help would be > greatly appreciated. > Thanks very much! > Nicole > -- > Nicole Strang > Graduate Student > Child Emotion Research Lab > University of Wisconsin-Madison > 1202 West Johnson St. > Madison, Wisconsin 53706 > Lab Phone: (608) 262-6647 > Fax: (608) 262-4029 From randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu Tue Aug 1 03:05:37 2006 From: randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu (randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu) Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2006 23:05:37 -0400 Subject: illegal attribute name In-Reply-To: <44CE6C2A.2010900@robertdoerr.de> Message-ID: Hello all, I think that these "keywords" may not be an exhaustive list. I find that I can declare "a," "b," or "d" as a variable. But if I try to use "c" as a variable name I get an error. --Richard Anderson ---------Included Message---------- >Date: 31-Jul-2006 16:48:21 -0400 >From: "Robert D?rr" >To: >Subject: Re: illegal attribute name > >> I couldn't find a complete list of attribute names that are not >> allowed.... >You can find such a list in the E-Basic Help, topic 'Keywords'. > >Robert > > > ---------End of Included Message---------- - Best regards, Richard Anderson From kebir_oussama at yahoo.fr Tue Aug 1 06:30:33 2006 From: kebir_oussama at yahoo.fr (kebir oussama) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 08:30:33 +0200 Subject: about error message when install e prime "key too long for register" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: IT WORKS THANKS Paul Gr a ?crit : Just try to install the lates HASP drivers from aladdin before installing eprime: http://www.aladdin.com/support/hasp/hasp4/enduser.asp paul >From: kebir oussama >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Subject: about error message when install e prime "key too long for >register" >Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 19:07:43 +0200 (CEST) > > > Hi, > > I encountered a problem when I tried to install e prime; an error >message appears and contains information that can be understood like "key >too long for register" > > > is there a solution ? > > Oussama KEBIR > Hopital Razi > Tunisia > > >--------------------------------- > D?couvrez un nouveau moyen de poser toutes vos questions quelque soit le >sujet ! Yahoo! Questions/R?ponses pour partager vos connaissances, vos >opinions et vos exp?riences. Cliquez ici. --------------------------------- D?couvrez un nouveau moyen de poser toutes vos questions quelque soit le sujet ! Yahoo! Questions/R?ponses pour partager vos connaissances, vos opinions et vos exp?riences. Cliquez ici. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From beamgau at gmx.de Tue Aug 1 11:25:10 2006 From: beamgau at gmx.de (Felix Fischer) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:25:10 +0200 Subject: nested lists Message-ID: hi everybody, i got a new problem. ;-) my experiment contains three factors: distance, size and angle. i want to use nested lists to combine every distance with every size with every angle. how to do this? at the moment i've got list1 contains attribute size, then nested list2 with attribute distance and then nested list3 containing different angels. the problem is, that not every combination is presented, but some more than one time. i think, i also tried with three (distance, size, angle) lists nested under one, and got the same problem. thank you for your support f.fischer From anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Tue Aug 1 13:24:00 2006 From: anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com (Tony Zuccolotto) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:24:00 -0400 Subject: nested lists In-Reply-To: <44CF3A16.3000504@gmx.de> Message-ID: Felix, If you want to assure a full & controlled crossing of those factors then you should do the full crossing in a single list and not use nesting. With nesting, each list is sampled independently so (depending on when reshuffles/resets occur within the sampling) you cannot guarantee that all combinations of attributes will be hit. I recommend you take a look at the Factor Table Wizard spreadsheet that is located in the E-Prime program group on the Start menu. Using this utility you can define each factor and its levels independently and then have the wizard do the full crossing for you. You can then copy/paste the cells from the spreadsheet into a List object within E-Prime. This process will save you a lot of typing and potential errors when you have a lot of factors or factors with a lot of levels. Hope that helps, Tony Anthony P. Zuccolotto President and Chief Executive Officer Psychology Software Tools, Inc. 2050 Ardmore Boulevard Suite 200 Pittsburgh, PA 15221-4610 Phone 412-271-5040 FAX 412-271-7077 Email anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Internet http://www.pstnet.com > -----Original Message----- > From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf > Of Felix Fischer > Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 7:25 AM > To: EPRIME at MAIL.TALKBANK.ORG > Subject: nested lists > > hi everybody, > > i got a new problem. ;-) > > my experiment contains three factors: distance, size and angle. i want > to use nested lists to combine every distance with every size with every > angle. > > how to do this? > > at the moment i've got list1 contains attribute size, then nested list2 > with attribute distance and then nested list3 containing different > angels. the problem is, that not every combination is presented, but > some more than one time. > > i think, i also tried with three (distance, size, angle) lists nested > under one, and got the same problem. > > thank you for your support > f.fischer From leisha at decisionresearch.org Tue Aug 1 16:06:00 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:06:00 -0700 Subject: illegal attribute name In-Reply-To: <44CE6C2A.2010900@robertdoerr.de> Message-ID: Thank you, that's good to know. Leisha Robert D?rr wrote: >> I couldn't find a complete list of attribute names that are not >> allowed.... > > You can find such a list in the E-Basic Help, topic 'Keywords'. > > Robert > > From leisha at decisionresearch.org Tue Aug 1 16:38:07 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:38:07 -0700 Subject: illegal attribute name In-Reply-To: <1154401537-1639.022.36-smmsdV2.1.2@smtp.bgsu.edu> Message-ID: Yes, because c is the context! People at the maillist helped me figure that out, but it isn't very evident from the available Help. Leisha randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu wrote: >Hello all, > >I think that these "keywords" may not be an exhaustive list. I find that I can declare "a," "b," >or "d" as a variable. But if I try to use "c" as a variable name I get an error. > >--Richard Anderson > >---------Included Message---------- > > >>Date: 31-Jul-2006 16:48:21 -0400 >>From: "Robert D?rr" >>To: >>Subject: Re: illegal attribute name >> >> >> >>>I couldn't find a complete list of attribute names that are not >>>allowed.... >>> >>> >>You can find such a list in the E-Basic Help, topic 'Keywords'. >> >>Robert >> >> >> >> >> >---------End of Included Message---------- > >- >Best regards, > >Richard Anderson > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wjhall at email.unc.edu Tue Aug 1 17:19:41 2006 From: wjhall at email.unc.edu (Will Hall) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:19:41 -0400 Subject: