From Ben.Ambridge at liverpool.ac.uk Tue May 3 14:23:36 2011 From: Ben.Ambridge at liverpool.ac.uk (Ambridge, Ben) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 15:23:36 +0100 Subject: Book announcement - Child Language Acquisition Message-ID: Dear all With apologies for the shameless self-promotion, we (Ben Ambridge & Elena Lieven) would like to inform you that our new textbook (Child Language Acquisition: Contrasting Theoretical Approaches, Cambridge University Press) is out now (paperback/hardback/Kindle). As the name implies, our aim in writing the book was to compare the competing theoretical accounts of all the major language-acquisition phenomena, in as even-handed and comprehensive a manner as possible. We therefore hope that this will be a useful textbook for course-leaders of all theoretical persuasions! If you teach a course on language acquisition, why not request a free inspection copy from Cambridge University Press? (links for inspection copies/purchase are below.) Table of Contents 1. Introduction 2. Speech perception, segmentation and production 3. Learning word meanings 4. Theoretical approaches to grammar acquisition 5. Inflection 6. Simple syntax 7. Movement and complex syntax 8. Binding, quantification and control 9. Related debates and conclusions. Summary: Is children's language acquisition based on innate linguistic structures or built from cognitive and communicative skills? This book summarises the major theoretical debates in all of the core domains of child language acquisition research (phonology, word-learning, inflectional morphology, syntax and binding) and includes a complete introduction to the two major contrasting theoretical approaches: generativist and constructivist. For each debate, the predictions of the competing accounts are closely and even-handedly evaluated against the empirical data. The result is an evidence-based review of the central issues in language acquisition research that will constitute a valuable resource for students, teachers, course-builders and researchers alike Cambridge University Press - to request a free inspection copy or purchase (though usually cheaper at Amazon) UK: http://www.cambridge.org/gb/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_GB USA: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_US Elsewhere: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/location/ Amazon UK: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300707811&sr=8-1 USA: http://www.amazon.com/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300708318&sr=8-1 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Chloe.Marshall.1 at city.ac.uk Tue May 3 19:13:41 2011 From: Chloe.Marshall.1 at city.ac.uk (Marshall, Chloe) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 20:13:41 +0100 Subject: Book announcement - Child Language Acquisition In-Reply-To: <0813B54A9D2C494CACBD693C6A2D4D4C147617E636@STAFFMBX2.livad.liv.ac.uk> Message-ID: Hi Ben, I'm reading your book at the moment and am enjoying it very much (and learning a great deal). I've also sent it out for review for the International Journal of Language and Communication Disorders, where I'm one of the book editors, and I'll keep you and Elena updated when the review comes in. Best wishes, Chloe Dr Chloe Marshall, Senior Lecturer in Developmental Psychology and Language Acquisition, and Leverhulme Early Career Fellow, Department of Language and Communication Science, City University London http://www.city.ac.uk/lcs/biographies/cmarshall.html ________________________________ From: Ambridge, Ben [Ben.Ambridge at liverpool.ac.uk] Sent: 03 May 2011 15:23 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: Book announcement - Child Language Acquisition Dear all With apologies for the shameless self-promotion, we (Ben Ambridge & Elena Lieven) would like to inform you that our new textbook (Child Language Acquisition: Contrasting Theoretical Approaches, Cambridge University Press) is out now (paperback/hardback/Kindle). As the name implies, our aim in writing the book was to compare the competing theoretical accounts of all the major language-acquisition phenomena, in as even-handed and comprehensive a manner as possible. We therefore hope that this will be a useful textbook for course-leaders of all theoretical persuasions! If you teach a course on language acquisition, why not request a free inspection copy from Cambridge University Press? (links for inspection copies/purchase are below.) Table of Contents 1. Introduction 2. Speech perception, segmentation and production 3. Learning word meanings 4. Theoretical approaches to grammar acquisition 5. Inflection 6. Simple syntax 7. Movement and complex syntax 8. Binding, quantification and control 9. Related debates and conclusions. Summary: Is children's language acquisition based on innate linguistic structures or built from cognitive and communicative skills? This book summarises the major theoretical debates in all of the core domains of child language acquisition research (phonology, word-learning, inflectional morphology, syntax and binding) and includes a complete introduction to the two major contrasting theoretical approaches: generativist and constructivist. For each debate, the predictions of the competing accounts are closely and even-handedly evaluated against the empirical data. The result is an evidence-based review of the central issues in language acquisition research that will constitute a valuable resource for students, teachers, course-builders and researchers alike Cambridge University Press - to request a free inspection copy or purchase (though usually cheaper at Amazon) UK: http://www.cambridge.org/gb/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_GB USA: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_US Elsewhere: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/location/ Amazon UK: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300707811&sr=8-1 USA: http://www.amazon.com/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300708318&sr=8-1 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tamarmr at gmail.com Sun May 8 17:48:59 2011 From: tamarmr at gmail.com (Tamar & Yves) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 10:48:59 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies Message-ID: Hello all, Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between us) and to a 4th one outside. Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his life. Thanks, Tamar & Yves -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Sun May 8 22:18:13 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 01:48:13 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Does he start babbling or one word in any language? Please stop him exposing to many languages as I experienced you may cause language delay for even four years or more. Let him learn one language and then another one. This may cause your kid language delay. Best, Parisa On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 9:18 PM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From beachjade at gmail.com Mon May 9 00:25:16 2011 From: beachjade at gmail.com (beachjade) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 17:25:16 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves, There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From beachjade at gmail.com Mon May 9 00:56:19 2011 From: beachjade at gmail.com (beachjade) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 17:56:19 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves, There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by the Linguistic Society of America (see below). Finally, I have included a link to a paper by Bialystok. I am hopeful that someone else on the list can speak to your question regarding language exposure at nursery school. With best regards, Margaret Friend http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bpearson at research.umass.edu Mon May 9 01:06:07 2011 From: bpearson at research.umass.edu (Barbara Pearson) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 21:06:07 -0400 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves, I, too, was going to question on what basis the earlier correspondent drew her or his conclusion. I remember hearing it said that "the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'evidence.'" (Perhaps someone can give us the sources of that quote, or a correction.) Meanwhile, I am thrilled to hear that you have choices (!) about which language or languages you can find in nurseries for your boy. In making your decision, you should consider which languages your son will have authentic sustained interactions in. When the need to learn four languages is strong, young children seem to be able to do it, but it gets a little difficult for parents to arrange enough exposure to all four languages at once. There's not one right answer. And the answer you decide on now may be best for now, and you will want to change it later. If you're thinking that your husband may get less opportunity to be with the child, perhaps it make sense to reinforce his mother tongue at the nursery if that is important to him. For work on the emotional aspects of bilingualism, you might look for work by Anna Pavlenko. Best wishes, Barbara Pearson ************************************************ Barbara Zurer Pearson, Ph.D. Research Associate, Depts of Linguistics and Communication Disorders c/o 226 South College University of Massachusetts Amherst Amherst MA 01003 bpearson at research.umass.edu http://www.umass.edu/aae/bp_indexold.htm http://www.zurer.com/pearson/bilingualchild > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your > second question about how early should you expose your child to his > many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my > reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism > in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed > by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves > wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . ************************************************ Barbara Zurer Pearson, Ph.D. Research Associate, Depts of Linguistics and Communication Disorders c/o 226 South College University of Massachusetts Amherst Amherst MA 01003 bpearson at research.umass.edu http://www.umass.edu/aae/bp_indexold.htm http://www.zurer.com/pearson -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 03:11:05 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 06:41:05 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second > question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. > In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the > literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not > a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > >> Hello all, >> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> >> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> >> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> >> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> life. >> >> Thanks, >> Tamar & Yves >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mohinish.s at gmail.com Mon May 9 03:27:50 2011 From: mohinish.s at gmail.com (Mohinish) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 23:27:50 -0400 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at all. Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? Thanks Mohinish On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:09:09 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:09:09 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar, You can find some answers to FAQ by parents to bilingual children at http://www.bi-sli.org/Parents.htm I doubt there is any solid (scientific based) evidence against raising your child multilingual, and hearsay is not a good enough reason. Barbara is right, go by the communicative needs of your child, keep in mind that bilingualism has many advantages and keep an open eye to your child's linguistic development as you would do for any child. Boys are more prone to impairments but there is nothing special about bi/multilingual boys. Best Sharon On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 8:48 PM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:18:35 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:48:35 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <8CD52FF4-5815-4D92-BAA8-547814A6CE23@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Mohinish, Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism might increase autistic symptoms. http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural situation where billions of children are grown up. Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when he starts speaking.* Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: > I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk > factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: > http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be > cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. > > I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories > that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, > but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; > and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES > problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, > e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I > don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at > all. > > Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a > single language early is better than learning multiple languages? > > Thanks > Mohinish > > > > On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental > delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology > suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other > languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>> >>> >>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>> >>> >>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>> >>> >>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>> life. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Tamar & Yves >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:34:20 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:34:20 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . Best Sharon On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Mohinish, > > Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk > factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would > compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although > there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism > might increase autistic symptoms. > > http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html > > > who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. > 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. > 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language > > what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation that > some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural > situation where billions of children are grown up. > > Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one > language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four > languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much > higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* > *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his > first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when > he starts speaking.* > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: > >> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk >> factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >> >> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories >> that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, >> but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; >> and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES >> problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, >> e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I >> don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at >> all. >> >> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a >> single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >> >> Thanks >> Mohinish >> >> >> >> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >> >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >> languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >> >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>> >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>> >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>> >>> >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>> >>> >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>> >>> >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>> >>>> Hello all, >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>> >>>> >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>> >>>> >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>> >>>> >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Tamar & Yves >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:49:29 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 08:19:29 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Sharon, I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web very quickly). Look at this part However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more hair-raising: Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who specializes in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend for surgery and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn languages.* "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a possible riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the benefits of bilingualism in *zero language child*? Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask specialists a question to act based on responses. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting > 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the > mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific > evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . > > Best > > Sharon > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < > pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Mohinish, >> >> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >> might increase autistic symptoms. >> >> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >> >> >> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >> >> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >> situation where billions of children are grown up. >> >> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his >> first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when >> he starts speaking.* >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >> >>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>> risk factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>> >>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories >>> that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, >>> but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; >>> and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES >>> problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, >>> e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I >>> don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at >>> all. >>> >>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning >>> a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>> >>> Thanks >>> Mohinish >>> >>> >>> >>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>> >>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>> >>> Best, >>> Parisa >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>> >>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>> >>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hello all, >>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>>> life. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Parisa Daftarifard >>> Phd Student of TEFL >>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair > The Department of English > Tel: +972 3 5318236 > The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center > Tel: +972 3 5317159 > Bar Ilan University > Ramat Gan, Israel > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:57:45 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:57:45 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, Google is full with hearsay. Even professors might be the source. I am not aware of real science (experimentally based with statistics) that supports your claims. But there are many studies nowadays that argue the other way round. A child who grows in a multilingual environment is not pushed too hard to learn languages. He just grows into it. What is important is balanced rich exposure to each language and listening for the communicative needs of the child. Multilingualism is not a risky situation, it is the way the world is for many children and they grow up O.K. Best wishes Sharon On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:49 AM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Sharon, > > I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web > very quickly). > Look at this part > > > However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more > hair-raising: > > Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who specializes > in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend for surgery > and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn languages.* > > "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. > "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a > speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." > > "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents > tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. > > > Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many > languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. > > *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a possible > riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the benefits of > bilingualism in *zero language child*? > > Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask > specialists a question to act based on responses. > > Best, > Parisa > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < > sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Parisa, >> >> Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting >> 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the >> mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific >> evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . >> >> Best >> >> Sharon >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear Mohinish, >>> >>> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >>> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >>> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >>> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >>> might increase autistic symptoms. >>> >>> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >>> >>> >>> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >>> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >>> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >>> >>> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >>> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >>> situation where billions of children are grown up. >>> >>> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >>> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >>> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >>> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >>> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn >>> his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like >>> when he starts speaking.