Pre-Basque Phonology

[Roslyn M. Frank]

At 09:07 AM 10/1/99 +0100, Larry Trask wrote:
[RF]
>> Then on your gloss of "maite" as "beloved", fine. But keep in mind,
>> also that in English it is common for the expression "love" to be
>> used as a form of address for another person, not just a female one,
>> right, Love?

[LT]
>Sure, but why is this relevant?

>Basque <maite>, in its definite form <maitea>, is of course a common way
>of addressing a sweetheart of either sex.  It is literally `(my)
>beloved', even though it is functionally roughly equivalent to English
>`love' here.

Let us agree to disagree about which form is the common used as a form of
address, one with a "definite article" or one without. Clearly we have have
different views about this situation as was demonstrated in the case of our
earlier discussion on whether <beltz> was a proper nickname for a bear,
rather than <beltza>. From your previous comments, you do not wish to
concede that in such circumstance the <mugagabe> unsuffixed form is often
used.

Contrarily, there is no question, as I believe I've said before, that when
translating from French of Spanish Basque speakers will add the "definite
article" to what is the unsuffixed form of the word in the Romance
languages. But that is a different case. In the case of nicknames there are
circumstances in which the suffixed form is common and there are also many
cases where both forms can be encountered.

I think part of our disagreement might be caused by the existence of two
slightly different definitions of what is meant by the words "the common
way of addressing someone." If one calls out to another and addresses the
person with a nickname, that word will not necessarily take what is called
the "definite article." I think you may have cited a couple examples of
this yourself. The problem is complicated further by the fact that the
"distal demonstrative" in Euskera has been appropriated as a "definite
article" but that role is still not identical to that of a "definite
article" in a language such as Spanish or English where, conceptually,
there *are* definite and indefinite articles.

If, on the other hand, one writes a letter, there is clearly the option of
using the "definite article" along with their "nickname" when "addressing"
the person.

Then there are many examples of the numens who populate Basque folklore and
mythology. The (nick)names of many of these beings, e.g., Praka Gorri "Red
Pants", appear without the definite article. However, I might refer to this
same character, when writing in Euskera, in a given sentence as Praka
Gorria. But when I do, I've changed the status of his (nick)name to
something like "The One with Red Pants." It can be done, the "definite
article" can be added, but when it is the name takes on a different nuance
of meaning.

In summary, I don't think one can come up with a hard and fast rule that
covers all the individual cases. And when one turns to the so-called proper
names the waters become even muddier. So, let's just agree to disagree on
this particular point.

Roz

************************************************************************
Roslyn M. Frank
Professor
************************************************************************
Department of Spanish & Portuguese	
University of Iowa
Iowa City, IA 52242
email: <roz-frank at uiowa.edu>
fax: (319)-335-2990