remove from list Message-ID: I would like to get removed from the E-Prime listserv. Thanks. Will Hall Social Research Assistant Healthy Study School of Nursing University of North Carolina CB #7460, 3600 Carrington Hall Chapel Hill, NC 27599-7460 (919) 966-3610 phone (919) 966-8564 fax wjhall at email.unc.edu From nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca Tue Aug 1 21:07:58 2006 From: nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca (EJ Nikelski) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 17:07:58 -0400 Subject: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object In-Reply-To: <6E3FDD28350CF344AC283906612E40C3682231@ex2.casl.umd.edu> Message-ID: Hi Susan, Yup, that's exactly what I was looking for. One can even use Edit:Experiment:Startup to set a file extension type (e.g. FileExt = .wav or .bmp) and then use [PathName][SoundFileName][FileExt] so that one doesn't need to code the file type in the trial list (important for me, as I present the same stimuli using different modalities). Thanks again. -Jim Susan G. Campbell wrote: > Have you considered setting the path as an attribute as well? That way > you could set the path separately in the list or, say, in the Edit: > Experiment: Startup Info screen. > > I tried setting the SoundOut Filename to [PathName][SoundFileName] and > E-Prime interpreted it correctly, where PathName was the constant > C:\\stimuli\whatever\ and SoundFileName was the name of the wav file. > You could also just put the whole path in SoundFileName, but that could > be problematic if you ever wanted to move the experiment to another > directory. > > Hope this helps, > Susan Campbell > Graduate Research Assistant > University of Maryland > Center for Advanced Study of Language > > -----Original Message----- > From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On > Behalf Of EJ Nikelski > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 5:21 PM > To: Subject: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object > > Hello List, > > I'm a new user, and I've run into a problem that must have a simple > solution ... although I haven't been able to find it. Specifically, I am > > using a SoundOut object to play a wav file for each trial; the wav file > to be played is defined as a trial attribute in the trial list. If I set > > the SoundOut object Filename field to [prime], there is no problem. > > However, when I place my wav files in a separate directory, and I > set the SoundOut Filename to something like > "C:\stimuli\auditory\[prime]", I get a compile error at the following > line: > > primeSoundBuffer.Filename = C:\\stimuli\\auditory\[prime") > > > Note that the line of code has been corrupted (double backslash on > the end missing, double quote inserted, square bracket changed to right > parenthesis). I've tried a few variations on this, but the only thing > that I have gotten working is (1) a completely fixed path wav filename, > and (2) using only the attribute -- which forces all of the wav files to > > be located in my experimental directory. > > I've run out of ideas. Any help would be very appreciated. > > > Thanks, > > > -Jim > > From epetersen99 at hotmail.com Wed Aug 2 00:22:04 2006 From: epetersen99 at hotmail.com (Eric Petersen) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 19:22:04 -0500 Subject: Please remove me from the E-Prime listserv. Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From k.jansonius at planet.nl Wed Aug 2 07:55:44 2006 From: k.jansonius at planet.nl (k. jansonius) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:55:44 +0200 Subject: No subject Message-ID: Please remove me from the talkbank! Thanks in advance! Kino Jansonius -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Wed Aug 2 08:18:21 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:18:21 +0200 Subject: how to unsubscribe from list In-Reply-To: <003801c6b609$0eae6970$4001a8c0@Headstart> Message-ID: if you would like to be removed from the EPrime list you should visit this page: http://step.psy.cmu.edu/eprime.html >From: "k. jansonius" >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 09:55:44 +0200 > >Please remove me from the talkbank! Thanks in advance! > >Kino Jansonius From wendy_davidson79 at hotmail.com Wed Aug 2 10:09:15 2006 From: wendy_davidson79 at hotmail.com (Wendy Davidson) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:09:15 +0100 Subject: specific angles in canvas Message-ID: Hello all, I was hoping someone could help me with my latest problem! I have managed to use the canvas object to design an experiment in which a dot travels along the screen, 'disappears' then reappears following a delay. The subject then indicates whether the dot is following the same trajectory. I want to alter the trajectory by varying levels of difficulty (i.e 30% difference in angular trajectory to 5% difference). So far I can only figure out how to change the x and y coordinates. Is it possible to convert this to angular differences? As usual any help would be gratefully appreciated. Wendy Davidson University of Aberdeen From dhair at wfubmc.edu Wed Aug 2 16:35:59 2006 From: dhair at wfubmc.edu (David Hairston) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:35:59 -0400 Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses Message-ID: I would like to get an externally triggered record of a keyboard press for use with an MEG system. Is there a way to get a time-locked onset signal or "trigger" of a keyboard/mouse response at the time it is made, similar to the .OnsetSignalEnabled property for runnable objects, even if the current object is still executing? Ideally I'd like to have access to the accuracy of said response, evaluate it and send an external digital signal signifying this... but just getting a signal out at all would be workable. I know it can be done easily AFTER the target object has occurred, for example something like "if rresponse.ACC = 1 then WritePort &378, 1". However, this is only (relatively) time-locked w/ the response in the case where the response terminates the object; in the case of a fixed-duration with recorded response, the evaluation/trigger would not occur until afterwards, and hence somewhat later than the actual response time. Does anybody have some insight on a trick to get this? Thanks W. David Hairston, Ph.D. ANSIR Lab Dept of Radiology Wake Forest University School of Medicine Medical Center Blvd Winston-Salem NC 27157 (336) 716-7160 (Offiice) (336) 716 0798 (Fax) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psudevan at uwsp.edu Wed Aug 2 16:56:17 2006 From: psudevan at uwsp.edu (Sudevan, Padmanabhan) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:56:17 -0500 Subject: General Question on Porting E-Prime experiments In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello all, I have a general question on porting a run-time version of an E-Prime experiment. I am giving a talk next week at a conference and, along with the usual information given in a talk about experiments, I would like to have available a working version of the experiments on my Thinkpad laptop, so that I can show what the trials look like, or have colleagues try their hand at the experiment after the talk if they wish to do so. My talk is PowerPoint-based. Now, my plan is to treat the laptop like another subject station machine and load the Run version of E-prime on it, with the hardware key in the