* >>> >>> Best, >>> Parisa >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >>> >>>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>>> risk factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>>> >>>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories >>>> that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, >>>> but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; >>>> and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES >>>> problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, >>>> e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I >>>> don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at >>>> all. >>>> >>>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning >>>> a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> Mohinish >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>>> >>>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> Parisa >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>>> >>>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>>> >>>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hello all, >>>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>>>> life. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Parisa Daftarifard >>> Phd Student of TEFL >>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >> The Department of English >> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >> Bar Ilan University >> Ramat Gan, Israel >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eclark at stanford.edu Mon May 9 05:12:59 2011 From: eclark at stanford.edu (Eve V. Clark) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 22:12:59 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The actual STUDIES of young children learning two or more languages in general show no adverse effects of doing this. In some situations, bilingual children fare better than monolinguals of the same age (e.g., in language awareness tasks). Otherwise, all other things being equal, they thrive. There's has long been a myth in some circles in the US than bilingualism is bad: this seems to be based on xenophobic reactions to immigrants on the one hand, and to the testing of immigrant children at the beginning of the school year (i.e., before they had had a chance to learn any English) and then concluding the children were 'retarded in development'. Since most of the world is bilingual or multilingual, this conclusion seems (and seemed then) rather misguided. Nowadays it is often tinged by social class: being bilingual is a good thing for middle-class children, but some people view bilingualism as a bad thing for lower-class children.... This seems a bit perverse. I am sorry to see some of these old attitudes still flourishing, and being backed by dubious citations from the web. (Anecdotes are never data.) If there were any reputable studies showing ill-effects, fair enough: we could sit down and evaluate the studies, against all the other studies around. But I don't know of any of such studies in the literature on child bilingualism. I would always advocate a bilingual upbringing if it's feasible, provided the parents are comfortable with it. Their attitudes are critical. Being bilingual is a boon socially and educationally. And it could even contribute to the policies and welfare of the US in the global economy. Eve Clark On May 8, 2011, at 9:18 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Mohinish, > > Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism might increase autistic symptoms. > > http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html > > > who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. > 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. > 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language > > what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural situation where billions of children are grown up. > > Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much higher statistically?) boy in future and maybe not! > As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when he starts speaking. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: > I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. > > I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at all. > > Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? > > Thanks > Mohinish > > > > On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> Hello all, >> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> >> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> >> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> >> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> life. >> >> Thanks, >> Tamar & Yves >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 05:17:41 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 08:47:41 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Sharon, Thank you for your comments. Very interesting... Question: *So based on the paper you are talking about you suggest that parents expose their kids with many languages when they are zero language?* . Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:27 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > Google is full with hearsay. Even professors might be the source. I am not > aware of real science (experimentally based with statistics) that supports > your claims. But there are many studies nowadays that argue the other way > round. > A child who grows in a multilingual environment is not pushed too hard to > learn languages. He just grows into it. What is important is balanced rich > exposure to each language and listening for the communicative needs of the > child. > > Multilingualism is not a risky situation, it is the way the world is for > many children and they grow up O.K. > > Best wishes > > Sharon > > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:49 AM, parisa Daftarifard > wrote: > >> Dear Sharon, >> >> I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web >> very quickly). >> Look at this part >> >> >> However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more >> hair-raising: >> >> Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who specializes >> in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend for surgery >> and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn languages.* >> >> "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. >> "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a >> speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." >> >> "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents >> tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. >> >> >> Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many >> languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. >> >> *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a >> possible riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the >> benefits of bilingualism in *zero language child*? >> >> Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask >> specialists a question to act based on responses. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < >> sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear Parisa, >>> >>> Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting >>> 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the >>> mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific >>> evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . >>> >>> Best >>> >>> Sharon >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >>> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Mohinish, >>>> >>>> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >>>> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >>>> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >>>> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >>>> might increase autistic symptoms. >>>> >>>> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >>>> >>>> >>>> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >>>> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >>>> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >>>> >>>> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >>>> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >>>> situation where billions of children are grown up. >>>> >>>> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >>>> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >>>> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >>>> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >>>> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn >>>> his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like >>>> when he starts speaking.* >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> Parisa >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >>>> >>>>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>>>> risk factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>>>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>>>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>>>> >>>>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental >>>>> trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include >>>>> language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of >>>>> these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that >>>>> language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be >>>>> substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start >>>>> speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' >>>>> 'delays' count as pathological at all. >>>>> >>>>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that >>>>> learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> Mohinish >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>>>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>>>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>>>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>>>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> Parisa >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>>>> >>>>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all, >>>>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English >>>>>>> between >>>>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of >>>>>>> his >>>>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to >>>>>>> those >>>>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>>>>> life. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >>> The Department of English >>> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >>> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >>> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >>> Bar Ilan University >>> Ramat Gan, Israel >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair > The Department of English > Tel: +972 3 5318236 > The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center > Tel: +972 3 5317159 > Bar Ilan University > Ramat Gan, Israel > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From e_schlag at hotmail.com Mon May 9 05:20:27 2011 From: e_schlag at hotmail.com (Edith Maria Schlag) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:20:27 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, just to add a personal experience (in full awareness that it is in no way representative): My son grew up under similar conditions: he was exposed to 3 languages at home (my husband (1), me (2) and English (3) as the language between my husband and me) and one (4) at the nursery from 10 months onwards. He only spoke and understood those languages he was addressed by (French, German, Dutch), he seemed not to pick up English which he heard from the conversation between my husband and me. Dutch ended up being the dominant language (the language of the environment). By the time my son was almost 4, we moved away from the Netherlands. After about 4 months of no exposure to Dutch, he no longer understood nor spoke the language. That was a surprise. Multilingualism is quite dynamic as it seems. He is 6,7 years old now and he speaks French, German and English. He learned English at school from 4 years onwards which he picked up quickly (possibly because of exposure at home). There weren't any problems in respect to social-emotional development. I am surprised that autism is mentioned as a risk factor. He also has no problems at school, on the contrary. Just to give one example where exposure to 4 languages, at least in the first 4 years, were no problem. Best wishes, Edith Edith Schlag, MSc, MPhil Abu Dhabi United Arab Emirates Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 06:41:05 +0330 Subject: Re: a question about multilingual babies From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: Dear Tamar and Yves, There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: Hello all, Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between us) and to a 4th one outside. Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his life. Thanks, Tamar & Yves -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 05:29:55 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 08:29:55 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, Based on all the current scientific work I say there is no harm in exposing your child to more than one language if it is in line with her communicative needs. For children who grow into a multilingual environment it is the most natural thing, and parents make their choices re language policy just as they make it for any other decisions they take in child rearing. Best wishes Sharon On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:17 AM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Sharon, > > Thank you for your comments. Very interesting... > Question: > *So based on the paper you are talking about you suggest that parents > expose their kids with many languages when they are zero language?* > > . > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:27 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < > sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Parisa, >> >> Google is full with hearsay. Even professors might be the source. I am not >> aware of real science (experimentally based with statistics) that supports >> your claims. But there are many studies nowadays that argue the other way >> round. >> A child who grows in a multilingual environment is not pushed too hard to >> learn languages. He just grows into it. What is important is balanced rich >> exposure to each language and listening for the communicative needs of the >> child. >> >> Multilingualism is not a risky situation, it is the way the world is for >> many children and they grow up O.K. >> >> Best wishes >> >> Sharon >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:49 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear Sharon, >>> >>> I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web >>> very quickly). >>> Look at this part >>> >>> >>> However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more >>> hair-raising: >>> >>> Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who >>> specializes in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend >>> for surgery and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn >>> languages.* >>> >>> "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. >>> "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a >>> speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." >>> >>> "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents >>> tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. >>> >>> >>> Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many >>> languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. >>> >>> *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a >>> possible riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the >>> benefits of bilingualism in *zero language child*? >>> >>> Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask >>> specialists a question to act based on responses. >>> >>> Best, >>> Parisa >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < >>> sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Parisa, >>>> >>>> Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting >>>> 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the >>>> mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific >>>> evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . >>>> >>>> Best >>>> >>>> Sharon >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >>>> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear Mohinish, >>>>> >>>>> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >>>>> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >>>>> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >>>>> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >>>>> might increase autistic symptoms. >>>>> >>>>> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >>>>> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >>>>> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >>>>> >>>>> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >>>>> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >>>>> situation where billions of children are grown up. >>>>> >>>>> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >>>>> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >>>>> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >>>>> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >>>>> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn >>>>> his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like >>>>> when he starts speaking.* >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> Parisa >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>>>>> risk factor. In fact Kovács & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>>>>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>>>>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>>>>> >>>>>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental >>>>>> trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include >>>>>> language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of >>>>>> these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that >>>>>> language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be >>>>>> substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start >>>>>> speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' >>>>>> 'delays' count as pathological at all. >>>>>> >>>>>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that >>>>>> learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> Mohinish >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>>>>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>>>>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>>>>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>>>>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> Parisa >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>>>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>>>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>>>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>>>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello all, >>>>>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English >>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what >>>>>>>> language >>>>>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of >>>>>>>> his >>>>>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on >>>>>>>> him, >>>>>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, >>>>>>>> but >>>>>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to >>>>>>>> those >>>>>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of >>>>>>>> his >>>>>>>> life. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >>>> The Department of English >>>> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >>>> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >>>> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >>>> Bar Ilan University >>>> Ramat Gan, Israel >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Parisa Daftarifard >>> Phd Student of TEFL >>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >> The Department of English >> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >> Bar Ilan University >> Ramat Gan, Israel >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com Mon May 9 07:05:59 2011 From: aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com (Aliyah MORGENSTERN) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 09:05:59 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) and write a lot of papers... So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your time and don't follow ONE advice. Best, Aliyah from Paris Le 9 mai 2011 à 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a écrit : > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 08:21:05 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 11:51:05 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <3DA5977E-3388-4B3D-8310-83D1D2939C47@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Aliyah, Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is *not being bilingual* (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is *about early bilingualism*. *Many early bilingualism* (for example the one Edith explained) one language is *dominant* and functional. I think we need research to see if multilingual *interaction from zero (one month forward)* would exist very much or not. Usually one language is functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish or Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all of them because I have no research at hand), through my individual questioning parents, are interacted in one language first and the second language is not dominant or interactional in early stages. *from educational perspective*, bilingualism brings many chances but when we approach the issue from the *clinical perspective* we need to *be very cautious about claims* and result of research. Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. If we expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more than one language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some times they show aggressive behavior. Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we are not sure that this kid is completely OK. Best, Parisa Daftarifard On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN < aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > > 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of > us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in > saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember > most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) > and write a lot of papers... > So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their > children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. > I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your > time and don't follow ONE advice. > Best, > Aliyah from Paris > > Le 9 mai 2011 à 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a écrit : > > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental > delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology > suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other > languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>> >>> >>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>> >>> >>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>> >>> >>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>> life. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Tamar & Yves >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.h.dos.santos at gmail.com Mon May 9 08:36:22 2011 From: christophe.h.dos.santos at gmail.com (Christophe dos Santos) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 10:36:22 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, I have read a lot of papers recently that seems to show that Autism is strongly based on genetic origin (not only one gene but a pool of genetic alterations can cause autism). It is not clear however how environment can trigger autism but environment seems not to be the origin of this "impairment". A general article about autism (but a simple search will give you a lot more information about genetic issues linked with autism) : http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/autism-and-genetics-a-breakthrough-that-sheds-light-on-a-medical-mystery-1996221.html Best, Christophe dos Santos Université François Rabelais, Tours 2011/5/9 parisa Daftarifard : > Dear Aliyah, > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is not being > bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is > about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the one Edith > explained) one language is dominant and functional. > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from zero (one > month forward) would exist very much or not. Usually one language is > functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish or > Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all of > them because I have no research at hand), through my individual questioning > parents, are interacted in one language first and the second language is not > dominant or interactional in early stages. > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but when we > approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be very cautious > about claims and result of research. > > Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. If we > expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more than one > language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic > bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at > the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive > language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with > language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some times > they show aggressive behavior. > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about > purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we are > not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN > wrote: >> >> Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, >> 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of >> us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in >> saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember >> most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) >> and write a lot of papers... >> So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their >> children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. >> I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your >> time and don't follow ONE advice. >> Best, >> Aliyah from Paris >> Le 9 mai 2011 à 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a écrit : >> >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >> languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>> >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>> languages.  In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>> not a risk factor in development.  This is echoed by >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>> >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>> >>>> Hello all, >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>> >>>> >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>> >>>> >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>> >>>> >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Tamar & Yves >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 09:04:35 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 12:34:35 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Christophe, Thank you so much for your reply. As you stated "how environment can trigger autism but environment seems not to be the origin of this "impairment" seems not but no research proves this. Some say *Genetics*, some say *Genetics + environment, some other says Vaccine, Some say environment*. I have recently read an article that state *all of us can be placed on this spectrum one way or another* but with low percentage. You know there is no agreement yet on whether Science is Fact or Hypothesis. As researchers, we cannot give advice to risk kids' health even if we have enough evidence that there are many bilingual kids that are healthy. What is agreed here is that early bilingualism would lead to *language delay * (either expressive or comprehension) and this could be dangerous for a possible autistic child. and we will not learn some autistic symptoms until *ages of two or even five and even ten*. In science we are working with *probability*. No one can here claim that all ideas stated early in this list are true for 100% and when it *comes to health* (mentally and cognitively) we are even cautious with even minimum percents (saying 10 % percent). Of course, by saying these I mean to be of help not ignoring some probable facts. Best regards, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 12:06 PM, Christophe dos Santos < christophe.h.dos.santos at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > I have read a lot of papers recently that seems to show that Autism is > strongly based on genetic origin (not only one gene but a pool of > genetic alterations can cause autism). > It is not clear however ". > > A general article about autism (but a simple search will give you a > lot more information about genetic issues linked with autism) : > > http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/autism-and-genetics-a-breakthrough-that-sheds-light-on-a-medical-mystery-1996221.html > > Best, > > Christophe dos Santos > Université François Rabelais, Tours > > 2011/5/9 parisa Daftarifard : > > Dear Aliyah, > > > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is not > being > > bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is > > about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the one > Edith > > explained) one language is dominant and functional. > > > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from zero > (one > > month forward) would exist very much or not. Usually one language is > > functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish > or > > Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all > of > > them because I have no research at hand), through my individual > questioning > > parents, are interacted in one language first and the second language is > not > > dominant or interactional in early stages. > > > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but when > we > > approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be very > cautious > > about claims and result of research. > > > > Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. > If we > > expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more than one > > language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic > > bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. > > > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at > > the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive > > language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with > > language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some > times > > they show aggressive behavior. > > > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about > > purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we > are > > not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > > > Best, > > Parisa Daftarifard > > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN > > wrote: > >> > >> Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > >> 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some > of > >> us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick > in > >> saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And > remember > >> most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French > speakers) > >> and write a lot of papers... > >> So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with > their > >> children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. > >> I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take > your > >> time and don't follow ONE advice. > >> Best, > >> Aliyah from Paris > >> Le 9 mai 2011 à 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a écrit : > >> > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, > developmental > >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology > >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other > >> languages. I can send you some books off list. > >> > >> Best, > >> Parisa > >> > >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > >>> > >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, > >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your > >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his > many > >>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading > of > >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of > itself is > >>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > >>> > >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Hello all, > >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > >>>> life. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> Tamar & Yves > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>>> For more options, visit this group at > >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>> For more options, visit this group at > >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "Info-CHILDES" group. > > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marilyn.vihman at york.ac.uk Mon May 9 09:33:47 2011 From: marilyn.vihman at york.ac.uk (marilyn vihman) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 12:33:47 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Just to add a word to this discussion: There is certainly no evidence that bilingualism in early childhood leads to real language delay - although the vocabulary size of bilingual children tends to be smaller in each language, while still being larger if the two are put together (see studies by Barbara Pearson, inter alia). How could we possibly demonstrate that bilingualism leads to delay? Each child is different in rate of language learning; there is no way to know whether a child exposed to two languages would have learned more quickly if exposed to only one - but since bilingual children often have vocabularies of a very respectable size by age two (500 words or more in production, with a correspondingly good start on producing combinations), there is definitely no overall tendency for language delay - based on the many case studies published to date. The question of the best advice for a multilingual family whose child IS seriously delayed (by which I mean very few words as late as 2.5 years and no word combinations) is something else again: I think the experts are divided on this one, but common sense suggests that consistent home use of just one language may be helpful for a child who happens to have difficulty with language learning. One small bit of anecdotal evidence: I have just met the family of a child exposed to three languages from the start (English as the interparental language, Estonian from the mother and Spanish from the father), who had a number of clearly identifiable words at 9 months - which is remarkably early for any child, monolingual or not. This single example is enough to illustrate at least that real precocity in lang. dev. is not incompatible with multiple-language exposure. (Should we believe that this child was 'delayed' and would have had 10-20 words already at age 7-8 mos? I know of no reason to think so!) -marilyn vihman On 9 May 2011, at 12:04, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Christophe, > Thank you so much for your reply. As you stated "how environment can > trigger autism but > environment seems not to be the origin of this "impairment" seems > not but no research proves this. Some say Genetics, some say > Genetics + environment, some other says Vaccine, Some say > environment. I have recently read an article that state all of us > can be placed on this spectrum one way or another but with low > percentage. You know there is no agreement yet on whether Science is > Fact or Hypothesis. > > As researchers, we cannot give advice to risk kids' health even if > we have enough evidence that there are many bilingual kids that are > healthy. > > What is agreed here is that early bilingualism would lead to > language delay (either expressive or comprehension) and this could > be dangerous for a possible autistic child. and we will not learn > some autistic symptoms until ages of two or even five and even ten. > > In science we are working with probability. No one can here claim > that all ideas stated early in this list are true for 100% and when > it comes to health (mentally and cognitively) we are even cautious > with even minimum percents (saying 10 % percent). > Of course, by saying these I mean to be of help not ignoring some > probable facts. > > Best regards, > Parisa > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 12:06 PM, Christophe dos Santos > wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > I have read a lot of papers recently that seems to show that Autism is > strongly based on genetic origin (not only one gene but a pool of > genetic alterations can cause autism). > It is not clear however ". > > A general article about autism (but a simple search will give you a > lot more information about genetic issues linked with autism) : > http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/autism-and-genetics-a-breakthrough-that-sheds-light-on-a-medical-mystery-1996221.html > > Best, > > Christophe dos Santos > Université François Rabelais, Tours > > 2011/5/9 parisa Daftarifard : > > Dear Aliyah, > > > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is > not being > > bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) > but is > > about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the > one Edith > > explained) one language is dominant and functional. > > > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from > zero (one > > month forward) would exist very much or not. Usually one language is > > functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. > Turkish or > > Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say > not all of > > them because I have no research at hand), through my individual > questioning > > parents, are interacted in one language first and the second > language is not > > dominant or interactional in early stages. > > > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but > when we > > approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be > very cautious > > about claims and result of research. > > > > Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age > two. If we > > expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more > than one > > language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of > autistic > > bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. > > > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start > speaking at > > the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. > expressive > > language is very important to mental health. I have seen those > kids with > > language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves > some times > > they show aggressive behavior. > > > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about > > purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language > while we are > > not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > > > Best, > > Parisa Daftarifard > > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN > > wrote: > >> > >> Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > >> 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and > some of > >> us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be > so quick in > >> saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. > And remember > >> most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French > speakers) > >> and write a lot of papers... > >> So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do > with their > >> children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural > society. > >> I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE > take your > >> time and don't follow ONE advice. > >> Best, > >> Aliyah from Paris > >> Le 9 mai 2011 à 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a écrit : > >> > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, > developmental > >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent > psychology > >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed > to other > >> languages. I can send you some books off list. > >> > >> Best, > >> Parisa > >> > >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade > wrote: > >>> > >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, > >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to > your > >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to > his many > >>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my > reading of > >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an > of itself is > >>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > >>> > >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Hello all, > >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each > one of > >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English > between > >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what > language > >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to > all 4 > >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years > of his > >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English) > (4)) > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden > on him, > >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the > answer, but > >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific > issues > >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication > on > >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby > to those > >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years > of his > >>>> life. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> Tamar & Yves > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the > Google > >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com > . > >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>>> For more options, visit this group at > >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the > Google Groups > >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>> To post to this group, send email to info- > childes at googlegroups.com. > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>> For more options, visit this group at > >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > "Info-CHILDES" group. > > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . Marilyn M. Vihman Professor, Language and Linguistic Science V/C/210, 2nd Floor, Block C, Vanbrugh College University of York Heslington York YO10 5DD tel 01904 433612 fax 01904 432673 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tamarmr at gmail.com Mon May 9 10:18:59 2011 From: tamarmr at gmail.com (Tamar & Yves) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 03:18:59 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear beachjade, Thanks for the referals. In our case, multiligualism is a necessity, so what's left is to find out how to supprt our son's acuisition of those 4 languages more easily. This is why we find your referal to studies on the psychological aspects of it so helpful. Thanks again, Tamar & Yves On 9 מאי, 02:25, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second > question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. >  In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the > literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not > a risk factor in development.  This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > > > > > Hello all, > > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > > life. > > > Thanks, > > Tamar & Yves > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "Info-CHILDES" group. > > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en.-הסתר טקסט מצוטט- > > -הראה טקסט מצוטט- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu Mon May 9 10:58:20 2011 From: natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu (Natalia Rakhlin) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 06:58:20 -0400 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, The alleged link between vaccines and autism has been thoroughly investigated by high-quality peer-reviewed studies on thousands of children in a number of different countries, which found no evidence of any such link. A good review of these studies (with citations) is in a recent article in Current Opinion in Pediatrics (Landrigan, P. J. (2010). What causes autism? Exploring the environmental contribution; Current Opinion in Pediatrics, 22(2), pp. 219-225). Although we do not know yet what causes autism (genetic factors, yes - but these alone are not sufficient to explain it in totality), we do know pretty definitively that vaccines or parenting style do not cause autism. Lancet famously retracted the 12-year-old article that claimed to have found a vaccination-autism link because the data in it were fabricated. The article I mentioned reviews the genetics studies of autism and probes other potential environmental causes, which all involve very early (prenatal) exposure to neurotoxins, such as lead, methylmercury, DDT, etc., whose effects on humans have not been studied well enough, but which plausibly may cause injury to developing brain. Like others who responded to this query, I am not aware of any study that suggested that early exposure to multiple languages is linked to autism. Sincerely, Natalia Natalia Rakhlin Child Study Center Yale University 230 South Frontage Road New Haven, CT 06519-1124 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From arieh.sherris at gmail.com Mon May 9 13:20:36 2011 From: arieh.sherris at gmail.com (Ari Sherris) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 16:20:36 +0300 Subject: CAL Digest on myths related to raising bilingual children Message-ID: The Center for Applied Linguistics (Washington, DC) has a CAL Digest (2006) on myths related to raising bilingual children that was written by two Georgetown Researcher. The digest is in English and Spanish at http://www.cal.org/resources/digest/raising-bilingual-children.html -- Arieh (Ari) Sherris, PhD King Abdullah University of Science and Technology Building 18, Room 3238 Kingldom of Saudi Arabia My Google pages: https://sites.google.com/site/arisherris/ Website: http://www.kaust.edu.sa Recent publications for language teachers: Sherris (2010). Coaching Language Teachers. http://www.cal.org/resources/digest/coachinglangteachers.html Sherris (2008) Integrated Content and Language Instruction. http://www.cal.org/resources/digest/integratedcontent.html Sherris, A., Bauder, T., Hillyard, L. (2007). An Insider's Guide to SIOP Coaching. http://calstore.cal.org/store/detail.aspx?ID=337 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com Mon May 9 13:30:43 2011 From: aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com (Aliyah MORGENSTERN) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 15:30:43 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, There is a lot of literature on "healthy" early bilingualism, I won't quote all my famous friends and colleagues, all specialists know them. As Tamar and Yves have just written, in their case, early trilingualism is a NECESSITY, as is bilingualism for millions of children whose parents speak different native languages. I believe health is extremely important, but what do you call health? Do you think Tunisian mothers married to French fathers who don't speak French at all when they arrive in France should NOT SPEAK to their child at all? I wouldn't have communicated with my American mother who arrived in France (with my father and myself) when I was three