[gothic-l] Re: The Several Shapes of Gaut

[Le Bateman]

It is possible that the god with the spear is Gautr, which Grimm also
identified with Odin. But he should also have ravens or wolves with him.
Could the Brackets be runes. I am not sure the Roman Mars who perhaps was a
refined and elder Ares was not depicted with a spear. Ares never had a
beard.
Le
----- Original Message -----
From: <dirk at smra.co.uk>
To: <gothic-l at egroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2000 11:01 AM
Subject: [gothic-l] Re: The Several Shapes of Gaut


> Very interesting coments. I have pointed out earlier that Russian
> scholars attribute a certain series of imitative coins in the Black
> Sea area to the Goths. These coins are based on Marcus Aurelius
> denari
> with the walking Mars reverse. Kazamanova, speculated that the Goths
> have chosen the Mars design because it was easiest to copy. From your
> comments, saying that Jordanes said that the Goths worshiped Mars, a
> different explanation comes to mind. Are the Goths depicting their
> god
> on these coins? This would add to the list of evidence that these
> coins really were made by at least parts of the Gothic tribal
> confederation at the Black Sea. Togther with the crude figure of Mars
> (a person with a spear) there are also different signs on the flan,
> which may just be space filler or as Kazamanova said a system to
> distinguish different issues. These signs are normally combinations
> of
>  X and O (i.e. XX, XO, OX, OO) and some others. However, around the
> head of Mars there is always a braket typ sign on each side, thus
> surrounding and engulfing the head of Mars,  which does not really
> have a correspondence on the model coins. Can anybody think of an
> explanation? You referred to the moon symbol and its
> significance. Could these brakets be half-moons on each side of
> the head? Also, the emperor's head on the obverse is totally degraded
> into a small  object within a sunburst on the later coins. Kazamanova
> said that there are parallels to  designs of the Wilbark culture
> found
> in East Prussia. Can anybody point to a book or anything were such an
> object is depicted? To sea a picture of such a coin, the best and
> only place outside Russian literature is Zograph, A.N. Ancient
> coinage, Oxford, British Archaelogical Reports, 1977.
>
> Dirk
>
>
>
> --- In gothic-l at egroups.com, "sunburst" <sunburst at j...> wrote:
> > Hails Bertil!
> >
> > >It is true that Gaut is associated with Odin as a warrior
> > >god, but Gaut was also a High god, a creator god and
> > >a heavenly god.
> >
> > Which might indicate a connection with Tiw.  Also, Jordanes
> mentions
> that
> > "Mars" was held highest among the Goths, and was reputed to have
> been born
> > among them, so that they were actually bestowing worship upon their
> > ancestor.  However, there is no proof Jordanes was talking about
> Gaut.
> >
> > What I am trying to do is find Gaut's place in the pantheon(s) of
> > Germanic/Norse mythology.  While Norse sources identify Gaut as
> Odin, some
> > scholars feel that when Odin usurped Tyr's position at the head of
> the
> > AEsir, "Gaut" was one of the bynames Odin absorbed.
> >
> > That the Goths, coming from Scandinavia as a Vanic cult had Gaut as
> their
> > patron god might suggest a connection between Gaut and the Vanir.
> This
> > would seem more likely if, as you say, Gaut is assocated with
> fertility, and
> > can be assocated with the Mannus myth.
> >
> > Or perhaps Gaut is a separate god altogether, as he seems to bear a
> > combination of qualities held by no other god.  Suggestions and
> comments are
> > welcome.
> >
> > The Gothic warriors carried for instance
> > >on their weapons signs of the moon, a typical fertility
> > >sign. Gaut undoubtedly also took on the form of a
> > >god who promoted harvest. If the Goths were worshiped
> > >a god whose name meant 'man', 'fertilizer' and 'pourer out'
> > >(as in poring out semen) it is not impossible to seem him
> > >also as a fertility god, but not only that.
> >
> >
> > Yes, that does indeed make sense.
> >
> > Albareiks
>
>
>
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>

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