laptop for this initial loading. Will this work? Or do I need to have the entire E-Prime software suite on my laptop? Once this is done, can I avoid taking the hardware key ( just as in the lab machines )? Lastly, is this the best way to proceed, or is there some simpler way? Any advice will be welcome. P Sudevan Professor and Chair Department of Psychology University of Wisconsin-Stevens Point -----Original Message----- From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf Of Paul Gr Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 3:18 AM To: k.jansonius at planet.nl; eprime at mail.talkbank.org Subject: how to unsubscribe from list if you would like to be removed from the EPrime list you should visit this page: http://step.psy.cmu.edu/eprime.html >From: "k. jansonius" >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 09:55:44 +0200 > >Please remove me from the talkbank! Thanks in advance! > >Kino Jansonius From Don.Rojas at UCHSC.edu Wed Aug 2 17:30:41 2006 From: Don.Rojas at UCHSC.edu (Don.Rojas at UCHSC.edu) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:30:41 -0600 Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses Message-ID: David, We tried this in our own MEG system and were never successful with respect to accuracy. The keyboard itself is terrible enough with timing, but then the problems you mention emerge. What response device are you using? I'd think not an actual keyboard in the shielded room - perhaps you use the Lumitouch optical device that maps to the keyboard? If so, what we did was have our engineer directly map that device to the MEG external stimulus/response inputs, while preserving the keyboard mapping for eprime. I don't think you'll ever be able to achieve what you want while still preserving accurate timing, but let me know if you think of another clever solution. Don Rojas, Ph.D. Neuromagnetism Laboratory U. of Colorado Health Sciences Center Denver, CO 80220 -----Original Message----- From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf Of David Hairston Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 10:36 AM To: EPRIME at mail.talkbank.org Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses I would like to get an externally triggered record of a keyboard press for use with an MEG system. Is there a way to get a time-locked onset signal or "trigger" of a keyboard/mouse response at the time it is made, similar to the .OnsetSignalEnabled property for runnable objects, even if the current object is still executing? Ideally I'd like to have access to the accuracy of said response, evaluate it and send an external digital signal signifying this... but just getting a signal out at all would be workable. I know it can be done easily AFTER the target object has occurred, for example something like "if rresponse.ACC = 1 then WritePort &378, 1". However, this is only (relatively) time-locked w/ the response in the case where the response terminates the object; in the case of a fixed-duration with recorded response, the evaluation/trigger would not occur until afterwards, and hence somewhat later than the actual response time. Does anybody have some insight on a trick to get this? Thanks W. David Hairston, Ph.D. ANSIR Lab Dept of Radiology Wake Forest University School of Medicine Medical Center Blvd Winston-Salem NC 27157 (336) 716-7160 (Offiice) (336) 716 0798 (Fax) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Wed Aug 2 17:56:40 2006 From: anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com (Tony Zuccolotto) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:56:40 -0400 Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses In-Reply-To: <4CCFAF32FB7B2C449A189C82198E426510963AF3@EXCHVS1.medctr.ad.wfubmc.edu> Message-ID: David, In some experiments you can get reasonable results if you happen to be terminating your stimulus on a key press and then immediately using WritePort as you have described below (whether or not this approach is feasible depends on the nature of your specific paradigm). Another approach you could use would be to set a different duration for the Duration property and the Time Limit property (e.g. 0 for the Duration and 5000ms on the Time Limit). This way you can get into Inline script immediately after the stimulus is presented and then you can poll the Stimulus.InputMask(1).IsPending method to determine when the response is logged and then use WritePort at that time. A more advanced way of getting into an Inline script immediately after the stimulus is displayed is to set your PreRelease property equal to the Duration of the object, e.g. this will allow the current object to display its stimulus, enable any response, and then move on. Overall though I would say the most generic and consistent approach would be to do this via hardware, i.e. take a trigger directly from your input device and give it to both E-Prime and whatever other hardware/software you need to send it to. You don't have many options if you are using a keyboard directly, but you do have options if you are using other types of input devices. PST has various button response system that are targeted at use in fMRI studies which, when used with E-Prime would provide the same accuracy of the PST Serial Response Box and also includes an external digital I/O port which you use to tap directly into the switch signal and provide it to another piece of equipment. Within E-Prime you should be able to add the device to your experiment and tell it to Emulate the Keyboard device and your experiment should continue running as is (but with more consistent timing accuracy than the keyboard can provide). Another alternative would be to create your own switch/input device and wire it up to either a PST Serial Response Box or connect it to the parallel port. You would then use either the SRBOX or Port device respectively in E-Prime, but because you are creating the switch you can take your own signal off the switch and send it to other equipment as needed. Hope that gives you some options. Tony Anthony P. Zuccolotto President and Chief Executive Officer Psychology Software Tools, Inc. 2050 Ardmore Boulevard Suite 200 Pittsburgh, PA 15221-4610 Phone 412-271-5040 FAX 412-271-7077 Email anthony.zuccolotto at pstnet.com Internet http://www.pstnet.com ________________________________ From: eprime at mail.talkbank.org [mailto:eprime at mail.talkbank.org] On Behalf Of David Hairston Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 12:36 PM To: EPRIME at mail.talkbank.org Subject: online trigger of keybaord responses I would like to get an externally triggered record of a keyboard press for use with an MEG system. Is there a way to get a time-locked onset signal or "trigger" of a keyboard/mouse response at the time it is made, similar to the .OnsetSignalEnabled property for runnable objects, even if the current object is still executing? Ideally I'd like to have access to the accuracy of said response, evaluate it and send an external digital signal signifying this... but just getting a signal out at all would be workable. I know it can be done easily AFTER the target object has occurred, for example something like "if rresponse.ACC = 1 then WritePort &378, 1". However, this is only (relatively) time-locked w/ the response in the case where the response terminates the object; in the case of a fixed-duration with recorded response, the evaluation/trigger would not occur until