months old if she had not spoken English to me. The relational/affective implications are as important as the health implications you are mentioning. I am particularly sensitive to this issue since in France, the Senate issued a document a few years ago telling teachers to influence "foreign" parents to speak FRENCH to their children at home so that the children wouldn't be "delayed". It could be a real tragedy when parents speak very poor French (and even if they have a good command of their second language, shouldn't they speak their native language to their own children?) , and the implications for deaf children who are prevented from being bilingual and learning a sign language are serious. So, even though I am absolutely not a specialist of the clinical dimension, I think one should take all the risks into account, including risks of not creating a healthy relationship with your own parent, or the risk of not having any command of language at all (deaf children for example). Best regards, Aliyah Le 9 mai 2011 à 10:21, parisa Daftarifard a écrit : > Dear Aliyah, > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is not being bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the one Edith explained) one language is dominant and functional. > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from zero (one month forward) would exist very much or not. Usually one language is functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish or Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all of them because I have no research at hand), through my individual questioning parents, are interacted in one language first and the second language is not dominant or interactional in early stages. > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but when we approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be very cautious about claims and result of research. > > Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. If we expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more than one language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some times they show aggressive behavior. > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we are not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN wrote: > Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > > 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) and write a lot of papers... > So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. > I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your time and don't follow ONE advice. > Best, > Aliyah from Paris > > Le 9 mai 2011 à 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a écrit : > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> Hello all, >> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> >> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> >> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> >> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> life. >> >> Thanks, >> Tamar & Yves >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hkasuya at gmail.com Mon May 9 14:10:30 2011 From: hkasuya at gmail.com (Hiroko Kasuya) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 23:10:30 +0900 Subject: JSLS2011 Call for Participation Message-ID: Call for Participation in the 13th Annual International Conference of the Japanese Society for Language Sciences (JSLS2011) The annual conference of the Japanese Society for Language Sciences will be held on June 25 and 26, 2011, at Kansai University in Osaka. Dr. Niko Besnier of the University of Amsterdam and Dr. Yasuhiro Katagiri of Future University Hakodate will deliver a plenary lecture. In addition, there will be a symposium, conducted in English, entitled "Reconsidering communicative competence: Findings and suggestions from fieldwork/empirical research" by Dr. Zane Goebel (LaTrobe University) , Dr. Akira Takada (Kyoto University), and Dr. Misao Okada (Hokusei Gakuen University). The deadline for pre-registration has already started. The deadline is June 1 (Wednesday) for presenters, and June 12th for general participation. For more information, please visit the conference website: http://www.jslsweb.sakura.ne.jp/jsls2011/wiki.cgi (Please note that the call for papers has closed.) Inquiries may be sent to the conference chair, Keiko IKEDA: keikoike at ipcku.kansai-u.ac.jp -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From miquel.serra at ub.edu Mon May 9 15:20:22 2011 From: miquel.serra at ub.edu (Miquel Serra) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 17:20:22 +0200 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <5E4B6534-8E49-4001-B50E-D98E66B2CEFE@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Parisa Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a desire of parents or politicians (and academics). Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional and has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant language. Miquel Serra U Barcelona, Catalonia -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 17:06:13 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 20:36:13 +0330 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <4DC80636.5040203@ub.edu> Message-ID: Dear Miquel and all, I understand that the concept is very important to you and many parents and sometimes a must in certain situation. I guess what I explained creates a little bit misunderstanding. What I said was that 1. Some children are at risk of many problems which leads to language delay (these problems would not show themselves very early) 2. We are not sure that who are those children 3. early simultaneous bilingualism might compound the situation for these kids for unknown reasons 4. Expressive and fluent and creative language development in many instances of bilingualism (based on experiences and papers) would requires more time than usual kids unless one language is dominant and functional and the other just environmental. what I have seen is based on clinical study. although we do not have many reports on language delay and bilingualism or autism, we cannot ignore some instances we see around. We are facing with *an innocent child* who is supposed to learn *an instrument* through which he develops his cognition, ways of expression, feeling and many other things. Some children, for unknown reasons, have language delay. many bilinguals (most of them) will start speaking fluently and creatively later than their own age. Some of the children have autistic signs and many language and cognitive impairments. Who can say any formula for these situations? All are mystery to us What I am suggesting is that we as parents should create the situation for the kid so that he learns one language functionally first and then moves to another language. You may disagree! And I agree to disagree... I have seen many bilinguals who *have problems* and their parents became concerned about their problems. because of the same situation you explained: mother was Iranian, Father English speaker, country Arab. The kid didn't speak at the age of three! What the doctor suggested was to stop speaking other languages but one that is mostly dominant. Let's say that the kid has other factors as well.... How would you claim that you can distinguish these kids from the rest when they are one month?! I hope I express my meaning. I have seen many instances like this. My son was exposed to English through TV and my interaction, his environment and father's interaction was Persian. His language development is very slow, even we thought that he might have had serious problems. I stopped English. Many instances like these exist that have not developed into papers. finding no paper about similar situation in an ISI journal cannot stop a researcher to ignore many other instances that assure the risk. When it comes to *clinical situation*, we decide based on few instances. I hope more research to be done regarding the benefits of bilingualism on true early bilingualism or simultaneous bilingualism which would clearly explain what the situation is. It would be great if we can learn about ideas of other specialists as well like psychologists, cognitive psychologists, those who are working with problematic children. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:50 PM, Miquel Serra wrote: > Dear Parisa > Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) > adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a desire > of parents or politicians (and academics). > Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project > depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional and > has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the > children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant language. > Miquel Serra > U Barcelona, Catalonia > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From elenan at ualberta.ca Mon May 9 17:17:04 2011 From: elenan at ualberta.ca (Elena Nicoladis) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 11:17:04 -0600 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear colleagues, On the question of autism, keeping in mind Eve Clark's point that anecdotes are never data, we have some videotaped observations of three children with autism who were exposed to two languages (two French & English, one Tagalog & English). They varied considerably in terms of how much they could use language. The highest functioning child could use both languages fluently and even to tell stories, the lowest functioning child simply repeated words on occasion (in both French and English) and the third child was somewhere in the middle, but using both languages approximately equally well. All of these children had fairly equal exposure to both languages. Keeping in mind that we have no comparison to typically developing children, were these results generalizable to a larger population, they would suggest that autism affects language(s) at some sort of constant rate. So, bilingualism would not be seen as a "burden" on children with autism. Adults count languages and often assume that the higher the number to be acquired, the harder the task. I'm not convinced that children count languages-- they seem to be learning appropriate behaviour for contexts in which they regularly find themselves. Language choice is part of appropriate behaviour for a context. Elena Quoting "parisa Daftarifard" : > Dear Miquel and all, > > I understand that the concept is very important to you and many parents and > sometimes a must in certain situation. I guess what I explained creates a > little bit misunderstanding. > > What I said was that > 1. Some children are at risk of many problems which leads to language delay > (these problems would not show themselves very early) > 2. We are not sure that who are those children > 3. early simultaneous bilingualism might compound the situation for these > kids for unknown reasons > 4. Expressive and fluent and creative language development in many > instances of bilingualism (based on experiences and papers) would requires > more time than usual kids unless one language is dominant and functional and > the other just environmental. > > what I have seen is based on clinical study. although we do not have many > reports on language delay and bilingualism or autism, we cannot ignore some > instances we see around. > > We are facing with *an innocent child* who is supposed to learn *an > instrument* through which he develops his cognition, ways of expression, > feeling and many other things. Some children, for unknown reasons, have > language delay. many bilinguals (most of them) will start speaking fluently > and creatively later than their own age. Some of the children have autistic > signs and many language and cognitive impairments. Who can say any formula > for these situations? All are mystery to us > > What I am suggesting is that we as parents should create the situation for > the kid so that he learns one language functionally first and then moves to > another language. You may disagree! And I agree to disagree... > > I have seen many bilinguals who *have problems* and their parents became > concerned about their problems. because of the same situation you > explained: mother was Iranian, Father English speaker, country Arab. The kid > didn't speak at the age of three! What the doctor suggested was to stop > speaking other languages but one that is mostly dominant. Let's say that the > kid has other factors as well.... How would you claim that you can > distinguish these kids from the rest when they are one month?! I hope I > express my meaning. > > I have seen many instances like this. My son was exposed to English through > TV and my interaction, his environment and father's interaction was Persian. > His language development is very slow, even we thought that he might have > had serious problems. I stopped English. Many instances like these exist > that have not developed into papers. finding no paper about similar > situation in an ISI journal cannot stop a researcher to ignore many other > instances that assure the risk. > > When it comes to *clinical situation*, we decide based on few instances. I > hope more research to be done regarding the benefits of bilingualism on true > early bilingualism or simultaneous bilingualism which would clearly explain > what the situation is. > > It would be great if we can learn about ideas of other specialists as well > like psychologists, cognitive psychologists, those who are working with > problematic children. > > > Best, > Parisa > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:50 PM, Miquel Serra wrote: > >> Dear Parisa >> Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) >> adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a desire >> of parents or politicians (and academics). >> Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project >> depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional and >> has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the >> children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant language. >> Miquel Serra >> U Barcelona, Catalonia >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > *************************************** Elena Nicoladis, PhD Department of Psychology University of Alberta P2-17 Biological Sciences Bdg. Edmonton AB T6G 2E9 CANADA "Since all the sciences, and especially psychology, are still immersed in such tremendous realms of the uncertain and the unknown, the best that any individual scientist, especially any psychologist, can do seems to be to follow his own gleam and his own bent, however inadequate they may be. In the end, the only sure criterion is to have fun." E. C. Tolman, 1959 *************************************** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From barriere.isa at gmail.com Mon May 9 18:07:52 2011 From: barriere.isa at gmail.com (isa barriere) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:07:52 -0400 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <20110509111704.193181hulkijjm34@webmail.ualberta.ca> Message-ID: Dear all, Just an addendum to Elena's message. I will not repeat the points made by my expert colleaguges, re: multilingualism not being a risk in itself. With respect to Autism Spectrum Disorders, there is a very interesting article (and thesis) by Kremer-Sadlik (see reference below). It cleraly shows that depriving children with ASD of multilingualism when they have to function in a multilingual social context is actually detrimental in that it increases their social isolation etc. Kremer-Sadlik, T. (2005) To Be or Not to Be Bilingual: Autistic Children from Multilingual Families. Cohen, K.T.McAlister, K. Rolstad & J. MacSwan (Eds.) ISB4: Proceedings of the *4th International **Symposium on Bilingualism. * With respect to ther sources of langauge delays, there has been many publications on a) the fact that bilingualism does not cause SLI and that SLI children benefit from bilingualism (Sharon's work, Paradis'work etc) and b) a few studies re: the fact that bilingualism has no detrimental effect on children with Down Syndrome etc (by Trudeau etc)... Best, Isabelle Barriere, PhD On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 1:17 PM, Elena Nicoladis wrote: > Dear colleagues, > On the question of autism, keeping in mind Eve Clark's point that anecdotes > are never data, we have some videotaped observations of three children with > autism who were exposed to two languages (two French & English, one Tagalog > & English). They varied considerably in terms of how much they could use > language. The highest functioning child could use both languages fluently > and even to tell stories, the lowest functioning child simply repeated words > on occasion (in both French and English) and the third child was somewhere > in the middle, but using both languages approximately equally well. All of > these > children had fairly equal exposure to both languages. > > Keeping in mind that we have no comparison to typically developing > children, were these results generalizable to a larger population, they > would suggest that autism affects language(s) at some sort of constant rate. > So, bilingualism would not be seen as a "burden" on children with autism. > > Adults count languages and often assume that the higher the number to be > acquired, the harder the task. I'm not convinced that children count > languages-- they seem to be learning appropriate behaviour for contexts in > which they regularly find themselves. Language choice is part of appropriate > behaviour for a context. > > Elena > > > Quoting "parisa Daftarifard" : > > Dear Miquel and all, >> >> I understand that the concept is very important to you and many parents >> and >> sometimes a must in certain situation. I guess what I explained creates a >> little bit misunderstanding. >> >> What I said was that >> 1. Some children are at risk of many problems which leads to language >> delay >> (these problems would not show themselves very early) >> 2. We are not sure that who are those children >> 3. early simultaneous bilingualism might compound the situation for these >> kids for unknown reasons >> 4. Expressive and fluent and creative language development in many >> instances of bilingualism (based on experiences and papers) would requires >> more time than usual kids unless one language is dominant and functional >> and >> the other just environmental. >> >> what I have seen is based on clinical study. although we do not have many >> reports on language delay and bilingualism or autism, we cannot ignore >> some >> instances we see around. >> >> We are facing with *an innocent child* who is supposed to learn *an >> instrument* through which he develops his cognition, ways of expression, >> feeling and many other things. Some children, for unknown reasons, have >> language delay. many bilinguals (most of them) will start speaking >> fluently >> and creatively later than their own age. Some of the children have >> autistic >> signs and many language and cognitive impairments. Who can say any formula >> for these situations? All are mystery to us >> >> What I am suggesting is that we as parents should create the situation for >> the kid so that he learns one language functionally first and then moves >> to >> another language. You may disagree! And I agree to disagree... >> >> I have seen many bilinguals who *have problems* and their parents became >> concerned about their problems. because of the same situation you >> explained: mother was Iranian, Father English speaker, country Arab. The >> kid >> didn't speak at the age of three! What the doctor suggested was to stop >> speaking other languages but one that is mostly dominant. Let's say that >> the >> kid has other factors as well.... How would you claim that you can >> distinguish these kids from the rest when they are one month?! I hope I >> express my meaning. >> >> I have seen many instances like this. My son was exposed to English >> through >> TV and my interaction, his environment and father's interaction was >> Persian. >> His language development is very slow, even we thought that he might have >> had serious problems. I stopped English. Many instances like these exist >> that have not developed into papers. finding no paper about similar >> situation in an ISI journal cannot stop a researcher to ignore many other >> instances that assure the risk. >> >> When it comes to *clinical situation*, we decide based on few instances. I >> hope more research to be done regarding the benefits of bilingualism on >> true >> early bilingualism or simultaneous bilingualism which would clearly >> explain >> what the situation is. >> >> It would be great if we can learn about ideas of other specialists as >> well >> like psychologists, cognitive psychologists, those who are working with >> problematic children. >> >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:50 PM, Miquel Serra wrote: >> >> Dear Parisa >>> Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) >>> adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a >>> desire >>> of parents or politicians (and academics). >>> Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project >>> depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional >>> and >>> has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the >>> children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant >>> language. >>> Miquel Serra >>> U Barcelona, Catalonia >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> > > > *************************************** > Elena Nicoladis, PhD > Department of Psychology > University of Alberta > P2-17 Biological Sciences Bdg. > Edmonton AB > T6G 2E9 > CANADA > > "Since all the sciences, and especially psychology, are still immersed in > such tremendous realms of the uncertain and the unknown, the best that any > individual scientist, especially any psychologist, can do seems to be to > follow his own gleam and his own bent, however inadequate they may be. In > the end, the only sure criterion is to have fun." > E. C. Tolman, 1959 > *************************************** > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lofa4 at hotmail.com Mon May 9 19:58:31 2011 From: lofa4 at hotmail.com (lofa) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 21:58:31 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <013cc2fb-e517-4e50-9ae6-f7c65124fe25@m10g2000yqd.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: Dear Tamar & Yves, I was just wondering how long you were planning to remain in the country with the 4th language? how well do you speak that 4th language yourself? Why didn't you name that 4th language, what's so secret about it, do you like the culture there? Your perception of languages may affect the way your child will relate to them. And does your son look to you like he's bothered by the present linguistic diversity now, like he's not reacting like you'd expect him to? You certainly do not have to reply, but it might help to ask yourself those questions. I see kids with language delays in France, and true that most of them are from bi- & tri-lingual families (I'd say 80%), but most of those families have to deal with situations and most of the mothers did not go to college (the mother's education matters in case of language delays) and some only speak French so well. Most of the time, there is some kind of cultural gap between France and their cultures. I think the issue is not bilingualism, it is biligualism in those situations. I side with those who say that a kid needs his parents to communicate with him as much as possible, in the language that they feel is the most authentic for them. Kind regards, Véronique -------------------------------------------------- From: "Tamar & Yves" Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 12:18 PM To: "Info-CHILDES" Subject: Re: a question about multilingual babies > Dear beachjade, > Thanks for the referals. In our case, multiligualism is a necessity, > so what's left is to find out how to supprt our son's acuisition of > those 4 languages more easily. > > This is why we find your referal to studies on the psychological > aspects of it so helpful. > > Thanks again, > Tamar & Yves > > On 9 מאי, 02:25, beachjade wrote: >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >> second >> question about how early should you expose your child to his many >> languages. >> In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the >> literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >> not >> a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> >> >> >> > Hello all, >> > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> > us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> > life. >> >> > Thanks, >> > Tamar & Yves >> >> > -- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > Groups >> > "Info-CHILDES" group. >> > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> > For more options, visit this group at >> >http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en.