[gothic-l] Re: du usfilhan ana gastim

[llama_nom]

Gerry,

> As for the list of dative verbs that llama_nom provided 
recently, "gahwotjan" 
> (= rebuke, threaten) could be added.

Thanks!  By coincidence I actually noticed an instance of this a 
couple of days ago.  I just checked now and all examples do indeed 
have dative.  It's been duly added to the list.  I should do one of 
genitive verbs too, but they're easier to predict (desire, use, 
thought, removal of/from...)--although there are a few anomalies 
like daupeinim brukjan, Sk 3,6 +dat. instead of the usual gen.  And 
gasothjan varies between gen. & dat. for the "satisfactant".

By the way, is Sk 1,5 (as it appears at the Wulfila Project) 
gahvotjandin a mistake for gahvatjandin?  This latter is the reading 
at the Skeireins Project, although the page doesn't seem to be 
working today.  Both Bennett and Streitberg's versions have 
gahvotjanin at the Titus website, so maybe gahvatjandin was 
Snaedal's ammendation?


>     du usfilhan ana gastim
>     eis taphén tois xenois

Thanks to for your clarification of this.  So the Gothic could be 
literally: "to bury on (i.e. be buried on) for strangers."  
Alternatively, since in Mt 6,1, dative indicates the agent ("to be 
seen BY THEM), maybe the sense is "for burials on [it] by 
foreigners" -- i.e. "for foreigners to bury [their dead] on."  
Literally: "for to be buried on, by foreigners."  Another thought I 
had was that ANA here might be like: ana Gutthiudai -- "among...", 
so "for burials among the foreign community."  Not entirely sure, 
but at the moment I'm inclining more towards your suggestion of 
passive infinitive + ana "on/in [the field]".

Llama Nom




--- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, Grsartor at a... wrote:
> About the Gothic phrase
> 
>     du usfilhan ana gastim
> 
> which translates the Greek
> 
>     eis taphén tois xenois:
> 
> How is the Gothic to be construed? The Greek seems to be "into 
(i.e. for the 
> purpose of) burial for strangers", though my Greek is too ropy for 
me to 
> pronounce confidently on this. The Revised Standard Version of 
Matthew has "to bury 
> strangers in". To make the Gothic match the Greek, the infinitive 
could be 
> taken as passive, since Gothic sometimes uses the active 
infinitive in this way; 
> e.g. Matthew 6:1 "du saihwan im" = to be seen by them. If  in 
addition the 
> use of "ana" here is taken to be adverbial, the sense is "for 
strangers to be 
> buried on". 
> 
> As for the list of dative verbs that llama_nom provided 
recently, "gahwotjan" 
> (= rebuke, threaten) could be added.
> 
> Gerry T.
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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