<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style>
<![endif]-->
<title>Re: [ILAT] upsurge</title>
<style>
<!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Wingdings;
panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Athabascan Naaki";
panose-1:2 11 5 2 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Book Antiqua";
panose-1:2 4 6 2 5 3 5 3 3 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Bernie;
panose-1:2 11 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Verdana;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
h1
{margin-top:12.0pt;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:3.0pt;
margin-left:0in;
page-break-before:always;
page-break-after:avoid;
font-size:16.0pt;
font-family:Arial;}
h2
{margin-top:12.0pt;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:3.0pt;
margin-left:0in;
page-break-after:avoid;
font-size:14.0pt;
font-family:"Athabascan Naaki";
font-style:italic;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
p.BlockQuote, li.BlockQuote, div.BlockQuote
{margin-top:0in;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
punctuation-wrap:simple;
text-autospace:none;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Book Antiqua";}
p.BulletsNumbering, li.BulletsNumbering, div.BulletsNumbering
{margin-top:0in;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
p.BlockParagraph, li.BlockParagraph, div.BlockParagraph
{margin-top:0in;
margin-right:.5in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
p.Heading4, li.Heading4, div.Heading4
{margin-top:0in;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";
font-style:italic;}
p.IndentedParagraph, li.IndentedParagraph, div.IndentedParagraph
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
text-indent:.5in;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
p.BlockParagraph0, li.BlockParagraph0, div.BlockParagraph0
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
span.EmailStyle23
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:Arial;
color:navy;}
@page Section1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.Section1
{page:Section1;}
/* List Definitions */
@list l0
{mso-list-id:1154950907;
mso-list-type:hybrid;
mso-list-template-ids:-343928786 798125090 -1284864802 -1209636544 788566900 1163138634 -1674010664 -1438982650 918845216 -1510284950;}
@list l0:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-style-link:Bullets&Numbering;
mso-level-text:\2022;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:Bernie;}
@list l0:level2
{mso-level-start-at:184;
mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\2013;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:Bernie;}
ol
{margin-bottom:0in;}
ul
{margin-bottom:0in;}
-->
</style>
</head>
<body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=blue>
<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Wow, this was truly a return to my
childhood for me. I grew up in New Hampshire, which is not too far south from
Quebec. One of my uncle’s parents were from there. But the real blast was
mention of the Huron confederacy. For some reason, the Hurons are woven into
the tapestry of that time – my childhood, that is. I don’t recall
quite why, nor can I explain the joy that surges, hearing that you met to
rekindle the Huron Confederacy. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Just thought I’d share . . . </span></font><font
size=2 color=navy face=Wingdings><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Wingdings;color:navy'>J</span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Mia <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Indigenous
Languages and Technology [mailto:ILAT@LISTSERV.ARIZONA.EDU] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Richard Smith<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, September 20, 2007
5:36 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> ILAT@LISTSERV.ARIZONA.EDU<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [ILAT] upsurge</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Verdana'>Yes Kevin,<br>
that was us meeting in the Midland Ontario area,for reburial/repatriation of
our ancestors<br>
remains and to recognize and rekindle the old "Huron" Confederacy in
1999.<br>
Some of us have close brother/sister ties with Wendats of Wendake,Quebec.<br>
I visit Wendake every couple years to hold traditional pottery workshops and
discuss language <br>
efforts and compare our dialect similarities and differences.<br>
Yes it's my understanding that the Wendat language borrows much from Wyandot
material<br>
and Mohawk Language is being used to fill in missing gaps by <br>
Michel GrosLouis who recently gained his Masters degree in Quebec in
Linguistics.<br>
Eventually He will most likely be hired as a full time linguist for the Wendat
nation.<br>
There is another Wendat woman preparing to get her masters in linguistics,and
already<br>
ceremonies are restored in Wendake in a beautiful Longhouse.<br>
<br>
Yes, our Wyandot language seems closer akin to what is known as
"Seneca", <br>
an Iroquoian language of a group of mixed tribes removed from the Ohio valley,<br>
and yes Craig Kopris who i really respect (a differant linguist) is helping a
good deal<br>
and does alot of study of the shared Iroquoian roots. <br>
It sounds like Lavel University will be helping too<br>
<br>
