From MSpape at FSW.leidenuniv.nl Mon Feb 2 15:07:30 2009 From: MSpape at FSW.leidenuniv.nl (Spape, Michiel) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 16:07:30 +0100 Subject: Multiple Responses In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Kari, The problem would appear to be that the E-Prime data is collected and ordered by its list- (thus, presentation) order. Although I'm sure it is possible, one way or another, to force the data of a later task to be in the first task (ex1), I don't see a simple solution. However, if you fiddle around with E-DataAid, you can easily get the result for each picture, for example, by doing Analyze --> choosing the picture-name in the Row, and conditions etc from the two tasks in the Column. But if you prefer the difficult route, you could store data from the first task in a couple of arrays or a matrix. For example, if you have 2 pictures with RTs, you could make an array: 'put this in user script (alt+5) dim RTs() as long And, let's say you have an attribute like PictureNum which gives each picture a unique number. Then, a script in task A would put the relevant data in the array, like: RTs(c.GetAttrib("PictureNum")) = TextDisplay1.RT 'that is, if this textdisplay1 is the one that collects rt data. And a script in task B would store that, if the picturenum is used there as well: c.SetAttrib "RTOfPictureInPreviousTask", RTs(c.GetAttrib("PictureNum")) I'm not sure what your task looks like exactly, so I'm sorry if the above is not as relevant as I hope it is, but I hope it at least illustrates the underlying logic. Hope this helps any. Best, Michiel M. Spapé Cognitive Psychology Unit Leiden University Institute for Psychology Research & Leiden Institute for Brain and Cognition Netherlands http://www.cognitology.eu -----Original Message----- From: e-prime at googlegroups.com [mailto:e-prime at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Kari Sent: 19 January 2009 18:28 To: E-Prime Subject: Multiple Responses Hi-- I am currently writing an experiment in 2 parts. the first part is a priming task, so i have 2 pictures, each with a set of attributes, randomly selected as primes and targets and i'm recording RT. In the second part, I have participants go through each picture individually and rate them on a few scales. The problem I am having is that I can't seem to match up the ratings for the second task with the RT and other parameters from the first task. Is there a way to force the ratings into the same e-data spreadsheet that is generated for the priming task? Any help would be appreciated, thank you so much, Kari ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. ********************************************************************** --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From bachman at psych.ucla.edu Wed Feb 4 17:32:04 2009 From: bachman at psych.ucla.edu (Bachman, Peter) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 09:32:04 -0800 Subject: E-Prime 2 conversion of .es files Message-ID: Hi, everyone, I have a question regarding an error with E-Prime 2. I tried to convert an .es file created in E-Prime 1 into an E-Prime 2 compatible format. It seemed to work - the process created an .es2 file that opened in E-Studio - but the script would not compile. I received the following error ... Encountered: constant Expecting: identifier Associated with setting "color as string" I'm wondering if this is an error that comes up with E-Prime 2 sometimes, and is perhaps not specific to my script. And also, if anyone has successfully fixed the problem in their scripts. Thanks! --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 5 21:17:37 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 16:17:37 -0500 Subject: E-Prime 2 conversion of .es files In-Reply-To: <65489019-9151-4348-9c68-45ae2841a792@r10g2000prf.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: At 2/4/2009 12:32 PM Wednesday, Peter Bachman wrote: >I have a question regarding an error with E-Prime 2. I tried to >convert an .es file created in E-Prime 1 into an E-Prime 2 compatible >format. It seemed to work - the process created an .es2 file that >opened in E-Studio - but the script would not compile. I received the >following error ... > >Encountered: constant >Expecting: identifier > >Associated with setting "color as string" > >I'm wondering if this is an error that comes up with E-Prime 2 >sometimes, and is perhaps not specific to my script. And also, if >anyone has successfully fixed the problem in their scripts. > >Thanks! I had to try this out myself, and indeed, this works with EP1 but not with EP2. Clearly, although not yet documented (the EP2 documentation lags behind the product), in EP2 "color" is now a restricted keyword. If you want to test this further yourself, just put any other known keyword (e.g., "string") in place of "color", and you will get practically the same error. The solution is simply to change the name of your variable from "color". --David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From jotapan at hotmail.com Fri Feb 6 12:55:47 2009 From: jotapan at hotmail.com (jotapan) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 04:55:47 -0800 Subject: response on the screen Message-ID: Hello, I am trying to use something like "radio buttons" presented on the screen so that the participant can give his answer directly with the mouse just by clicking on a box. I have looked for this information in the forum and came across a similar question... I have followed Matt's suggestion on using an image display procedure to do this. I'm actually using the script from his LoadImageUponMouseClick.zip (from the files section) in my program. However, as he mentions, this allows the participant to select more than one box at a time. Ideally, when a participant selects another response option during the period of time available for response, the previously selected box should become unselected and the new one become selected (this is what happens when we use radio buttons in a visual basic program). I assume this is possible to be done using some script... but I must confess I'm still very naive with respect to scrip writing; is there anyone who could help me on this? Thanks jotapan --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From coolpsychology at gmail.com Sat Feb 7 23:14:50 2009 From: coolpsychology at gmail.com (Rivermaker) Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 15:14:50 -0800 Subject: Is an If...then... by cycle possible? Message-ID: Hi! I don' t have much programming experience, so forgive me if this is really easy to do (I have spent a great deal of time looking first), and thank you for your time. Basically, I want to show the participant text that informs them to which set of stim presentations they're about to be exposed. I was thinking that there must be a way to build an InLine script that attached the current cycle count from a particular list object to text string. For example, following each set of stim presentations, I could imagine something like : If (on cycle 1) then text reads "Get ready for set 2!" If (on cycle 2) then text reads "Get ready for set 3!" . . . If (on cycle 10) then text reads "You're finished!" Is there a way to do this? If you can't do this with the cycle count, is there a way to set up a variable to use for this instead? Could you show me the way? Thanks very much indeed! Michael Magee --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 9 13:29:19 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 08:29:19 -0500 Subject: Is an If...then... by cycle possible? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Rivermaker (i.e., Michael), > I don' t have much programming experience, E-Prime is a great system for using existing programming skills to build programs for psychology experiments, but it is a lousy system for first learning how to program. For that I recommend taking a regular course in any established object-oriented computer language such as VisualBasic, Python, JavaScript, or C++. But enough editorial, on to your question (which was very nicely laid out)... > Basically, I want to show the participant text that informs them to > which set of stim presentations they're about to be exposed. I was > thinking that there must be a way to build an InLine script that > attached the current cycle count from a particular list object to text > string. > > For example, following each set of stim presentations, I could imagine > something like : > > If (on cycle 1) then text reads "Get ready for set 2!" > If (on cycle 2) then text reads "Get ready for set 3!" > . > . > . > If (on cycle 10) then text reads "You're finished!" > > > > Is there a way to do this? Perhaps. As you have noticed, your E-DataAid files have a column or "attribute" showing a cycle count for each List, e.g., "TrialList.Cycle". Naturally, you want to know if you can use this attribute within your program. Well, like most any E-Prime attribute, the list cycle count is available through the GetAttrib method of the Context object (see the online E-Basic Help for details), e.g., If c.GetAttrib("TrialList.Cycle") Then ... But I have not explored this very far, and the cycle attribute for your list may not be available at every phase of your program. So... > If you can't do this with the cycle count, > is there a way to set up a variable to use for this instead? Even if you can do this with the cycle count, doing it with a variable may offer some advantages. I cannot show you the entire way, but first you need to set up a global variable. To learn how to do that please work through the "Using E-Basic" chapter of the User's Guide that came with E-Prime, especially 4.3.4 ff. You should be able to take it from there. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 13:42:27 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 08:42:27 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number Message-ID: Hello, I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks! Best Regards, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From nanderson at klaru-baycrest.on.ca Mon Feb 9 14:30:57 2009 From: nanderson at klaru-baycrest.on.ca (Nicole Anderson) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:30:57 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Greg, Just dim a string variable in your user script, e.g., Dim SubNum as String And then in an InLine, type SubNum=C.GetAttrib("Subject") Cheers, Nicole Anderson Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hello, > I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific > subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time > locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that > was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? > > Thanks! > > Best Regards, > Greg > > > > > > > -- ______________________________________________________________________ Nicole D. Anderson, PhD, CPsych Associate Professor, Psychiatry and Psychology, University of Toronto Scientist, Kunin-Lunenfeld Applied Research Unit, Baycrest 3560 Bathurst Street Toronto, Ontario M6A 2E1 Phone: (416) 785-2500 x3366 Fax: (416) 785-2862 Email: nanderson at klaru-baycrest.on.ca --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From tina.paciorek at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 15:17:52 2009 From: tina.paciorek at gmail.com (Albertyna Paciorek) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 16:17:52 +0100 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Can I please be taken off the list? Thank you Albertyna On Mon, Feb 9, 2009 at 4:16 PM, Albertyna Paciorek wrote: > > Can I please be taken off the list? > > Thank you > > Albertyna > On Mon, Feb 9, 2009 at 2:42 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > >> >> Hello, >> I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific >> subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time >> locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that >> was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? >> >> Thanks! >> >> Best Regards, >> Greg >> >> >> >> > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 9 16:59:20 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 11:59:20 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: <49903E21.1020600@klaru-baycrest.on.ca> Message-ID: In fact, you can even skip the step of declaring a variable, and just use c.GetAttrib("Subject") directly wherever you need it, e.g., ListFileName = "ListFile" & c.GetAttrib("Subject") & ".txt" It all depends on what is most convenient for you, and what fits your programming style. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder Nicole Anderson wrote: > Hello Greg, > > Just dim a string variable in your user script, e.g., > Dim SubNum as String > > And then in an InLine, type > SubNum=C.GetAttrib("Subject") > > Cheers, > > Nicole Anderson > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: >> Hello, >> I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific >> subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time >> locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that >> was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? >> >> Thanks! >> >> Best Regards, >> Greg >> >> >> >> > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 17:19:55 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 12:19:55 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: <499060E8.8060008@msu.edu> Message-ID: Does c.GetAttrib("Subject") get the subject's name or the Subject Number (I am after the subject Number) If not, now that I know that it is an attribute and not an object property I just be able to find it fairly easily. Thanks for the assistance Greg On Mon, Feb 9, 2009 at 11:59 AM, David McFarlane wrote: > > In fact, you can even skip the step of declaring a variable, and just > use c.GetAttrib("Subject") directly wherever you need it, e.g., > > ListFileName = "ListFile" & c.GetAttrib("Subject") & ".txt" > > It all depends on what is most convenient for you, and what fits your > programming style. > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > Nicole Anderson wrote: >> Hello Greg, >> >> Just dim a string variable in your user script, e.g., >> Dim SubNum as String >> >> And then in an InLine, type >> SubNum=C.GetAttrib("Subject") >> >> Cheers, >> >> Nicole Anderson >> >> >> Greg Osenbach wrote: >>> Hello, >>> I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific >>> subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time >>> locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that >>> was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? >>> >>> Thanks! >>> >>> Best Regards, >>> Greg >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 9 18:28:27 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:28:27 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >Does c.GetAttrib("Subject") get the subject's name or the Subject >Number (I am after the subject Number) Subject number. Matter of fact, you cannot get the subject name at all, unless you change the default behavior of E-Prime. Subject number, Session, and more get controlled via the Startup Info tab of the Experiment object properties box, and you can see how all this works by looking at the generated code for Sub Main(), in the sections following "StartupInfoPrompt" labels. Hope that helps a bit, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From coolpsychology at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 21:49:52 2009 From: coolpsychology at gmail.com (Rivermaker) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:49:52 -0800 Subject: Is an If...then... by cycle possible? In-Reply-To: <49902FAF.8040604@msu.edu> Message-ID: Thanks David! So I should learn how to set up a global variable and then I should be able to use an If...Then...else... command. Doesn't sound like it's too hard. I will follow your advice and come back here if I get stuck. Thanks for your time and assistance. Mike On Feb 9, 8:29 am, David McFarlane wrote: > Rivermaker (i.e., Michael), > > > I don' t have much programming experience, > > E-Prime is a great system for using existing programming skills to build > programs for psychology experiments, but it is a lousy system for first > learning how to program.  For that I recommend taking a regular course > in any established object-oriented computer language such as > VisualBasic, Python, JavaScript, or C++.  But enough editorial, on to > your question (which was very nicely laid out)... > > > > > Basically, I want to show the participant text that informs them to > > which set of stim presentations they're about to be exposed. I was > > thinking that there must be a way to build an InLine script that > > attached the current cycle count from a particular list object to text > > string. > > > For example, following each set of stim presentations, I could imagine > > something like : > > > If (on cycle 1) then text reads "Get ready for set 2!" > > If (on cycle 2) then text reads "Get ready for set 3!" > > . > > . > > . > > If (on cycle 10) then text reads "You're finished!" > > > Is there a way to do this? > > Perhaps.  As you have noticed, your E-DataAid files have a column or > "attribute" showing a cycle count for each List, e.g., > "TrialList.Cycle".  Naturally, you want to know if you can use this > attribute within your program.  Well, like most any E-Prime attribute, > the list cycle count is available through the GetAttrib method of the > Context object (see the online E-Basic Help for details), e.g., > > If c.GetAttrib("TrialList.Cycle") Then ... > > But I have not explored this very far, and the cycle attribute for your > list may not be available at every phase of your program.  So... > > > If you can't do this with the cycle count, > > is there a way to set up a variable to use for this instead? > > Even if you can do this with the cycle count, doing it with a variable > may offer some advantages.  I cannot show you the entire way, but first > you need to set up a global variable.  To learn how to do that please > work through the "Using E-Basic" chapter of the User's Guide that came > with E-Prime, especially 4.3.4 ff.  You should be able to take it from > there. > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de Tue Feb 10 07:49:44 2009 From: janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de (janpsy) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 23:49:44 -0800 Subject: Dual task paradigm Message-ID: Hello, I am trying to program a dual task paradigm in which the subjects have to decide between two objects (keyboard response). Meanwhile they hear numbers and should press a key if three consecutive numbers are odd. To realize these two tasks I used a loop around slide on which the decision task is presented as well as the tons. An inline previous to the slide randomizes the numbers. My problem is, that the slide does not respond every time to the keys. Can you give me a hint how I could save the responses? Thanks for your help, Janina --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From D.Moore at bath.ac.uk Tue Feb 10 12:46:22 2009 From: D.Moore at bath.ac.uk (David Moore) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 12:46:22 +0000 Subject: sending ttl pulse Message-ID: Hi all, I've been programming in eprime for a little while now but have come across a problem with trying to get eprime (2) to communicate with an external device. The device that I'm sending the pulse to is a Pathway ATS stimulator (). The pulse in port appears to be a BCN port and I am wondering if anyone can a) recommend the cable that would be best for sending a pulse down and b) the code for sending an on/off pulse. Best Dave --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 10 17:07:21 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 12:07:21 -0500 Subject: sending ttl pulse In-Reply-To: <76C19CF927A0440E17E65159@mppc-112-res-09.campus.bath.ac.uk > Message-ID: Dave, >I've been programming in eprime for a little while now but have come across >a problem with trying to get eprime (2) to communicate with an external >device. The device that I'm sending the pulse to is a Pathway ATS >stimulator (). The pulse >in port appears to be a BCN port and I am wondering if anyone can a) >recommend the cable that would be best for sending a pulse down and b) the >code for sending an on/off pulse. Did you by any chance mean a "BNC" port? If so, the next question is whether that takes a standard TTL (0V to 5V) pulse. And if that is so I would look into sending the pulse out the parallel (lpt) port, after making a custom lpt-to-BNC cable. At the lpt end of the cable (a DB-25 female) I would use pin 18 for signal ground, and pin 2 for data. You would have to figure out the lpt port # on your computer, typically is uses &H378 for the data. In that case you might use code like ' I hate "magic" numbers, so make constants instead: Const lptDataPort as Integer = &H378 Const pulseDur as Integer = 20 ' ms WritePort lptDataPort, 1 ' turn on pulse Sleep pulseDur WritePort lptDataPort, 0 ' turn off pulse or, if you want to hedge your bets, turn on *all* the bits above with ... WritePort lptDataPort, &HFF ' turn on pulse ... And if you search around the list archives or the PST Forum you can probably find more instructions on this. Alternatively, if you have a SRBox and an expansion kit (or can make your own expansion cable), then you can send the pulses through that. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 02:13:25 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:13:25 -0500 Subject: Strings Message-ID: Hello, I am having a small problems with some strings. I have String1 and "String2 two and I would like to have "String1String2", however what I am getting is "String1 String2" (note the whitespace) I have tried both String = String1 + String 2 and String = String1 & String 2 I really do not understand why I am getting that whitespace in the first place, however, since it is there, is there a easy way to remove it from the final string? Thanks, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Wed Feb 11 02:46:08 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:46:08 +1100 Subject: Strings In-Reply-To: Message-ID: might have a space lurking at end of String1 .. or beginning of String2, perhaps At 01:13 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: >Hello, > >I am having a small problems with some strings. I have String1 and >"String2 two and I would like to have "String1String2", however what >I am getting is "String1 String2" (note the whitespace) > >I have tried both String = String1 + String 2 and String = String1 & String 2 > >I really do not understand why I am getting that whitespace in the >first place, however, since it is there, is there a easy way to >remove it from the final string? > >Thanks, >Greg > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: >10/02/2009 7:20 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: 10/02/2009 7:20 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 02:56:38 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:56:38 -0500 Subject: Strings In-Reply-To: <20090211024656.TFFF807.nschwotgx01p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis.une.edu.au> Message-ID: I did find it eventually :) This code was giving me " XX" which is my String2 ListFileNumber = str(((SubjectNumber Mod 45) + 16)) So I changed it slightly to: ListFileNumber = trim(str(((SubjectNumber Mod 45) + 16))) Thanks, Greg On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 9:46 PM, Peter Quain wrote: > > > might have a space lurking at end of String1 .. or beginning of > String2, perhaps > > At 01:13 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: > > >Hello, > > > >I am having a small problems with some strings. I have String1 and > >"String2 two and I would like to have "String1String2", however what > >I am getting is "String1 String2" (note the whitespace) > > > >I have tried both String = String1 + String 2 and String = String1 & > String 2 > > > >I really do not understand why I am getting that whitespace in the > >first place, however, since it is there, is there a easy way to > >remove it from the final string? > > > >Thanks, > >Greg > > > >> > > > > > >No virus found in this incoming message. > >Checked by AVG. > >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: > >10/02/2009 7:20 AM > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: > 10/02/2009 7:20 AM > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 04:13:12 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:13:12 -0500 Subject: Reading from a file Message-ID: Hello All, I would like to open an existing log file from and e-prime experiment in an second experiment. I see there is a the Open, and Input command to read the file into memory. I need to search the log file (which is quite large) for one of the list entries used in the previous experiment and then extract some data from those results to use in the second experiment. Does anyone have any suggestions how I can search through the log file for this information? For Example I want to find in the log BlockList: 5 and then pull the attribute LastValue for use in my new experiment. See the following log snippit as an example. Can anyone please point me in the right direction? Thanks. Greg *** LogFrame Start *** Procedure: BlockProc BlockList: 5 Value: 1 EV: 1.80000000 SD: 2.40000000 CorrectAnswer: 1 Attempts: 7 LastValue: 2.9 Type: 1.0000000o Running: BlockList BlockList.Cycle: 1 BlockList.Sample: 2 TrialCount: 13 Test.RTTime: 26215 Test.RT: 73 Test.RESP: 1 Test.CRESP: *** LogFrame End *** --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Wed Feb 11 08:53:46 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 19:53:46 +1100 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: One easy way of doing this might be: - when exp-1 finished, open the log file, find the entry you want (it will be the same in each file i presume, so easy to find quickly) - copy LastValue down In an InLine in exp-2 - set an AskBox to display immediately after startup info gathered - type in LastValue - pass the AskBox variable value to an attribute (nnnnnValue) Dim lastvalue As String lastvalue= AskBox ("LastValue:", , "Please type the final value from exp-1 here") c.SetAttrib "LastValue", lastvalue use the attribute to set the experiment running as you wish. Primitive but might get the job done without writing code to scour the log file . At 03:13 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: >Hello All, > >I would like to open an existing log file from and e-prime >experiment in an second experiment. I see there is a the Open, and >Input command to read the file into memory. > >I need to search the log file (which is quite large) for one of the >list entries used in the previous experiment and then extract some >data from those results to use in the second experiment. > >Does anyone have any suggestions how I can search through the log >file for this information? > >For Example I want to find in the log BlockList: 5 and then pull the >attribute LastValue for use in my new experiment. See the following >log snippit as an example. Can anyone please point me in the right >direction? Thanks. > >Greg > >*** LogFrame Start *** > Procedure: BlockProc > BlockList: 5 > Value: 1 > EV: 1.80000000 > SD: 2.40000000 > CorrectAnswer: 1 > Attempts: 7 > LastValue: 2.9 > Type: 1.0000000o > Running: BlockList > BlockList.Cycle: 1 > BlockList.Sample: 2 > TrialCount: 13 > Test.RTTime: 26215 > Test.RT: 73 > Test.RESP: 1 > Test.CRESP: >*** LogFrame End *** > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: >10/02/2009 7:20 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: 10/02/2009 7:20 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk Wed Feb 11 09:36:48 2009 From: d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk (David P Vinson) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:36:48 -0000 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, Greg wrote > ...I need to search the log file (which is quite large) for one of the > list entries used in the previous experiment and then extract some data > from those results to use in the second experiment. > > Does anyone have any suggestions how I can search through the log file for > this information? I had a similar situation and kept running into problems finding exactly the right thing in the log file due to multiple instances of my target text, only one of which was actually the one I was looking for. It turned out it was much easier to use inline code to create a separate text file to which only the desired information is written. This could work in your case - adding this code to your first experiment. In its simplest form the output file could contain a single LastValue, with a filename that indicates subject/session (although probably better to add a little bit more information for recordkeeping). Your second experiment could then include a little snippet of code to read in this value. This way you don't need to do some kind of more complicated search through the log file, just open the little output file from the previous experiment and read the desired value. dv --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk Wed Feb 11 09:43:33 2009 From: d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk (David P Vinson) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:43:33 -0000 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: <1534.86.155.234.79.1234345008.squirrel@www.webmail.ucl.ac.uk> Message-ID: (oops, sorry!) I missed "existing log file from previous experiment" in the previous email I sent. Of course my suggestion only works if you haven't yet run the first experiment. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 10:30:19 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 05:30:19 -0500 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: <1624.86.155.234.79.1234345413.squirrel@www.webmail.ucl.ac.uk> Message-ID: Ok, Tanks for the suggestions. So so lets say the list from my orignal experiment is 120 rows long and could be from any one of 60 different lists. I need the LastValue from two of those (at random). At the end of experiment 1 I pick at random 2 rows from the list, and write a text file containing: ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue And later on will just read this text file rather than the log file. Is see the Input commands loads the contents of the file into a string. Then what? with e-basic how do I find the two LastValues in said string? Other languages I have used have functions built in that would directly take a comma dileminated file and place it in a 2 dimensional array, where I could then just read array(0,2) and (1,2). I hae not come across anything in e-basic that might accomplish this, only the input command which looks like it just will read a cartin number of bytes into a string. Let's assume that ListFileName and BlockNumber cab be a variable length, which will change the relative positions of LastValue in the file. Thoughts? Thanks, Greg On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 4:43 AM, David P Vinson wrote: > > (oops, sorry!) > I missed "existing log file from previous experiment" in the previous > email I sent. Of course my suggestion only works if you haven't yet run > the first experiment. > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Wed Feb 11 22:15:48 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 09:15:48 +1100 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue are all attributes. maybe just write them to text file as seperate lines. you'll get 6 lines (strings). then just read in lines 3 and 6 when you start exp-2. Or if you want to know in exp-2 which lastvalues came from which list and which block in exp-1, read all lines into an array and set the attributes from the array. At 09:30 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: >Ok, Tanks for the suggestions. > >So so lets say the list from my orignal experiment is 120 rows long >and could be from any one of 60 different lists. I need the >LastValue from two of those (at random). > >At the end of experiment 1 I pick at random 2 rows from the list, >and write a text file containing: > >ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue >ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue > >And later on will just read this text file rather than the log file. > >Is see the Input commands loads the contents of the file into a >string. Then what? with e-basic how do I find the two LastValues >in said string? Other languages I have used have functions built in >that would directly take a comma dileminated file and place it in a >2 dimensional array, where I could then just read array(0,2) and >(1,2). I hae not come across anything in e-basic that might >accomplish this, only the input command which looks like it just >will read a cartin number of bytes into a string. Let's assume that >ListFileName and BlockNumber cab be a variable length, which will >change the relative positions of LastValue in the file. > >Thoughts? > >Thanks, >Greg > >On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 4:43 AM, David P Vinson ><d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk> wrote: > >(oops, sorry!) >I missed "existing log file from previous experiment" in the previous >email I sent. Of course my suggestion only works if you haven't yet run >the first experiment. > > > > > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: >10/02/2009 7:20 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.22/1946 - Release Date: 11/02/2009 11:13 AM From mplenhart at gmail.com Tue Feb 17 15:02:34 2009 From: mplenhart at gmail.com (Matt Lenhart) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 07:02:34 -0800 Subject: E-Prime 2 conversion of .es files In-Reply-To: <498b5791.20ed720a.2b35.ffffcb3cSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hello, Yes, a Color object has been added to the E-Basic language for E-Prime 2.0. Thus, you will be unable to use "Color" for object or variable names (i.e., in the same way that you cannot use TextDisplay, Dim, etc). In future builds, Color will turn blue when it is typed into an InLine or the User script. A KB was created when the Color object was added. You can take a look at http://www.pstnet.com/e-prime/support/kb.asp?TopicID=2667 for more information on the Colors object and its syntax. - Matt http://www.pstnet.com --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu Wed Feb 18 22:48:08 2009 From: avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu (Vidrine, Amy) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 15:48:08 -0700 Subject: E-Prime conversions 1.x to 2.0 Message-ID: We're having a problem getting E-Prime 2.0 Pro to load a 1.x *.es file. We have the 2.0.8.22 version of the software, which has already caused us a headache with one other file (we had to get the original authors to load it in one that had that version instead of the 2.0.1 and then recompile and send us the file...which is just...strange to me). Now it's not converting a 1.x *.es file. I get the error message 10005 when I try to load it, with a message that states "Unable to load Date/Time property." I know that other people have been using this file and converting it into EP 2.0. What I don't know is their version number, though I have a sneaking suspicion that we will be told to "downgrade" to 2.0.1. The file is available on a website that is password protected, so they would know if others were having problems with their files (I assume that those they give the passwords to would contact them with any problems). And no one else is having these problems. Any suggestions? I have put in a support request with E-Prime, but I wondered if anyone else had any thoughts. Thank you, avidrine --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu Thu Feb 19 16:48:44 2009 From: avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu (avidrine) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 08:48:44 -0800 Subject: E-Basic problems Message-ID: We're also having problems with E-Basic. Admittedly, I am rather new to E-Prime. However, I was messing around with the InLine tool and actually COPIED and PASTED the actual text from the Help file into the InLine....and it did not work!! What is up with that? I get an error message for the Sub Main() that says Encountered: Sub Expecting: Does anyone know why E-prime's own Help scripts do not work?? Amy V. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 19 19:25:04 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 14:25:04 -0500 Subject: E-Basic problems In-Reply-To: <85059614-3cb3-47b4-b3b8-a33c054ac11d@q9g2000yqc.googlegrou ps.com> Message-ID: Amy, >We're also having problems with E-Basic. Admittedly, I am rather new >to E-Prime. However, I was messing around with the InLine tool and >actually COPIED and PASTED the actual text from the Help file into the >InLine....and it did not work!! What is up with that? I get an error >message for the Sub Main() that says Encountered: Sub Expecting: > > >Does anyone know why E-prime's own Help scripts do not work?? Ah, I am glad that you discovered the online E-Basic Help, that is the real documentation for E-Prime. But make sure you read everything around the example scripts first, often that contains instructions about what example file to start with and other details needed to make the sample script work. The sample scripts in the Help are often just fragments that need supporting code, as should be understood by anyone generally familiar with computer programming. And before you delve into the online E-Basic Help, please at least work through *all* the tutorials in the Getting Started Guide that came with E-Prime. Even better if you work through all the tutorials and sample experiments in the User's Guide. The manuals are not designed to explain the underlying principles, concepts, and technical details of E-Prime usage, but at least the tutorials really are pretty useful as far as they go. And if you are serious about inline script, please work through the Using E-Basic chapter of the User's Guide. And every lab that cares about critical timing *must* have someone in their lab read and understand chapter three of the User's Guide. Hmm, I might take this opportunity to post for the first time my notes on solving E-Prime puzzles. I might later post this separately under a proper subject heading to make it easier to find and refer to. Regards, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder ---------------------------- How to Solve E-Prime Puzzles A General Algorithm I have developed a general algorithm for solving E-Prime problems, and I am putting this in the record here in case anyone (including me) ever needs to search for this. - Read the manuals that came with E-Prime (and pay attention to the tutorials): - Getting Started Guide - User's Guide - Reference Guide - Look at the sample programs that came with E-Prime - BasicRT - PictureRT - SoundRT - SlideRT - NestingRT - NestingXRT - MovieRT (EP2 only) - MultipleDisplayRt (EP2 only) - Search and study the online E-Basic Help - From E-Studio: Help > E-Basic Help - From the Windows Start menu: Path may vary, but it will be in the same place as the shortcut to E-Studio - Read the online FAQ, whenever that gets written (I am still working on this one) - Look at sample programs available on the Web - From PST: http://www.pstnet.com/e-prime/support/samples.asp (requires registration and login) - From the E-Prime Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime/files - From the System for Teaching Experimental Psychology (STEP): http://step.psy.cmu.edu/ - From Paul Groot: http://www.psy.vu.nl/download/menu/xml/TOC.xml - Attached to various messages at the PST Forum (requires registration & login to download attachments): http://support.pstnet.com/forum/Forum3-1.aspx - Search the E-Prime Knowledge Base at http://www.pstnet.com/e-prime/support/kb.asp - Search, browse, and study the web forums - E-Prime mailing list -- two portals to the same content: - Archives of EPRIME List: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/eprime.html - E-Prime Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime/ - PST Forum: http://support.pstnet.com/forum/Forum3-1.aspx - After all the above fail, post a question at the web forums above. This may require registration. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Fri Feb 20 16:03:42 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 11:03:42 -0500 Subject: E-Basic problems In-Reply-To: <499db288.20ed720a.58d2.ffffde6dSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Following up after an off-list exchange with Amy... >I was looking at the random number generator, the Random >(function). It was getting an error at the Sub Main() Aha, that's it. Most likely you innocently pasted that entire example script into an inline script object. That will not work at all, as you cannot define a Sub in inline script (since that is already executing from withing a Sub), you must define Subs and Functions in the global User Area, as described in the Using E-Basic chapter of the User's Guide. Furthermore, that example is really meant for version 1.x. Back in version 1.x you could edit the raw source code as text directly in E-Run; version 2 took that away from us. Anyway, you would open a blank E-Run window, then copy and paste the complete Random() example into E-Run, and run that. Just to make sure, I tried this myself and... what do you know, the Random() example has an error in it! They forgot to define their variables, you need to add a "Dim x, y, message" or the like in there, then it works. Bad E-Prime example writers! They really need to proofread and test what they write before foisting it off on innocent users! I will report this error to PST in case they want to fix it in future documentation. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Fri Feb 20 16:15:57 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 11:15:57 -0500 Subject: E-Basic problems In-Reply-To: <499ed464.20ed720a.58d2.ffffcf7dSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Sorry for further belaboring this, but for the record... > >I was looking at the random number generator, the Random > >(function). It was getting an error at the Sub Main() The Random() example does work if you paste it all into an inline script object, add the line Dim x, y, message and delete the "Sub Main()" and "End Sub" lines. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Sun Feb 22 18:15:56 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 13:15:56 -0500 Subject: working with files Message-ID: Hello everyone. I am wishing to use a text file for some temporary storage of some experiment data to use in various other experiments. I see hope to open a new file and I think I have it down how to write to it. However I would like to delete the file when I am done with it. Does anyone know how I can go about doing that? Thanks, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 03:15:58 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:15:58 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list Message-ID: Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. Thanks, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Mon Feb 23 03:29:33 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:29:33 +1100 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: looking at the text dump of your edat output, perhaps you are running List called BlocklList, and this trial is Sample: 2. A property of the List object is [ListName].Sample, and it is recorded here as an attribute. *** LogFrame Start *** Procedure: BlockProc BlockList: 5 Value: 1 EV: 1.80000000 SD: 2.40000000 CorrectAnswer: 1 Attempts: 7 LastValue: 2.9 Type: 1.0000000o Running: BlockList BlockList.Cycle: 1 BlockList.Sample: 2 TrialCount: 13 Test.RTTime: 26215 Test.RT: 73 Test.RESP: 1 Test.CRESP: *** LogFrame End *** myrow = c.GetAttrib (BlockList.Sample) At 02:15 PM 23/02/2009, you wrote: >Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > >How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is >using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If >anyone can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > >Thanks, >Greg > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: >22/02/2009 5:21 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: 22/02/2009 5:21 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From cblais at berkeley.edu Mon Feb 23 03:31:57 2009 From: cblais at berkeley.edu (Chris Blais) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 19:31:57 -0800 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order in which they appear in the list. Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > Thanks, > Greg > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 03:36:49 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:36:49 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A218AD.5060204@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: Ah Ha! It is .Sample! That's the missing method I was looking for! Thanks guys! Greg On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais wrote: > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order > in which they appear in the list. > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 03:55:29 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:55:29 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A218AD.5060204@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error "Sample is not a property of the Object" Suggestions? My line of code: Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) And: If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then Lot1CE = CEValue End If If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then Lot2CE = CEValue End If Thanks, Greg On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais wrote: > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order > in which they appear in the list. > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ejk4 at pitt.edu Mon Feb 23 04:01:51 2009 From: ejk4 at pitt.edu (Eliezer Kanal) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 23:01:51 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The error is in how you're calling GetAttrib. "c.GetAttrib" means "get attribute from c", or "get attribute from context". Context is sort of the base-level storage of the entire experiment. You don't want to get an attribute of the context, you want an attribute of BlockList. I think you want to try str(BlockList.GetAttrib("Sample")) I don't have eprime on this computer, though, so I can't test that. Good luck - Cheers, Eliezer Kanal PhD Candidate, Bioengineering Laboratory for Computational Neuroscience University of Pittsburgh On Feb 22, 2009, at 10:55 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > Suggestions? > > My line of code: > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > And: > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > Lot1CE = CEValue > End If > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > Lot2CE = CEValue > End If > > Thanks, > Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 04:08:19 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 23:08:19 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <4986D524-DF92-4C5B-A29B-047C3AD8A015@pitt.edu> Message-ID: Thanks for the suggestion! although that gets me an error: GetAttrib: Missing Parameter(s) Thanks, Greg On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 11:01 PM, Eliezer Kanal wrote: > > The error is in how you're calling GetAttrib. "c.GetAttrib" means "get > attribute from c", or "get attribute from context". Context is sort of > the base-level storage of the entire experiment. You don't want to get > an attribute of the context, you want an attribute of BlockList. I > think you want to try > > str(BlockList.GetAttrib("Sample")) > > I don't have eprime on this computer, though, so I can't test that. > Good luck - > > Cheers, > Eliezer Kanal > PhD Candidate, Bioengineering > Laboratory for Computational Neuroscience > University of Pittsburgh > > > > On Feb 22, 2009, at 10:55 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cblais at berkeley.edu Mon Feb 23 04:43:22 2009 From: cblais at berkeley.edu (Chris Blais) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 20:43:22 -0800 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call Target.RT)? Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > Suggestions? > > My line of code: > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > And: > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > Lot1CE = CEValue > End If > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > Lot2CE = CEValue > End If > > Thanks, > Greg > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > wrote: > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order > in which they appear in the list. > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If > anyone > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 04:46:16 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 23:46:16 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A2296A.9030507@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: Chris, Debug.Print "Row = " + str(BlockList.Sample) just gets me an invalid property error. On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 11:43 PM, Chris Blais wrote: > > > Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried > calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call > Target.RT)? > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > > wrote: > > > > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the > order > > in which they appear in the list. > > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If > > anyone > > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most > appreciated. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cblais at berkeley.edu Mon Feb 23 05:05:20 2009 From: cblais at berkeley.edu (Chris Blais) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 21:05:20 -0800 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I know it's logged as BlockList.Sample in the eDat file, but yes, it doesn't exist as a method/property of the object. Given your code: If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then Lot1CE = CEValue End If If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then Lot2CE = CEValue End If Couldn't you just add another Attribute/Column to the list which serves the same purpose? For example, name a column LotValue which has "Lot1" or "Lot2" as its value and then: If (c.GetAttrib(LotValue) = "Lot1") Then Lot1CE = CEValue Elseif (c.GetAttrib(LotValue) = "Lot2") Then Lot2CE = CEValue End If Greg Osenbach wrote: > Chris, > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(BlockList.Sample) just gets me an invalid > property error. > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 11:43 PM, Chris Blais > wrote: > > > > Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried > calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call > Target.RT)? > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > > > >> wrote: > > > > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample > numbers range > > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered > in the order > > in which they appear in the list. > > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my > experiment is > > > using? I have been messing around with this one for > hours. If > > anyone > > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most > appreciated. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From pquain at une.edu.au Mon Feb 23 05:02:45 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 16:02:45 +1100 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A2296A.9030507@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: ah ... even though [ListName].Sample is logged in the edat file (with the property syntax (.)), it isn't a property of the List Object. ----------------------------------------------- The List object derives from Factor. The List has no additional properties or methods. See the Factor object for further information. Properties ActionDelay Filename Name ResetCondition TargetOffsetTime ActionTime FinishTime OffsetTime ResetEveryRun TargetOnsetTime Deletion ID OnsetTime StartTime TerminateCondition Duration LoadMethod Order Tag Methods AddLevel GetNextAttrib PeekAttrib SetAttribLogFlag Size GetAttrib GetPrevAttrib Reset SetNested Terminate GetAttibLogFlag GetProc Run SetProc GetCurrentAttrib Load SetAttrib SetWeight -------------------------------------------------- i spose you could add an attribute to your list(s) .. say called 'lstsample' and number sequentially.. and then grab that value sss = [ListName].GetCurrentAttrib("lstsample") At 03:43 PM 23/02/2009, you wrote: >Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried >calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call >Target.RT)? > >Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > > wrote: > > > > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered > in the order > > in which they appear in the list. > > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If > > anyone > > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: >22/02/2009 5:21 PM > > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: >22/02/2009 5:21 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: 22/02/2009 5:21 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 23 14:16:53 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 09:16:53 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <4986D524-DF92-4C5B-A29B-047C3AD8A015@pitt.edu> Message-ID: OK, let me try to straighten this out. First, you all need to go back and look at the online E-Basic Help and look at the "Context" and "List" entries where much of this gets explained. Second, as you will note there, List.GetAttrib is different than Context.GetAttrib. List.GetAttrib requires that you supply both a level number and an attribute name, whereas Context.GetAttrib takes only an attribute name. So Eliezer's suggestion would not work because it uses the wrong syntax. It also would not work because a List object only knows its own attributes (columns) and nothing else. At least Eliezer knew to submit the attribute name as a quote-enclosed string, e.g, "Sample", which gets me to point three. As clearly explained and illustrated in the documentation, the attribute name must be a *string*, you cannot use a mere variable name or property. Thus, Greg should simply have used c.GetAttrib("BlockList.Sample") ' note the use of quotes! in the first place. Finally, in reference to some other postings on this topic, there is exactly one and only one Context object created in any E-Prime program, and it is automatically given the simple name "c". That Context object always contains *all* the attributes active at the current time in the program. You all really need to take a time out and get some basic lessons in object-oriented programming. Regards, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder Eliezer Kanal wrote: > The error is in how you're calling GetAttrib. "c.GetAttrib" means "get > attribute from c", or "get attribute from context". Context is sort of > the base-level storage of the entire experiment. You don't want to get > an attribute of the context, you want an attribute of BlockList. I > think you want to try > > str(BlockList.GetAttrib("Sample")) > > I don't have eprime on this computer, though, so I can't test that. > Good luck - > > Cheers, > Eliezer Kanal > PhD Candidate, Bioengineering > Laboratory for Computational Neuroscience > University of Pittsburgh > > > > On Feb 22, 2009, at 10:55 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > >> Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error >> >> "Sample is not a property of the Object" >> >> Suggestions? >> >> My line of code: >> Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) >> >> And: >> If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then >> Lot1CE = CEValue >> End If >> If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then >> Lot2CE = CEValue >> End If >> >> Thanks, >> Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 23 19:42:00 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:42:00 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <20090223050317.TES7357.nschwotgx03p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis. une.edu.au> Message-ID: At 2/23/2009 12:02 AM Monday, Peter Quain wrote: >i spose you could add an attribute to your list(s) .. say called >'lstsample' and number sequentially.. and then grab that value >sss = [ListName].GetCurrentAttrib("lstsample") Yes, even I shot my mouth off a little too soon (I was at home over breakfast, now I made it to my work site). Peter actually has the most serviceable answer here, although there is a slightly slicker approach that may work. And the previous answers using ".Sample" are not strictly correct, although it may by accident work in some cases. Let me explain. Suppose you have a List named List1. When you run that list, you will find three related columns in the resulting .edat file: List1, List1.Cycle, and List1.Sample. If you only run one cycle of List1, *and* run in sequential order, *then* List1.Cycle will always show 1, and List1 will always equal List1.Sample. However, if you run in random order, List1.Cycle will still always show 1 *but* List1 will only equal List1.Sample in the event that the "random" order turns out to be sequential, otherwise the values in these two attributes will differ -- List1.Sample will always show sequential values, whereas List1 will show which random row of List1 was selected for that iteration of the list. Finally, if you run for more than one cycle, then, regardless of whether you use sequential or random selection, List1.Cycle will show which cycle of the list is running, and after cycle 1 then List1 will *never* equal List1.Sample -- i.e., List1.Sample will continue to increase sequentially, while List1 again shows which row of the list was selected for that iteration of the list. Whew! So how do we summarize all that? - The attribute "List1" shows which row of the list has been selected for the current iteration of List1. - The attribute "List1.Cycle" shows which repetition of List1 in in progress. - The attribute "List1.Sample" shows how many times we have taken a sample from List1 so far. (This attribute is always strictly increasing, and in some cases could be used for a built-in trial counter, though in general you would to better using your own script variable for that.) So, after all that, Greg could use something like sss = c.GetAttrib("MyList") (There are even fancier things you can to with casting functions in case you don't know what list name will be used and want to determine that programmatically at run time. But that is far too advanced a topic.) But I really prefer Peter's answer, since it is a little clearer (insofar as it relies a little less on deep understanding of E-Prime lists and attributes) and allows for more control and flexibility. And please, as always do not take my word for any of this! I insist that you to construct your own demonstration programs and test this for yourselves. My apologies to all for not getting this right the first time, and for once again posting a lengthy explanation, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 23 19:57:38 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:57:38 -0500 Subject: working with files In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >I am wishing to use a text file for some temporary storage of some >experiment data to use in various other experiments. I see hope to >open a new file and I think I have it down how to write to >it. However I would like to delete the file when I am done with >it. Does anyone know how I can go about doing that? Hmm, I imagine you want to delete the file directly from your E-Prime program, rather than waiting and then just deleting it manually with Windows Explorer later. If that is that case, then you want to look at the "Kill" topic in the online E-Basic Help. BTW, that was a nice little puzzle -- I actually had to run a full search in the online E-Basic Help using the term "delete" in order to find the Kill topic, that was not the obvious answer (although in retrospect, that keyword is often enough used in systems as a command to delete files). Of course, if it really is a temporary file then you might just use the same file name each time, leave the file in place, and just overwrite it for each new session. That would spare you the extra work of deleting the file each time. Just a thought. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From rickogorman at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 21:06:06 2009 From: rickogorman at gmail.com (Rick O'Gorman) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 21:06:06 +0000 Subject: E-DataAid slow Message-ID: Hi all, Recently went from 2.0.1 to 2.0.8, and I'm finding data-aid really slow to export to any format (SPSS, Excel, other text). Don't remember it being this slow before. Any ideas? Rick -- Rick O'Gorman, PhD Psychology, Faculty of Development and Society Collegiate Crescent Campus, Sheffield Hallam University, Sheffield S10 2BP Phone: 0114 225 5788 Fax: 0114 225 2430 http://www.shu.ac.uk/psychology/staff/OGorman.html If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. --Albert Einstein --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 23:28:52 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:28:52 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49a2fc61.13bb720a.36f6.fffff770SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Thank you for explaining that so clearly David. That helps me out a lot. As it is, I am a LabVIEW programmer and I do have to admit that my text based programming is a little rusty from many years of disuse :) I will take another crack at this now and let you all know how it goes. I eventually gave up last night about midnight in frustration at nothing working how I intended it. I am sure lack of sleep may have been a factor. :) Cheers, Greg On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 2:42 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > At 2/23/2009 12:02 AM Monday, Peter Quain wrote: > >i spose you could add an attribute to your list(s) .. say called > >'lstsample' and number sequentially.. and then grab that value > >sss = [ListName].GetCurrentAttrib("lstsample") > > Yes, even I shot my mouth off a little too soon (I was at home over > breakfast, now I made it to my work site). Peter actually has the > most serviceable answer here, although there is a slightly slicker > approach that may work. And the previous answers using ".Sample" are > not strictly correct, although it may by accident work in some > cases. Let me explain. > > Suppose you have a List named List1. When you run that list, you > will find three related columns in the resulting .edat file: List1, > List1.Cycle, and List1.Sample. If you only run one cycle of List1, > *and* run in sequential order, *then* List1.Cycle will always show 1, > and List1 will always equal List1.Sample. However, if you run in > random order, List1.Cycle will still always show 1 *but* List1 will > only equal List1.Sample in the event that the "random" order turns > out to be sequential, otherwise the values in these two attributes > will differ -- List1.Sample will always show sequential values, > whereas List1 will show which random row of List1 was selected for > that iteration of the list. Finally, if you run for more than one > cycle, then, regardless of whether you use sequential or random > selection, List1.Cycle will show which cycle of the list is running, > and after cycle 1 then List1 will *never* equal List1.Sample -- i.e., > List1.Sample will continue to increase sequentially, while List1 > again shows which row of the list was selected for that iteration of the > list. > > Whew! So how do we summarize all that? > - The attribute "List1" shows which row of the list has been selected > for the current iteration of List1. > - The attribute "List1.Cycle" shows which repetition of List1 in in > progress. > - The attribute "List1.Sample" shows how many times we have taken a > sample from List1 so far. (This attribute is always strictly > increasing, and in some cases could be used for a built-in trial > counter, though in general you would to better using your own script > variable for that.) > > So, after all that, Greg could use something like > sss = c.GetAttrib("MyList") > > (There are even fancier things you can to with casting functions in > case you don't know what list name will be used and want to determine > that programmatically at run time. But that is far too advanced a topic.) > > But I really prefer Peter's answer, since it is a little clearer > (insofar as it relies a little less on deep understanding of E-Prime > lists and attributes) and allows for more control and flexibility. > > And please, as always do not take my word for any of this! I insist > that you to construct your own demonstration programs and test this > for yourselves. > > My apologies to all for not getting this right the first time, and > for once again posting a lengthy explanation, > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From graftedlife at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 04:15:30 2009 From: graftedlife at gmail.com (Paul) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 20:15:30 -0800 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag Message-ID: Hi All, I'm running a cross-modal lexical priming task on EP2, presenting firstly an auditory prime and then a visual target word at prime offset. While presenting the auditory prime, I also need to put a fixation point on the screen. The problem is, I tried to put the soundout object and a fixation jpeg file in a slide together, while the actual slide presentation duration varies often; sometimes the sound has finshed while the fixation point stays on the screen. The settings are as follows: Slide Object: Duration: infinite Device: none (therefore no time limit/end action) (Setting prerelease did not seem to help, so for now I changed it back to 0) SlideSoundOut Object: Buffer mode: Streaming (the files are quite small, usually about 1 second long, but I still used this mode, with buffer size being 9000; I tried to set buffer size at 20000 and use the buffer mode on a laptop earlier, though that did not seem to work at that time.) Loop: No Stop After: Yes End Sound Action: Terminate I tried to put a inline object in the beginning of the session procedure (as discussed in another article) to set the soundload factor as 3 ("c.SetAttrib "Sound.LoadFactor", 3), though that did not seem to help. And then I tried to see if I could pre-cache the sound and the image file in the slide object, by adding the following inline objects before the slide (though I'm not sure if they are correctly written), and the situation did not change much: 1. (Trying to preload the slidesoundout object) Dim strSlideSoundOut As SlideSoundOut Set strSlideSoundOut = CSlideSoundOut(PracPrime.States (PracPrime.ActiveState).Objects ("SoundOut1")) Dim MyBuffer As SoundBuffer Set MyBuffer = strSlideSoundOut.Buffers(1) MyBuffer.Filename = c.GetAttrib("PrimeSound") MyBuffer.Load 2. (Trying to preload the slideimage object) Dim strImageFile As SlideImage Set strImageFile = CSlideImage(PracPrime.States (PracPrime.ActiveState).Objects("Image1")) strImageFile.Filename = "Cross.jpg" strImageFile.Load I'm running the experiment under XP, and I guess the machine meets e- prime's requirement, but still I got timing problems. I would be very grateful for your help, as timing is critically important to cross- modal experiments. Sincere thanks, Paul --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From scampbell at casl.umd.edu Tue Feb 24 16:08:28 2009 From: scampbell at casl.umd.edu (Susan G. Campbell) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:08:28 -0500 Subject: E-DataAid slow Message-ID: Hi Rick (and list), If you don't need the unicode export, you might try turning it off (I believe it's a checkbox at the bottom of the export dialog, and it's on by default). I found that sped up my exports for big files quite a bit, though I think 1.2 may still have been faster; I never had 2.0.1, so I'm not sure if that's the difference you're seeing. HTH, Susan Susan Campbell, MA Graduate Research Assistant University of Maryland Center for Advanced Study of Language -----Original Message----- From: e-prime at googlegroups.com on behalf of Rick O'Gorman Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 4:06 PM To: E-Prime Subject: E-DataAid slow Hi all, Recently went from 2.0.1 to 2.0.8, and I'm finding data-aid really slow to export to any format (SPSS, Excel, other text). Don't remember it being this slow before. Any ideas? Rick -- Rick O'Gorman, PhD Psychology, Faculty of Development and Society Collegiate Crescent Campus, Sheffield Hallam University, Sheffield S10 2BP Phone: 0114 225 5788 Fax: 0114 225 2430 http://www.shu.ac.uk/psychology/staff/OGorman.html If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. --Albert Einstein --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From rickogorman at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 17:34:31 2009 From: rickogorman at gmail.com (Rick O'Gorman) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:34:31 +0000 Subject: E-DataAid slow In-Reply-To: <6E3FDD28350CF344AC283906612E40C32FC220@ex2.casl.umd.edu> Message-ID: Thanks Susan. I have to say I don't notice a difference, although I didn't do a full comparison. That also raises another issue--why is the unicode on by default for exporting SPSS text file? I couldn't figure out why SPSS was seeing a garbled file when I tried importing until I re-saved the text file as ANSI and then it read it fine! I don't know what DataAid is doing exactly, but it seems to me that it is not doing anything too complex and is clearly poorly optimised. Rick Susan G. Campbell wrote: > Hi Rick (and list), > > If you don't need the unicode export, you might try turning it off (I believe it's a checkbox at the bottom of the export dialog, and it's on by default). I found that sped up my exports for big files quite a bit, though I think 1.2 may still have been faster; I never had 2.0.1, so I'm not sure if that's the difference you're seeing. > > HTH, > Susan > > Susan Campbell, MA > Graduate Research Assistant > University of Maryland Center for Advanced Study of Language > > -----Original Message----- > From: e-prime at googlegroups.com on behalf of Rick O'Gorman > Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 4:06 PM > To: E-Prime > Subject: E-DataAid slow > > > Hi all, > > Recently went from 2.0.1 to 2.0.8, and I'm finding data-aid really slow > to export to any format (SPSS, Excel, other text). Don't remember it > being this slow before. > > Any ideas? > > Rick -- Rick O'Gorman, PhD Psychology, Faculty of Development and Society Collegiate Crescent Campus, Sheffield Hallam University, Sheffield S10 2BP Phone: 0114 225 5788 Fax: 0114 225 2430 http://www.shu.ac.uk/psychology/staff/OGorman.html If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. --Albert Einstein --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 20:07:19 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:07:19 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime (was: Re: What is the current row in a list) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 2/23/2009 06:28 PM Monday, Greg Osenbach wrote: >I am a LabVIEW programmer So I am curious, why would you switch to E-Prime from LabVIEW? Does E-Prime have some advantage over LabVIEW? Or did you just get stucke with a decree from on high? Thanks, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 20:31:41 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:31:41 -0500 Subject: E-DataAid slow In-Reply-To: <49A42FA7.9060909@gmail.com> Message-ID: >That also raises another issue--why is the >unicode on by default for exporting SPSS text file? I couldn't figure >out why SPSS was seeing a garbled file when I tried importing until I >re-saved the text file as ANSI and then it read it fine! I had a similar problem when I wanted to process some exported data with an Excel macro (for later re-importing back into E-DataAid). Excel handled the file pretty well, except it had an extra character at the beginning of "STRING" in cell A1, and that messed up the re-import into E-DataAid. When I made sure to export the data without Unicode, cell A1 came out as it should. Since Unicode was the unalterable default and I could not trust my users to manually turn off Unicode every time, I worked around the problem in Excel by just writing "STRING" back into cell A1. Sheesh. What was PST staff thinking? (Or perhaps, what were they smoking, etc., pick your own gibe.) I agree that E-DataAid 2 should export data as non-Unicode by default, or at least allow us to change the default setting. In fact, I already posted this request in December to the PST Forum at http://support.pstnet.com/forum/Topic2552-12-1.aspx . Perhaps others could add their voice to that post. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 20:47:16 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:47:16 -0500 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag In-Reply-To: <9525c27f-97aa-4793-bd66-e9bb9f85b277@k19g2000yqg.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: Paul, OK, first just checking our assumptions before we look further... >SlideSoundOut Object: >Buffer mode: Streaming (the files are quite small, usually about 1 >second long, OK, but how many KB are the sound files? How many channels (mono or stereo?), how many samples/sec, and how many bits/sample? Also, how many KB is your fixation .jpg file? What is its resolution (pixels width and height), its color bit depth, and its compression ratio? And why use a .jpg for the fixation instead of just a text "+"? Finally, you didn't say but if you are using EP2 then you do well to stick to XP, as PST does not yet have EP2 sound & video working reliably under Vista (as attested in several other list & forum messages). Usually everything still works well under XP though. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 20:53:38 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:53:38 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime (was: Re: What is the current row in a list) In-Reply-To: <49a4537a.25bd720a.41ed.ffffee60SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a project since no one in the program really knows much about programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. Greg On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 3:07 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > At 2/23/2009 06:28 PM Monday, Greg Osenbach wrote: > >I am a LabVIEW programmer > > So I am curious, why would you switch to E-Prime from LabVIEW? Does > E-Prime have some advantage over LabVIEW? Or did you just get stucke > with a decree from on high? > > Thanks, > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 21:07:48 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:07:48 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working >towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for >running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a >project since no one in the program really knows much about >programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. Ah, so you did get stuck with a decree from on high :). Same here, if I had my druthers I would still program everything in C, or perhaps graduate to C++ or MatLab. Please post a comparison review here once you get more experience, perhaps some of us would want to switch to LabVIEW if we only knew it better. Thanks, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 21:24:28 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:24:28 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <49a461a8.20ed720a.58d2.454cSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Well, first off, LabVIEW make it very easy for people to program things badly :) I am not sure what the price points are.. A seat of LabVIEW runs from about $2,500 for the basic package. I have no idea how that compares with E-Prime. Are you familiar with LabVIEW then? Greg On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 4:07 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > Greg, > > >LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working > >towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for > >running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a > >project since no one in the program really knows much about > >programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. > > Ah, so you did get stuck with a decree from on high :). Same here, > if I had my druthers I would still program everything in C, or > perhaps graduate to C++ or MatLab. Please post a comparison review > here once you get more experience, perhaps some of us would want to > switch to LabVIEW if we only knew it better. > > Thanks, > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 21:43:51 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:43:51 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >Well, first off, LabVIEW make it very easy for people to program >things badly :) LOL! I don't know that E-Prime does any better, but I defer to your judgment. >I am not sure what the price points are.. A seat of LabVIEW runs >from about $2,500 for the basic package. I have no idea how that >compares with E-Prime. Yikes! (Although I found a note from 2007 showing a "base price" of $1200.) By comparison, if you ask you can still get a full EP1 license for $700. As for the current EP2 product, as detailed at the PST sales site, (http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/#Pricing ) a single "Professional" license runs $1000, what I call the "base" edition runs a mere $800 for one license, and you can get a "run-time" license (no E-Studio hardware key) for $125. Network licenses and quantity discounts are also available. >Are you familiar with LabVIEW then? As it turns out, I have been told by a user in our organization that we have a site license for LabVIEW, so I could explore it for no charge! Now if only I had the time to spare... -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 21:51:07 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (mary) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:51:07 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" Message-ID: Hi, we're using eprime 2.0. We have our program set up so that it will advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI scanner sends out every 3 seconds. We want to also be able to log our subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t keys), it will advance the slide. Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra blank slide. Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide for a specific key instead of any key? (We tried going to the advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that did not work. Do we have to do an in-line or something? Thanks! Mary --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 21:53:58 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:53:58 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <49a46a1b.25bd720a.41ed.166eSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Perhaps I am mistaken about the LabVIEW base price, I may be thinking of one of the other development packages, rather than the base package. If you ever get the urge to take a look at it, I would be more than happy to answer any questions you may have :) Greg On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 4:43 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > Greg, > > >Well, first off, LabVIEW make it very easy for people to program > >things badly :) > > LOL! I don't know that E-Prime does any better, but I defer to your > judgment. > > >I am not sure what the price points are.. A seat of LabVIEW runs > >from about $2,500 for the basic package. I have no idea how that > >compares with E-Prime. > > Yikes! (Although I found a note from 2007 showing a "base price" of > $1200.) By comparison, if you ask you can still get a full EP1 > license for $700. As for the current EP2 product, as detailed at the > PST sales site, (http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/#Pricing ) a > single "Professional" license runs $1000, what I call the "base" > edition runs a mere $800 for one license, and you can get a > "run-time" license (no E-Studio hardware key) for $125. Network > licenses and quantity discounts are also available. > > >Are you familiar with LabVIEW then? > > As it turns out, I have been told by a user in our organization that > we have a site license for LabVIEW, so I could explore it for no > charge! Now if only I had the time to spare... > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Tue Feb 24 22:08:27 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 09:08:27 +1100 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <49a461a8.20ed720a.58d2.454cSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: i thought that the key selling point of specialised stimulus presentation software is low level routines - probably written in C or C++ (?) - that optimise interaction with the OS (and thus its devices) to provide millisecond precision timing accuracy for the higher level routines that organise the stimulus properties and collect responses. A programmatic interface to these higher level routines makes their manipulation easy and powerful (if you can work out where to put dots, and the like :), but it doesn't touch the OS interface. I'm wondering whether you could be confident that standalone applications built in C etc could provide that sort of accuracy without a hell of a lot of testing and modification of the OS interface routines, and then tuning them on individual machines. Same basic question with LabView (i thought it was a data acquisition, processing tool, with a GUI and a maths language), and MatLab (data manipulation tool, full script interface). Can you build stimulus presentation paradigms in these applications ..track blanking signals properly for example? Could you check easily their performance on different machines? We've identified some substantial timing errors in a couple of paradigms written in C++. On the other hand, our e-prime data from visual paradigms shows that on an appropriate machine e-prime can perform as pst state. If you went this way, could you trust the timing? At 08:07 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: >Greg, > > >LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working > >towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for > >running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a > >project since no one in the program really knows much about > >programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. > >Ah, so you did get stuck with a decree from on high :). Same here, >if I had my druthers I would still program everything in C, or >perhaps graduate to C++ or MatLab. Please post a comparison review >here once you get more experience, perhaps some of us would want to >switch to LabVIEW if we only knew it better. > >Thanks, >-- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > >> > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 22:11:42 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:11:42 -0500 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <5c4ae755-e12d-44d6-966b-3ed2ebe04efb@v18g2000vbb.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: Mary, >we're using eprime 2.0. We have our program set up so that it will >advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI >scanner sends out every 3 seconds. We want to also be able to log our >subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the >next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t >keys), it will advance the slide. > >Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide >right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would >hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra >blank slide. Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide >for a specific key instead of any key? (We tried going to the >advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that >did not work. Do we have to do an in-line or something? Perhaps, but there may be other ways. I would explore adding a second Keyboard device in the Input Mask for your original Slide object. It's a little known fact that you can add multiple instances of any input device into the Input Mask of any display object, and each instance can have its own settings for Allowable, Correct, Time Limit, and End Action (I don't know where PST documents this, if anywhere). Be careful with this, it can get confusing as you have to click on each instance in the Input Mask box to work with the settings for that instance! So anyway, keep your first Keyboard mask as it is, terminating the slide when it gets a "t". Then set up your second Keyboard mask with End Action "(none)" so that subjects can press keys without terminating the slide. Just make sure subjects do not press "t"! Also, if you want to allow more than one response then you have to adjust that under the Advanced button. One gotcha though, I don't know how you get all your subject response data out of this, I think it will store only the final "t" from the scanner in the .edat2 file. You might have to use some script and the InputMask.Responses property to store the subject's responses to the .edat file. See the InputMask.Responses topic in the online E-Basic Help, and/or search around on this Google group or in the PST Forum, some of this has been discussed before. And if it were me I would first test out this idea in a little demo program for that purpose, rather than jumping right in and trying to make it work on my real experiment program. Once I get the tiny demo to work I would apply what I learned to the real program. Just a bit of strategic advice from an old hand. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:13:07 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:13:07 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <5c4ae755-e12d-44d6-966b-3ed2ebe04efb@v18g2000vbb.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) and not logging the subject's response. How do we only log the "non- action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > Hi, > > we're using eprime 2.0.  We have our program set up so that it will > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > scanner sends out every 3 seconds.  We want to also be able to log our > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > keys), it will advance the slide. > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > blank slide.  Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > for a specific key instead of any key?  (We tried going to the > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > did not work.  Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > Thanks! > Mary --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From pquain at une.edu.au Tue Feb 24 22:26:34 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 09:26:34 +1100 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <75868a42-f867-41e9-ab28-a2a93ec6ed9d@f33g2000vbf.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: maybe buy a button box, use that for subject response. Or get the pulse (?) from the scanner through a port ... is this what you have plugged into (one of your?) keyboard input(s)? ... and use this to progress the slide. At 09:13 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: >By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an >input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other >keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) >and not logging the subject's response. How do we only log the "non- >action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > >On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > > Hi, > > > > we're using eprime 2.0. We have our program set up so that it will > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds. We want to also be able to log our > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > blank slide. Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > for a specific key instead of any key? (We tried going to the > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > did not work. Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > > Thanks! > > Mary >> > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:25:10 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:25:10 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <75868a42-f867-41e9-ab28-a2a93ec6ed9d@f33g2000vbf.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: ha! ok thanks for your help. On Feb 24, 5:13 pm, msmith wrote: > By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an > input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other > keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) > and not logging the subject's response.  How do we only log the "non- > action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > > On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > > > Hi, > > > we're using eprime 2.0.  We have our program set up so that it will > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds.  We want to also be able to log our > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > blank slide.  Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > for a specific key instead of any key?  (We tried going to the > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > did not work.  Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > Thanks! > > Mary --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:36:27 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:36:27 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <20090224222638.TZIK5528.nskntotgx03p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis.une.edu.au> Message-ID: Yes, we do use a button box for subject input (although it still gives character responses r, g, b, or y so using a keyboard is the same as long as you press those buttons). I will look into using a "port" for the scanner but as far as I know it magically sends a "t", I think, through the button box. On Feb 24, 5:26 pm, Peter Quain wrote: > maybe buy a button box, use that for subject response. > Or get the pulse (?) from the scanner through a port ... is this what > you have plugged into (one of your?) keyboard input(s)? ... and use > this to progress the slide. > > At 09:13 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: > > > > >By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an > >input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other > >keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) > >and not logging the subject's response.  How do we only log the "non- > >action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > > >On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > we're using eprime 2.0.  We have our program set up so that it will > > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds.  We want to also be able to log our > > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > > blank slide.  Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > > for a specific key instead of any key?  (We tried going to the > > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > > did not work.  Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > > Thanks! > > > Mary > > >-- > >No virus found in this incoming message. > >Checked by AVG. > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > >-- > >No virus found in this incoming message. > >Checked by AVG. > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:45:40 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:45:40 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This seems to solve the problem: http://e-prime.googlegroups.com/web/MultipleResponseCollection.es?gda=xGpkx08AAABX7qKQ4-iIf6hgMt1hLSvBZzqSgoxrYBkRljkWhaiQ5Mm-Kz7jI7xuJi9cntUnGSKLthDhGK8sJIhZxVRc98mRnHMhSp_qzSgvndaTPyHVdA&gsc=ks4VPwsAAACnj8K_dqhBwyQfyaQoH72F On Feb 24, 5:36 pm, msmith wrote: > Yes, we do use a button box for subject input (although it still gives > character responses r, g, b, or y so using a keyboard is the same as > long as you press those buttons).  I will look into using a "port" for > the scanner but as far as I know it magically sends a "t", I think, > through the button box. > > On Feb 24, 5:26 pm, Peter Quain wrote: > > > maybe buy a button box, use that for subject response. > > Or get the pulse (?) from the scanner through a port ... is this what > > you have plugged into (one of your?) keyboard input(s)? ... and use > > this to progress the slide. > > > At 09:13 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: > > > >By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an > > >input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other > > >keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) > > >and not logging the subject's response.  How do we only log the "non- > > >action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > > > >On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > > we're using eprime 2.0.  We have our program set up so that it will > > > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds.  We want to also be able to log our > > > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > > > blank slide.  Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > > > for a specific key instead of any key?  (We tried going to the > > > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > > > did not work.  Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > > > Thanks! > > > > Mary > > > >-- > > >No virus found in this incoming message. > > >Checked by AVG. > > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > >-- > > >No virus found in this incoming message. > > >Checked by AVG. > > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > -- > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > Checked by AVG. > > Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From graftedlife at gmail.com Wed Feb 25 02:59:03 2009 From: graftedlife at gmail.com (Paul) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:59:03 -0800 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag In-Reply-To: <49a45cd8.25bd720a.41ed.0335SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Dear David, Yes, thanks a lot for your reply. >OK, but how many KB are the sound files? How many channels (mono or >stereo?), how many samples/sec, and how many bits/sample? The sounds are usually very short, with a size of about 25 KB to 55 KB. They are recorded in only one channel; the sampling frequency is 22050Hz, 16bits per sample. >Also, how many KB is your fixation .jpg file? What is its resolution >(pixels width and height), its color bit depth, and its compression ratio? >And why use a .jpg for the fixation instead of just a text "+"? The size of the jpg file is less than 1 KB. Its resolution is 44 by 44 pixiels (72dpi); the color bit depth is 24. (I'm sorry for now I don't know how to check out the compression ratio on my computer, but when I made it I guess I set it to the highest quality.) But in the slide object I used the strech function to make it fill up the whole screen. Still, I tried not to use a fixation jpg but simply a text "+", but the slide still lags. Yes, I used EP2 on my vista before, and I did not know why I frequently got timeout errors until I checked the discussions here. Thank you for your help! Paul --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Wed Feb 25 22:17:35 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 17:17:35 -0500 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Paul, OK then, your stimulus files certainly are miniscule, so much for that :). And now I'm pretty much out of ideas. If it were me, next I would set aside the actual experiment program and make a small demo program that does nothing but display my slide with my image and sound. And if I had problems there, I would next copy everything to another machine and try it all again. IOW, the old divide-and-conquer strategy. As far as I can tell your program does nothing extraordinary, so it certainly should work. Good luck. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > Dear David, > > Yes, thanks a lot for your reply. > >> OK, but how many KB are the sound files? How many channels (mono or >> stereo?), how many samples/sec, and how many bits/sample? > > The sounds are usually very short, with a size of about 25 KB to 55 > KB. They are recorded in only one channel; the sampling frequency is > 22050Hz, 16bits per sample. > >> Also, how many KB is your fixation .jpg file? What is its resolution >> (pixels width and height), its color bit depth, and its compression ratio? >> And why use a .jpg for the fixation instead of just a text "+"? > > The size of the jpg file is less than 1 KB. Its resolution is 44 by 44 > pixiels (72dpi); the color bit depth is 24. (I'm sorry for now I don't > know how to check out the compression ratio on my computer, but when I > made it I guess I set it to the highest quality.) But in the slide > object I used the strech function to make it fill up the whole screen. > > Still, I tried not to use a fixation jpg but simply a text "+", but > the slide still lags. > > Yes, I used EP2 on my vista before, and I did not know why I > frequently got timeout errors until I checked the discussions here. > > Thank you for your help! > Paul --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Wed Feb 25 22:48:26 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 17:48:26 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <20090224220832.EHUV807.nschwotgx01p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis.une.edu.au> Message-ID: Peter, > i thought that the key selling point of specialised stimulus > presentation software is low level routines - probably written in C > or C++ (?) - that optimise interaction with the OS (and thus its > devices) to provide millisecond precision timing accuracy for the > higher level routines that organise the stimulus properties and > collect responses. A programmatic interface to these higher level > routines makes their manipulation easy and powerful (if you can work > out where to put dots, and the like :), but it doesn't touch the OS interface. Well put, thank you! I agree with much of your sentiment throughout, but allow me to attempt some counterpoint nonetheless. > I'm wondering whether you could be confident that standalone > applications built in C etc could provide that sort of accuracy > without a hell of a lot of testing and modification of the OS > interface routines, and then tuning them on individual machines. Indeed, nor would I take for granted that PST or any other company has done that job for us. As I recall, long ago PST itself marketed a product called MEL ("Micro Experimental Laboratory") that was then found to have a subtle timing error that affected some experimental results. And even now PST does not seem competent to make sound and video work properly under Vista, how confident can we be that their product does not have other problems lurking in its critical timing? As for the necessity of tuning individual machines, even PST advises that we tune each machine individually for critical timing with E-Prime, so they have not even relieved us of that burden. To its credit PST provides a tool for that, their RefreshClockTest. But even then I would not take for granted that their program works as advertised. Indeed, I tore into the guts of their program myself, and was heartened to find that the few lines of code that did the critical work in that vast program implemented one of the three algorithms that I would use myself. Only then would I consider using their test program (and even then I rewrote three streamlined alternatives to suit my own tastes). As I keep telling all my researchers and everyone online, *if* they care about critical timing (not everyone has such a need) then someone in their lab *must* thoroughly read and understand chapter 3 of the User's Guide that comes with E-Prime. Sadly, I don't know that anyone follows through on that. No, buying a commercial product does not relieve any of us in any way of the duty of understanding the underlying principles of our tools and doing our own extensive testing of their shortcomings. The surety of science comes not from taking the work of others for granted, but in the growing network of continued and redundant fact-checking. Sadly, I find that fact-checking attitude far too lacking among the research labs of my acquaintance, and relying on a product like E-Prime helps them to continue in their lax practices. As I keep telling my researchers, they should never trust anyone's software, not even mine. Yes I apply a lot of expertise and care to guarantee the critical performance of my programs (to the dismay of my researchers, who would generally rather that I just quickly dash off some barely working slop), but in the end each researcher has the responsibility to fully verify for themself the suitability of the tools they use. (E.g., I know a student who lost 2-1/2 years of dissertation research with paid clinical subjects because they blindly trusted an E-Prime program from another world-renowned researcher.) Now you do have a point that making this all work in C or the like would still require that someone have deep understanding of the OS in order to work around its vagaries. I keep forgetting that I did all that C programming back in the days of DOS, before preemptive multitasking, so my programs more or less took complete control of the processor with no special effort. That was great. But those days are long gone. And the systems we used back then did not have the graphics or multimedia capabilities that we have today (though for simple text and low-resolution graphics, for all their power I doubt that the task presentation systems of today can perform any better than an Apple II or a Commodore 64). So I do have PST to thank for a product that put all the added power of Windows machines to work for presenting behavioral tasks. And indeed, it was I who encouraged our researchers to standardize on E-Prime, because it really did leap-frog beyond what I could do at the time in C and DOS. And on the whole, I continue to endorse E-Prime until I chance upon a better product (which would please me much, I detest PST's business practices). But in principle, a suitable subroutine or object library in C or C++ or C# or MatLab or whatever could provide as much facility for critical timing as E-Prime. In fact, when you think of it, that is all that E-Prime does anyway. Under the covers (and as anyone can see if they peruse the online E-Basic Help as I have) E-Prime is just a dialect of Microsoft Visual Basic with a specialized object library, and E-Studio is just a pretty graphical "skin" or front-end over that. Moreover, if you study the reviews as I have, you will find that E-Prime accomplishes its timing feats only by relying on Microsoft's DirectX technology, nothing proprietary or peculiar to E-Prime. Indeed, other products such as DirectRT, Inquisit, and Paradigm accomplish the same feats using the same underlying technology. Anybody practiced in DirectX could do it. So it would not be that much of a stretch to provide a similar library for skilled programmers to use in a language of their choosing. And if someone wanted to add a graphical front-end for the sake of dedicated non-programmers (who by their own inclination and admission are ill suited to programming intricate behavioral tasks no matter how you dumb down the programming platform, and therefore ought really to leave this task to so many others better inclined and practiced anyway), so be it (think Linux with user-choosable desktop environments and shells). Even better if this were open source. Now in practice I do not know that any such thing is available. But heck, if enough of us were just motivated enough, we could form a consortium and make it ourselves. And with C++ or the like we would have a much more serviceable and well-ordered platform for building precision tools. Heck, in C we could even use inline assembly code for critical points (as I did for some projects in those bygone days). And we would have a much more extensible platform -- I cannot easily extend E-Prime with my own custom libraries as I could with C, E-Prime's PackageCall notwithstanding (I have yet to find a non-commercial E-Prime developer who builds on that feature). > Same basic question with LabView (i thought it was a data > acquisition, processing tool, with a GUI and a maths language), and > MatLab (data manipulation tool, full script interface). Can you build > stimulus presentation paradigms in these applications ..track > blanking signals properly for example? I too thought MatLab was just an analysis tool, so I was surprised when I learned some of our researchers used it for presenting tasks, even for fMRI. So I took a look and was amazed. Seems that a variety of specialized Matlab modules or libraries are available for task presentation and all sorts of other things. And it can do things that put E-Prime to shame. Just for instance, people have asked here how to mirror-reverse text on-the-fly in E-Prime. E-Prime has no hope of doing any such thing. But MatLab can not only do the text mirror-reversal on the fly, I have seen it animate the the text and make it rotate and distort and fly across the screen, all on-the-fly, and all with just a few function calls. That is precisely why one of our fMRI researchers uses MatLab from their own laptop (a MacBook, if you must know) instead of using the E-Prime system that we have set up for everyone else. I have not looked into MatLab's timing accuracy, but ... > Could you check easily their performance on different machines? Yes -- the principles of a time checking program are pretty straightforward and constant (as illustrated in PST's own RefreshClockTest), and I have built such tools with every programming platform I use. No problem. I would hope that everyone else does the same .... > We've identified some substantial timing errors in a couple of paradigms written in C++. ... just as you. Clearly you too know how simple it is to build time checking tools for a given platform. No big deal, it just has to be done. > On the other hand, our e-prime data from visual paradigms shows that on an > appropriate machine e-prime can perform as pst state. My preliminary tests show pretty much the same, as long as we are clear on what "PST states" -- as carefully discussed in great detail in chapter 3 of the E-Prime User's Guide, more or less millisecond accuracy, with occasional and unavoidable (though minimizable) lapses due to the vagaries inherent in any modern preemptive multitasking system. I am confident that skilled programmers could do the same with with many other programming platforms, especially using DirectX. So having considered all this further, yes, if I could program only for myself, and given a suitable function or object library, then I would still rather do everything in straight C or the like. But I do not program for myself, and therein lies the rub. The behavioral researchers I work with would hardly stand for the sort of text-based and fully regular development platform that suits me; and admittedly I find the E-Prime GUI helpful in working with these researchers. (To be sure, as far as mating underlying text-based source with a GUI front-end, I find that the initial designers of E-Prime (Brandon C, I suppose this includes you) have done a masterful job, largely through the provision of Inline objects.) And yet, it repeatedly confounds me how researchers keep overlooking the terrific programming capacity so masterfully given to them in the E-Studio GUI objects and instead gravitate directly to E-Basic script. Go figure. Peter, you sound like one of the few who actually bothers to test their systems, and knows how to do it. Sadly, I find your attitude and competence rare. But I would very much like to have my misgivings proven wrong. There, I got that off my chest. And for anybody who did not simply throw this straight into the trash (as I might well have done myself), my apologies for cluttering your inbox with this long rant. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Thu Feb 26 01:33:04 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:33:04 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide Message-ID: Hi guys, I have a simple sounding question here and I am sure I am having a problem here simply due to a lack of experience with e-prime. I have a slide that I am looping through (time out at 100ms). Each time I change one of the values on the slide (random number). The subject is supposed to press a key to stop it and then I do some calculations with what ever the random number was at the time. I would like the subject to do this with the space bar. When I set the allowable response to {SPACE} and my inline do a check: If Slide1.RESP = " " and I have also tries If Slide1.RESP = chr(32), it does not work. If I set the allowable response to 1 and do the check If Slide1.RESP = "1", It works perfectly. I would think that I need something in my if statement other than " " or chr(32). Anyone have any ideas? Thanks. Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Thu Feb 26 01:54:42 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 12:54:42 +1100 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: if there is only the single response to Slide1, using SPACE (and that response terminates the Object) maybe log Slide1.RT, then something like: If Slide1.RT <> 0 Then ... whatever End If At 12:33 PM 26/02/2009, you wrote: >Hi guys, > >I have a simple sounding question here and I am sure I am having a >problem here simply due to a lack of experience with e-prime. > >I have a slide that I am looping through (time out at 100ms). Each >time I change one of the values on the slide (random number). The >subject is supposed to press a key to stop it and then I do some >calculations with what ever the random number was at the time. I >would like the subject to do this with the space bar. When I set >the allowable response to {SPACE} and my inline do a check: If >Slide1.RESP = " " and I have also tries If Slide1.RESP = chr(32), it >does not work. If I set the allowable response to 1 and do the >check If Slide1.RESP = "1", It works perfectly. I would think that >I need something in my if statement other than " " or chr(32). > >Anyone have any ideas? Thanks. > >Greg > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1971 - Release Date: >25/02/2009 6:40 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1971 - Release Date: 25/02/2009 6:40 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de Thu Feb 26 07:07:39 2009 From: janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de (janpsy) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:07:39 -0800 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Greg, Slide1.RESP="{SPACE}" should work. You find the whole key nomenclature in the E-Basic Help. Janina --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 13:48:29 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 08:48:29 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: <8b4996e8-21a8-4158-b207-79ae13537a89@h20g2000yqn.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: Just to summarize, in the case where you have only one allowable response (e.g., 'SPACE') and you want to test for the occurrence of only that response, then the following should work: If Slide1.RESP = "{SPACE}" ' using the {key} nomenclature from online E-Basic Help If Slide1.RESP <> "" If Slide1.RT > 0 ' or "<>" if you prefer If Slide1.RT ' you don't even need the explicit test in this case If Slide1.RTTime > 0 ' etc. as in .RT test If you had also set the Correct response to {SPACE}, then you could also use If Slide1.ACC = 1 If Slide1.ACC <> 0 If Slice1.ACC ' once again, do not need explicit test in this case Also note that E-Basic/Visual Basic itself is case insensitive, so you may use whatever case you like, except that you must observe case for the E-Basic {key} nomenclature. I leave it as an exercise to the reader to figure out the corresponding tests for the case of more than one allowable response, or how to test for the occurrence of a non-response (or non-occurrence of a response?). You may post your solutions here for extra credit. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder and Insufferable Pedant --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 14:12:18 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 09:12:18 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, > I have a slide that I am looping through (time out at 100ms). Each time > I change one of the values on the slide (random number). The subject is > supposed to press a key to stop it and then I do some calculations with > what ever the random number was at the time. I would like the subject > to do this with the space bar. When I set the allowable response to > {SPACE} and my inline do a check: If Slide1.RESP = " " and I have also > tries If Slide1.RESP = chr(32), it does not work. If I set the > allowable response to 1 and do the check If Slide1.RESP = "1", It works > perfectly. I would think that I need something in my if statement other > than " " or chr(32). > > Anyone have any ideas? Thanks. BTW, if I were looping through a slide and just wanted to stop when the subject responds to any presentation, I might try another EP trick. Instead of even getting a response to each slide presentation, I might put a Wait object (let's call it ResponseWait) before my slide loop. I would make its Duration 0, set it collect my desired response, and (here's the key) set Time Limit to "(infinite)" or the max duration of my slide loop. The PST User's Guide calls this Extended Input, see the much overlooked Appendix C. I would probably also set its End Action to Terminate so that it will terminate the current slide when the subject responds, unless I wanted to allow the final slide to time-out on its own. Anyway, then in my script or whatever I would just test for a response to ResponseWait instead of my slides. I really don't know if this makes things any better in your case, but I had an experiment where this technique solved a lot of problems. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 14:29:18 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 09:29:18 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: <49A6A342.2030100@msu.edu> Message-ID: I wrote, > I had an experiment where this technique solved a lot of problems. Sorry to keep posting in piece-meal fashion, but just to explain a bit... We had a task where we rapidly looped through a set of slides (i.e., new slide on each screen refresh) and wanted to stop when the subject responded. I first did it as you described, testing for a response to the slides themselves. But much of time the program would not detect the subject response. When I thought it through and looked at the timing, I realized that in this case the program spent a good proportion of its time between each slide, whereas it could collect responses only during each slide's run; e.g., if a slide appeared every 17 ms, with 7 ms for in-between-slide setup and 10 ms of actual slide running (even though it does remain on the screen for the full 17 ms), my program got responses only during the 10 ms interval so 7/17 = 40% of the time my program could not get a response! I solved the problem using one pre-loop object with extended input as described in my previous post, and I have described this just in case it can ever do anyone else any good. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Thu Feb 26 21:21:48 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:21:48 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: <49A6A73E.7020503@msu.edu> Message-ID: David. I just now am reading through this email chain and what you described in this last one is exactly what I am attempting to do and that is exactly one of problems I am seeing. I only had the few minutes to get it set up so have not had any time to try another method yet. They requested they have it look through faster than what I had it set at, but could not run it any faster without having to kit the stop key several times to get it to stop :) Thank you for the suggestion, I'll try it out this evening and let you know how it goes. Greg (ps. Thanks for all the very detailed help you give on this list!!) On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 9:29 AM, David McFarlane wrote: > > I wrote, > > > I had an experiment where this technique solved a lot of problems. > > Sorry to keep posting in piece-meal fashion, but just to explain a bit... > > We had a task where we rapidly looped through a set of slides (i.e., new > slide on each screen refresh) and wanted to stop when the subject > responded. I first did it as you described, testing for a response to > the slides themselves. But much of time the program would not detect > the subject response. When I thought it through and looked at the > timing, I realized that in this case the program spent a good proportion > of its time between each slide, whereas it could collect responses only > during each slide's run; e.g., if a slide appeared every 17 ms, with 7 > ms for in-between-slide setup and 10 ms of actual slide running (even > though it does remain on the screen for the full 17 ms), my program got > responses only during the 10 ms interval so 7/17 = 40% of the time my > program could not get a response! > > I solved the problem using one pre-loop object with extended input as > described in my previous post, and I have described this just in case it > can ever do anyone else any good. > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 22:16:28 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 17:16:28 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide Message-ID: Greg, >I only had the few minutes to get it set up That illustrates the bigger problem here. Behavioral research labs today seem to think that they can do research in a rush, and so do not allow time to do things properly. Back in my graduate training in the early 1980s, my advisor at the University of Chicago actually reminded me that science is a deliberative process, and I needed to slow down and take more time to ponder things. Seems our culture has abandoned those values, taking an abundance of whiz-bang technology as a substitute for timely deliberation. As for me, I do not find that an improvement. But then I am a cranky old geezer. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Fri Feb 27 02:07:28 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:07:28 -0500 Subject: Off Topic: Programming woes. Was: Response to a slide Message-ID: Warning: Continued rant Agreed. A lot of the problem that I have noticed in my career, (not referring specifically to this project, my current position is as a consultant for industrial data acquisition and testing software and hardware), is that non-programmers simply do not understand what is involved in creating a good piece of software. A lot of people look at computers and see how they make everything easy and fast for them and assume that the programming part must be easy and fast as well. (Would you like your project quickly, cheap, or done well? Pick two :) ) People see the front end on a piece of software which is abstracted out to the point of it having a very simple look and feel and is easy to use and figure that what is going on in the background is the same, fairly simple. However, as you probably know, the simpler you make a program to run and use, the more complex it is. Attacking something like a complex piece of software without first building up a plan, assembling detailed documentation, and clearly defining the specifications is a recipie for a disasterious project. The kind of projects I typically work on are on the order of a few hundered hours of work and billed at $120-$135 an hour, so having a plan is very important. It also means that I need to sell my customers on the fact that I can give them something that is done right, the first time, that is modular and expandable and works with very few bugs (nothing is ever 100% bug frre except for "hello world" programs). If someone is going to pay tens of thousands of dollars for a bit of custom software, you deffinatly do not want to give them something you banged out in a weekend. If you are not able to do it right, a lot of times it's not worth the headache of doing it at all. There is nothing worse than agreeing to do a project on an accelerated time table and cutting corners and them coming back to you latter and saying "there are bugs, we need you to fix them and we do not think we should have to pay for it because you supplied us with buggy software" when it is buggy in the first place because of how they emanded that it be done up front. On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 5:16 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > Greg, > > >I only had the few minutes to get it set up > > > That illustrates the bigger problem here. Behavioral research labs > today seem to think that they can do research in a rush, and so do > not allow time to do things properly. Back in my graduate training > in the early 1980s, my advisor at the University of Chicago actually > reminded me that science is a deliberative process, and I needed to > slow down and take more time to ponder things. Seems our culture has > abandoned those values, taking an abundance of whiz-bang technology > as a substitute for timely deliberation. As for me, I do not find > that an improvement. But then I am a cranky old geezer. > > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Fri Feb 27 15:10:59 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:10:59 -0500 Subject: Off Topic: Programming woes. Was: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, Amen!! At 2/26/2009 09:07 PM Thursday, you wrote: >Warning: Continued rant > >Agreed. A lot of the problem that I have noticed in my career, (not >referring specifically to this project, my current position is as a >consultant for industrial data acquisition and testing software and >hardware), is that non-programmers simply do not understand what is >involved in creating a good piece of software. A lot of people look >at computers and see how they make everything easy and fast for them >and assume that the programming part must be easy and fast as >well. (Would you like your project quickly, cheap, or done >well? Pick two :) ) People see the front end on a piece of >software which is abstracted out to the point of it having a very >simple look and feel and is easy to use and figure that what is >going on in the background is the same, fairly simple. However, as >you probably know, the simpler you make a program to run and use, >the more complex it is. Attacking something like a complex piece of >software without first building up a plan, assembling detailed >documentation, and clearly defining the specifications is a recipie >for a disasterious project. The kind of projects I typically work >on are on the order of a few hundered hours of work and billed at >$120-$135 an hour, so having a plan is very important. It also >means that I need to sell my customers on the fact that I can give >them something that is done right, the first time, that is modular >and expandable and works with very few bugs (nothing is ever 100% >bug frre except for "hello world" programs). If someone is going to >pay tens of thousands of dollars for a bit of custom software, you >deffinatly do not want to give them something you banged out in a >weekend. If you are not able to do it right, a lot of times it's >not worth the headache of doing it at all. There is nothing worse >than agreeing to do a project on an accelerated time table and >cutting corners and them coming back to you latter and saying "there >are bugs, we need you to fix them and we do not think we should have >to pay for it because you supplied us with buggy software" when it >is buggy in the first place because of how they emanded that it be >done up front. > >On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 5:16 PM, David McFarlane ><mcfarla9 at msu.edu> wrote: > >Greg, > > >I only had the few minutes to get it set up > > >That illustrates the bigger problem here. Behavioral research labs >today seem to think that they can do research in a rush, and so do >not allow time to do things properly. Back in my graduate training >in the early 1980s, my advisor at the University of Chicago actually >reminded me that science is a deliberative process, and I needed to >slow down and take more time to ponder things. Seems our culture has >abandoned those values, taking an abundance of whiz-bang technology >as a substitute for timely deliberation. As for me, I do not find >that an improvement. But then I am a cranky old geezer. > > >-- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From anderson.catherine at gmail.com Fri Feb 27 19:58:43 2009 From: anderson.catherine at gmail.com (Catherine Anderson) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:58:43 -0800 Subject: Requesting help converting from EP1 to EP2 Message-ID: Hello all, I have a run-time license for EP2 (a.k.a. E-Run 2), and I have a set of scripts that a colleague has created in EP1, which have the .es file extension. E-Run2 is not recognizing these scripts. Is there anyone who is willing to open my .es scripts in EP2, save them as .ebs2 files, and send them back to me? I'm told this is a fairly simple conversion. I would be much obliged to you. Many thanks, - Catherine Anderson. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From MSpape at FSW.leidenuniv.nl Mon Feb 2 15:07:30 2009 From: MSpape at FSW.leidenuniv.nl (Spape, Michiel) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 16:07:30 +0100 Subject: Multiple Responses In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Kari, The problem would appear to be that the E-Prime data is collected and ordered by its list- (thus, presentation) order. Although I'm sure it is possible, one way or another, to force the data of a later task to be in the first task (ex1), I don't see a simple solution. However, if you fiddle around with E-DataAid, you can easily get the result for each picture, for example, by doing Analyze --> choosing the picture-name in the Row, and conditions etc from the two tasks in the Column. But if you prefer the difficult route, you could store data from the first task in a couple of arrays or a matrix. For example, if you have 2 pictures with RTs, you could make an array: 'put this in user script (alt+5) dim RTs() as long And, let's say you have an attribute like PictureNum which gives each picture a unique number. Then, a script in task A would put the relevant data in the array, like: RTs(c.GetAttrib("PictureNum")) = TextDisplay1.RT 'that is, if this textdisplay1 is the one that collects rt data. And a script in task B would store that, if the picturenum is used there as well: c.SetAttrib "RTOfPictureInPreviousTask", RTs(c.GetAttrib("PictureNum")) I'm not sure what your task looks like exactly, so I'm sorry if the above is not as relevant as I hope it is, but I hope it at least illustrates the underlying logic. Hope this helps any. Best, Michiel M. Spap? Cognitive Psychology Unit Leiden University Institute for Psychology Research & Leiden Institute for Brain and Cognition Netherlands http://www.cognitology.eu -----Original Message----- From: e-prime at googlegroups.com [mailto:e-prime at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Kari Sent: 19 January 2009 18:28 To: E-Prime Subject: Multiple Responses Hi-- I am currently writing an experiment in 2 parts. the first part is a priming task, so i have 2 pictures, each with a set of attributes, randomly selected as primes and targets and i'm recording RT. In the second part, I have participants go through each picture individually and rate them on a few scales. The problem I am having is that I can't seem to match up the ratings for the second task with the RT and other parameters from the first task. Is there a way to force the ratings into the same e-data spreadsheet that is generated for the priming task? Any help would be appreciated, thank you so much, Kari ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. ********************************************************************** --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From bachman at psych.ucla.edu Wed Feb 4 17:32:04 2009 From: bachman at psych.ucla.edu (Bachman, Peter) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 09:32:04 -0800 Subject: E-Prime 2 conversion of .es files Message-ID: Hi, everyone, I have a question regarding an error with E-Prime 2. I tried to convert an .es file created in E-Prime 1 into an E-Prime 2 compatible format. It seemed to work - the process created an .es2 file that opened in E-Studio - but the script would not compile. I received the following error ... Encountered: constant Expecting: identifier Associated with setting "color as string" I'm wondering if this is an error that comes up with E-Prime 2 sometimes, and is perhaps not specific to my script. And also, if anyone has successfully fixed the problem in their scripts. Thanks! --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 5 21:17:37 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 16:17:37 -0500 Subject: E-Prime 2 conversion of .es files In-Reply-To: <65489019-9151-4348-9c68-45ae2841a792@r10g2000prf.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: At 2/4/2009 12:32 PM Wednesday, Peter Bachman wrote: >I have a question regarding an error with E-Prime 2. I tried to >convert an .es file created in E-Prime 1 into an E-Prime 2 compatible >format. It seemed to work - the process created an .es2 file that >opened in E-Studio - but the script would not compile. I received the >following error ... > >Encountered: constant >Expecting: identifier > >Associated with setting "color as string" > >I'm wondering if this is an error that comes up with E-Prime 2 >sometimes, and is perhaps not specific to my script. And also, if >anyone has successfully fixed the problem in their scripts. > >Thanks! I had to try this out myself, and indeed, this works with EP1 but not with EP2. Clearly, although not yet documented (the EP2 documentation lags behind the product), in EP2 "color" is now a restricted keyword. If you want to test this further yourself, just put any other known keyword (e.g., "string") in place of "color", and you will get practically the same error. The solution is simply to change the name of your variable from "color". --David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From jotapan at hotmail.com Fri Feb 6 12:55:47 2009 From: jotapan at hotmail.com (jotapan) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 04:55:47 -0800 Subject: response on the screen Message-ID: Hello, I am trying to use something like "radio buttons" presented on the screen so that the participant can give his answer directly with the mouse just by clicking on a box. I have looked for this information in the forum and came across a similar question... I have followed Matt's suggestion on using an image display procedure to do this. I'm actually using the script from his LoadImageUponMouseClick.zip (from the files section) in my program. However, as he mentions, this allows the participant to select more than one box at a time. Ideally, when a participant selects another response option during the period of time available for response, the previously selected box should become unselected and the new one become selected (this is what happens when we use radio buttons in a visual basic program). I assume this is possible to be done using some script... but I must confess I'm still very naive with respect to scrip writing; is there anyone who could help me on this? Thanks jotapan --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From coolpsychology at gmail.com Sat Feb 7 23:14:50 2009 From: coolpsychology at gmail.com (Rivermaker) Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 15:14:50 -0800 Subject: Is an If...then... by cycle possible? Message-ID: Hi! I don' t have much programming experience, so forgive me if this is really easy to do (I have spent a great deal of time looking first), and thank you for your time. Basically, I want to show the participant text that informs them to which set of stim presentations they're about to be exposed. I was thinking that there must be a way to build an InLine script that attached the current cycle count from a particular list object to text string. For example, following each set of stim presentations, I could imagine something like : If (on cycle 1) then text reads "Get ready for set 2!" If (on cycle 2) then text reads "Get ready for set 3!" . . . If (on cycle 10) then text reads "You're finished!" Is there a way to do this? If you can't do this with the cycle count, is there a way to set up a variable to use for this instead? Could you show me the way? Thanks very much indeed! Michael Magee --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 9 13:29:19 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 08:29:19 -0500 Subject: Is an If...then... by cycle possible? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Rivermaker (i.e., Michael), > I don' t have much programming experience, E-Prime is a great system for using existing programming skills to build programs for psychology experiments, but it is a lousy system for first learning how to program. For that I recommend taking a regular course in any established object-oriented computer language such as VisualBasic, Python, JavaScript, or C++. But enough editorial, on to your question (which was very nicely laid out)... > Basically, I want to show the participant text that informs them to > which set of stim presentations they're about to be exposed. I was > thinking that there must be a way to build an InLine script that > attached the current cycle count from a particular list object to text > string. > > For example, following each set of stim presentations, I could imagine > something like : > > If (on cycle 1) then text reads "Get ready for set 2!" > If (on cycle 2) then text reads "Get ready for set 3!" > . > . > . > If (on cycle 10) then text reads "You're finished!" > > > > Is there a way to do this? Perhaps. As you have noticed, your E-DataAid files have a column or "attribute" showing a cycle count for each List, e.g., "TrialList.Cycle". Naturally, you want to know if you can use this attribute within your program. Well, like most any E-Prime attribute, the list cycle count is available through the GetAttrib method of the Context object (see the online E-Basic Help for details), e.g., If c.GetAttrib("TrialList.Cycle") Then ... But I have not explored this very far, and the cycle attribute for your list may not be available at every phase of your program. So... > If you can't do this with the cycle count, > is there a way to set up a variable to use for this instead? Even if you can do this with the cycle count, doing it with a variable may offer some advantages. I cannot show you the entire way, but first you need to set up a global variable. To learn how to do that please work through the "Using E-Basic" chapter of the User's Guide that came with E-Prime, especially 4.3.4 ff. You should be able to take it from there. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 13:42:27 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 08:42:27 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number Message-ID: Hello, I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks! Best Regards, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From nanderson at klaru-baycrest.on.ca Mon Feb 9 14:30:57 2009 From: nanderson at klaru-baycrest.on.ca (Nicole Anderson) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:30:57 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Greg, Just dim a string variable in your user script, e.g., Dim SubNum as String And then in an InLine, type SubNum=C.GetAttrib("Subject") Cheers, Nicole Anderson Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hello, > I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific > subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time > locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that > was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? > > Thanks! > > Best Regards, > Greg > > > > > > > -- ______________________________________________________________________ Nicole D. Anderson, PhD, CPsych Associate Professor, Psychiatry and Psychology, University of Toronto Scientist, Kunin-Lunenfeld Applied Research Unit, Baycrest 3560 Bathurst Street Toronto, Ontario M6A 2E1 Phone: (416) 785-2500 x3366 Fax: (416) 785-2862 Email: nanderson at klaru-baycrest.on.ca --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From tina.paciorek at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 15:17:52 2009 From: tina.paciorek at gmail.com (Albertyna Paciorek) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 16:17:52 +0100 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Can I please be taken off the list? Thank you Albertyna On Mon, Feb 9, 2009 at 4:16 PM, Albertyna Paciorek wrote: > > Can I please be taken off the list? > > Thank you > > Albertyna > On Mon, Feb 9, 2009 at 2:42 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > >> >> Hello, >> I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific >> subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time >> locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that >> was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? >> >> Thanks! >> >> Best Regards, >> Greg >> >> >> >> > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 9 16:59:20 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 11:59:20 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: <49903E21.1020600@klaru-baycrest.on.ca> Message-ID: In fact, you can even skip the step of declaring a variable, and just use c.GetAttrib("Subject") directly wherever you need it, e.g., ListFileName = "ListFile" & c.GetAttrib("Subject") & ".txt" It all depends on what is most convenient for you, and what fits your programming style. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder Nicole Anderson wrote: > Hello Greg, > > Just dim a string variable in your user script, e.g., > Dim SubNum as String > > And then in an InLine, type > SubNum=C.GetAttrib("Subject") > > Cheers, > > Nicole Anderson > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: >> Hello, >> I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific >> subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time >> locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that >> was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? >> >> Thanks! >> >> Best Regards, >> Greg >> >> >> >> > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 17:19:55 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 12:19:55 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: <499060E8.8060008@msu.edu> Message-ID: Does c.GetAttrib("Subject") get the subject's name or the Subject Number (I am after the subject Number) If not, now that I know that it is an attribute and not an object property I just be able to find it fairly easily. Thanks for the assistance Greg On Mon, Feb 9, 2009 at 11:59 AM, David McFarlane wrote: > > In fact, you can even skip the step of declaring a variable, and just > use c.GetAttrib("Subject") directly wherever you need it, e.g., > > ListFileName = "ListFile" & c.GetAttrib("Subject") & ".txt" > > It all depends on what is most convenient for you, and what fits your > programming style. > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > Nicole Anderson wrote: >> Hello Greg, >> >> Just dim a string variable in your user script, e.g., >> Dim SubNum as String >> >> And then in an InLine, type >> SubNum=C.GetAttrib("Subject") >> >> Cheers, >> >> Nicole Anderson >> >> >> Greg Osenbach wrote: >>> Hello, >>> I would like to be able to load a particular list file for specific >>> subjects. I can load the files, however I am having a difficult time >>> locating the Object.Property for retrieving the subject number that >>> was entered. Can anyone point me in the right direction? >>> >>> Thanks! >>> >>> Best Regards, >>> Greg >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 9 18:28:27 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:28:27 -0500 Subject: Access the Subject Number In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >Does c.GetAttrib("Subject") get the subject's name or the Subject >Number (I am after the subject Number) Subject number. Matter of fact, you cannot get the subject name at all, unless you change the default behavior of E-Prime. Subject number, Session, and more get controlled via the Startup Info tab of the Experiment object properties box, and you can see how all this works by looking at the generated code for Sub Main(), in the sections following "StartupInfoPrompt" labels. Hope that helps a bit, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From coolpsychology at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 21:49:52 2009 From: coolpsychology at gmail.com (Rivermaker) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:49:52 -0800 Subject: Is an If...then... by cycle possible? In-Reply-To: <49902FAF.8040604@msu.edu> Message-ID: Thanks David! So I should learn how to set up a global variable and then I should be able to use an If...Then...else... command. Doesn't sound like it's too hard. I will follow your advice and come back here if I get stuck. Thanks for your time and assistance. Mike On Feb 9, 8:29?am, David McFarlane wrote: > Rivermaker (i.e., Michael), > > > I don' t have much programming experience, > > E-Prime is a great system for using existing programming skills to build > programs for psychology experiments, but it is a lousy system for first > learning how to program. ?For that I recommend taking a regular course > in any established object-oriented computer language such as > VisualBasic, Python, JavaScript, or C++. ?But enough editorial, on to > your question (which was very nicely laid out)... > > > > > Basically, I want to show the participant text that informs them to > > which set of stim presentations they're about to be exposed. I was > > thinking that there must be a way to build an InLine script that > > attached the current cycle count from a particular list object to text > > string. > > > For example, following each set of stim presentations, I could imagine > > something like : > > > If (on cycle 1) then text reads "Get ready for set 2!" > > If (on cycle 2) then text reads "Get ready for set 3!" > > . > > . > > . > > If (on cycle 10) then text reads "You're finished!" > > > Is there a way to do this? > > Perhaps. ?As you have noticed, your E-DataAid files have a column or > "attribute" showing a cycle count for each List, e.g., > "TrialList.Cycle". ?Naturally, you want to know if you can use this > attribute within your program. ?Well, like most any E-Prime attribute, > the list cycle count is available through the GetAttrib method of the > Context object (see the online E-Basic Help for details), e.g., > > If c.GetAttrib("TrialList.Cycle") Then ... > > But I have not explored this very far, and the cycle attribute for your > list may not be available at every phase of your program. ?So... > > > If you can't do this with the cycle count, > > is there a way to set up a variable to use for this instead? > > Even if you can do this with the cycle count, doing it with a variable > may offer some advantages. ?I cannot show you the entire way, but first > you need to set up a global variable. ?To learn how to do that please > work through the "Using E-Basic" chapter of the User's Guide that came > with E-Prime, especially 4.3.4 ff. ?You should be able to take it from > there. > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de Tue Feb 10 07:49:44 2009 From: janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de (janpsy) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 23:49:44 -0800 Subject: Dual task paradigm Message-ID: Hello, I am trying to program a dual task paradigm in which the subjects have to decide between two objects (keyboard response). Meanwhile they hear numbers and should press a key if three consecutive numbers are odd. To realize these two tasks I used a loop around slide on which the decision task is presented as well as the tons. An inline previous to the slide randomizes the numbers. My problem is, that the slide does not respond every time to the keys. Can you give me a hint how I could save the responses? Thanks for your help, Janina --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From D.Moore at bath.ac.uk Tue Feb 10 12:46:22 2009 From: D.Moore at bath.ac.uk (David Moore) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 12:46:22 +0000 Subject: sending ttl pulse Message-ID: Hi all, I've been programming in eprime for a little while now but have come across a problem with trying to get eprime (2) to communicate with an external device. The device that I'm sending the pulse to is a Pathway ATS stimulator (). The pulse in port appears to be a BCN port and I am wondering if anyone can a) recommend the cable that would be best for sending a pulse down and b) the code for sending an on/off pulse. Best Dave --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 10 17:07:21 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 12:07:21 -0500 Subject: sending ttl pulse In-Reply-To: <76C19CF927A0440E17E65159@mppc-112-res-09.campus.bath.ac.uk > Message-ID: Dave, >I've been programming in eprime for a little while now but have come across >a problem with trying to get eprime (2) to communicate with an external >device. The device that I'm sending the pulse to is a Pathway ATS >stimulator (). The pulse >in port appears to be a BCN port and I am wondering if anyone can a) >recommend the cable that would be best for sending a pulse down and b) the >code for sending an on/off pulse. Did you by any chance mean a "BNC" port? If so, the next question is whether that takes a standard TTL (0V to 5V) pulse. And if that is so I would look into sending the pulse out the parallel (lpt) port, after making a custom lpt-to-BNC cable. At the lpt end of the cable (a DB-25 female) I would use pin 18 for signal ground, and pin 2 for data. You would have to figure out the lpt port # on your computer, typically is uses &H378 for the data. In that case you might use code like ' I hate "magic" numbers, so make constants instead: Const lptDataPort as Integer = &H378 Const pulseDur as Integer = 20 ' ms WritePort lptDataPort, 1 ' turn on pulse Sleep pulseDur WritePort lptDataPort, 0 ' turn off pulse or, if you want to hedge your bets, turn on *all* the bits above with ... WritePort lptDataPort, &HFF ' turn on pulse ... And if you search around the list archives or the PST Forum you can probably find more instructions on this. Alternatively, if you have a SRBox and an expansion kit (or can make your own expansion cable), then you can send the pulses through that. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 02:13:25 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:13:25 -0500 Subject: Strings Message-ID: Hello, I am having a small problems with some strings. I have String1 and "String2 two and I would like to have "String1String2", however what I am getting is "String1 String2" (note the whitespace) I have tried both String = String1 + String 2 and String = String1 & String 2 I really do not understand why I am getting that whitespace in the first place, however, since it is there, is there a easy way to remove it from the final string? Thanks, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Wed Feb 11 02:46:08 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:46:08 +1100 Subject: Strings In-Reply-To: Message-ID: might have a space lurking at end of String1 .. or beginning of String2, perhaps At 01:13 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: >Hello, > >I am having a small problems with some strings. I have String1 and >"String2 two and I would like to have "String1String2", however what >I am getting is "String1 String2" (note the whitespace) > >I have tried both String = String1 + String 2 and String = String1 & String 2 > >I really do not understand why I am getting that whitespace in the >first place, however, since it is there, is there a easy way to >remove it from the final string? > >Thanks, >Greg > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: >10/02/2009 7:20 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: 10/02/2009 7:20 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 02:56:38 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:56:38 -0500 Subject: Strings In-Reply-To: <20090211024656.TFFF807.nschwotgx01p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis.une.edu.au> Message-ID: I did find it eventually :) This code was giving me " XX" which is my String2 ListFileNumber = str(((SubjectNumber Mod 45) + 16)) So I changed it slightly to: ListFileNumber = trim(str(((SubjectNumber Mod 45) + 16))) Thanks, Greg On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 9:46 PM, Peter Quain wrote: > > > might have a space lurking at end of String1 .. or beginning of > String2, perhaps > > At 01:13 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: > > >Hello, > > > >I am having a small problems with some strings. I have String1 and > >"String2 two and I would like to have "String1String2", however what > >I am getting is "String1 String2" (note the whitespace) > > > >I have tried both String = String1 + String 2 and String = String1 & > String 2 > > > >I really do not understand why I am getting that whitespace in the > >first place, however, since it is there, is there a easy way to > >remove it from the final string? > > > >Thanks, > >Greg > > > >> > > > > > >No virus found in this incoming message. > >Checked by AVG. > >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: > >10/02/2009 7:20 AM > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: > 10/02/2009 7:20 AM > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 04:13:12 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:13:12 -0500 Subject: Reading from a file Message-ID: Hello All, I would like to open an existing log file from and e-prime experiment in an second experiment. I see there is a the Open, and Input command to read the file into memory. I need to search the log file (which is quite large) for one of the list entries used in the previous experiment and then extract some data from those results to use in the second experiment. Does anyone have any suggestions how I can search through the log file for this information? For Example I want to find in the log BlockList: 5 and then pull the attribute LastValue for use in my new experiment. See the following log snippit as an example. Can anyone please point me in the right direction? Thanks. Greg *** LogFrame Start *** Procedure: BlockProc BlockList: 5 Value: 1 EV: 1.80000000 SD: 2.40000000 CorrectAnswer: 1 Attempts: 7 LastValue: 2.9 Type: 1.0000000o Running: BlockList BlockList.Cycle: 1 BlockList.Sample: 2 TrialCount: 13 Test.RTTime: 26215 Test.RT: 73 Test.RESP: 1 Test.CRESP: *** LogFrame End *** --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Wed Feb 11 08:53:46 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 19:53:46 +1100 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: One easy way of doing this might be: - when exp-1 finished, open the log file, find the entry you want (it will be the same in each file i presume, so easy to find quickly) - copy LastValue down In an InLine in exp-2 - set an AskBox to display immediately after startup info gathered - type in LastValue - pass the AskBox variable value to an attribute (nnnnnValue) Dim lastvalue As String lastvalue= AskBox ("LastValue:", , "Please type the final value from exp-1 here") c.SetAttrib "LastValue", lastvalue use the attribute to set the experiment running as you wish. Primitive but might get the job done without writing code to scour the log file . At 03:13 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: >Hello All, > >I would like to open an existing log file from and e-prime >experiment in an second experiment. I see there is a the Open, and >Input command to read the file into memory. > >I need to search the log file (which is quite large) for one of the >list entries used in the previous experiment and then extract some >data from those results to use in the second experiment. > >Does anyone have any suggestions how I can search through the log >file for this information? > >For Example I want to find in the log BlockList: 5 and then pull the >attribute LastValue for use in my new experiment. See the following >log snippit as an example. Can anyone please point me in the right >direction? Thanks. > >Greg > >*** LogFrame Start *** > Procedure: BlockProc > BlockList: 5 > Value: 1 > EV: 1.80000000 > SD: 2.40000000 > CorrectAnswer: 1 > Attempts: 7 > LastValue: 2.9 > Type: 1.0000000o > Running: BlockList > BlockList.Cycle: 1 > BlockList.Sample: 2 > TrialCount: 13 > Test.RTTime: 26215 > Test.RT: 73 > Test.RESP: 1 > Test.CRESP: >*** LogFrame End *** > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: >10/02/2009 7:20 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: 10/02/2009 7:20 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk Wed Feb 11 09:36:48 2009 From: d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk (David P Vinson) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:36:48 -0000 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, Greg wrote > ...I need to search the log file (which is quite large) for one of the > list entries used in the previous experiment and then extract some data > from those results to use in the second experiment. > > Does anyone have any suggestions how I can search through the log file for > this information? I had a similar situation and kept running into problems finding exactly the right thing in the log file due to multiple instances of my target text, only one of which was actually the one I was looking for. It turned out it was much easier to use inline code to create a separate text file to which only the desired information is written. This could work in your case - adding this code to your first experiment. In its simplest form the output file could contain a single LastValue, with a filename that indicates subject/session (although probably better to add a little bit more information for recordkeeping). Your second experiment could then include a little snippet of code to read in this value. This way you don't need to do some kind of more complicated search through the log file, just open the little output file from the previous experiment and read the desired value. dv --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk Wed Feb 11 09:43:33 2009 From: d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk (David P Vinson) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:43:33 -0000 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: <1534.86.155.234.79.1234345008.squirrel@www.webmail.ucl.ac.uk> Message-ID: (oops, sorry!) I missed "existing log file from previous experiment" in the previous email I sent. Of course my suggestion only works if you haven't yet run the first experiment. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Wed Feb 11 10:30:19 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 05:30:19 -0500 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: <1624.86.155.234.79.1234345413.squirrel@www.webmail.ucl.ac.uk> Message-ID: Ok, Tanks for the suggestions. So so lets say the list from my orignal experiment is 120 rows long and could be from any one of 60 different lists. I need the LastValue from two of those (at random). At the end of experiment 1 I pick at random 2 rows from the list, and write a text file containing: ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue And later on will just read this text file rather than the log file. Is see the Input commands loads the contents of the file into a string. Then what? with e-basic how do I find the two LastValues in said string? Other languages I have used have functions built in that would directly take a comma dileminated file and place it in a 2 dimensional array, where I could then just read array(0,2) and (1,2). I hae not come across anything in e-basic that might accomplish this, only the input command which looks like it just will read a cartin number of bytes into a string. Let's assume that ListFileName and BlockNumber cab be a variable length, which will change the relative positions of LastValue in the file. Thoughts? Thanks, Greg On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 4:43 AM, David P Vinson wrote: > > (oops, sorry!) > I missed "existing log file from previous experiment" in the previous > email I sent. Of course my suggestion only works if you haven't yet run > the first experiment. > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Wed Feb 11 22:15:48 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 09:15:48 +1100 Subject: Reading from a file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue are all attributes. maybe just write them to text file as seperate lines. you'll get 6 lines (strings). then just read in lines 3 and 6 when you start exp-2. Or if you want to know in exp-2 which lastvalues came from which list and which block in exp-1, read all lines into an array and set the attributes from the array. At 09:30 PM 11/02/2009, you wrote: >Ok, Tanks for the suggestions. > >So so lets say the list from my orignal experiment is 120 rows long >and could be from any one of 60 different lists. I need the >LastValue from two of those (at random). > >At the end of experiment 1 I pick at random 2 rows from the list, >and write a text file containing: > >ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue >ListFileName,BlockNumber,LastValue > >And later on will just read this text file rather than the log file. > >Is see the Input commands loads the contents of the file into a >string. Then what? with e-basic how do I find the two LastValues >in said string? Other languages I have used have functions built in >that would directly take a comma dileminated file and place it in a >2 dimensional array, where I could then just read array(0,2) and >(1,2). I hae not come across anything in e-basic that might >accomplish this, only the input command which looks like it just >will read a cartin number of bytes into a string. Let's assume that >ListFileName and BlockNumber cab be a variable length, which will >change the relative positions of LastValue in the file. > >Thoughts? > >Thanks, >Greg > >On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 4:43 AM, David P Vinson ><d.vinson at ucl.ac.uk> wrote: > >(oops, sorry!) >I missed "existing log file from previous experiment" in the previous >email I sent. Of course my suggestion only works if you haven't yet run >the first experiment. > > > > > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: >10/02/2009 7:20 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.22/1946 - Release Date: 11/02/2009 11:13 AM From mplenhart at gmail.com Tue Feb 17 15:02:34 2009 From: mplenhart at gmail.com (Matt Lenhart) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 07:02:34 -0800 Subject: E-Prime 2 conversion of .es files In-Reply-To: <498b5791.20ed720a.2b35.ffffcb3cSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hello, Yes, a Color object has been added to the E-Basic language for E-Prime 2.0. Thus, you will be unable to use "Color" for object or variable names (i.e., in the same way that you cannot use TextDisplay, Dim, etc). In future builds, Color will turn blue when it is typed into an InLine or the User script. A KB was created when the Color object was added. You can take a look at http://www.pstnet.com/e-prime/support/kb.asp?TopicID=2667 for more information on the Colors object and its syntax. - Matt http://www.pstnet.com --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu Wed Feb 18 22:48:08 2009 From: avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu (Vidrine, Amy) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 15:48:08 -0700 Subject: E-Prime conversions 1.x to 2.0 Message-ID: We're having a problem getting E-Prime 2.0 Pro to load a 1.x *.es file. We have the 2.0.8.22 version of the software, which has already caused us a headache with one other file (we had to get the original authors to load it in one that had that version instead of the 2.0.1 and then recompile and send us the file...which is just...strange to me). Now it's not converting a 1.x *.es file. I get the error message 10005 when I try to load it, with a message that states "Unable to load Date/Time property." I know that other people have been using this file and converting it into EP 2.0. What I don't know is their version number, though I have a sneaking suspicion that we will be told to "downgrade" to 2.0.1. The file is available on a website that is password protected, so they would know if others were having problems with their files (I assume that those they give the passwords to would contact them with any problems). And no one else is having these problems. Any suggestions? I have put in a support request with E-Prime, but I wondered if anyone else had any thoughts. Thank you, avidrine --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu Thu Feb 19 16:48:44 2009 From: avidrine at nursing.arizona.edu (avidrine) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 08:48:44 -0800 Subject: E-Basic problems Message-ID: We're also having problems with E-Basic. Admittedly, I am rather new to E-Prime. However, I was messing around with the InLine tool and actually COPIED and PASTED the actual text from the Help file into the InLine....and it did not work!! What is up with that? I get an error message for the Sub Main() that says Encountered: Sub Expecting: Does anyone know why E-prime's own Help scripts do not work?? Amy V. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 19 19:25:04 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 14:25:04 -0500 Subject: E-Basic problems In-Reply-To: <85059614-3cb3-47b4-b3b8-a33c054ac11d@q9g2000yqc.googlegrou ps.com> Message-ID: Amy, >We're also having problems with E-Basic. Admittedly, I am rather new >to E-Prime. However, I was messing around with the InLine tool and >actually COPIED and PASTED the actual text from the Help file into the >InLine....and it did not work!! What is up with that? I get an error >message for the Sub Main() that says Encountered: Sub Expecting: > > >Does anyone know why E-prime's own Help scripts do not work?? Ah, I am glad that you discovered the online E-Basic Help, that is the real documentation for E-Prime. But make sure you read everything around the example scripts first, often that contains instructions about what example file to start with and other details needed to make the sample script work. The sample scripts in the Help are often just fragments that need supporting code, as should be understood by anyone generally familiar with computer programming. And before you delve into the online E-Basic Help, please at least work through *all* the tutorials in the Getting Started Guide that came with E-Prime. Even better if you work through all the tutorials and sample experiments in the User's Guide. The manuals are not designed to explain the underlying principles, concepts, and technical details of E-Prime usage, but at least the tutorials really are pretty useful as far as they go. And if you are serious about inline script, please work through the Using E-Basic chapter of the User's Guide. And every lab that cares about critical timing *must* have someone in their lab read and understand chapter three of the User's Guide. Hmm, I might take this opportunity to post for the first time my notes on solving E-Prime puzzles. I might later post this separately under a proper subject heading to make it easier to find and refer to. Regards, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder ---------------------------- How to Solve E-Prime Puzzles A General Algorithm I have developed a general algorithm for solving E-Prime problems, and I am putting this in the record here in case anyone (including me) ever needs to search for this. - Read the manuals that came with E-Prime (and pay attention to the tutorials): - Getting Started Guide - User's Guide - Reference Guide - Look at the sample programs that came with E-Prime - BasicRT - PictureRT - SoundRT - SlideRT - NestingRT - NestingXRT - MovieRT (EP2 only) - MultipleDisplayRt (EP2 only) - Search and study the online E-Basic Help - From E-Studio: Help > E-Basic Help - From the Windows Start menu: Path may vary, but it will be in the same place as the shortcut to E-Studio - Read the online FAQ, whenever that gets written (I am still working on this one) - Look at sample programs available on the Web - From PST: http://www.pstnet.com/e-prime/support/samples.asp (requires registration and login) - From the E-Prime Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime/files - From the System for Teaching Experimental Psychology (STEP): http://step.psy.cmu.edu/ - From Paul Groot: http://www.psy.vu.nl/download/menu/xml/TOC.xml - Attached to various messages at the PST Forum (requires registration & login to download attachments): http://support.pstnet.com/forum/Forum3-1.aspx - Search the E-Prime Knowledge Base at http://www.pstnet.com/e-prime/support/kb.asp - Search, browse, and study the web forums - E-Prime mailing list -- two portals to the same content: - Archives of EPRIME List: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/eprime.html - E-Prime Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime/ - PST Forum: http://support.pstnet.com/forum/Forum3-1.aspx - After all the above fail, post a question at the web forums above. This may require registration. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Fri Feb 20 16:03:42 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 11:03:42 -0500 Subject: E-Basic problems In-Reply-To: <499db288.20ed720a.58d2.ffffde6dSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Following up after an off-list exchange with Amy... >I was looking at the random number generator, the Random >(function). It was getting an error at the Sub Main() Aha, that's it. Most likely you innocently pasted that entire example script into an inline script object. That will not work at all, as you cannot define a Sub in inline script (since that is already executing from withing a Sub), you must define Subs and Functions in the global User Area, as described in the Using E-Basic chapter of the User's Guide. Furthermore, that example is really meant for version 1.x. Back in version 1.x you could edit the raw source code as text directly in E-Run; version 2 took that away from us. Anyway, you would open a blank E-Run window, then copy and paste the complete Random() example into E-Run, and run that. Just to make sure, I tried this myself and... what do you know, the Random() example has an error in it! They forgot to define their variables, you need to add a "Dim x, y, message" or the like in there, then it works. Bad E-Prime example writers! They really need to proofread and test what they write before foisting it off on innocent users! I will report this error to PST in case they want to fix it in future documentation. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Fri Feb 20 16:15:57 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 11:15:57 -0500 Subject: E-Basic problems In-Reply-To: <499ed464.20ed720a.58d2.ffffcf7dSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Sorry for further belaboring this, but for the record... > >I was looking at the random number generator, the Random > >(function). It was getting an error at the Sub Main() The Random() example does work if you paste it all into an inline script object, add the line Dim x, y, message and delete the "Sub Main()" and "End Sub" lines. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Sun Feb 22 18:15:56 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 13:15:56 -0500 Subject: working with files Message-ID: Hello everyone. I am wishing to use a text file for some temporary storage of some experiment data to use in various other experiments. I see hope to open a new file and I think I have it down how to write to it. However I would like to delete the file when I am done with it. Does anyone know how I can go about doing that? Thanks, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 03:15:58 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:15:58 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list Message-ID: Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. Thanks, Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Mon Feb 23 03:29:33 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:29:33 +1100 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: looking at the text dump of your edat output, perhaps you are running List called BlocklList, and this trial is Sample: 2. A property of the List object is [ListName].Sample, and it is recorded here as an attribute. *** LogFrame Start *** Procedure: BlockProc BlockList: 5 Value: 1 EV: 1.80000000 SD: 2.40000000 CorrectAnswer: 1 Attempts: 7 LastValue: 2.9 Type: 1.0000000o Running: BlockList BlockList.Cycle: 1 BlockList.Sample: 2 TrialCount: 13 Test.RTTime: 26215 Test.RT: 73 Test.RESP: 1 Test.CRESP: *** LogFrame End *** myrow = c.GetAttrib (BlockList.Sample) At 02:15 PM 23/02/2009, you wrote: >Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > >How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is >using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If >anyone can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > >Thanks, >Greg > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: >22/02/2009 5:21 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: 22/02/2009 5:21 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From cblais at berkeley.edu Mon Feb 23 03:31:57 2009 From: cblais at berkeley.edu (Chris Blais) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 19:31:57 -0800 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order in which they appear in the list. Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > Thanks, > Greg > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 03:36:49 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:36:49 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A218AD.5060204@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: Ah Ha! It is .Sample! That's the missing method I was looking for! Thanks guys! Greg On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais wrote: > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order > in which they appear in the list. > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 03:55:29 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:55:29 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A218AD.5060204@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error "Sample is not a property of the Object" Suggestions? My line of code: Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) And: If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then Lot1CE = CEValue End If If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then Lot2CE = CEValue End If Thanks, Greg On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais wrote: > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order > in which they appear in the list. > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If anyone > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ejk4 at pitt.edu Mon Feb 23 04:01:51 2009 From: ejk4 at pitt.edu (Eliezer Kanal) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 23:01:51 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The error is in how you're calling GetAttrib. "c.GetAttrib" means "get attribute from c", or "get attribute from context". Context is sort of the base-level storage of the entire experiment. You don't want to get an attribute of the context, you want an attribute of BlockList. I think you want to try str(BlockList.GetAttrib("Sample")) I don't have eprime on this computer, though, so I can't test that. Good luck - Cheers, Eliezer Kanal PhD Candidate, Bioengineering Laboratory for Computational Neuroscience University of Pittsburgh On Feb 22, 2009, at 10:55 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > Suggestions? > > My line of code: > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > And: > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > Lot1CE = CEValue > End If > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > Lot2CE = CEValue > End If > > Thanks, > Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 04:08:19 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 23:08:19 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <4986D524-DF92-4C5B-A29B-047C3AD8A015@pitt.edu> Message-ID: Thanks for the suggestion! although that gets me an error: GetAttrib: Missing Parameter(s) Thanks, Greg On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 11:01 PM, Eliezer Kanal wrote: > > The error is in how you're calling GetAttrib. "c.GetAttrib" means "get > attribute from c", or "get attribute from context". Context is sort of > the base-level storage of the entire experiment. You don't want to get > an attribute of the context, you want an attribute of BlockList. I > think you want to try > > str(BlockList.GetAttrib("Sample")) > > I don't have eprime on this computer, though, so I can't test that. > Good luck - > > Cheers, > Eliezer Kanal > PhD Candidate, Bioengineering > Laboratory for Computational Neuroscience > University of Pittsburgh > > > > On Feb 22, 2009, at 10:55 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cblais at berkeley.edu Mon Feb 23 04:43:22 2009 From: cblais at berkeley.edu (Chris Blais) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 20:43:22 -0800 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call Target.RT)? Greg Osenbach wrote: > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > Suggestions? > > My line of code: > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > And: > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > Lot1CE = CEValue > End If > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > Lot2CE = CEValue > End If > > Thanks, > Greg > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > wrote: > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the order > in which they appear in the list. > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If > anyone > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 04:46:16 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 23:46:16 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A2296A.9030507@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: Chris, Debug.Print "Row = " + str(BlockList.Sample) just gets me an invalid property error. On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 11:43 PM, Chris Blais wrote: > > > Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried > calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call > Target.RT)? > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > > wrote: > > > > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered in the > order > > in which they appear in the list. > > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If > > anyone > > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most > appreciated. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cblais at berkeley.edu Mon Feb 23 05:05:20 2009 From: cblais at berkeley.edu (Chris Blais) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 21:05:20 -0800 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I know it's logged as BlockList.Sample in the eDat file, but yes, it doesn't exist as a method/property of the object. Given your code: If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then Lot1CE = CEValue End If If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then Lot2CE = CEValue End If Couldn't you just add another Attribute/Column to the list which serves the same purpose? For example, name a column LotValue which has "Lot1" or "Lot2" as its value and then: If (c.GetAttrib(LotValue) = "Lot1") Then Lot1CE = CEValue Elseif (c.GetAttrib(LotValue) = "Lot2") Then Lot2CE = CEValue End If Greg Osenbach wrote: > Chris, > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(BlockList.Sample) just gets me an invalid > property error. > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 11:43 PM, Chris Blais > wrote: > > > > Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried > calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call > Target.RT)? > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > > > >> wrote: > > > > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample > numbers range > > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered > in the order > > in which they appear in the list. > > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my > experiment is > > > using? I have been messing around with this one for > hours. If > > anyone > > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most > appreciated. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From pquain at une.edu.au Mon Feb 23 05:02:45 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 16:02:45 +1100 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49A2296A.9030507@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: ah ... even though [ListName].Sample is logged in the edat file (with the property syntax (.)), it isn't a property of the List Object. ----------------------------------------------- The List object derives from Factor. The List has no additional properties or methods. See the Factor object for further information. Properties ActionDelay Filename Name ResetCondition TargetOffsetTime ActionTime FinishTime OffsetTime ResetEveryRun TargetOnsetTime Deletion ID OnsetTime StartTime TerminateCondition Duration LoadMethod Order Tag Methods AddLevel GetNextAttrib PeekAttrib SetAttribLogFlag Size GetAttrib GetPrevAttrib Reset SetNested Terminate GetAttibLogFlag GetProc Run SetProc GetCurrentAttrib Load SetAttrib SetWeight -------------------------------------------------- i spose you could add an attribute to your list(s) .. say called 'lstsample' and number sequentially.. and then grab that value sss = [ListName].GetCurrentAttrib("lstsample") At 03:43 PM 23/02/2009, you wrote: >Hmm...I've never actually used the .sample method. Have you tried >calling it as BlockList.Sample (in the same way as you might call >Target.RT)? > >Greg Osenbach wrote: > > Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error > > > > "Sample is not a property of the Object" > > > > Suggestions? > > > > My line of code: > > Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) > > > > And: > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then > > Lot1CE = CEValue > > End If > > If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then > > Lot2CE = CEValue > > End If > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 10:31 PM, Chris Blais > > wrote: > > > > > > It will be found in the .edat file. Or, it you need to see it in > > real-time for debugging you can write an inLine: > > > > debug.print "ListName_Row=" & ListName.Sample > > > > where ListName is the name of the list and the .sample numbers range > > from 1 to the number of items in the list and they numbered > in the order > > in which they appear in the list. > > > > Greg Osenbach wrote: > > > Hi guys. I am struggling with this one. > > > > > > How do I determine what the current row in a list my experiment is > > > using? I have been messing around with this one for hours. If > > anyone > > > can point me int he correct direction, it would be most appreciated. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: >22/02/2009 5:21 PM > > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: >22/02/2009 5:21 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1966 - Release Date: 22/02/2009 5:21 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 23 14:16:53 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 09:16:53 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <4986D524-DF92-4C5B-A29B-047C3AD8A015@pitt.edu> Message-ID: OK, let me try to straighten this out. First, you all need to go back and look at the online E-Basic Help and look at the "Context" and "List" entries where much of this gets explained. Second, as you will note there, List.GetAttrib is different than Context.GetAttrib. List.GetAttrib requires that you supply both a level number and an attribute name, whereas Context.GetAttrib takes only an attribute name. So Eliezer's suggestion would not work because it uses the wrong syntax. It also would not work because a List object only knows its own attributes (columns) and nothing else. At least Eliezer knew to submit the attribute name as a quote-enclosed string, e.g, "Sample", which gets me to point three. As clearly explained and illustrated in the documentation, the attribute name must be a *string*, you cannot use a mere variable name or property. Thus, Greg should simply have used c.GetAttrib("BlockList.Sample") ' note the use of quotes! in the first place. Finally, in reference to some other postings on this topic, there is exactly one and only one Context object created in any E-Prime program, and it is automatically given the simple name "c". That Context object always contains *all* the attributes active at the current time in the program. You all really need to take a time out and get some basic lessons in object-oriented programming. Regards, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder Eliezer Kanal wrote: > The error is in how you're calling GetAttrib. "c.GetAttrib" means "get > attribute from c", or "get attribute from context". Context is sort of > the base-level storage of the entire experiment. You don't want to get > an attribute of the context, you want an attribute of BlockList. I > think you want to try > > str(BlockList.GetAttrib("Sample")) > > I don't have eprime on this computer, though, so I can't test that. > Good luck - > > Cheers, > Eliezer Kanal > PhD Candidate, Bioengineering > Laboratory for Computational Neuroscience > University of Pittsburgh > > > > On Feb 22, 2009, at 10:55 PM, Greg Osenbach wrote: > >> Hmm.. This just seems to give me an error >> >> "Sample is not a property of the Object" >> >> Suggestions? >> >> My line of code: >> Debug.Print "Row = " + str(c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample)) >> >> And: >> If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot1) Then >> Lot1CE = CEValue >> End If >> If (c.GetAttrib(BlockList.Sample) = Lot2) Then >> Lot2CE = CEValue >> End If >> >> Thanks, >> Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 23 19:42:00 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:42:00 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <20090223050317.TES7357.nschwotgx03p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis. une.edu.au> Message-ID: At 2/23/2009 12:02 AM Monday, Peter Quain wrote: >i spose you could add an attribute to your list(s) .. say called >'lstsample' and number sequentially.. and then grab that value >sss = [ListName].GetCurrentAttrib("lstsample") Yes, even I shot my mouth off a little too soon (I was at home over breakfast, now I made it to my work site). Peter actually has the most serviceable answer here, although there is a slightly slicker approach that may work. And the previous answers using ".Sample" are not strictly correct, although it may by accident work in some cases. Let me explain. Suppose you have a List named List1. When you run that list, you will find three related columns in the resulting .edat file: List1, List1.Cycle, and List1.Sample. If you only run one cycle of List1, *and* run in sequential order, *then* List1.Cycle will always show 1, and List1 will always equal List1.Sample. However, if you run in random order, List1.Cycle will still always show 1 *but* List1 will only equal List1.Sample in the event that the "random" order turns out to be sequential, otherwise the values in these two attributes will differ -- List1.Sample will always show sequential values, whereas List1 will show which random row of List1 was selected for that iteration of the list. Finally, if you run for more than one cycle, then, regardless of whether you use sequential or random selection, List1.Cycle will show which cycle of the list is running, and after cycle 1 then List1 will *never* equal List1.Sample -- i.e., List1.Sample will continue to increase sequentially, while List1 again shows which row of the list was selected for that iteration of the list. Whew! So how do we summarize all that? - The attribute "List1" shows which row of the list has been selected for the current iteration of List1. - The attribute "List1.Cycle" shows which repetition of List1 in in progress. - The attribute "List1.Sample" shows how many times we have taken a sample from List1 so far. (This attribute is always strictly increasing, and in some cases could be used for a built-in trial counter, though in general you would to better using your own script variable for that.) So, after all that, Greg could use something like sss = c.GetAttrib("MyList") (There are even fancier things you can to with casting functions in case you don't know what list name will be used and want to determine that programmatically at run time. But that is far too advanced a topic.) But I really prefer Peter's answer, since it is a little clearer (insofar as it relies a little less on deep understanding of E-Prime lists and attributes) and allows for more control and flexibility. And please, as always do not take my word for any of this! I insist that you to construct your own demonstration programs and test this for yourselves. My apologies to all for not getting this right the first time, and for once again posting a lengthy explanation, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Mon Feb 23 19:57:38 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:57:38 -0500 Subject: working with files In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >I am wishing to use a text file for some temporary storage of some >experiment data to use in various other experiments. I see hope to >open a new file and I think I have it down how to write to >it. However I would like to delete the file when I am done with >it. Does anyone know how I can go about doing that? Hmm, I imagine you want to delete the file directly from your E-Prime program, rather than waiting and then just deleting it manually with Windows Explorer later. If that is that case, then you want to look at the "Kill" topic in the online E-Basic Help. BTW, that was a nice little puzzle -- I actually had to run a full search in the online E-Basic Help using the term "delete" in order to find the Kill topic, that was not the obvious answer (although in retrospect, that keyword is often enough used in systems as a command to delete files). Of course, if it really is a temporary file then you might just use the same file name each time, leave the file in place, and just overwrite it for each new session. That would spare you the extra work of deleting the file each time. Just a thought. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From rickogorman at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 21:06:06 2009 From: rickogorman at gmail.com (Rick O'Gorman) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 21:06:06 +0000 Subject: E-DataAid slow Message-ID: Hi all, Recently went from 2.0.1 to 2.0.8, and I'm finding data-aid really slow to export to any format (SPSS, Excel, other text). Don't remember it being this slow before. Any ideas? Rick -- Rick O'Gorman, PhD Psychology, Faculty of Development and Society Collegiate Crescent Campus, Sheffield Hallam University, Sheffield S10 2BP Phone: 0114 225 5788 Fax: 0114 225 2430 http://www.shu.ac.uk/psychology/staff/OGorman.html If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. --Albert Einstein --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Mon Feb 23 23:28:52 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:28:52 -0500 Subject: What is the current row in a list In-Reply-To: <49a2fc61.13bb720a.36f6.fffff770SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Thank you for explaining that so clearly David. That helps me out a lot. As it is, I am a LabVIEW programmer and I do have to admit that my text based programming is a little rusty from many years of disuse :) I will take another crack at this now and let you all know how it goes. I eventually gave up last night about midnight in frustration at nothing working how I intended it. I am sure lack of sleep may have been a factor. :) Cheers, Greg On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 2:42 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > At 2/23/2009 12:02 AM Monday, Peter Quain wrote: > >i spose you could add an attribute to your list(s) .. say called > >'lstsample' and number sequentially.. and then grab that value > >sss = [ListName].GetCurrentAttrib("lstsample") > > Yes, even I shot my mouth off a little too soon (I was at home over > breakfast, now I made it to my work site). Peter actually has the > most serviceable answer here, although there is a slightly slicker > approach that may work. And the previous answers using ".Sample" are > not strictly correct, although it may by accident work in some > cases. Let me explain. > > Suppose you have a List named List1. When you run that list, you > will find three related columns in the resulting .edat file: List1, > List1.Cycle, and List1.Sample. If you only run one cycle of List1, > *and* run in sequential order, *then* List1.Cycle will always show 1, > and List1 will always equal List1.Sample. However, if you run in > random order, List1.Cycle will still always show 1 *but* List1 will > only equal List1.Sample in the event that the "random" order turns > out to be sequential, otherwise the values in these two attributes > will differ -- List1.Sample will always show sequential values, > whereas List1 will show which random row of List1 was selected for > that iteration of the list. Finally, if you run for more than one > cycle, then, regardless of whether you use sequential or random > selection, List1.Cycle will show which cycle of the list is running, > and after cycle 1 then List1 will *never* equal List1.Sample -- i.e., > List1.Sample will continue to increase sequentially, while List1 > again shows which row of the list was selected for that iteration of the > list. > > Whew! So how do we summarize all that? > - The attribute "List1" shows which row of the list has been selected > for the current iteration of List1. > - The attribute "List1.Cycle" shows which repetition of List1 in in > progress. > - The attribute "List1.Sample" shows how many times we have taken a > sample from List1 so far. (This attribute is always strictly > increasing, and in some cases could be used for a built-in trial > counter, though in general you would to better using your own script > variable for that.) > > So, after all that, Greg could use something like > sss = c.GetAttrib("MyList") > > (There are even fancier things you can to with casting functions in > case you don't know what list name will be used and want to determine > that programmatically at run time. But that is far too advanced a topic.) > > But I really prefer Peter's answer, since it is a little clearer > (insofar as it relies a little less on deep understanding of E-Prime > lists and attributes) and allows for more control and flexibility. > > And please, as always do not take my word for any of this! I insist > that you to construct your own demonstration programs and test this > for yourselves. > > My apologies to all for not getting this right the first time, and > for once again posting a lengthy explanation, > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From graftedlife at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 04:15:30 2009 From: graftedlife at gmail.com (Paul) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 20:15:30 -0800 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag Message-ID: Hi All, I'm running a cross-modal lexical priming task on EP2, presenting firstly an auditory prime and then a visual target word at prime offset. While presenting the auditory prime, I also need to put a fixation point on the screen. The problem is, I tried to put the soundout object and a fixation jpeg file in a slide together, while the actual slide presentation duration varies often; sometimes the sound has finshed while the fixation point stays on the screen. The settings are as follows: Slide Object: Duration: infinite Device: none (therefore no time limit/end action) (Setting prerelease did not seem to help, so for now I changed it back to 0) SlideSoundOut Object: Buffer mode: Streaming (the files are quite small, usually about 1 second long, but I still used this mode, with buffer size being 9000; I tried to set buffer size at 20000 and use the buffer mode on a laptop earlier, though that did not seem to work at that time.) Loop: No Stop After: Yes End Sound Action: Terminate I tried to put a inline object in the beginning of the session procedure (as discussed in another article) to set the soundload factor as 3 ("c.SetAttrib "Sound.LoadFactor", 3), though that did not seem to help. And then I tried to see if I could pre-cache the sound and the image file in the slide object, by adding the following inline objects before the slide (though I'm not sure if they are correctly written), and the situation did not change much: 1. (Trying to preload the slidesoundout object) Dim strSlideSoundOut As SlideSoundOut Set strSlideSoundOut = CSlideSoundOut(PracPrime.States (PracPrime.ActiveState).Objects ("SoundOut1")) Dim MyBuffer As SoundBuffer Set MyBuffer = strSlideSoundOut.Buffers(1) MyBuffer.Filename = c.GetAttrib("PrimeSound") MyBuffer.Load 2. (Trying to preload the slideimage object) Dim strImageFile As SlideImage Set strImageFile = CSlideImage(PracPrime.States (PracPrime.ActiveState).Objects("Image1")) strImageFile.Filename = "Cross.jpg" strImageFile.Load I'm running the experiment under XP, and I guess the machine meets e- prime's requirement, but still I got timing problems. I would be very grateful for your help, as timing is critically important to cross- modal experiments. Sincere thanks, Paul --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From scampbell at casl.umd.edu Tue Feb 24 16:08:28 2009 From: scampbell at casl.umd.edu (Susan G. Campbell) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:08:28 -0500 Subject: E-DataAid slow Message-ID: Hi Rick (and list), If you don't need the unicode export, you might try turning it off (I believe it's a checkbox at the bottom of the export dialog, and it's on by default). I found that sped up my exports for big files quite a bit, though I think 1.2 may still have been faster; I never had 2.0.1, so I'm not sure if that's the difference you're seeing. HTH, Susan Susan Campbell, MA Graduate Research Assistant University of Maryland Center for Advanced Study of Language -----Original Message----- From: e-prime at googlegroups.com on behalf of Rick O'Gorman Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 4:06 PM To: E-Prime Subject: E-DataAid slow Hi all, Recently went from 2.0.1 to 2.0.8, and I'm finding data-aid really slow to export to any format (SPSS, Excel, other text). Don't remember it being this slow before. Any ideas? Rick -- Rick O'Gorman, PhD Psychology, Faculty of Development and Society Collegiate Crescent Campus, Sheffield Hallam University, Sheffield S10 2BP Phone: 0114 225 5788 Fax: 0114 225 2430 http://www.shu.ac.uk/psychology/staff/OGorman.html If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. --Albert Einstein --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From rickogorman at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 17:34:31 2009 From: rickogorman at gmail.com (Rick O'Gorman) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:34:31 +0000 Subject: E-DataAid slow In-Reply-To: <6E3FDD28350CF344AC283906612E40C32FC220@ex2.casl.umd.edu> Message-ID: Thanks Susan. I have to say I don't notice a difference, although I didn't do a full comparison. That also raises another issue--why is the unicode on by default for exporting SPSS text file? I couldn't figure out why SPSS was seeing a garbled file when I tried importing until I re-saved the text file as ANSI and then it read it fine! I don't know what DataAid is doing exactly, but it seems to me that it is not doing anything too complex and is clearly poorly optimised. Rick Susan G. Campbell wrote: > Hi Rick (and list), > > If you don't need the unicode export, you might try turning it off (I believe it's a checkbox at the bottom of the export dialog, and it's on by default). I found that sped up my exports for big files quite a bit, though I think 1.2 may still have been faster; I never had 2.0.1, so I'm not sure if that's the difference you're seeing. > > HTH, > Susan > > Susan Campbell, MA > Graduate Research Assistant > University of Maryland Center for Advanced Study of Language > > -----Original Message----- > From: e-prime at googlegroups.com on behalf of Rick O'Gorman > Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 4:06 PM > To: E-Prime > Subject: E-DataAid slow > > > Hi all, > > Recently went from 2.0.1 to 2.0.8, and I'm finding data-aid really slow > to export to any format (SPSS, Excel, other text). Don't remember it > being this slow before. > > Any ideas? > > Rick -- Rick O'Gorman, PhD Psychology, Faculty of Development and Society Collegiate Crescent Campus, Sheffield Hallam University, Sheffield S10 2BP Phone: 0114 225 5788 Fax: 0114 225 2430 http://www.shu.ac.uk/psychology/staff/OGorman.html If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. --Albert Einstein --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 20:07:19 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:07:19 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime (was: Re: What is the current row in a list) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 2/23/2009 06:28 PM Monday, Greg Osenbach wrote: >I am a LabVIEW programmer So I am curious, why would you switch to E-Prime from LabVIEW? Does E-Prime have some advantage over LabVIEW? Or did you just get stucke with a decree from on high? Thanks, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 20:31:41 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:31:41 -0500 Subject: E-DataAid slow In-Reply-To: <49A42FA7.9060909@gmail.com> Message-ID: >That also raises another issue--why is the >unicode on by default for exporting SPSS text file? I couldn't figure >out why SPSS was seeing a garbled file when I tried importing until I >re-saved the text file as ANSI and then it read it fine! I had a similar problem when I wanted to process some exported data with an Excel macro (for later re-importing back into E-DataAid). Excel handled the file pretty well, except it had an extra character at the beginning of "STRING" in cell A1, and that messed up the re-import into E-DataAid. When I made sure to export the data without Unicode, cell A1 came out as it should. Since Unicode was the unalterable default and I could not trust my users to manually turn off Unicode every time, I worked around the problem in Excel by just writing "STRING" back into cell A1. Sheesh. What was PST staff thinking? (Or perhaps, what were they smoking, etc., pick your own gibe.) I agree that E-DataAid 2 should export data as non-Unicode by default, or at least allow us to change the default setting. In fact, I already posted this request in December to the PST Forum at http://support.pstnet.com/forum/Topic2552-12-1.aspx . Perhaps others could add their voice to that post. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 20:47:16 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:47:16 -0500 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag In-Reply-To: <9525c27f-97aa-4793-bd66-e9bb9f85b277@k19g2000yqg.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: Paul, OK, first just checking our assumptions before we look further... >SlideSoundOut Object: >Buffer mode: Streaming (the files are quite small, usually about 1 >second long, OK, but how many KB are the sound files? How many channels (mono or stereo?), how many samples/sec, and how many bits/sample? Also, how many KB is your fixation .jpg file? What is its resolution (pixels width and height), its color bit depth, and its compression ratio? And why use a .jpg for the fixation instead of just a text "+"? Finally, you didn't say but if you are using EP2 then you do well to stick to XP, as PST does not yet have EP2 sound & video working reliably under Vista (as attested in several other list & forum messages). Usually everything still works well under XP though. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 20:53:38 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:53:38 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime (was: Re: What is the current row in a list) In-Reply-To: <49a4537a.25bd720a.41ed.ffffee60SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a project since no one in the program really knows much about programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. Greg On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 3:07 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > At 2/23/2009 06:28 PM Monday, Greg Osenbach wrote: > >I am a LabVIEW programmer > > So I am curious, why would you switch to E-Prime from LabVIEW? Does > E-Prime have some advantage over LabVIEW? Or did you just get stucke > with a decree from on high? > > Thanks, > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 21:07:48 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:07:48 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working >towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for >running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a >project since no one in the program really knows much about >programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. Ah, so you did get stuck with a decree from on high :). Same here, if I had my druthers I would still program everything in C, or perhaps graduate to C++ or MatLab. Please post a comparison review here once you get more experience, perhaps some of us would want to switch to LabVIEW if we only knew it better. Thanks, -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 21:24:28 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:24:28 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <49a461a8.20ed720a.58d2.454cSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Well, first off, LabVIEW make it very easy for people to program things badly :) I am not sure what the price points are.. A seat of LabVIEW runs from about $2,500 for the basic package. I have no idea how that compares with E-Prime. Are you familiar with LabVIEW then? Greg On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 4:07 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > Greg, > > >LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working > >towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for > >running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a > >project since no one in the program really knows much about > >programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. > > Ah, so you did get stuck with a decree from on high :). Same here, > if I had my druthers I would still program everything in C, or > perhaps graduate to C++ or MatLab. Please post a comparison review > here once you get more experience, perhaps some of us would want to > switch to LabVIEW if we only knew it better. > > Thanks, > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 21:43:51 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:43:51 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, >Well, first off, LabVIEW make it very easy for people to program >things badly :) LOL! I don't know that E-Prime does any better, but I defer to your judgment. >I am not sure what the price points are.. A seat of LabVIEW runs >from about $2,500 for the basic package. I have no idea how that >compares with E-Prime. Yikes! (Although I found a note from 2007 showing a "base price" of $1200.) By comparison, if you ask you can still get a full EP1 license for $700. As for the current EP2 product, as detailed at the PST sales site, (http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/#Pricing ) a single "Professional" license runs $1000, what I call the "base" edition runs a mere $800 for one license, and you can get a "run-time" license (no E-Studio hardware key) for $125. Network licenses and quantity discounts are also available. >Are you familiar with LabVIEW then? As it turns out, I have been told by a user in our organization that we have a site license for LabVIEW, so I could explore it for no charge! Now if only I had the time to spare... -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 21:51:07 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (mary) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:51:07 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" Message-ID: Hi, we're using eprime 2.0. We have our program set up so that it will advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI scanner sends out every 3 seconds. We want to also be able to log our subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t keys), it will advance the slide. Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra blank slide. Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide for a specific key instead of any key? (We tried going to the advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that did not work. Do we have to do an in-line or something? Thanks! Mary --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 21:53:58 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:53:58 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <49a46a1b.25bd720a.41ed.166eSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Perhaps I am mistaken about the LabVIEW base price, I may be thinking of one of the other development packages, rather than the base package. If you ever get the urge to take a look at it, I would be more than happy to answer any questions you may have :) Greg On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 4:43 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > Greg, > > >Well, first off, LabVIEW make it very easy for people to program > >things badly :) > > LOL! I don't know that E-Prime does any better, but I defer to your > judgment. > > >I am not sure what the price points are.. A seat of LabVIEW runs > >from about $2,500 for the basic package. I have no idea how that > >compares with E-Prime. > > Yikes! (Although I found a note from 2007 showing a "base price" of > $1200.) By comparison, if you ask you can still get a full EP1 > license for $700. As for the current EP2 product, as detailed at the > PST sales site, (http://www.pstnet.com/products/e-prime/#Pricing ) a > single "Professional" license runs $1000, what I call the "base" > edition runs a mere $800 for one license, and you can get a > "run-time" license (no E-Studio hardware key) for $125. Network > licenses and quantity discounts are also available. > > >Are you familiar with LabVIEW then? > > As it turns out, I have been told by a user in our organization that > we have a site license for LabVIEW, so I could explore it for no > charge! Now if only I had the time to spare... > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Tue Feb 24 22:08:27 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 09:08:27 +1100 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <49a461a8.20ed720a.58d2.454cSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: i thought that the key selling point of specialised stimulus presentation software is low level routines - probably written in C or C++ (?) - that optimise interaction with the OS (and thus its devices) to provide millisecond precision timing accuracy for the higher level routines that organise the stimulus properties and collect responses. A programmatic interface to these higher level routines makes their manipulation easy and powerful (if you can work out where to put dots, and the like :), but it doesn't touch the OS interface. I'm wondering whether you could be confident that standalone applications built in C etc could provide that sort of accuracy without a hell of a lot of testing and modification of the OS interface routines, and then tuning them on individual machines. Same basic question with LabView (i thought it was a data acquisition, processing tool, with a GUI and a maths language), and MatLab (data manipulation tool, full script interface). Can you build stimulus presentation paradigms in these applications ..track blanking signals properly for example? Could you check easily their performance on different machines? We've identified some substantial timing errors in a couple of paradigms written in C++. On the other hand, our e-prime data from visual paradigms shows that on an appropriate machine e-prime can perform as pst state. If you went this way, could you trust the timing? At 08:07 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: >Greg, > > >LabVIEW programing is my day job. My wife is currently working > >towards her PhD in psychometrics and her department uses E-Prime for > >running experiments. I am helping out one of her classmates with a > >project since no one in the program really knows much about > >programming and they were having a difficult time on their own. > >Ah, so you did get stuck with a decree from on high :). Same here, >if I had my druthers I would still program everything in C, or >perhaps graduate to C++ or MatLab. Please post a comparison review >here once you get more experience, perhaps some of us would want to >switch to LabVIEW if we only knew it better. > >Thanks, >-- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > >> > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Tue Feb 24 22:11:42 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:11:42 -0500 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <5c4ae755-e12d-44d6-966b-3ed2ebe04efb@v18g2000vbb.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: Mary, >we're using eprime 2.0. We have our program set up so that it will >advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI >scanner sends out every 3 seconds. We want to also be able to log our >subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the >next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t >keys), it will advance the slide. > >Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide >right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would >hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra >blank slide. Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide >for a specific key instead of any key? (We tried going to the >advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that >did not work. Do we have to do an in-line or something? Perhaps, but there may be other ways. I would explore adding a second Keyboard device in the Input Mask for your original Slide object. It's a little known fact that you can add multiple instances of any input device into the Input Mask of any display object, and each instance can have its own settings for Allowable, Correct, Time Limit, and End Action (I don't know where PST documents this, if anywhere). Be careful with this, it can get confusing as you have to click on each instance in the Input Mask box to work with the settings for that instance! So anyway, keep your first Keyboard mask as it is, terminating the slide when it gets a "t". Then set up your second Keyboard mask with End Action "(none)" so that subjects can press keys without terminating the slide. Just make sure subjects do not press "t"! Also, if you want to allow more than one response then you have to adjust that under the Advanced button. One gotcha though, I don't know how you get all your subject response data out of this, I think it will store only the final "t" from the scanner in the .edat2 file. You might have to use some script and the InputMask.Responses property to store the subject's responses to the .edat file. See the InputMask.Responses topic in the online E-Basic Help, and/or search around on this Google group or in the PST Forum, some of this has been discussed before. And if it were me I would first test out this idea in a little demo program for that purpose, rather than jumping right in and trying to make it work on my real experiment program. Once I get the tiny demo to work I would apply what I learned to the real program. Just a bit of strategic advice from an old hand. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:13:07 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:13:07 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <5c4ae755-e12d-44d6-966b-3ed2ebe04efb@v18g2000vbb.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) and not logging the subject's response. How do we only log the "non- action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? On Feb 24, 4:51?pm, mary wrote: > Hi, > > we're using eprime 2.0. ?We have our program set up so that it will > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > scanner sends out every 3 seconds. ?We want to also be able to log our > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > keys), it will advance the slide. > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > blank slide. ?Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > for a specific key instead of any key? ?(We tried going to the > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > did not work. ?Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > Thanks! > Mary --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From pquain at une.edu.au Tue Feb 24 22:26:34 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 09:26:34 +1100 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <75868a42-f867-41e9-ab28-a2a93ec6ed9d@f33g2000vbf.googlegro ups.com> Message-ID: maybe buy a button box, use that for subject response. Or get the pulse (?) from the scanner through a port ... is this what you have plugged into (one of your?) keyboard input(s)? ... and use this to progress the slide. At 09:13 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: >By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an >input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other >keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) >and not logging the subject's response. How do we only log the "non- >action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > >On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > > Hi, > > > > we're using eprime 2.0. We have our program set up so that it will > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds. We want to also be able to log our > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > blank slide. Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > for a specific key instead of any key? (We tried going to the > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > did not work. Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > > Thanks! > > Mary >> > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: >24/02/2009 1:35 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:25:10 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:25:10 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <75868a42-f867-41e9-ab28-a2a93ec6ed9d@f33g2000vbf.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: ha! ok thanks for your help. On Feb 24, 5:13?pm, msmith wrote: > By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an > input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other > keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) > and not logging the subject's response. ?How do we only log the "non- > action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > > On Feb 24, 4:51?pm, mary wrote: > > > Hi, > > > we're using eprime 2.0. ?We have our program set up so that it will > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds. ?We want to also be able to log our > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > blank slide. ?Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > for a specific key instead of any key? ?(We tried going to the > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > did not work. ?Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > Thanks! > > Mary --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:36:27 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:36:27 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: <20090224222638.TZIK5528.nskntotgx03p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis.une.edu.au> Message-ID: Yes, we do use a button box for subject input (although it still gives character responses r, g, b, or y so using a keyboard is the same as long as you press those buttons). I will look into using a "port" for the scanner but as far as I know it magically sends a "t", I think, through the button box. On Feb 24, 5:26?pm, Peter Quain wrote: > maybe buy a button box, use that for subject response. > Or get the pulse (?) from the scanner through a port ... is this what > you have plugged into (one of your?) keyboard input(s)? ... and use > this to progress the slide. > > At 09:13 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: > > > > >By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an > >input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other > >keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) > >and not logging the subject's response. ?How do we only log the "non- > >action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > > >On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > we're using eprime 2.0. ?We have our program set up so that it will > > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds. ?We want to also be able to log our > > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > > blank slide. ?Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > > for a specific key instead of any key? ?(We tried going to the > > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > > did not work. ?Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > > Thanks! > > > Mary > > >-- > >No virus found in this incoming message. > >Checked by AVG. > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > >-- > >No virus found in this incoming message. > >Checked by AVG. > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From maryesmith at gmail.com Tue Feb 24 22:45:40 2009 From: maryesmith at gmail.com (msmith) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:45:40 -0800 Subject: key logging vs. advancing to the next slide with a "t" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This seems to solve the problem: http://e-prime.googlegroups.com/web/MultipleResponseCollection.es?gda=xGpkx08AAABX7qKQ4-iIf6hgMt1hLSvBZzqSgoxrYBkRljkWhaiQ5Mm-Kz7jI7xuJi9cntUnGSKLthDhGK8sJIhZxVRc98mRnHMhSp_qzSgvndaTPyHVdA&gsc=ks4VPwsAAACnj8K_dqhBwyQfyaQoH72F On Feb 24, 5:36?pm, msmith wrote: > Yes, we do use a button box for subject input (although it still gives > character responses r, g, b, or y so using a keyboard is the same as > long as you press those buttons). ?I will look into using a "port" for > the scanner but as far as I know it magically sends a "t", I think, > through the button box. > > On Feb 24, 5:26?pm, Peter Quain wrote: > > > maybe buy a button box, use that for subject response. > > Or get the pulse (?) from the scanner through a port ... is this what > > you have plugged into (one of your?) keyboard input(s)? ... and use > > this to progress the slide. > > > At 09:13 AM 25/02/2009, you wrote: > > > >By the way, we figured out that we need to add another keyboard as an > > >input device so now we can progress only on the "t" and not other > > >keys--but now it is only logging the "t" inputs (which we don't need) > > >and not logging the subject's response. ?How do we only log the "non- > > >action-taking" responses, and not the "t"s? > > > >On Feb 24, 4:51 pm, mary wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > > we're using eprime 2.0. ?We have our program set up so that it will > > > > advance to the next slide every time it receives a "t" that our MRI > > > > scanner sends out every 3 seconds. ?We want to also be able to log our > > > > subject's responses on another keypad separately without moving to the > > > > next slide--but it seems like no matter what key we press (i.e., non-t > > > > keys), it will advance the slide. > > > > > Apparently there's a way to do this if we add another short slide > > > > right after the first one that advances with a "t", but this would > > > > hurt our design and add more room for mistakes by adding this extra > > > > blank slide. ?Can we both log responses and also "terminate" the slide > > > > for a specific key instead of any key? ?