afterwards, and hence somewhat later than the actual response time. Does anybody have some insight on a trick to get this? Thanks W. David Hairston, Ph.D. ANSIR Lab Dept of Radiology Wake Forest University School of Medicine Medical Center Blvd Winston-Salem NC 27157 (336) 716-7160 (Offiice) (336) 716 0798 (Fax) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbedwell at mail.ucf.edu Sun Aug 6 23:01:39 2006 From: jbedwell at mail.ucf.edu (Jeffrey Bedwell) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 19:01:39 -0400 Subject: Eprime Digest - 08/06/06 (out of office) Message-ID: I will be out of the office until 8/10 and may not be able to reply before that time. -Jeff Bedwell >>> eprime 08/06/06 19:00 >>> Eprime Digest - Sunday, August 6, 2006 Re: illegal attribute name by "Robert D?rr" Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object by "EJ Nikelski" RE: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object by "Susan G. Campbell" Re: illegal attribute name by "randers at bgnet.bgsu.edu" RE : RE: about error message when install e prime "key too long for regis by "kebir oussama" nested lists by "Felix Fischer" RE: nested lists by "Tony Zuccolotto" Re: illegal attribute name by "Leisha Wharfield" Re: illegal attribute name by "Leisha Wharfield" remove from list by "Will Hall" Re: Setting complex sound file name in SoundOut object by "EJ Nikelski" Please remove me from the E-Prime listserv. by "Eric Petersen" (no subject) by "k. jansonius" how to unsubscribe from list by "Paul Gr" specific angles in canvas by "Wendy Davidson" online trigger of keybaord responses by "David Hairston" General Question on Porting E-Prime experiments by "Sudevan, Padmanabhan" RE: online trigger of keybaord responses by RE: online trigger of keybaord responses by "Tony Zuccolotto" From debbie.gilkey at pstnet.com Mon Aug 7 14:50:34 2006 From: debbie.gilkey at pstnet.com (Debbie Gilkey) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 10:50:34 -0400 Subject: PST Job Opportunity Message-ID: Dear Forum Members, PST is looking for a motivated individual to add to our tech support and research development teams. The Technical Consultant position is full time with benefits at our Pittsburgh, PA office. For more information about this position, please browse to http://www.pstnet.com/info/jobs.htm. All interested applicants should send their cover letter and resume to jobs at pstnet.com. Debbie Gilkey Human Resources Administrator ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Psychology Software Tools, Inc. 2050 Ardmore Boulevard Suite 200 Pittsburgh, PA 15221-4610 USA ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit our Web Site for the latest information: > E-Mail: info at pstnet.com Voice: (412) 271-5040 x223 Fax: (412) 271-7077 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From joseph.williams at utoronto.ca Wed Aug 9 12:00:54 2006 From: joseph.williams at utoronto.ca (Joseph Williams) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:00:54 +0200 Subject: Displaying and collecting responses from two objects at the same time Message-ID: I am modifying an experiment where two objects are used at the same time. One is a soundout object that plays a tone and then collects the timed response to that tone (it lasts for about two seconds). The other is either a textdisplay or slide object that shows a word for 200-500 msecs. The way the program is set up now it's not possible to show the text (using either a textdisplay or a textdisplay on a slide object) and play the tone (using a soundout object), at exactly the same time. For the tone to collect a response over a period of 2000 msecs it seems that the duration of the soundout object has to be set to be 2000 msecs (I may be wrong here), so if the tone is played first the textdisplay will only be shown after 2000 msecs. Similarly if the textdisplay is loaded first (e.g. for 200 msecs) the tone is delayed by 200 msecs. If the textdisplay is loaded on a slide (with duration 0 msecs) and then the tone is loaded as a soundout object at the same time, there isn't a way to clear the text from the screen after 200 msecs. If I put both the textdisplay and the soundout object in the same slide, I could use the slide to collect the response to the tone, except that then there's no way to clear the word after 200 msecs. There are some ratches I tried to get this to work, but they're not completely satisfactory. It seems to be a natural thing to use two objects at the same time or to use two objects in overlapping time intervals, without having to load them sequentially- the sequential loading means that an object cannot be loaded while another object is still in action. Is there a way to use both a soundout object and a textdisplay (or slide) object at the same time, without forcing the loading of one of these objects to wait until the other's duration has been completed? Thanks in advance, Joseph Williams -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dap at wjh.harvard.edu Wed Aug 9 23:59:14 2006 From: dap at wjh.harvard.edu (Diego Pizzagalli) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 19:59:14 -0400 Subject: Away from my mail Message-ID: Thank you for your message. Please note that I will be out of the office until August 22 and will not be checking email regularly. For urgent matters, please contact Elena Goetz (egoetz at wjh.harvard.edu) or Jeffrey Birk (birk at wjh.harvard.edu), (617) 384-9841. From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Fri Aug 11 07:58:53 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:58:53 +0200 Subject: Displaying and collecting responses from two objects at the same time In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Joseph, I think this should be possible though. To start with, you could place the sound object before the stimulus object and set the duration to zero. You would also have to set the ?stopafter? property to ?no? to prevent immediate termination of the sound itself. Then add an input object such as a keyboard and set the time limit to the duration of the required time window (i.e. 2000). You can add the stimulus object (with duration 200) and an empty text object (duration 1800) after the sound object. That should do the trick. There is only one thing that could be a bit tricky: By default the end action property of the input object is set to ?terminate?. This could be a problem because only the active object will be terminated. If the response occurs during playback of the stimulus (rt<200), then only the stimulus will be terminated and the second object (empty screen for 1800ms) will be played as usual. A bit of scripting could solve this. best, Paul >From: "Joseph Williams" >To: eprime at mail.talkbank.org >Subject: Displaying and collecting responses from two objects at the same >time >Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:00:54 +0200 > >I am modifying an experiment where two objects are used at the same time. >One is a soundout object that plays a tone and then collects the timed >response to that tone (it lasts for about two seconds). The other is either >a textdisplay or slide object that shows a word for 200-500 msecs. The way >the program is set up now it's not possible to show the text (using either >a >textdisplay or a textdisplay on a slide object) and play the tone (using a >soundout object), at exactly the same time. > >For the tone to collect