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<p>--- In <a href="mailto:gothic-l%40yahoogroups.com">gothic-l@yahoogroup<wbr>s.com</a>, "llama_nom" <600cell@...<wbr>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> <br>
> 1. Leo Wiener: Commentary to the Germanic Laws and Medieval <br>
Documents:<br>
> "In Spain the Gothic language existed as late as the year 1091, <br>
for it<br>
> was in that year prohibited by a decree of the Synod of <br>
Leon." "'Et<br>
> interfuit etiam Renerius legatus, et Romanae ecclesiae Cardinalis,<br>
> ibidemque celebrato concilio cum Bernardo Toletano primate, multa <br>
de<br>
> officijs ecclesiae statuerunt, et etiam de caetero omnes scriptores<br>
> omissa litera Toletana, quam Gulfilas Gothorum Episcopus adinuenit,<br>
> Gallicis literis vterentur,' Roderici Toletani (Rodrigo Ximenes)<br>
> Chronicon, lib, VI, cap. XXX. See Hefele, Conciliengeschichte<wbr>, 2nd<br>
> ed., vol. V, p. 201. The assertion made somewhere that the <br>
reference<br>
> is to a calligraphy and not to the Gothic language is without any<br>
> foundation, for the Gothic alphabet was never used for anything but<br>
> Gothic." Admittedly Wiener expresses some eccentric views <br>
elsewhere<br>
> in this book and disputes the generally accepted chronology of the<br>
> surviving Gothic manuscripts, but I'd be curious to know what <br>
people<br>
> make of this quote. Of course, even if this does indicate the<br>
> survival of the Gothic written language, it doesn't necessarily <br>
mean<br>
> that it was still spoken.<br>
<br>
It's very difficult, though tempting, to think that Gothic was <br>
spoken up to the 11th century. My first impression of the quote is <br>
that it says about a single letter (litera Toletana vs. Gallicis <br>
literis) which had been borrowed from the Gothic (or maybe some <br>
other forgotten alphabet) into the mode of writing of Iberian <br>
scribes. It could be the letter for þ, for example. Like Old English <br>
scribes who retained several runic letters (þ and w, if I remember <br>
right) in the Latin-based alphabet of their manuscripts.<br>
<br>
> 2. Tabula gentes, 550. I'd be interested to know more about this<br>
> document and the context of the term Valagothi. Is it used <br>
anywhere<br>
> else in texts of this time and place? Is the prefix Vala- used<br>
> elsewhere in a similar context? Is linguistic 'Romanisation' the <br>
only<br>
> possible interpretation? The Valagothi also are named in the <br>
Historia<br>
> Brittonum, in a passage tracing the supposed descent of <br>
contemporary<br>
> peoples from the Hebrew patriarchs of the Bible, I:17: "Armenon <br>
autem<br>
> habuit quinque filios: Gothus, Valagothus, Gebidus, Burgundus,<br>
> Longobardus. [...]. ab Armenone autem quinque: Gothi, Valagothi,<br>
> Gebidi, Burgundi, Longobardi." This text may go back to the 11th <br>
c.,<br>
> although it has traditionally been attributed to Nennius, d. 809.<br>
<br>
There was a name Valgautr which Cleasby-Vigfusson lead back to val-<br>
"Roman", not to val "slain". I don't know if it's relevant here.<br>
<br>
[...]<br>
> 8. Placenames. A complex issue, obviously. It seems that there <br>
are<br>
> placenames in Iberia and France attributed to the Goths, but we<br>
> haven't come to any agreement about what their distribution might <br>
show<br>
> about how long the language survived. We might have to consider <br>
that<br>
> naming traditions could have outlasted the Gothic language, and <br>
that<br>
> placenames could have been formed by analogy with other placenames<br>
> using Gothic elements, even by Romance speakers. Compare the use <br>
of<br>
> -ville as a suffix in US placenames.<br>
<br>
The city of Burgos – is it a Gothic name (baurgs)?<br>
<br>
Ualarauans<br>
<br>
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