"community driven study" at this point is probably not accurate to
describe us...<br>
But definitely a "community excited to support" language recovery
work!<br>
<br>
Richard<br>
Wyandotte Oklahoma<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 9/20/07 10:02 AM, "Kevin Brousseau"
<brousseau_kevin@YAHOO.CA> wrote:</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.5pt;
font-family:Verdana'>This is the first time I hear about work being done on
Wyandot - this is a community driven study? Are you trying to bring the
language back to the point of having fluent speakers once again? <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I'm very curious because as you probably know there is a Wyandot community here
in Quebec and a small diaspora of Wyandot people from the Ohio valley who are
scattered a little bit everywhere. A few years ago a meeting was organized at
Georgian bay I think it was called, where some Wyandot people from a few
different places met in order to discuss language revitalisation and land
claims I think. This was the first time I heard of Wyadot people organizing in
order to bring back their language, but I had been hearing about the idea by
some Wyadot friends of mine for a long time, who wish to bring back the
language and have been studying Mohawk in the mean time to acquire competence
in a closely related language, hoping it will help them acquire Wyandot with
the proper accent or pronunciation. Is your team working with present Iroqiuan
languages too for comparative purposes and are you involved with the community
in Quebec?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Kevin Brousseau<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<b><i><span style='font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>Richard Smith
<rzs@TDS.NET></span></i></b> wrote:<br>
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.5pt;
font-family:Verdana'>thanks Bill,<br>
good points to consider...our linguists haven't had the honor<br>
to sit with fluent speakers...though they could listen to the various<br>
longhouse speeches on recordings for helpful hints<br>
<br>
Aidan was pretty much right on target.<br>
<br>
Wyandotte or wandat is one of those languages said to be extinct.<br>
well .... i never liked that word- "extinct"<br>
We have a mass of material left by ethnologists,linguists and even speakers<br>
- a huge dictionary and MANY lists,over forty narratives,incredible stories<br>
written in Wandat, including recordings of spoken words,over 300 songs and<br>
part of a story ,all originally collected on wax cylinders.<br>
This was collected here in 1911 by good ol' french canadian Marius Barbeau.<br>
Barbeau wasn't educated in Iroquoian morphology ...he simply recorded<br>
what he heard often running words together or dividing them in funny places.<br>
But actually,He was complimented by Wyandottes in this area for his good<br>
pronunciation,though teased for his rather feminine voice.<br>
As we have no other record of any outsider given this compliment,<br>
we tend to trust his phonetic chart as a pretty good standard,<br>
and it actually lines up with specific voiced word examples recorded.<br>
We also have a good recording of a Green Corn speech by a Wyandot<br>
from this area,though it's spoken in what's referred to as "Seneca".<br>
<br>
I don't want to discredit what our linguist has contributed !<br>
He is an unpaid hard worker who mostly works in isolation in a distant<br>
state. Unraveling patterns of the morphology is a huge success and we're all<br>
very grateful.<br>
However phoneticly ,he teaches adults a "simplified" pronunciation.<br>
one example:<br>
On his own,He decided to represent EVERY o written as a nasal ö.<br>
but not the original nasal ö as in french "bon" as Barbeau heard,<br>
and as i hear it spoken in longhouse speeches.<br>
He teaches ö as in "known"<br>
which to me is the same o as in "bone"<br>
I hear "bone" and "bon" as two differant "o"
sounds<br>
both important to keep distinct.<br>
<br>
another example:<br>
-Barbeau indicates-nasal ä as in the french "marchand"<br>
our linguist now teaches ä as in "none"<br>
....huh?<br>
but he also decided to drop most of the nasal "ä" anyway<br>
in his own translation work he reduces them to a simple "a"<br>
as in "father" well?...can they do that and still publish?<br>
<br>
It's made me realize we need a team of Wyandotte tribal members to<br>
form a group who can make important decisions so that linguist work is<br>
evaluated, proposals made and decisions can be agreed upon<br>
if he is to have the nations endorsement.<br>
Then he can truthfully write in his upcoming book,<br>
"the present Wyandotte Community prefers..."<br>
<br>
am i just being fussy?<br>
<br>
Richard<br>
Wyandotte Oklahoma</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.5pt;
font-family:Verdana'><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=2
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Verdana'>
<hr size=1 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.5pt;
font-family:Verdana'>Make free worldwide PC-to-PC calls. Try the new <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>Yahoo! Canada Messenger</span></b> <a
href="http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/"><http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/></a>
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>