a response over a period of 2000 msecs it seems >that >the duration of the soundout object has to be set to be 2000 msecs (I may >be >wrong here), so if the tone is played first the textdisplay will only be >shown after 2000 msecs. Similarly if the textdisplay is loaded first (e.g. >for 200 msecs) the tone is delayed by 200 msecs. If the textdisplay is >loaded on a slide (with duration 0 msecs) and then the tone is loaded as a >soundout object at the same time, there isn't a way to clear the text from >the screen after 200 msecs. If I put both the textdisplay and the soundout >object in the same slide, I could use the slide to collect the response to >the tone, except that then there's no way to clear the word after 200 >msecs. > >There are some ratches I tried to get this to work, but they're not >completely satisfactory. It seems to be a natural thing to use two objects >at the same time or to use two objects in overlapping time intervals, >without having to load them sequentially- the sequential loading means that >an object cannot be loaded while another object is still in action. Is >there >a way to use both a soundout object and a textdisplay (or slide) object at >the same time, without forcing the loading of one of these objects to wait >until the other's duration has been completed? > >Thanks in advance, > >Joseph Williams From nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca Tue Aug 15 14:40:34 2006 From: nikelski at bic.mni.mcgill.ca (EJ Nikelski) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 10:40:34 -0400 Subject: Response times on the USB bus Message-ID: Hi All, I believe that I have a very simple question, although a search of the E-Prime Knowledge Base (and and this List's archive) could not provide me with an answer. The question is one relating to using a USB mouse as a response device; specifically, can we? I am asking the List, as I would like to get the opinions of researchers who (1) are using various response devices - and therefore have likely given this some thought, and (2) do not have an interest in trying to sell me a button box. The PST User Guide appears clear on this (page A-16), noting that the approx. 100 ms response delay in addition to a std dev of 8 ms, makes a mouse inappropriate when ms accuracy is required. I see a few problems here: (1) I believe that the 100 ms delay is of little concern to many researchers, as long as the delay is constant -- it's the 8 ms SD that is of concern, as it adds unwanted noise to the signal. (2) PST used a PS/2 mouse in their tests -- most modern mice (mouses?) use USB. How does a USB mouse perform? If you take a look at the Lancaster University web site (www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/research/reactionTimes/input.html) they seem to suggest that USB mice will produce a variance in RT ranging from 0 to 8 ms, which is a direct result of the 125 ms polling interval used by Windows XP when sampling USB devices. This polling frequency can, however, be changed, as the USB standard allows for a 1 ms polling rate (1000 Hz) (apparently, some gamers do this). (3) PST got excellent results using a keyboard as a response device, which is surprising, as the sampling rate of a PS/2 keyboard is actually lower than that of a USB mouse (according to Lancaster University). In addition, as most modern keyboards now also use USB, I cannot see how the response time of a USB keyboard would be better than that of a USB mouse. (4) PST did all of their timing tests on Windows 98. The code base of Windows XP shares nothing in common at all with the old DOS-based Windows OSes (Win 98, 95, 3.1, etc). Timing values derived on these ancient OSes cannot be extended to Win XP. Sorry for the lengthy e-mail, but I wanted to present my question clearly. So ... what does the List think of using USB devices (including both mice and keyboards) for data collection? Is anyone changing their USB sampling rates prior to running subjects in order to address the 125 Hz default sampling-induced response variance? How are you doing this? Has anyone used some of the high-sampling-rate gaming mice (e.g. the Logitech Laser mouse G5can sample at 500 Hz)? Any ideas and/or suggestions would be welcome. -Jim -- Jim Nikelski, Ph.D. Postdoctoral Research Fellow Bloomfield Centre for Research in Aging Lady Davis Institute for Medical Research Sir Mortimer B. Davis - Jewish General Hospital McGill University Tel: (514) 340-8222 x 2298 Fax: (514) 340-8295 From leisha at decisionresearch.org Tue Aug 15 15:40:34 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:40:34 -0700 Subject: Response times on the USB bus In-Reply-To: <44E1DCE2.2050703@bic.mni.mcgill.ca> Message-ID: I'm also interested in the responses you get to this question. Input devices & timing are ongoing questions. Thanks, Leisha EJ Nikelski wrote: > Hi All, > > I believe that I have a very simple question, although a search of > the E-Prime Knowledge Base (and and this List's archive) could not > provide me with an answer. The question is one relating to using a USB > mouse as a response device; specifically, can we? I am asking the > List, as I would like to get the opinions of researchers who (1) are > using various response devices - and therefore have likely given this > some thought, and (2) do not have an interest in trying to sell me a > button box. > > The PST User Guide appears clear on this (page A-16), noting that > the approx. 100 ms response delay in addition to a std dev of 8 ms, > makes a mouse inappropriate when ms accuracy is required. I see a few > problems here: > > (1) I believe that the 100 ms delay is of little concern to many > researchers, as long as the delay is constant -- it's the 8 ms SD that > is of concern, as it adds unwanted noise to the signal. > > (2) PST used a PS/2 mouse in their tests -- most modern mice (mouses?) > use USB. How does a USB mouse perform? If you take a look at the > Lancaster University web site > (www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/research/reactionTimes/input.html) they seem to > suggest that USB mice will produce a variance in RT ranging from 0 to > 8 ms, which is a direct result of the 125 ms polling interval used by > Windows XP when sampling USB devices. This polling frequency can, > however, be changed, as the USB standard allows for a 1 ms polling > rate (1000 Hz) (apparently, some gamers do this). > > (3) PST got excellent results using a keyboard as a response device, > which is surprising, as the sampling rate of a PS/2 keyboard is > actually lower than that of a USB mouse (according to Lancaster > University). In addition, as most modern keyboards now also use USB, I > cannot see how the response time of a USB keyboard would be better > than that of a USB mouse. > > (4) PST did all of their timing tests on Windows 98. The code base of > Windows XP shares nothing in common at all with the old DOS-based > Windows OSes (Win 98, 95, 3.1, etc). Timing values derived on these > ancient OSes cannot be extended to Win XP. > > > Sorry for the lengthy e-mail, but I wanted to present my question > clearly. So ... what does the List think of using USB devices > (including both mice and keyboards) for data collection? Is anyone > changing their USB sampling rates prior to running subjects in order > to address the 125 Hz default sampling-induced response variance? How > are you doing this? Has anyone used some of the