(We tried going to the > > > > advanced button and typing in "t" for termination response and that > > > > did not work. ?Do we have to do an in-line or something? > > > > > Thanks! > > > > Mary > > > >-- > > >No virus found in this incoming message. > > >Checked by AVG. > > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > >-- > > >No virus found in this incoming message. > > >Checked by AVG. > > >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: > > >24/02/2009 1:35 PM > > > -- > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > Checked by AVG. > > Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 24/02/2009 1:35 PM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From graftedlife at gmail.com Wed Feb 25 02:59:03 2009 From: graftedlife at gmail.com (Paul) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:59:03 -0800 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag In-Reply-To: <49a45cd8.25bd720a.41ed.0335SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Dear David, Yes, thanks a lot for your reply. >OK, but how many KB are the sound files? How many channels (mono or >stereo?), how many samples/sec, and how many bits/sample? The sounds are usually very short, with a size of about 25 KB to 55 KB. They are recorded in only one channel; the sampling frequency is 22050Hz, 16bits per sample. >Also, how many KB is your fixation .jpg file? What is its resolution >(pixels width and height), its color bit depth, and its compression ratio? >And why use a .jpg for the fixation instead of just a text "+"? The size of the jpg file is less than 1 KB. Its resolution is 44 by 44 pixiels (72dpi); the color bit depth is 24. (I'm sorry for now I don't know how to check out the compression ratio on my computer, but when I made it I guess I set it to the highest quality.) But in the slide object I used the strech function to make it fill up the whole screen. Still, I tried not to use a fixation jpg but simply a text "+", but the slide still lags. Yes, I used EP2 on my vista before, and I did not know why I frequently got timeout errors until I checked the discussions here. Thank you for your help! Paul --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Wed Feb 25 22:17:35 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 17:17:35 -0500 Subject: Need help with slide (sound/image) lag In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Paul, OK then, your stimulus files certainly are miniscule, so much for that :). And now I'm pretty much out of ideas. If it were me, next I would set aside the actual experiment program and make a small demo program that does nothing but display my slide with my image and sound. And if I had problems there, I would next copy everything to another machine and try it all again. IOW, the old divide-and-conquer strategy. As far as I can tell your program does nothing extraordinary, so it certainly should work. Good luck. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > Dear David, > > Yes, thanks a lot for your reply. > >> OK, but how many KB are the sound files? How many channels (mono or >> stereo?), how many samples/sec, and how many bits/sample? > > The sounds are usually very short, with a size of about 25 KB to 55 > KB. They are recorded in only one channel; the sampling frequency is > 22050Hz, 16bits per sample. > >> Also, how many KB is your fixation .jpg file? What is its resolution >> (pixels width and height), its color bit depth, and its compression ratio? >> And why use a .jpg for the fixation instead of just a text "+"? > > The size of the jpg file is less than 1 KB. Its resolution is 44 by 44 > pixiels (72dpi); the color bit depth is 24. (I'm sorry for now I don't > know how to check out the compression ratio on my computer, but when I > made it I guess I set it to the highest quality.) But in the slide > object I used the strech function to make it fill up the whole screen. > > Still, I tried not to use a fixation jpg but simply a text "+", but > the slide still lags. > > Yes, I used EP2 on my vista before, and I did not know why I > frequently got timeout errors until I checked the discussions here. > > Thank you for your help! > Paul --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Wed Feb 25 22:48:26 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 17:48:26 -0500 Subject: LabVIEW vs. E-Prime In-Reply-To: <20090224220832.EHUV807.nschwotgx01p.mx.bigpond.com@tardis.une.edu.au> Message-ID: Peter, > i thought that the key selling point of specialised stimulus > presentation software is low level routines - probably written in C > or C++ (?) - that optimise interaction with the OS (and thus its > devices) to provide millisecond precision timing accuracy for the > higher level routines that organise the stimulus properties and > collect responses. A programmatic interface to these higher level > routines makes their manipulation easy and powerful (if you can work > out where to put dots, and the like :), but it doesn't touch the OS interface. Well put, thank you! I agree with much of your sentiment throughout, but allow me to attempt some counterpoint nonetheless. > I'm wondering whether you could be confident that standalone > applications built in C etc could provide that sort of accuracy > without a hell of a lot of testing and modification of the OS > interface routines, and then tuning them on individual machines. Indeed, nor would I take for granted that PST or any other company has done that job for us. As I recall, long ago PST itself marketed a product called MEL ("Micro Experimental Laboratory") that was then found to have a subtle timing error that affected some experimental results. And even now PST does not seem competent to make sound and video work properly under Vista, how confident can we be that their product does not have other problems lurking in its critical timing? As for the necessity of tuning individual machines, even PST advises that we tune each machine individually for critical timing with E-Prime, so they have not even relieved us of that burden. To its credit PST provides a tool for that, their RefreshClockTest. But even then I would not take for granted that their program works as advertised. Indeed, I tore into the guts of their program myself, and was heartened to find that the few lines of code that did the critical work in that vast program implemented one of the three algorithms that I would use myself. Only then would I consider using their test program (and even then I rewrote three streamlined alternatives to suit my own tastes). As I keep telling all my researchers and everyone online, *if* they care about critical timing (not everyone has such a need) then someone in their lab *must* thoroughly read and understand chapter 3 of the User's Guide that comes with E-Prime. Sadly, I don't know that anyone follows through on that. No, buying a commercial product does not relieve any of us in any way of the duty of understanding the underlying principles of our tools and doing our own extensive testing of their shortcomings. The surety of science comes not from taking the work of others for granted, but in the growing network of continued and redundant fact-checking. Sadly, I find that fact-checking attitude far too lacking among the research labs of my acquaintance, and relying on a product like E-Prime helps them to continue in their lax practices. As I keep telling my researchers, they should never trust anyone's software, not even mine. Yes I apply a lot of expertise and care to guarantee the critical performance of my programs (to the dismay of my researchers, who would generally rather that I just quickly dash off some barely working slop), but in the end each researcher has the responsibility to fully verify for themself the suitability of the tools they use. (E.g., I know a student who lost 2-1/2 years of dissertation research with paid clinical subjects because they blindly trusted an E-Prime program from another world-renowned researcher.) Now you do have a point that making this all work in C or the like would still require that someone have deep understanding of the OS in order to work around its vagaries. I keep forgetting that I did all that C programming back in the days of DOS, before preemptive multitasking, so my programs more or less took complete control of the processor with no special effort. That was great. But those days are long gone. And the systems we used back then did not have the graphics or multimedia capabilities that we have today (though for simple text and low-resolution graphics, for all their power I doubt that the task presentation systems of today can perform any better than an Apple II or a Commodore 64). So I do have PST to thank for a product that put all the added power of Windows machines to work for presenting behavioral tasks. And indeed, it was I who encouraged our researchers to standardize on E-Prime, because it really did leap-frog beyond what I could do at the time in C and DOS. And on the whole, I continue to endorse E-Prime until I chance upon a better product (which would please me much, I detest PST's business practices). But in principle, a suitable subroutine or object library in C or C++ or C# or MatLab or whatever could provide as much facility for critical timing as E-Prime. In fact, when you think of it, that is all that E-Prime does anyway. Under the covers (and as anyone can see if they peruse the online E-Basic Help as I have) E-Prime is just a dialect of Microsoft Visual Basic with a specialized object library, and E-Studio is just a pretty graphical "skin" or front-end over that. Moreover, if you study the reviews as I have, you will find that E-Prime accomplishes its timing feats only by relying on Microsoft's DirectX technology, nothing proprietary or peculiar to E-Prime. Indeed, other products such as DirectRT, Inquisit, and Paradigm accomplish the same feats using the same underlying technology. Anybody practiced in DirectX could do it. So it would not be that much of a stretch to provide a similar library for skilled programmers to use in a language of their choosing. And if someone wanted to add a graphical front-end for the sake of dedicated non-programmers (who by their own inclination and admission are ill suited to programming intricate behavioral tasks no matter how you dumb down the programming platform, and therefore ought really to leave this task to so many others better inclined and practiced anyway), so be it (think Linux with user-choosable desktop environments and shells). Even better if this were open source. Now in practice I do not know that any such thing is available. But heck, if enough of us were just motivated enough, we could form a consortium and make it ourselves. And with C++ or the like we would have a much more serviceable and well-ordered platform for building precision tools. Heck, in C we could even use inline assembly code for critical points (as I did for some projects in those bygone days). And we would have a much more extensible platform -- I cannot easily extend E-Prime with my own custom libraries as I could with C, E-Prime's PackageCall notwithstanding (I have yet to find a non-commercial E-Prime developer who builds on that feature). > Same basic question with LabView (i thought it was a data > acquisition, processing tool, with a GUI and a maths language), and > MatLab (data manipulation tool, full script interface). Can you build > stimulus presentation paradigms in these applications ..track > blanking signals properly for example? I too thought MatLab was just an analysis tool, so I was surprised when I learned some of our researchers used it for presenting tasks, even for fMRI. So I took a look and was amazed. Seems that a variety of specialized Matlab modules or libraries are available for task presentation and all sorts of other things. And it can do things that put E-Prime to shame. Just for instance, people have asked here how to mirror-reverse text on-the-fly in E-Prime. E-Prime has no hope of doing any such thing. But MatLab can not only do the text mirror-reversal on the fly, I have seen it animate the the text and make it rotate and distort and fly across the screen, all on-the-fly, and all with just a few function calls. That is precisely why one of our fMRI researchers uses MatLab from their own laptop (a MacBook, if you must know) instead of using the E-Prime system that we have set up for everyone else. I have not looked into MatLab's timing accuracy, but ... > Could you check easily their performance on different machines? Yes -- the principles of a time checking program are pretty straightforward and constant (as illustrated in PST's own RefreshClockTest), and I have built such tools with every programming platform I use. No problem. I would hope that everyone else does the same .... > We've identified some substantial timing errors in a couple of paradigms written in C++. ... just as you. Clearly you too know how simple it is to build time checking tools for a given platform. No big deal, it just has to be done. > On the other hand, our e-prime data from visual paradigms shows that on an > appropriate machine e-prime can perform as pst state. My preliminary tests show pretty much the same, as long as we are clear on what "PST states" -- as carefully discussed in great detail in chapter 3 of the E-Prime User's Guide, more or less millisecond accuracy, with occasional and unavoidable (though minimizable) lapses due to the vagaries inherent in any modern preemptive multitasking system. I am confident that skilled programmers could do the same with with many other programming platforms, especially using DirectX. So having considered all this further, yes, if I could program only for myself, and given a suitable function or object library, then I would still rather do everything in straight C or the like. But I do not program for myself, and therein lies the rub. The behavioral researchers I work with would hardly stand for the sort of text-based and fully regular development platform that suits me; and admittedly I find the E-Prime GUI helpful in working with these researchers. (To be sure, as far as mating underlying text-based source with a GUI front-end, I find that the initial designers of E-Prime (Brandon C, I suppose this includes you) have done a masterful job, largely through the provision of Inline objects.) And yet, it repeatedly confounds me how researchers keep overlooking the terrific programming capacity so masterfully given to them in the E-Studio GUI objects and instead gravitate directly to E-Basic script. Go figure. Peter, you sound like one of the few who actually bothers to test their systems, and knows how to do it. Sadly, I find your attitude and competence rare. But I would very much like to have my misgivings proven wrong. There, I got that off my chest. And for anybody who did not simply throw this straight into the trash (as I might well have done myself), my apologies for cluttering your inbox with this long rant. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Thu Feb 26 01:33:04 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:33:04 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide Message-ID: Hi guys, I have a simple sounding question here and I am sure I am having a problem here simply due to a lack of experience with e-prime. I have a slide that I am looping through (time out at 100ms). Each time I change one of the values on the slide (random number). The subject is supposed to press a key to stop it and then I do some calculations with what ever the random number was at the time. I would like the subject to do this with the space bar. When I set the allowable response to {SPACE} and my inline do a check: If Slide1.RESP = " " and I have also tries If Slide1.RESP = chr(32), it does not work. If I set the allowable response to 1 and do the check If Slide1.RESP = "1", It works perfectly. I would think that I need something in my if statement other than " " or chr(32). Anyone have any ideas? Thanks. Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pquain at une.edu.au Thu Feb 26 01:54:42 2009 From: pquain at une.edu.au (Peter Quain) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 12:54:42 +1100 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: if there is only the single response to Slide1, using SPACE (and that response terminates the Object) maybe log Slide1.RT, then something like: If Slide1.RT <> 0 Then ... whatever End If At 12:33 PM 26/02/2009, you wrote: >Hi guys, > >I have a simple sounding question here and I am sure I am having a >problem here simply due to a lack of experience with e-prime. > >I have a slide that I am looping through (time out at 100ms). Each >time I change one of the values on the slide (random number). The >subject is supposed to press a key to stop it and then I do some >calculations with what ever the random number was at the time. I >would like the subject to do this with the space bar. When I set >the allowable response to {SPACE} and my inline do a check: If >Slide1.RESP = " " and I have also tries If Slide1.RESP = chr(32), it >does not work. If I set the allowable response to 1 and do the >check If Slide1.RESP = "1", It works perfectly. I would think that >I need something in my if statement other than " " or chr(32). > >Anyone have any ideas? Thanks. > >Greg > >> > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1971 - Release Date: >25/02/2009 6:40 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1971 - Release Date: 25/02/2009 6:40 AM --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de Thu Feb 26 07:07:39 2009 From: janhoffm at mail.uni-mannheim.de (janpsy) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:07:39 -0800 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Greg, Slide1.RESP="{SPACE}" should work. You find the whole key nomenclature in the E-Basic Help. Janina --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 13:48:29 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 08:48:29 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: <8b4996e8-21a8-4158-b207-79ae13537a89@h20g2000yqn.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: Just to summarize, in the case where you have only one allowable response (e.g., 'SPACE') and you want to test for the occurrence of only that response, then the following should work: If Slide1.RESP = "{SPACE}" ' using the {key} nomenclature from online E-Basic Help If Slide1.RESP <> "" If Slide1.RT > 0 ' or "<>" if you prefer If Slide1.RT ' you don't even need the explicit test in this case If Slide1.RTTime > 0 ' etc. as in .RT test If you had also set the Correct response to {SPACE}, then you could also use If Slide1.ACC = 1 If Slide1.ACC <> 0 If Slice1.ACC ' once again, do not need explicit test in this case Also note that E-Basic/Visual Basic itself is case insensitive, so you may use whatever case you like, except that you must observe case for the E-Basic {key} nomenclature. I leave it as an exercise to the reader to figure out the corresponding tests for the case of more than one allowable response, or how to test for the occurrence of a non-response (or non-occurrence of a response?). You may post your solutions here for extra credit. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder and Insufferable Pedant --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 14:12:18 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 09:12:18 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, > I have a slide that I am looping through (time out at 100ms). Each time > I change one of the values on the slide (random number). The subject is > supposed to press a key to stop it and then I do some calculations with > what ever the random number was at the time. I would like the subject > to do this with the space bar. When I set the allowable response to > {SPACE} and my inline do a check: If Slide1.RESP = " " and I have also > tries If Slide1.RESP = chr(32), it does not work. If I set the > allowable response to 1 and do the check If Slide1.RESP = "1", It works > perfectly. I would think that I need something in my if statement other > than " " or chr(32). > > Anyone have any ideas? Thanks. BTW, if I were looping through a slide and just wanted to stop when the subject responds to any presentation, I might try another EP trick. Instead of even getting a response to each slide presentation, I might put a Wait object (let's call it ResponseWait) before my slide loop. I would make its Duration 0, set it collect my desired response, and (here's the key) set Time Limit to "(infinite)" or the max duration of my slide loop. The PST User's Guide calls this Extended Input, see the much overlooked Appendix C. I would probably also set its End Action to Terminate so that it will terminate the current slide when the subject responds, unless I wanted to allow the final slide to time-out on its own. Anyway, then in my script or whatever I would just test for a response to ResponseWait instead of my slides. I really don't know if this makes things any better in your case, but I had an experiment where this technique solved a lot of problems. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 14:29:18 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 09:29:18 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: <49A6A342.2030100@msu.edu> Message-ID: I wrote, > I had an experiment where this technique solved a lot of problems. Sorry to keep posting in piece-meal fashion, but just to explain a bit... We had a task where we rapidly looped through a set of slides (i.e., new slide on each screen refresh) and wanted to stop when the subject responded. I first did it as you described, testing for a response to the slides themselves. But much of time the program would not detect the subject response. When I thought it through and looked at the timing, I realized that in this case the program spent a good proportion of its time between each slide, whereas it could collect responses only during each slide's run; e.g., if a slide appeared every 17 ms, with 7 ms for in-between-slide setup and 10 ms of actual slide running (even though it does remain on the screen for the full 17 ms), my program got responses only during the 10 ms interval so 7/17 = 40% of the time my program could not get a response! I solved the problem using one pre-loop object with extended input as described in my previous post, and I have described this just in case it can ever do anyone else any good. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Thu Feb 26 21:21:48 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:21:48 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: <49A6A73E.7020503@msu.edu> Message-ID: David. I just now am reading through this email chain and what you described in this last one is exactly what I am attempting to do and that is exactly one of problems I am seeing. I only had the few minutes to get it set up so have not had any time to try another method yet. They requested they have it look through faster than what I had it set at, but could not run it any faster without having to kit the stop key several times to get it to stop :) Thank you for the suggestion, I'll try it out this evening and let you know how it goes. Greg (ps. Thanks for all the very detailed help you give on this list!!) On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 9:29 AM, David McFarlane wrote: > > I wrote, > > > I had an experiment where this technique solved a lot of problems. > > Sorry to keep posting in piece-meal fashion, but just to explain a bit... > > We had a task where we rapidly looped through a set of slides (i.e., new > slide on each screen refresh) and wanted to stop when the subject > responded. I first did it as you described, testing for a response to > the slides themselves. But much of time the program would not detect > the subject response. When I thought it through and looked at the > timing, I realized that in this case the program spent a good proportion > of its time between each slide, whereas it could collect responses only > during each slide's run; e.g., if a slide appeared every 17 ms, with 7 > ms for in-between-slide setup and 10 ms of actual slide running (even > though it does remain on the screen for the full 17 ms), my program got > responses only during the 10 ms interval so 7/17 = 40% of the time my > program could not get a response! > > I solved the problem using one pre-loop object with extended input as > described in my previous post, and I have described this just in case it > can ever do anyone else any good. > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Thu Feb 26 22:16:28 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 17:16:28 -0500 Subject: Response to a slide Message-ID: Greg, >I only had the few minutes to get it set up That illustrates the bigger problem here. Behavioral research labs today seem to think that they can do research in a rush, and so do not allow time to do things properly. Back in my graduate training in the early 1980s, my advisor at the University of Chicago actually reminded me that science is a deliberative process, and I needed to slow down and take more time to ponder things. Seems our culture has abandoned those values, taking an abundance of whiz-bang technology as a substitute for timely deliberation. As for me, I do not find that an improvement. But then I am a cranky old geezer. -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From gosenbach at gmail.com Fri Feb 27 02:07:28 2009 From: gosenbach at gmail.com (Greg Osenbach) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:07:28 -0500 Subject: Off Topic: Programming woes. Was: Response to a slide Message-ID: Warning: Continued rant Agreed. A lot of the problem that I have noticed in my career, (not referring specifically to this project, my current position is as a consultant for industrial data acquisition and testing software and hardware), is that non-programmers simply do not understand what is involved in creating a good piece of software. A lot of people look at computers and see how they make everything easy and fast for them and assume that the programming part must be easy and fast as well. (Would you like your project quickly, cheap, or done well? Pick two :) ) People see the front end on a piece of software which is abstracted out to the point of it having a very simple look and feel and is easy to use and figure that what is going on in the background is the same, fairly simple. However, as you probably know, the simpler you make a program to run and use, the more complex it is. Attacking something like a complex piece of software without first building up a plan, assembling detailed documentation, and clearly defining the specifications is a recipie for a disasterious project. The kind of projects I typically work on are on the order of a few hundered hours of work and billed at $120-$135 an hour, so having a plan is very important. It also means that I need to sell my customers on the fact that I can give them something that is done right, the first time, that is modular and expandable and works with very few bugs (nothing is ever 100% bug frre except for "hello world" programs). If someone is going to pay tens of thousands of dollars for a bit of custom software, you deffinatly do not want to give them something you banged out in a weekend. If you are not able to do it right, a lot of times it's not worth the headache of doing it at all. There is nothing worse than agreeing to do a project on an accelerated time table and cutting corners and them coming back to you latter and saying "there are bugs, we need you to fix them and we do not think we should have to pay for it because you supplied us with buggy software" when it is buggy in the first place because of how they emanded that it be done up front. On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 5:16 PM, David McFarlane wrote: > > Greg, > > >I only had the few minutes to get it set up > > > That illustrates the bigger problem here. Behavioral research labs > today seem to think that they can do research in a rush, and so do > not allow time to do things properly. Back in my graduate training > in the early 1980s, my advisor at the University of Chicago actually > reminded me that science is a deliberative process, and I needed to > slow down and take more time to ponder things. Seems our culture has > abandoned those values, taking an abundance of whiz-bang technology > as a substitute for timely deliberation. As for me, I do not find > that an improvement. But then I am a cranky old geezer. > > > -- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mcfarla9 at msu.edu Fri Feb 27 15:10:59 2009 From: mcfarla9 at msu.edu (David McFarlane) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:10:59 -0500 Subject: Off Topic: Programming woes. Was: Response to a slide In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, Amen!! At 2/26/2009 09:07 PM Thursday, you wrote: >Warning: Continued rant > >Agreed. A lot of the problem that I have noticed in my career, (not >referring specifically to this project, my current position is as a >consultant for industrial data acquisition and testing software and >hardware), is that non-programmers simply do not understand what is >involved in creating a good piece of software. A lot of people look >at computers and see how they make everything easy and fast for them >and assume that the programming part must be easy and fast as >well. (Would you like your project quickly, cheap, or done >well? Pick two :) ) People see the front end on a piece of >software which is abstracted out to the point of it having a very >simple look and feel and is easy to use and figure that what is >going on in the background is the same, fairly simple. However, as >you probably know, the simpler you make a program to run and use, >the more complex it is. Attacking something like a complex piece of >software without first building up a plan, assembling detailed >documentation, and clearly defining the specifications is a recipie >for a disasterious project. The kind of projects I typically work >on are on the order of a few hundered hours of work and billed at >$120-$135 an hour, so having a plan is very important. It also >means that I need to sell my customers on the fact that I can give >them something that is done right, the first time, that is modular >and expandable and works with very few bugs (nothing is ever 100% >bug frre except for "hello world" programs). If someone is going to >pay tens of thousands of dollars for a bit of custom software, you >deffinatly do not want to give them something you banged out in a >weekend. If you are not able to do it right, a lot of times it's >not worth the headache of doing it at all. There is nothing worse >than agreeing to do a project on an accelerated time table and >cutting corners and them coming back to you latter and saying "there >are bugs, we need you to fix them and we do not think we should have >to pay for it because you supplied us with buggy software" when it >is buggy in the first place because of how they emanded that it be >done up front. > >On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 5:16 PM, David McFarlane ><mcfarla9 at msu.edu> wrote: > >Greg, > > >I only had the few minutes to get it set up > > >That illustrates the bigger problem here. Behavioral research labs >today seem to think that they can do research in a rush, and so do >not allow time to do things properly. Back in my graduate training >in the early 1980s, my advisor at the University of Chicago actually >reminded me that science is a deliberative process, and I needed to >slow down and take more time to ponder things. Seems our culture has >abandoned those values, taking an abundance of whiz-bang technology >as a substitute for timely deliberation. As for me, I do not find >that an improvement. But then I am a cranky old geezer. > > >-- David McFarlane, Professional Faultfinder --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From anderson.catherine at gmail.com Fri Feb 27 19:58:43 2009 From: anderson.catherine at gmail.com (Catherine Anderson) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:58:43 -0800 Subject: Requesting help converting from EP1 to EP2 Message-ID: Hello all, I have a run-time license for EP2 (a.k.a. E-Run 2), and I have a set of scripts that a colleague has created in EP1, which have the .es file extension. E-Run2 is not recognizing these scripts. Is there anyone who is willing to open my .es scripts in EP2, save them as .ebs2 files, and send them back to me? I'm told this is a fairly simple conversion. I would be much obliged to you. Many thanks, - Catherine Anderson. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "E-Prime" group. To post to this group, send email to e-prime at googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to e-prime+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/e-prime?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---