high-sampling-rate > gaming mice (e.g. the Logitech Laser mouse G5can sample at 500 Hz)? > Any ideas and/or suggestions would be welcome. > > > -Jim > > From mooreks at umich.edu Wed Aug 16 17:49:00 2006 From: mooreks at umich.edu (Katherine Sledge Moore) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:49:00 -0400 Subject: "sound device not set to open" Message-ID: Hi all, I am trying to use sound in my most recent eprime program, and when I try to generate the script, I get an error message that says, "A fatal error occurred while generating the initialization code for E-Object "ResponseClick": Cannot generate code due to sound device not set to open." Any thoughts on what I'm supposed to do to get the sound device to be set to open? I've used sounds in the past without a problem, so I don't know what is going on now. Thanks. Katherine Sledge Moore Department of Psychology PhD Student, Cognition and Perception http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Thu Aug 17 06:41:37 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:41:37 +0200 Subject: "sound device not set to open" In-Reply-To: <000c01c6c15c$42bfb5d0$2a04d38d@psycjjonides14> Message-ID: hi Katherine, This is exactly the same message EPrime will show when you didn't configure (and enable!) the Sound device yet. You can do this in Menu->Edit->Expiriments->Devices. Also make sure that the sound format (mono/stereo, sample rate and #bits) of the wave file(s) match the configuration of the Sound device. best, paul >From: "Katherine Sledge Moore" >To: >Subject: "sound device not set to open" >Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:49:00 -0400 > >Hi all, > >I am trying to use sound in my most recent eprime program, and when I try >to >generate the script, I get an error message that says, "A fatal error >occurred while generating the initialization code for E-Object >"ResponseClick": Cannot generate code due to sound device not set to open." >Any thoughts on what I'm supposed to do to get the sound device to be set >to >open? I've used sounds in the past without a problem, so I don't know what >is going on now. Thanks. > >Katherine Sledge Moore >Department of Psychology >PhD Student, Cognition and Perception >http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks > > > From n490b at unb.ca Thu Aug 17 11:35:26 2006 From: n490b at unb.ca (Jones, Stephanie) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:35:26 -0300 Subject: Question Message-ID: Hello, I was wondering if it is possible to instruct E Prime, running off of one hard drive, to display two different series of images at the same time, one series on one monitor and a second series on a second monitor? Thanks, Stephanie Jones University of New Brunswick, Saint John From brandon_cernicky at yahoo.com Fri Aug 18 10:31:46 2006 From: brandon_cernicky at yahoo.com (Brandon Cernicky) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 03:31:46 -0700 Subject: Response times on the USB bus In-Reply-To: <40401.41312@mail.talkbank.org> Message-ID: Hi Nick, The following is a reply to the questions you asked via E-Prime Web Support. Your questions appear to be identical to the ones you posted to the Talkbank forum with additional A/B/C questions posted only in Web Support (included below). I am responding to both Web Support and the Talkbank forum so that others may share in this information. PST cannot make a blanket statement that a PS/2 or USB device (keyboard, mouse, or otherwise) will perform adequately for a specific paradigm. In the Spring of 2006, PST conducted another batch of internal timing tests with a batch of responses devices we keep on hand. These devices were modified by the EE group at PST to be able to simulate a human response when triggered by a port (parallel, BBTK, etc). A short summary of the response device latency test can be viewed at http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/timing/. One can note that each device has its own timing characteristics depending on the machine class and operating system. Significant differences can be viewed between devices of the same class. For example, on a 3GHZ XP system, a modern Dell USB Keyboard has an average of 13.98 ms and a stddev of 0.74. On the same machine running a Belkin USB keyboard, the numbers reported increase to 39.84 average with a stddev of 8.30. The same differences can be viewed with USB mice of different manufactures and models. Response devices of the exact model (e.g. two MS Intellimouse Optical) may have different timing characteristics depending on lot number and other variations. A reference to these types of issues are discussed in the paper ?How choice of mouse may effect response timing in psychological studies? (Plant, R. R., Hammond, N. V. and Whitehouse T. (2003), Behavior Research Methods, Instruments and Computers) There are a number of factors on how USB devices communicate in Windows. The operating system version, USB version (1.1, 2.0), the USB mode speed, and the device driver are all variables. The following is an edited summary from Andrew Sobotka, Computer Engineer, Electronics Engineer at Psychology Software Tools: USB 1.1 has low-speed and full-speed devices. Low- and full-speed devices can be polled at a maximum rate of 1 khz, but (reports indicate) that Windows XP caps low-speed HID at 125 hz (8ms). USB 2.0 supports low-, full-, and hi-speed devices. Low- and full-speed devices are still polled at 1 khz max, but a hi-speed device can be polled at 8 khz. Interrupt Endpoints are defined in USB that the device informs the host about how often it wants to be polled, at a minimum. This information comes from a descriptor which is stored locally in the device's memory. Therefore a gaming mouse will probably have much better performance, because its descriptors will specify a minimum polling rate of e.g. 500 hz. To achieve rates higher than 125 hz (8ms), the standard HID driver in Windows may not be able to be used and will require a custom driver offered by the manufacture of the device. A USB device (mouse or keyboard) with an interrupt endpoint will inform Windows about how often it wants polled. A USB Host Controller will make sure that there is bandwidth available for that packet at the requested polling rate, as that's what the rate is for. A USB keyboard could have a better response time than a USB mouse, because they use different descriptors which specify different polling times. Additionally, although the USB device is successfully sending data at the polling rate requested by the device, Windows may or may not process the data at the USB polling rate. For more information on what a HID is, please view http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_human_interface_device_class. Please note that a system that offers USB 2.0 ports and has a mixture of USB 1.1 and 2.0 compliant devices attached may perform differently when only USB 2.0 devices are attached than when USB 2.0 and USB 1.1 devices are attached since the USB host controller must adjust to the 1.1 specifications. Psychology Software Tools encourages researchers to conduct timing tests on the equipment (machine, device, etc) used in their paradigms and indicate information about those devices in the Methods section for replication of studies. A blanket statement cannot be issued for a specific response device, machine class, or operating system. Modern response devices when compared to the response devices collected in the circa 2000 E-Prime 1.0 documentation have a much lower average and stddev values, but also continue to have discrepancies between device class, operating system, and machine. The remainder of this text is in regards to replies to your specific questions (authored by Brandon Cernicky and AJ Sobotka of Psychology Software Tools): (2) PST used a PS/2 mouse in their tests -- most modern mice (mouses?) use USB. How does a USB mouse perform? If you take a look at the Lancaster University web site (www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/research/reactionTimes/input.html) they seem to suggest that USB mice will produce a variance in RT ranging from 0 to 8 ms, which is a direct result of the 125 ms polling interval used by Windows XP when sampling USB devices. This polling frequency can, however, be changed, as the USB 2.0 standard allows for a 1 ms polling rate (1000 Hz) (apparently, some gamers do this). [Brandon] The response devices and machine classes used in the E-Prime 1.0 Documentation were of circa 2000. Nearly all modern response devices and machines today outperform those numbers by an order of magnitude. The figures reported in the timing tests we conducted in Spring 2006 http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/timing/ show that it is possible to achieve a stddev of < 1 ms. (3) PST got excellent results using a keyboard as a response device, which is surprising, as the sampling rate of a PS/2 keyboard is actually lower than that of a USB mouse (according to Lancaster University). In addition, as most modern keyboards now also use USB, I cannot see how the response time of a USB keyboard would be better than that of a USB mouse. [Brandon] The type of results are device specific. A bargain keyboard purchased at a department store may have components that are not higher performance than one purchased from a PC manufacture. The speed of any keyboard relates to the circuitry on how quickly the devices receive the keys. A less efficient keyboard may scan each key. More modern keyboards use a matrix with higher speed integrated circuits. AJ Sobotka indicates that USB Keyboard replies are typically 10 bytes, depending on how they are built. (4) PST did all of their timing tests on Windows 98. The code base of Windows XP shares nothing in common at all with the old DOS-based Windows OSes (Win 98, 95, 3.1, etc). Timing values derived on these ancient OSes cannot be extended to Win XP. Furthermore, I understand that Win 2000 and 98SE polled the USB bus more frequently than Win XP currently does. Is this true? Would running Win 2000 with a USB high poll rate mouse provide less variability in the response times? [Brandon] Your observation about the different operating system architecture is accurate. To provide application threads more time, Windows 2000/XP do permit the operating system to take control for a larger time, but are overall/time can be more accurate because operating system communication like this may occur less often. Running the PST Refresh Clock Test experiment on the same machine running 98/XP will show in the resultant edat file that the XP will likely have more ticks in the lower bins but will have a few values in the higher bin counts. The figures reported in the timing tests we conducted in Spring 2006 http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/timing/ show that it is possible to achieve low average and stdev values for response devices. For example, using a parallel port as a response device in XP had an average and stdev response time latency values both < 1 ms. So, in sum, my (additional) questions are: (A) What is PST's current opinion with regard to using USB devices (including both mice and keyboards) for data collection? And why? [Brandon] Refer to the comments at the top of this text. (B) Has PST tech heard of anyone changing their USB sampling rates prior to running subjects in order to address the 125 Hz default sampling-induced response variance? How is this best done? [Brandon] We have had no reports about end users attempting to do this and at this time would not encourage this attempt as there are more straightforward routes (SRBOX, gaming mice, etc). (C) Can PST recommend any of the high-sampling-rate gaming mice? For example, the Logitech Laser mouse G5 can sample at 500 Hz. [Brandon] PST at this time does not recommend any mice. Besides the mouse you mentioned, there appears to be good information from the Razer Copperhead. http://www.everythingusb.com/razer_copperhead.html. If PST in the future obtains a high performance gaming mouse, it will perform timing tests on the device and report the results. -Brandon ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Brandon S. Cernicky Senior Software Engineer Psychology Software Tools __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From mooreks at umich.edu Fri Aug 18 13:52:29 2006 From: mooreks at umich.edu (Katherine Sledge Moore) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:52:29 -0400 Subject: setting procedure and weight attributes Message-ID: Is it possible to set the values of the procedure or weight attributes using in line code, the way you can for other variables? The problem I see is that inline code can only be used to modify the attributes of the current level, not the level below, but it's self-referential to modify the weight of the procedure you're currently operating on (or to set it to a different procedure altogether!) So, is there an exception built into Eprime wherein one can set these values using code at a level above? For my issue I am most interested in the weight setting, but I'm curious about the procedure setting as well. Katherine Sledge Moore Department of Psychology PhD Student, Cognition and Perception http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks From pauls_postbus at hotmail.com Sun Aug 20 13:09:08 2006 From: pauls_postbus at hotmail.com (Paul Gr) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:09:08 +0200 Subject: setting procedure and weight attributes In-Reply-To: <000001c6c2cd$8ddf1750$6c01a8c0@psycjjonides14> Message-ID: hi Katherine, Because EPrime prepares List objects once before executing, it is not possible to change weight and procedure configurations on the fly. There are special functions which you can call to change those settings (List.SetWeight, List.SetProc, ...), but they should be called before the list is reset and activated. So, if you would like to change the trial order and run count (weight) while the list is already running, then you will have to implement some kind of workaround. One thing you could do is the following: Just create a List object for playing your trials (i.e. TrialList) and define one level with and a procedure called TrialProc. Then place a new List object (called CaseList for example) on the timeline of this TrialProc. This sub list will be used to select and play one of the possible trial types you are going to implement each time the TrialProc runs. Then add a new level to CaseList for each trial type and implement the procedures. In the attached example I?ve created only two types: Proc1 and Proc2. Now you will have to add some script to select one of the levels of the CaseList. To do this you should insert an inline script icon before in TrialProc before CaseList. The following code is an example for randomly selecting one of the two levels in the example script: Dim NextCase as integer NextCase = Random(1,2) Set CaseList.Order = OffsetOrder(NextCase) Set CaseList.TerminateCondition = Samples(1) CaseList.Reset The construction with CaseList is very similar to the ?Case-Select? construction of the Basic language (or the switch construction of C/C++): only one specific item of a given list will be selected at runtime for execution. You can use the ?Exit list? properties of TrialList to specify the termination condition as usual. However, if you also would like to have more control of the termination of the list, then you can use the Terminate function of TrialList to exit the list on the fly. For example, the following script will terminate the list as soon as trial type 1 is played 3 times: ' as an example, this experiment terminates as soon as trial type 1 is executed 3 times if NextCase=1 then ' TrialType1Count is a global variable (see User Section) TrialType1Count = TrialType1Count + 1 if TrialType1Count=3 then TrialList.Terminate ' stop when this trial has finished end if end if To prevent early termination, I've also set the exit list property (cycle count) to 1000. I?ve attached a simple example script. (This will probably be filtered out on the eprime list) Hope this helps, Paul Groot Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam >From: "Katherine Sledge Moore" >To: >Subject: setting procedure and weight attributes >Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:52:29 -0400 > >Is it possible to set the values of the procedure or weight attributes >using >in line code, the way you can for other variables? > >The problem I see is that inline code can only be used to modify the >attributes of the current level, not the level below, but it's >self-referential to modify the weight of the procedure you're currently >operating on (or to set it to a different procedure altogether!) > >So, is there an exception built into Eprime wherein one can set these >values >using code at a level above? For my issue I am most interested in the >weight >setting, but I'm curious about the procedure setting as well. > >Katherine Sledge Moore >Department of Psychology >PhD Student, Cognition and Perception >http://www.umich.edu/~mooreks > > > From jmrnak at siu.edu Thu Aug 24 18:05:07 2006 From: jmrnak at siu.edu (jmrnak at siu.edu) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:05:07 -0500 Subject: IAT in E-Prime? In-Reply-To: <97187.51812@mail.talkbank.org> Message-ID: Hello all, I am writing to inquire whether the Implicit Association Task (IAT) is currently in existence in E-Prime. I have run across some discussion of this very issue on the web back in October of 2003, but I've had no luck actually finding a script. I would greatly appreciate a copy of the EBS file, if anyone is willing to share, or any suggestions on where one may be found. Many thanks, Jennifer Mrnak, M.A. Doctoral Candidate Department of Psychology Southern Illinois University Carbondale 618-453-3585 jmrnak at siu.edu From leisha at decisionresearch.org Thu Aug 24 18:23:49 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:23:49 -0700 Subject: IAT in E-Prime? In-Reply-To: <1156442707-17514.00026.00035-smmsdV2.1.6@saluki-mailhub.siu.edu> Message-ID: I knew that was familiar! We looked at using IAT back in 2003. Dr. Greenwald has a site where you can learn all about it and try the test on yourself at http://projectimplicit.net/nosek/iat/. He's very helpful and friendly. Unfortunately for us E-Primers, he uses Inquisit. Leisha jmrnak at siu.edu wrote: >Hello all, > >I am writing to inquire whether the Implicit Association Task >(IAT) is currently in existence in E-Prime. I have run across >some discussion of this very issue on the web back in October >of 2003, but I've had no luck actually finding a script. I >would greatly appreciate a copy of the EBS file, if anyone is >willing to share, or any suggestions on where one may be found. > >Many thanks, > >Jennifer Mrnak, M.A. >Doctoral Candidate >Department of Psychology >Southern Illinois University Carbondale >618-453-3585 >jmrnak at siu.edu > > > > > > From nstrang at wisc.edu Fri Aug 25 20:17:23 2006 From: nstrang at wisc.edu (Nicole Strang) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:17:23 -0500 Subject: problem with c.GetAttrib function and RT data Message-ID: Hi all, I am trying to have a running average of a participants reaction time so that the duration of a trial can be adjusted based on a subjects performance. I think I know how to do this, however I am unable to get the RT data. One issue that I thought may be a problem is that the RT data comes from an object with an infinite duration, however when I look at a data file the RT data appears to be completely appropriate. What I have right now (although I have tried a number of different approaches) is in the user tab I define my variable dim nSingleRT as long 'In an inline prior to the beginning of the block nSingleRT=0 'In an inline at the very end of the trial nSingleRT=c.GetAttrib("Math.RT") Debug.Print nSingleRT In the debug tab I get all zeros. I have tried using the summation function, but had no more success. To try and better ascertain the nature of the problem, I replace Math.RT with MathList and the attributes were collected without any problem. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks very much! Nicole -- Nicole Strang Graduate Student Child Emotion Research Lab University of Wisconsin-Madison 1202 West Johnson St. Madison, Wisconsin 53706 Lab Phone: (608) 262-6647 Fax: (608) 262-4029 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From leisha at decisionresearch.org Fri Aug 25 21:21:42 2006 From: leisha at decisionresearch.org (Leisha Wharfield) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 14:21:42 -0700 Subject: problem with c.GetAttrib function and RT data In-Reply-To: <6924dfda0608251317q70d46decg195238d050fc4415@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Nicole, I think you may have a syntax problem. The RT is a number not a string, so you don't need the quote marks. I think that nSingleRT = Math.RT will do it. Leisha Nicole Strang wrote: > Hi all, > > I am trying to have a running average of a participants reaction time > so that the duration of a trial can be adjusted based on a subjects > performance. I think I know how to do this, however I am unable to get > the RT data. One issue that I thought may be a problem is that the RT > data comes from an object with an infinite duration, however when I > look at a data file the RT data appears to be completely appropriate. > What I have right now (although I have tried a number of different > approaches) is in the user tab I define my variable > dim nSingleRT as long > > 'In an inline prior to the beginning of the block > nSingleRT=0 > > 'In an inline at the very end of the trial > nSingleRT=c.GetAttrib ("Math.RT") > Debug.Print nSingleRT > > In the debug tab I get all zeros. I have tried using the summation > function, but had no more success. To try and better ascertain the > nature of the problem, I replace Math.RT with MathList and the > attributes were collected without any problem. Any help would be > greatly appreciated. > Thanks very much! > Nicole > -- > Nicole Strang > Graduate Student > Child Emotion Research Lab > University of Wisconsin-Madison > 1202 West Johnson St. > Madison, Wisconsin 53706 > Lab Phone: (608) 262-6647 > Fax: (608) 262-4029