-הסתר טקסט מצוטט- >> >> -הראה טקסט מצוטט- > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From macw at cmu.edu Mon May 9 20:54:33 2011 From: macw at cmu.edu (Brian MacWhinney) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 22:54:33 +0200 Subject: posting from Joanne Message-ID: Here is note from Joanne Paradis that she is having trouble posting. So I am sending it for her. -- Brian MacWhinney Dear colleagues I would like to add my voice to the majority of you who have strongly supported early bilingualism in your comments. My professional experience as a researcher of early bilingualism and language disorders, as well as my experience as a mother of two bilingual-from-birth children, lead me to to unequivocally support early bilingualism. In particular, there is no research evidence that children with language delay and disorders - even autism - have their condition exacerbated by bilingualism; existing research suggests the contrary. In addition, there are numerous reasons based on family and societal context that point to bilingualism as the best or only choice for children with language disorders. Fred Genesee, Martha Crago and I have dealt with many of the issues that have come forward in this discussion in the second edition of our book: Dual language development and disorders. A link to the book and a Q&A with the authors is below. (I hope you will forgive this "self-promotion"). Paradis, J., Genesee, F., & Crago, M. (2010). Dual language development and disorders: A handbook on bilingualism and second language learning (2nd Edition). Baltimore, MD: Brookes. http://www.brookespublishing.com/store/books/paradis-70588/index.htm -Johanne **************************************************************************************************** Johanne Paradis | Associate Professor | Department of Linguistics 4-46 Assiniboia Hall | University of Alberta | Edmonton, AB | T6G 2E7 | Canada tel: 1 (780) 492-0805 | fax: 1 (780) 492-0806 | http://www.ualberta.ca/~jparadis/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From natalija.radivojevic at gmail.com Mon May 9 21:22:52 2011 From: natalija.radivojevic at gmail.com (Natalija Radivojevic) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:22:52 -0700 Subject: MacArthur CDI-adaptation in Croatian language Message-ID: Dear all, I'm sorry for bugging some of you again with the same question, but I need help in locating Dr. Melita Kovacevic, author of the CDI adaptation in Croatian or anyone else who could provide us information about this inventory, it's standardisation, psychometric characteristics, and availability of the test for further research. I am a PhD student and I am currently involved in the project in the area of bilingualism. I am currently at Arizona State University on Short Term Scientific Mission and I am working with Dr. Restrepo on the development of the basic frame for bilingual Serbian-English assessment for children aged 2 to 3 years. We are informed that adaptation in Croatian is available, but we haven't been able to locate the author Dr. Melita Kovacevic. We tried with two of her e-mail addresses, but have had no success yet. If you have any information about how we could get in touch with Dr. Melita Kovacevic or any other person that could provide us these information, please let us know. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From eclark at stanford.edu Mon May 9 21:45:24 2011 From: eclark at stanford.edu (Eve V. Clark) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:45:24 -0700 Subject: MacArthur CDI-adaptation in Croatian language In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Melita Kovacevic, Department of Speech & Language Pathology, University of Zagreb melita.kovacevic at public.srce.hr melita.kovacevic at unizg.hr www.labpolin.org/eunm-cdi/program.pdf No address in the IASCL address list On May 9, 2011, at 2:22 PM, Natalija Radivojevic wrote: > Dear all, > > I'm sorry for bugging some of you again with the same question, but I > need help in locating Dr. Melita Kovacevic, author of the CDI > adaptation in Croatian or anyone else who could provide us information > about this inventory, it's standardisation, psychometric > characteristics, and availability of the test for further research. > > I am a PhD student and I am currently involved in the project in the > area of bilingualism. I am currently at Arizona State University on > Short Term Scientific Mission and I am working with Dr. Restrepo on > the development of the basic frame for bilingual Serbian-English > assessment for children aged 2 to 3 years. > > We are informed that adaptation in Croatian is available, but we > haven't been able to locate the author Dr. Melita Kovacevic. We tried > with two of her e-mail addresses, but have had no success yet. > > If you have any information about how we could get in touch with Dr. > Melita Kovacevic or any other person that could provide us these > information, please let us know. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Tue May 10 10:07:02 2011 From: k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk (Katie Alcock) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 03:07:02 -0700 Subject: Language acquisition in sub-Saharan Africa Message-ID: I've tried to post this message twice so here's hoping it goes through this time... I'm writing a review chapter on this topic and I'm keen to make sure I don't miss those hard-to-find articles. If you have anything, or know of anything, that you feel should be included, particularly if it's not published in a widely-available journal (conference papers, PhD theses, articles in press, that kind of thing), please do get in touch (preferably off list if you can work out how to do that...) I'm excluding languages of European origin (I haven't had to make a decision about Arabic yet as I haven't found any papers on children in the region acquiring Arabic). Thanks very much Katie k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Katie Alcock, DPhil, CPsychol Lecturer Department of Psychology University of Lancaster Fylde College Lancaster LA1 4YF Tel 01524 593833 Fax 01524 593744 Web http://www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/people/KatieAlcock.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From brunilda at gmail.com Tue May 10 19:35:51 2011 From: brunilda at gmail.com (Bruno) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 12:35:51 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hmmm, as for references, some of the best names in research of bilingualism have already been put forward. You know, my two cents, from reading the literature, investigating first language acquisition, having been raised simultaneous bilingual, and multilingual sequentially, and having a multilingual situation at home now, is that your child will be most fluent in whatever language they speak in most of the time. That will ALMOST ALWAYS be (in my opinion), the community language (seemingly the 4th language you're not mentioning). That is, the language of their peers (friends and foes alike :-) ). Your child will have varying degrees of fluency in the other languages, and will most likely be able to understand those languages almost perfectly if he/she keeps hearing them, even if the child ends up being quite unable to produce languages 1, 2, and 3. Moreover, I am afraid how much exposure your child gets before going to school may not matter as much, since attrition and loss at a very early age can happen in a matter of mere months. I would humbly put forth the following suggestion: you and your partner need to establish some clear goals for your child in terms of language proficiency. You will likely have to consider where you will be throughout your child's childhood, as well as how important each language is likely to be in the future FROM YOUR CHILD's perspective. If it is absolutely essential, or even highly desirable, that your child SPEAK languages 1, 2, or 3 (I am not sure about English in your case), then that will require a lot of effort on your part. In particular, it will require exposing your child to contexts where his/ her speaking those languages is communicationally, socially, and emotionally adequate (that is, for example, travel abroad to family, play dates with friends who do not speak their community language, etc.) HARD to do, not impossible. Bruno Estigarribia UNC-Chapel Hill On May 8, 1:48 pm, "Tamar & Yves" wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From fromm at andrew.cmu.edu Wed May 11 01:27:12 2011 From: fromm at andrew.cmu.edu (Davida S Fromm) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 21:27:12 -0400 Subject: multilingualism Message-ID: Just to add a few comments on multilingualism: First, I agree with most of what's been said by others about children having no difficulty whatsoever learning more than one language from early on. I think the arguments and evidence on difference and delay, etc., are complex and demand more discussion than possible in emails. But the bottom line is that even where there may be initial differences across children with distinct exposure to language X, the differences are usually subtle, and in the end the differences get neutralized. I also agree with others that this is contingent, of course, on the child continuing to be exposed to the languages in question. (A child can't learn a language s/he is not hearing.) But what I wanted to bring up is that it is about time we turned these issues on their head. The discussions need to turn to how the MONOLINGUAL child is at a disadvantage, not the bilingual/multilingual child. Just to list some areas where this is true: 1. Easiest and most obvious: The monolingual ends up with only one language, the bilingual with two or more. In my mind, that is reason enough to bring up a child bilingually, if one has that option. Others in this discussion have already commented on the very considerable social, political, economic, cultural, etc. advantages of knowing more than one language, advantages that are on top of the linguistic advantages. 2. The facility and fluency with which a child growing up bilingually speaks those languages can rarely be gained by someone starting the second language at a later stage in life. Is there a single adult among us who began a language in adolescence or adulthood that would not have preferred to learn that language in childhood? We are doing a disservice to our children making them wait to learn a second language. 3. As mentioned by others, the bilingual child gains metalinguistic awareness earlier than monolingual children [i.e., one could say a monolingual child is "delayed" in metalinguistic awareness]. 4. The bilingual child is opened to distinct ways of viewing and thinking about the world according to the "packaging" offered by the language ? crosslinguistic differences have been shown to affect what we pay attention to, similarity judgments, and the like, as well as more down-to-earth matters such as how violent a jury might view the actions of a defendant in a trial to be (e.g., Luna Filipovic's work). 5. There is considerable evidence on bilingual advantages on executive function tasks ? sometimes they're faster, sometimes better/more accurate on such tasks. Again, the implication is that the monolingual is at a disadvantage. It is clear that a bilingual is not two monolinguals in one head. Poor monolingual. I think it often helps to draw analogies: Who has a richer experience as a musician ? the person who can play 2 or 3 or more instruments well, or the person who can only play one? If a drummer can bring enhanced sensitivities for rhythm to how s/he plays the guitar, does this make him/her a worse guitar player than one who can only play the guitar, or does it mean the "mono-guitar" player may be lacking some richness that can only be gained by being "multi-musical"? Ginny Gathercole Professor, School of Psychology Co-Director, ESRC Centre for Research on Bilingualism in Theory and Practice Bangor University Wales -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu Thu May 12 20:22:19 2011 From: natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu (Natalia Rakhlin) Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 16:22:19 -0400 Subject: job announcement Message-ID: Dear colleagues, Here is a job posting from Yale University. Please, pass it along to anyone who may be interested. For more information about the lab, please go to our website: www.yale.edu/eglab/index.html Thank you, Natalia Rakhlin Natalia Rakhlin Child Study Center Yale University 230 South Frontage Road New Haven, CT 06519-1124 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Arabic_job_Yale.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 31121 bytes Desc: not available URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 16 03:29:51 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 06:59:51 +0330 Subject: acquiring "or question" Message-ID: Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Mon May 16 08:53:38 2011 From: k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk (Alcock, Katie) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 09:53:38 +0100 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I assume that this has a fairly strong relationship to phonological short term memory, the recency effect and the primacy effect, all of which are fairly well covered in the literature. Katie Alcock From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto:info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard Sent: 16 May 2011 04:30 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: acquiring "or question" Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 16 08:57:09 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 12:27:09 +0330 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: <8D843A98A995F54E874111C9C6DADFE003B827FE@exchange-be7.lancs.local> Message-ID: Thank ou Katie, What if the kid just repeat the question? Best, Parisa On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Alcock, Katie wrote: > I assume that this has a fairly strong relationship to phonological short > term memory, the recency effect and the primacy effect, all of which are > fairly well covered in the literature. > > > > Katie Alcock > > > > > > *From:* info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto: > info-childes at googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *parisa Daftarifard > *Sent:* 16 May 2011 04:30 > *To:* info-childes at googlegroups.com > *Subject:* acquiring "or question" > > > > Dear List members, > > > > "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When > you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely > yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the > first option or choose the second option. > > > > > > Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific > topic. > > > > I appreciate your help in advance. > > Best, > > Parisa Daftarifard > > -- > > Parisa Daftarifard > > Phd Student of TEFL > > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Mon May 16 09:02:31 2011 From: k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk (Alcock, Katie) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 10:02:31 +0100 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: That's not unique to "or" questions, though, is it - children repeat a fair proportion of what they hear, verbatim (or as close as they can get), regardless of what type of input it is, but (though you'd have to look this up) probably more when they realise a response is required i.e. when it's a question. From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto:info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard Sent: 16 May 2011 09:57 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: Re: acquiring "or question" Thank ou Katie, What if the kid just repeat the question? Best, Parisa On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Alcock, Katie wrote: I assume that this has a fairly strong relationship to phonological short term memory, the recency effect and the primacy effect, all of which are fairly well covered in the literature. Katie Alcock From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto:info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard Sent: 16 May 2011 04:30 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: acquiring "or question" Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu Mon May 16 03:47:35 2011 From: natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu (Natalia Rakhlin) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 23:47:35 -0400 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, There is some work on children's interpretation of disjunction by Stephen Crain and his colleagues. For example, there was a BU proceedings paper (in 2001, I believe) by Chierchia, Crain, Guasti, Gualmini and Meroni on the acquisition of disjunction. There was another BU paper on this topic by Goro, Minai and Crain in 2005. I am not familiar with any review articles, though. Best, Natalia On May 15, 2011, at 11:29 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear List members, > > "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. > > > Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. > > I appreciate your help in advance. > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. Natalia Rakhlin Child Study Center Yale University 230 South Frontage Road New Haven, CT 06519-1124 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From KNelson at gc.cuny.edu Mon May 16 13:51:27 2011 From: KNelson at gc.cuny.edu (Nelson, Katherine) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 09:51:27 -0400 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Parisa, There is a now dated review of studies of "or" comprehension and production in the following: French, L. A. and K. Nelson (1985). Young children's understanding of relational terms: Some ifs, ors and buts. New York, Springer-Verlag. The conclusion there is that the disjunctive "or" is understood and used by children of 4 and 5 years but not younger, and that prior to this age it may be used as a conjunctive equivalent to "and". Thus most 2 year olds would not be expected to consistently reply to "or" questions appropriately. This source also noted that many studies of the comprehension of "or" indicated that this was not achieved until a much later age, but the argument in French and Nelson was that these studies conflated the natural language use of "or" with the formal logic understanding of the term. I have not kept up with this line of research so cannot provide any more recent sources. Katherine ________________________________ From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard [pdaftaryfard at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2011 11:29 PM To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: acquiring "or question" Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 16 16:08:00 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 19:38:00 +0330 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: <5D45CB1E13D80E4C8B05AEDC079CE7F217E74D2BC3@MAILBOX.gc.cuny.edu> Message-ID: Dear Natalia and Katherine, Thank you so much for your information. I hope to find more review . It is interesting point that not younger than 4 can understand or question. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Nelson, Katherine wrote: > Parisa, > There is a now dated review of studies of "or" comprehension and production > in the following: > > French, L. A. and K. Nelson (1985). *Young children's understanding of > relational terms: Some ifs, ors and buts*. New York, Springer-Verlag. > > The conclusion there is that the disjunctive "or" is understood and used by > children of 4 and 5 years but not younger, and that prior to this age it may > be used as a conjunctive equivalent to "and". Thus most 2 year olds would > not be expected to consistently reply to "or" questions appropriately. > > > > This source also noted that many studies of the comprehension of "or" > indicated that this was not achieved until a much later age, but the > argument in French and Nelson was that these studies conflated the natural > language use of "or" with the formal logic understanding of the term. > > > > I have not kept up with this line of research so cannot provide any more > recent sources. > > > > Katherine > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* info-childes at googlegroups.com [info-childes at googlegroups.com] On > Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard [pdaftaryfard at gmail.com] > *Sent:* Sunday, May 15, 2011 11:29 PM > > *To:* info-childes at googlegroups.com > *Subject:* acquiring "or question" > > Dear List members, > > "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When > you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely > yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the > first option or choose the second option. > > > Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific > topic. > > I appreciate your help in advance. > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Fri May 20 07:40:54 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 11:10:54 +0330 Subject: Sorry for Cross-posting Message-ID: Dear List Members, Greetings, I apologize for cross-posting in this list. This lady is in dire need of English native speaker's idea. She asked me for help. She should be very much grateful for the precious time you may spend answering her questions Again I apologize for cross-posting. Also we should highly appreciate your kind concern and attention beforehand. Best, Parisa . --- On *Fri, 5/20/11, Maryam Esmaeili * wrote: From: Maryam Esmaeili Subject: Please help me Dear List members Greetings, I apologize for crossposting this request. For My MA thesis I am working on a topic regarding interlanguage pragmatics assessment. To do this I need to have *English Native* Speakers’ idea through the questionnaire to which the link is given below. I should highly appreciate you if you kindly as Native English Speaker of English help me with this survey and answer the questions of this questionnaire. http://www.kwiksurveys.com?s=NKEHOI_1117d6e All participants will remain anonymous and no personal information will be collected. Your answer will provide us with invaluable information crucial for the completion of our investigation. I should highly appreciate your kind cooperation in advance. Best, Maryam MA Student, Shahrekord University -----Inline Attachment Follows----- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yrose at mun.ca Fri May 20 18:54:03 2011 From: yrose at mun.ca (Yvan Rose) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 14:54:03 -0400 Subject: New version of Phon available Message-ID: Dear Info-CHILDES and PhonBank list members, We are pleased to announce the release of Phon 1.5, which offers a vast array of improvements over all previous versions of the application. Please see the Release notes (link below) for a highlight of the most important changes. Brief description Phon is a software program that greatly facilitates a number of tasks required for the analysis of phonological development. Phon supports multimedia data linkage, unit segmentation, multiple-blind transcription, automatic labeling of data, and systematic comparisons between target (model) and actual (produced) phonological forms. All of these functions are accessible through a user-friendly graphical interface. Databases managed within Phon can also be queried using a powerful search interface. This software program works on Mac OS X, Windows and Unix/Linux platforms, is fully compliant with the CHILDES/TalkBank XML format, and supports Unicode font encoding. Phon is being made freely available to the community as open-source software. It meets specific needs related to the study of first language phonological development (including babbling), second language acquisition, and speech disorders. Phon facilitates data exchange among researchers and the construction of a shared PhonBank database, which supports research in all areas of phonological development. Important links Links to Phon: http://childes.psy.cmu.edu/phon/ http://phon.ling.mun.ca/phonwiki/ Release notes: http://phon.ling.mun.ca/phontrac/wiki/phon1_5/ReleaseNotes Links to the PhonBank corpora: -Corpora in CHAT format: http://childes.psy.cmu.edu/data/PhonBank/ -Corpora in Phon format: http://childes.psy.cmu.edu/data/PhonBank-Phon/ Discussion group: Phon users are encouraged to subscribe to the discussion group (no Gmail account required to subscribe): http://groups.google.com/group/phon -To join the group, click on the “Apply for group membership” and follow the instructions. -Group's email address (for message posting): phon at googlegroups.com Acknowledgments Funding: Current development of Phon and PhonBank is supported by the National Institute of Health. Earlier development of Phon was funded by grants from National Science Foundation, Canada Fund for Innovation, Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council of Canada, Petro-Canada Fund for Young Innovators, and the Office of the Vice-President (Research) and the Faculty of Arts at Memorial University of Newfoundland. Special thanks: While it is impossible to name everyone who ended up being involved in one way or another in this project, we owe special thanks to a wonderful group of early adopters and beta testers, without whom it would have been much more difficult to produce the current software. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From alicia.chang at gmail.com Thu May 26 14:28:05 2011 From: alicia.chang at gmail.com (Alicia Chang) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 10:28:05 -0400 Subject: Postdoctoral position at the University of Delaware Message-ID: *Postdoctoral Fellowship* * * *Dr. Roberta M. Golinkoff* * * *UNIVERSITY OF DELAWARE* *School of Education* *Newark, Delaware* * * We are currently accepting applications for a post-doctoral fellowship on an NIH-funded project focusing on preschoolers’ knowledge of geometric shapes. The project examines the relationship between what children know about shapes and their mathematical knowledge upon school entry. Ideally, the applicant would be an expert in the area of early mathematical or spatial development and have an interest in cognitive development. Applicants would be expected to have strong research training, extensive statistical experience, and a Ph.D. in developmental psychology or a closely related area. Experience in using an eye-tracker would be welcomed, and excellent writing skills are a must. Funding is available for one year with full, excellent benefits*.* *Responsibilities:* Data analysis, writing up results for presentation and publication, literature reviews, designing and assisting in the conduct of follow-up studies, grant writing, and collaborative participation with our research team. *Materials:* Please submit a CV, cover letter with statement of research interests, letters of recommendation, and evidence of scholarly publications to Alicia Chang at aliciac at udel.edu . -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bhuvana.linguistics at gmail.com Sat May 28 20:47:08 2011 From: bhuvana.linguistics at gmail.com (Bhuvana Narasimhan) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 13:47:08 -0700 Subject: Psycholinguistics Courses at the Linguistic Institute, July 7 - Aug 2, 2011 Message-ID: Subject: Psycholinguistics Courses at the Linguistic Institute, July 7 - Aug 2, 2011 (**apologies for any cross-postings**) The University of Colorado is offering a fantastic opportunity for people interested in Psycholinguistics to be brought up to date with the latest developments and trends in 4 short weeks. This is part of the Linguistic Institute 2011 in Boulder (see below), which offers an unusually wide range of Psycholinguistics courses by renowned researchers. Course offerings cover a range of topics: - language acquisition (infant speech perception, information structure development, learnability theory, sign language development, the emergence of phonology, etc.); - adult language processing (neural mechanisms of language comprehension, grammatical ‘illusions’, studying language processing using eye-tracking, processing phonological structure and phonetic variation, etc.); - computational psycholinguistics and information-theoretic approaches; - the creation of new languages (development of pidgins and creoles). In addition to providing a comprehensive introduction to the relevant concepts and scientific literature, many of the courses (as well as several Institute workshops) provide experience with state-of-the-art tools-of-the-trade. Detailed course descriptions can be found here: https://verbs.colorado.edu/LSA2011/courses-areas.html A list of Institute workshops can be found here: https://verbs.colorado.edu/LSA2011/events-calendar.html#workshop These courses are open to anyone, and you can register as an affiliate if you do not need transfer credit. The courses meet twice a week, so it would be possible to take a full load of 4 courses by attending just two days a week. It is an extraordinary networking opportunity, with small classes and lots of institute-wide events. ============================================================================= The Linguistic Institute 2011 will take place July 7-August 2 on the campus of the University of Colorado at Boulder, with major sponsorship by the Linguistic Society of America and the university. Courses are being taught by over 100 outstanding international visiting faculty members. In addition, more than 20 affiliated workshops and conference meetings will be held during Institute 2011. The theme of the 2011 Linguistic Institute is Language in the World, and the focus is on interdisciplinary, empirically based approaches to language. In keeping with this theme, a large suite of courses target language documentation and description, as well as processes of language endangerment and appropriate responses. The Institute not only continues a vital tradition in the field but also showcases the outstanding research and teaching activities at the University of Colorado at Boulder. The 79 one-credit hour courses include many courses on sociolinguistics, field methods, typology, syntactic/ semantic/pragmatic theory, cognitive science and computational linguistics. Online registration is open through July 5th at the Institute website: https://verbs.colorado.edu/LSA2011/index.html. CAMPUS HOUSING RESERVATIONS CAN BE MADE THROUGH JUNE 13, 2011. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From natasha.ringblom at slav.su.se Mon May 30 09:43:06 2011 From: natasha.ringblom at slav.su.se (Natasha Ringblom) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 11:43:06 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves! Your question has generated a great deal of discussion among my students of bilingualism at the University of Uppsala. Thanks a lot for raising this issue. Below I attach one of the answers of my students (Olof Pettersson - olofmartinhenry at gmail.com) who did a great job going through all the previous answers and comments and at the same time adding a new perspective. Hope it will be interesting for you to read and perhaps - even help making your decision. Best, Natasha Ringblom Dear Tamar and Yves, I would like to begin by stating that while I don't think your situation is as complicated as some of the earlier responses make it out to be, I would say that it is far from without complexity. Most research on bilingualism seems to focus on bilingual children rather than tri- or quadrilingual, as is the case with your child. This is what potentially could make things a little complicated. I feel the need to point out that I do not agree with those who claim that bilingual first language acquisition could be disadvantageous to the mental development of children, causing language delay or even autism. Given the state of the world, where bilingualism (i. e. a situation where children have been exposed to more than one language since before they can produce utterances) has a clear statistical majority over monolingualism, it seems absurd to claim that multiple language acquisition could be the cause of impairment of the cognitive abilities of a child. Many of the earlier responses have already mentioned this statistical majority, so I feel that not much more needs to be added about that. Now, something that seems rather crucial to mention, that I haven't seen in any of the responses so far, is the notion of a “critical period” for acquisition of language. Most researchers agree that such a period exists, based on evidence that the neurological maturation of the brain causes it to lose its initial plasticity. Such a development has been proven to exist in many other species, and is typically linked to some art-specific skill (like flight for birds). In the case of humans, this is supposed to lead to easier language acquisition before this process is finished. Now, there is little consensus among the scientific community as to what age range this period actually applies to. The originally propositioned end age of 13 has been abandoned, and many researchers are now speaking of different critical periods for different sections of language acquisition (i. e. phonology, morphology, syntax etc.). One thing that most linguists researching early bilingualism however seem to agree on is that the early years and months are ideal for learning more than one language with native-like control as ultimate attainment as goal. Thus I would agree with Bruno (10/5 2011) that it is important that you make out clear goals for your child, based on which language you deem to be most likely to be the most instrumental to him in his future. This brings me to your question about what language his nursery should be in. Also here you should take into account what the future might hold for your son, because the language(s) he learns there is likely to be a strong candidate for becoming his dominant language, especially if it is the same language as spoken by the society in which he grows up, or also if it is one of the languages he hears at home. As Lofa (9/5 2011) writes, and I agree, the country of residence and your own attitudes towards the different languages play huge roles in shaping the prerequisites for your son's language choices. Every little thing that can be associated with the respective languages is going to be picked up by him, because in the state of neurologically optimized language-learning he currently is, he is sensitive to all available input. When choosing what language you want him to be surrounded by the most, it is also important to keep in mind that complete multilingualism is very hard to attain. Most often, multilingual children will end up with a complete abstract linguistic system, with domain-based proficiency in each of their different languages. This means that whichever language your son is most likely to hear in for example the kitchen, is the language he will most frequently use about kitchen items or activities. Keeping all these things in mind, together with the answers given earlier, I hope you feel that you are better equipped to make good choices for your son. I hope I was able to add something useful. Olof Pettersson, linguistics student at the University of Uppsala, Sweden Olof Pettersson - olofmartinhenry at gmail.com 8 maj 2011 kl. 19.48 skrev Tamar & Yves: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Ben.Ambridge at liverpool.ac.uk Tue May 3 14:23:36 2011 From: Ben.Ambridge at liverpool.ac.uk (Ambridge, Ben) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 15:23:36 +0100 Subject: Book announcement - Child Language Acquisition Message-ID: Dear all With apologies for the shameless self-promotion, we (Ben Ambridge & Elena Lieven) would like to inform you that our new textbook (Child Language Acquisition: Contrasting Theoretical Approaches, Cambridge University Press) is out now (paperback/hardback/Kindle). As the name implies, our aim in writing the book was to compare the competing theoretical accounts of all the major language-acquisition phenomena, in as even-handed and comprehensive a manner as possible. We therefore hope that this will be a useful textbook for course-leaders of all theoretical persuasions! If you teach a course on language acquisition, why not request a free inspection copy from Cambridge University Press? (links for inspection copies/purchase are below.) Table of Contents 1. Introduction 2. Speech perception, segmentation and production 3. Learning word meanings 4. Theoretical approaches to grammar acquisition 5. Inflection 6. Simple syntax 7. Movement and complex syntax 8. Binding, quantification and control 9. Related debates and conclusions. Summary: Is children's language acquisition based on innate linguistic structures or built from cognitive and communicative skills? This book summarises the major theoretical debates in all of the core domains of child language acquisition research (phonology, word-learning, inflectional morphology, syntax and binding) and includes a complete introduction to the two major contrasting theoretical approaches: generativist and constructivist. For each debate, the predictions of the competing accounts are closely and even-handedly evaluated against the empirical data. The result is an evidence-based review of the central issues in language acquisition research that will constitute a valuable resource for students, teachers, course-builders and researchers alike Cambridge University Press - to request a free inspection copy or purchase (though usually cheaper at Amazon) UK: http://www.cambridge.org/gb/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_GB USA: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_US Elsewhere: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/location/ Amazon UK: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300707811&sr=8-1 USA: http://www.amazon.com/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300708318&sr=8-1 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Chloe.Marshall.1 at city.ac.uk Tue May 3 19:13:41 2011 From: Chloe.Marshall.1 at city.ac.uk (Marshall, Chloe) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 20:13:41 +0100 Subject: Book announcement - Child Language Acquisition In-Reply-To: <0813B54A9D2C494CACBD693C6A2D4D4C147617E636@STAFFMBX2.livad.liv.ac.uk> Message-ID: Hi Ben, I'm reading your book at the moment and am enjoying it very much (and learning a great deal). I've also sent it out for review for the International Journal of Language and Communication Disorders, where I'm one of the book editors, and I'll keep you and Elena updated when the review comes in. Best wishes, Chloe Dr Chloe Marshall, Senior Lecturer in Developmental Psychology and Language Acquisition, and Leverhulme Early Career Fellow, Department of Language and Communication Science, City University London http://www.city.ac.uk/lcs/biographies/cmarshall.html ________________________________ From: Ambridge, Ben [Ben.Ambridge at liverpool.ac.uk] Sent: 03 May 2011 15:23 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: Book announcement - Child Language Acquisition Dear all With apologies for the shameless self-promotion, we (Ben Ambridge & Elena Lieven) would like to inform you that our new textbook (Child Language Acquisition: Contrasting Theoretical Approaches, Cambridge University Press) is out now (paperback/hardback/Kindle). As the name implies, our aim in writing the book was to compare the competing theoretical accounts of all the major language-acquisition phenomena, in as even-handed and comprehensive a manner as possible. We therefore hope that this will be a useful textbook for course-leaders of all theoretical persuasions! If you teach a course on language acquisition, why not request a free inspection copy from Cambridge University Press? (links for inspection copies/purchase are below.) Table of Contents 1. Introduction 2. Speech perception, segmentation and production 3. Learning word meanings 4. Theoretical approaches to grammar acquisition 5. Inflection 6. Simple syntax 7. Movement and complex syntax 8. Binding, quantification and control 9. Related debates and conclusions. Summary: Is children's language acquisition based on innate linguistic structures or built from cognitive and communicative skills? This book summarises the major theoretical debates in all of the core domains of child language acquisition research (phonology, word-learning, inflectional morphology, syntax and binding) and includes a complete introduction to the two major contrasting theoretical approaches: generativist and constructivist. For each debate, the predictions of the competing accounts are closely and even-handedly evaluated against the empirical data. The result is an evidence-based review of the central issues in language acquisition research that will constitute a valuable resource for students, teachers, course-builders and researchers alike Cambridge University Press - to request a free inspection copy or purchase (though usually cheaper at Amazon) UK: http://www.cambridge.org/gb/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_GB USA: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/isbn/item5741469/?site_locale=en_US Elsewhere: http://www.cambridge.org/us/knowledge/location/ Amazon UK: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300707811&sr=8-1 USA: http://www.amazon.com/Child-Language-Acquisition-Contrasting-Theoretical/dp/0521745233/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1300708318&sr=8-1 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tamarmr at gmail.com Sun May 8 17:48:59 2011 From: tamarmr at gmail.com (Tamar & Yves) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 10:48:59 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies Message-ID: Hello all, Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between us) and to a 4th one outside. Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his life. Thanks, Tamar & Yves -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Sun May 8 22:18:13 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 01:48:13 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Does he start babbling or one word in any language? Please stop him exposing to many languages as I experienced you may cause language delay for even four years or more. Let him learn one language and then another one. This may cause your kid language delay. Best, Parisa On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 9:18 PM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From beachjade at gmail.com Mon May 9 00:25:16 2011 From: beachjade at gmail.com (beachjade) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 17:25:16 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves, There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From beachjade at gmail.com Mon May 9 00:56:19 2011 From: beachjade at gmail.com (beachjade) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 17:56:19 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves, There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by the Linguistic Society of America (see below). Finally, I have included a link to a paper by Bialystok. I am hopeful that someone else on the list can speak to your question regarding language exposure at nursery school. With best regards, Margaret Friend http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bpearson at research.umass.edu Mon May 9 01:06:07 2011 From: bpearson at research.umass.edu (Barbara Pearson) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 21:06:07 -0400 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves, I, too, was going to question on what basis the earlier correspondent drew her or his conclusion. I remember hearing it said that "the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'evidence.'" (Perhaps someone can give us the sources of that quote, or a correction.) Meanwhile, I am thrilled to hear that you have choices (!) about which language or languages you can find in nurseries for your boy. In making your decision, you should consider which languages your son will have authentic sustained interactions in. When the need to learn four languages is strong, young children seem to be able to do it, but it gets a little difficult for parents to arrange enough exposure to all four languages at once. There's not one right answer. And the answer you decide on now may be best for now, and you will want to change it later. If you're thinking that your husband may get less opportunity to be with the child, perhaps it make sense to reinforce his mother tongue at the nursery if that is important to him. For work on the emotional aspects of bilingualism, you might look for work by Anna Pavlenko. Best wishes, Barbara Pearson ************************************************ Barbara Zurer Pearson, Ph.D. Research Associate, Depts of Linguistics and Communication Disorders c/o 226 South College University of Massachusetts Amherst Amherst MA 01003 bpearson at research.umass.edu http://www.umass.edu/aae/bp_indexold.htm http://www.zurer.com/pearson/bilingualchild > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your > second question about how early should you expose your child to his > many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my > reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism > in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed > by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves > wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . ************************************************ Barbara Zurer Pearson, Ph.D. Research Associate, Depts of Linguistics and Communication Disorders c/o 226 South College University of Massachusetts Amherst Amherst MA 01003 bpearson at research.umass.edu http://www.umass.edu/aae/bp_indexold.htm http://www.zurer.com/pearson -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 03:11:05 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 06:41:05 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second > question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. > In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the > literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not > a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > >> Hello all, >> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> >> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> >> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> >> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> life. >> >> Thanks, >> Tamar & Yves >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mohinish.s at gmail.com Mon May 9 03:27:50 2011 From: mohinish.s at gmail.com (Mohinish) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 23:27:50 -0400 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at all. Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? Thanks Mohinish On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:09:09 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:09:09 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar, You can find some answers to FAQ by parents to bilingual children at http://www.bi-sli.org/Parents.htm I doubt there is any solid (scientific based) evidence against raising your child multilingual, and hearsay is not a good enough reason. Barbara is right, go by the communicative needs of your child, keep in mind that bilingualism has many advantages and keep an open eye to your child's linguistic development as you would do for any child. Boys are more prone to impairments but there is nothing special about bi/multilingual boys. Best Sharon On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 8:48 PM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:18:35 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:48:35 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <8CD52FF4-5815-4D92-BAA8-547814A6CE23@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Mohinish, Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism might increase autistic symptoms. http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural situation where billions of children are grown up. Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when he starts speaking.* Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: > I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk > factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: > http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be > cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. > > I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories > that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, > but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; > and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES > problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, > e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I > don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at > all. > > Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a > single language early is better than learning multiple languages? > > Thanks > Mohinish > > > > On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental > delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology > suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other > languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>> >>> >>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>> >>> >>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>> >>> >>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>> life. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Tamar & Yves >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:34:20 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:34:20 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . Best Sharon On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Mohinish, > > Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk > factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would > compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although > there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism > might increase autistic symptoms. > > http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html > > > who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. > 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. > 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language > > what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation that > some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural > situation where billions of children are grown up. > > Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one > language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four > languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much > higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* > *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his > first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when > he starts speaking.* > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: > >> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk >> factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >> >> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories >> that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, >> but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; >> and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES >> problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, >> e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I >> don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at >> all. >> >> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a >> single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >> >> Thanks >> Mohinish >> >> >> >> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >> >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >> languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >> >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>> >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>> >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>> >>> >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>> >>> >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>> >>> >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>> >>>> Hello all, >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>> >>>> >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>> >>>> >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>> >>>> >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Tamar & Yves >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:49:29 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 08:19:29 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Sharon, I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web very quickly). Look at this part However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more hair-raising: Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who specializes in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend for surgery and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn languages.* "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a possible riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the benefits of bilingualism in *zero language child*? Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask specialists a question to act based on responses. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting > 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the > mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific > evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . > > Best > > Sharon > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < > pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Mohinish, >> >> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >> might increase autistic symptoms. >> >> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >> >> >> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >> >> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >> situation where billions of children are grown up. >> >> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his >> first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when >> he starts speaking.* >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >> >>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>> risk factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>> >>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories >>> that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, >>> but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; >>> and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES >>> problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, >>> e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I >>> don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at >>> all. >>> >>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning >>> a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>> >>> Thanks >>> Mohinish >>> >>> >>> >>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>> >>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>> >>> Best, >>> Parisa >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>> >>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>> >>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hello all, >>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>>> life. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Parisa Daftarifard >>> Phd Student of TEFL >>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair > The Department of English > Tel: +972 3 5318236 > The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center > Tel: +972 3 5317159 > Bar Ilan University > Ramat Gan, Israel > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 04:57:45 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:57:45 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, Google is full with hearsay. Even professors might be the source. I am not aware of real science (experimentally based with statistics) that supports your claims. But there are many studies nowadays that argue the other way round. A child who grows in a multilingual environment is not pushed too hard to learn languages. He just grows into it. What is important is balanced rich exposure to each language and listening for the communicative needs of the child. Multilingualism is not a risky situation, it is the way the world is for many children and they grow up O.K. Best wishes Sharon On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:49 AM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Sharon, > > I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web > very quickly). > Look at this part > > > However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more > hair-raising: > > Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who specializes > in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend for surgery > and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn languages.* > > "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. > "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a > speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." > > "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents > tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. > > > Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many > languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. > > *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a possible > riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the benefits of > bilingualism in *zero language child*? > > Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask > specialists a question to act based on responses. > > Best, > Parisa > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < > sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Parisa, >> >> Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting >> 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the >> mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific >> evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . >> >> Best >> >> Sharon >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear Mohinish, >>> >>> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >>> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >>> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >>> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >>> might increase autistic symptoms. >>> >>> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >>> >>> >>> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >>> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >>> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >>> >>> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >>> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >>> situation where billions of children are grown up. >>> >>> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >>> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >>> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >>> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >>> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn >>> his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like >>> when he starts speaking.* >>> >>> Best, >>> Parisa >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >>> >>>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>>> risk factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>>> >>>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories >>>> that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, >>>> but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; >>>> and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES >>>> problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, >>>> e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I >>>> don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at >>>> all. >>>> >>>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning >>>> a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> Mohinish >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>>> >>>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> Parisa >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>>> >>>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>>> >>>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hello all, >>>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>>>> life. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Parisa Daftarifard >>> Phd Student of TEFL >>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >> The Department of English >> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >> Bar Ilan University >> Ramat Gan, Israel >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eclark at stanford.edu Mon May 9 05:12:59 2011 From: eclark at stanford.edu (Eve V. Clark) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 22:12:59 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The actual STUDIES of young children learning two or more languages in general show no adverse effects of doing this. In some situations, bilingual children fare better than monolinguals of the same age (e.g., in language awareness tasks). Otherwise, all other things being equal, they thrive. There's has long been a myth in some circles in the US than bilingualism is bad: this seems to be based on xenophobic reactions to immigrants on the one hand, and to the testing of immigrant children at the beginning of the school year (i.e., before they had had a chance to learn any English) and then concluding the children were 'retarded in development'. Since most of the world is bilingual or multilingual, this conclusion seems (and seemed then) rather misguided. Nowadays it is often tinged by social class: being bilingual is a good thing for middle-class children, but some people view bilingualism as a bad thing for lower-class children.... This seems a bit perverse. I am sorry to see some of these old attitudes still flourishing, and being backed by dubious citations from the web. (Anecdotes are never data.) If there were any reputable studies showing ill-effects, fair enough: we could sit down and evaluate the studies, against all the other studies around. But I don't know of any of such studies in the literature on child bilingualism. I would always advocate a bilingual upbringing if it's feasible, provided the parents are comfortable with it. Their attitudes are critical. Being bilingual is a boon socially and educationally. And it could even contribute to the policies and welfare of the US in the global economy. Eve Clark On May 8, 2011, at 9:18 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Mohinish, > > Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism might increase autistic symptoms. > > http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html > > > who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. > 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. > 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language > > what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural situation where billions of children are grown up. > > Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much higher statistically?) boy in future and maybe not! > As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like when he starts speaking. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: > I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a risk factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. > > I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' 'delays' count as pathological at all. > > Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? > > Thanks > Mohinish > > > > On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> Hello all, >> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> >> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> >> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> >> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> life. >> >> Thanks, >> Tamar & Yves >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 05:17:41 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 08:47:41 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Sharon, Thank you for your comments. Very interesting... Question: *So based on the paper you are talking about you suggest that parents expose their kids with many languages when they are zero language?* . Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:27 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > Google is full with hearsay. Even professors might be the source. I am not > aware of real science (experimentally based with statistics) that supports > your claims. But there are many studies nowadays that argue the other way > round. > A child who grows in a multilingual environment is not pushed too hard to > learn languages. He just grows into it. What is important is balanced rich > exposure to each language and listening for the communicative needs of the > child. > > Multilingualism is not a risky situation, it is the way the world is for > many children and they grow up O.K. > > Best wishes > > Sharon > > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:49 AM, parisa Daftarifard > wrote: > >> Dear Sharon, >> >> I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web >> very quickly). >> Look at this part >> >> >> However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more >> hair-raising: >> >> Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who specializes >> in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend for surgery >> and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn languages.* >> >> "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. >> "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a >> speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." >> >> "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents >> tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. >> >> >> Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many >> languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. >> >> *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a >> possible riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the >> benefits of bilingualism in *zero language child*? >> >> Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask >> specialists a question to act based on responses. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < >> sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear Parisa, >>> >>> Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting >>> 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the >>> mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific >>> evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . >>> >>> Best >>> >>> Sharon >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >>> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Mohinish, >>>> >>>> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >>>> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >>>> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >>>> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >>>> might increase autistic symptoms. >>>> >>>> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >>>> >>>> >>>> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >>>> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >>>> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >>>> >>>> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >>>> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >>>> situation where billions of children are grown up. >>>> >>>> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >>>> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >>>> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >>>> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >>>> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn >>>> his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like >>>> when he starts speaking.* >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> Parisa >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >>>> >>>>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>>>> risk factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>>>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>>>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>>>> >>>>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental >>>>> trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include >>>>> language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of >>>>> these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that >>>>> language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be >>>>> substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start >>>>> speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' >>>>> 'delays' count as pathological at all. >>>>> >>>>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that >>>>> learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> Mohinish >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>>>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>>>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>>>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>>>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> Parisa >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>>>> >>>>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all, >>>>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English >>>>>>> between >>>>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of >>>>>>> his >>>>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to >>>>>>> those >>>>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>>>>> life. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >>> The Department of English >>> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >>> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >>> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >>> Bar Ilan University >>> Ramat Gan, Israel >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair > The Department of English > Tel: +972 3 5318236 > The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center > Tel: +972 3 5317159 > Bar Ilan University > Ramat Gan, Israel > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From e_schlag at hotmail.com Mon May 9 05:20:27 2011 From: e_schlag at hotmail.com (Edith Maria Schlag) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 07:20:27 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, just to add a personal experience (in full awareness that it is in no way representative): My son grew up under similar conditions: he was exposed to 3 languages at home (my husband (1), me (2) and English (3) as the language between my husband and me) and one (4) at the nursery from 10 months onwards. He only spoke and understood those languages he was addressed by (French, German, Dutch), he seemed not to pick up English which he heard from the conversation between my husband and me. Dutch ended up being the dominant language (the language of the environment). By the time my son was almost 4, we moved away from the Netherlands. After about 4 months of no exposure to Dutch, he no longer understood nor spoke the language. That was a surprise. Multilingualism is quite dynamic as it seems. He is 6,7 years old now and he speaks French, German and English. He learned English at school from 4 years onwards which he picked up quickly (possibly because of exposure at home). There weren't any problems in respect to social-emotional development. I am surprised that autism is mentioned as a risk factor. He also has no problems at school, on the contrary. Just to give one example where exposure to 4 languages, at least in the first 4 years, were no problem. Best wishes, Edith Edith Schlag, MSc, MPhil Abu Dhabi United Arab Emirates Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 06:41:05 +0330 Subject: Re: a question about multilingual babies From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: Dear Tamar and Yves, There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: Hello all, Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between us) and to a 4th one outside. Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his life. Thanks, Tamar & Yves -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com Mon May 9 05:29:55 2011 From: sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com (Sharon Armon-Lotem) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 08:29:55 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, Based on all the current scientific work I say there is no harm in exposing your child to more than one language if it is in line with her communicative needs. For children who grow into a multilingual environment it is the most natural thing, and parents make their choices re language policy just as they make it for any other decisions they take in child rearing. Best wishes Sharon On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:17 AM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Sharon, > > Thank you for your comments. Very interesting... > Question: > *So based on the paper you are talking about you suggest that parents > expose their kids with many languages when they are zero language?* > > . > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:27 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < > sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Parisa, >> >> Google is full with hearsay. Even professors might be the source. I am not >> aware of real science (experimentally based with statistics) that supports >> your claims. But there are many studies nowadays that argue the other way >> round. >> A child who grows in a multilingual environment is not pushed too hard to >> learn languages. He just grows into it. What is important is balanced rich >> exposure to each language and listening for the communicative needs of the >> child. >> >> Multilingualism is not a risky situation, it is the way the world is for >> many children and they grow up O.K. >> >> Best wishes >> >> Sharon >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:49 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear Sharon, >>> >>> I just refer to the statement by the professor (I searched it through web >>> very quickly). >>> Look at this part >>> >>> >>> However, the article cites some negative reactions that are even more >>> hair-raising: >>> >>> Dr. Shin Min-sup, a professor at Seoul National University who >>> specializes in issues of adolescent psychiatry, is worried about the trend >>> for surgery and also *for pushing young children too hard to learn >>> languages.* >>> >>> "There's the potential for life-damaging after-effects," Shin said. >>> "Learning a foreign language too early, in some cases, may not only cause a >>> speech impediment but, in the worst case, make an child autistic." >>> >>> "What's wrong with speaking English with an accent anyway? Many parents >>> tend to discount the importance of a well-rounded education," Shin said. >>> >>> >>> Finding ariticles about the risky act of exposing zero child to many >>> languages is not very difficult. Please search through google web. >>> >>> *Would you accept the responsiblity* to expose one kid in *such a >>> possible riskiy situation* based on limited published paper on the >>> benefits of bilingualism in *zero language child*? >>> >>> Please say this frankly because they are parents to kids and ask >>> specialists a question to act based on responses. >>> >>> Best, >>> Parisa >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Sharon Armon-Lotem < >>> sharon.armonlotem at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Parisa, >>>> >>>> Did you actually read what the link was about? It was about frenotomy (cutting >>>> 1 to 1.5 cm from the strap of tissue linking the tongue to the floor of the >>>> mouth), and in a Reuters article, which I would not call scientific >>>> evidence, but rather someone quoting a hearsay. . >>>> >>>> Best >>>> >>>> Sharon >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, parisa Daftarifard < >>>> pdaftaryfard at gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear Mohinish, >>>>> >>>>> Thank you for your question. Although Bilingualism might not be a risk >>>>> factor (nobody said this for sure through research though) but would >>>>> compound the situaiton if the child has the hiden autistic factors. Although >>>>> there are many as you can read below suggest that early bilingualism >>>>> might increase autistic symptoms. >>>>> >>>>> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000085.html >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> who would like to create a risky situation for his or her kids. >>>>> 1. There is no well known reason discovered for autism. >>>>> 2. there are many disagreements about the way children learn language >>>>> >>>>> what your result would be? To rush the poor baby in a risky situation >>>>> that some articles with limited number of subjects showed or in a natural >>>>> situation where billions of children are grown up. >>>>> >>>>> Bilingualism can be achieved even when the baby starts speaking one >>>>> language. Why should we expose our kids to two or three or even worse four >>>>> languages to have maybe a healthy cognitively high (we don't know how much >>>>> higher statistically?) boy in future and *maybe not!* >>>>> *As a mother and researcher I suggest you give your kid time to learn >>>>> his first language! then help him learn as many languages as he would like >>>>> when he starts speaking.* >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> Parisa >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Mohinish wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I too share other posters' understanding that bilingualism is not a >>>>>> risk factor. In fact Kov?cs & Mehler (PNAS, 2009: >>>>>> http://www.pnas.org/content/106/16/6556.short) show that there can be >>>>>> cognitive GAINS in 7-mo-old bilinguals, compared to monolinguals. >>>>>> >>>>>> I think there is a causal asymmetry - certain developmental >>>>>> trajectories that lead to abnormal conditions like autism might include >>>>>> language delays, but language delays by themselves need not be the CAUSE of >>>>>> these conditions; and I would be very interested to see evidence that >>>>>> language delay CAUSES problems like autism. We know that there can be >>>>>> substantial variation in, e.g, production, such that some kids start >>>>>> speaking earlier than others. I don't think that the later-speaking kids' >>>>>> 'delays' count as pathological at all. >>>>>> >>>>>> Parisa, could you include some key references that suggest that >>>>>> learning a single language early is better than learning multiple languages? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> Mohinish >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On May 8, 2011, at 11:11 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >>>>>> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >>>>>> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >>>>>> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >>>>>> languages. I can send you some books off list. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> Parisa >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>>>>>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>>>>>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>>>>>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>>>>>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello all, >>>>>>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English >>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what >>>>>>>> language >>>>>>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>>>>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of >>>>>>>> his >>>>>>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>>>>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on >>>>>>>> him, >>>>>>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, >>>>>>>> but >>>>>>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>>>>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>>>>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to >>>>>>>> those >>>>>>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of >>>>>>>> his >>>>>>>> life. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> Tamar & Yves >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Parisa Daftarifard >>>>> Phd Student of TEFL >>>>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >>>> The Department of English >>>> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >>>> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >>>> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >>>> Bar Ilan University >>>> Ramat Gan, Israel >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Parisa Daftarifard >>> Phd Student of TEFL >>> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair >> The Department of English >> Tel: +972 3 5318236 >> The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center >> Tel: +972 3 5317159 >> Bar Ilan University >> Ramat Gan, Israel >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Dr. Sharon Armon-Lotem, Chair The Department of English Tel: +972 3 5318236 The Gonda Multidisciplinary Brain Research Center Tel: +972 3 5317159 Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, Israel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com Mon May 9 07:05:59 2011 From: aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com (Aliyah MORGENSTERN) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 09:05:59 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) and write a lot of papers... So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your time and don't follow ONE advice. Best, Aliyah from Paris Le 9 mai 2011 ? 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a ?crit : > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 08:21:05 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 11:51:05 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <3DA5977E-3388-4B3D-8310-83D1D2939C47@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Aliyah, Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is *not being bilingual* (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is *about early bilingualism*. *Many early bilingualism* (for example the one Edith explained) one language is *dominant* and functional. I think we need research to see if multilingual *interaction from zero (one month forward)* would exist very much or not. Usually one language is functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish or Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all of them because I have no research at hand), through my individual questioning parents, are interacted in one language first and the second language is not dominant or interactional in early stages. *from educational perspective*, bilingualism brings many chances but when we approach the issue from the *clinical perspective* we need to *be very cautious about claims* and result of research. Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. If we expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more than one language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some times they show aggressive behavior. Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we are not sure that this kid is completely OK. Best, Parisa Daftarifard On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN < aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > > 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of > us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in > saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember > most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) > and write a lot of papers... > So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their > children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. > I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your > time and don't follow ONE advice. > Best, > Aliyah from Paris > > Le 9 mai 2011 ? 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a ?crit : > > Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental > delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology > suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other > languages. I can send you some books off list. > > Best, > Parisa > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>> >>> >>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>> >>> >>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>> >>> >>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>> life. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Tamar & Yves >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.h.dos.santos at gmail.com Mon May 9 08:36:22 2011 From: christophe.h.dos.santos at gmail.com (Christophe dos Santos) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 10:36:22 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, I have read a lot of papers recently that seems to show that Autism is strongly based on genetic origin (not only one gene but a pool of genetic alterations can cause autism). It is not clear however how environment can trigger autism but environment seems not to be the origin of this "impairment". A general article about autism (but a simple search will give you a lot more information about genetic issues linked with autism) : http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/autism-and-genetics-a-breakthrough-that-sheds-light-on-a-medical-mystery-1996221.html Best, Christophe dos Santos Universit? Fran?ois Rabelais, Tours 2011/5/9 parisa Daftarifard : > Dear Aliyah, > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is not being > bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is > about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the one Edith > explained)?one?language is dominant and functional. > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from zero (one > month forward)?would exist very much or not. Usually one language is > functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish or > Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all of > them because I have no research at hand), through my?individual questioning > parents, are interacted in one language first?and the second language is not > dominant or interactional in early stages. > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but when we > approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be very cautious > about claims and result of research. > > Many?cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. If?we > expose our kid when we are not even aware of?his health to more than one > language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic > bilingual who benefit?multiple exposures. > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at > the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive > language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with > language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some times > they show aggressive behavior. > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about > purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we are > not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN > wrote: >> >> Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, >> 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of >> us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in >> saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember >> most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) >> and write a lot of papers... >> So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their >> children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. >> I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your >> time and don't follow ONE advice. >> Best, >> Aliyah from Paris >> Le 9 mai 2011 ? 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a ?crit : >> >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other >> languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >>> >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his many >>> languages. ?In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >>> not a risk factor in development. ?This is echoed by >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >>> >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >>>> >>>> Hello all, >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. >>>> >>>> >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >>>> >>>> >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >>>> >>>> >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >>>> life. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Tamar & Yves >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 09:04:35 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 12:34:35 +0330 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Christophe, Thank you so much for your reply. As you stated "how environment can trigger autism but environment seems not to be the origin of this "impairment" seems not but no research proves this. Some say *Genetics*, some say *Genetics + environment, some other says Vaccine, Some say environment*. I have recently read an article that state *all of us can be placed on this spectrum one way or another* but with low percentage. You know there is no agreement yet on whether Science is Fact or Hypothesis. As researchers, we cannot give advice to risk kids' health even if we have enough evidence that there are many bilingual kids that are healthy. What is agreed here is that early bilingualism would lead to *language delay * (either expressive or comprehension) and this could be dangerous for a possible autistic child. and we will not learn some autistic symptoms until *ages of two or even five and even ten*. In science we are working with *probability*. No one can here claim that all ideas stated early in this list are true for 100% and when it *comes to health* (mentally and cognitively) we are even cautious with even minimum percents (saying 10 % percent). Of course, by saying these I mean to be of help not ignoring some probable facts. Best regards, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 12:06 PM, Christophe dos Santos < christophe.h.dos.santos at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > I have read a lot of papers recently that seems to show that Autism is > strongly based on genetic origin (not only one gene but a pool of > genetic alterations can cause autism). > It is not clear however ". > > A general article about autism (but a simple search will give you a > lot more information about genetic issues linked with autism) : > > http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/autism-and-genetics-a-breakthrough-that-sheds-light-on-a-medical-mystery-1996221.html > > Best, > > Christophe dos Santos > Universit? Fran?ois Rabelais, Tours > > 2011/5/9 parisa Daftarifard : > > Dear Aliyah, > > > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is not > being > > bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is > > about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the one > Edith > > explained) one language is dominant and functional. > > > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from zero > (one > > month forward) would exist very much or not. Usually one language is > > functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish > or > > Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all > of > > them because I have no research at hand), through my individual > questioning > > parents, are interacted in one language first and the second language is > not > > dominant or interactional in early stages. > > > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but when > we > > approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be very > cautious > > about claims and result of research. > > > > Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. > If we > > expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more than one > > language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic > > bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. > > > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at > > the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive > > language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with > > language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some > times > > they show aggressive behavior. > > > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about > > purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we > are > > not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > > > Best, > > Parisa Daftarifard > > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN > > wrote: > >> > >> Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > >> 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some > of > >> us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick > in > >> saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And > remember > >> most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French > speakers) > >> and write a lot of papers... > >> So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with > their > >> children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. > >> I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take > your > >> time and don't follow ONE advice. > >> Best, > >> Aliyah from Paris > >> Le 9 mai 2011 ? 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a ?crit : > >> > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, > developmental > >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology > >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other > >> languages. I can send you some books off list. > >> > >> Best, > >> Parisa > >> > >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: > >>> > >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, > >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your > >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to his > many > >>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading > of > >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of > itself is > >>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > >>> > >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Hello all, > >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > >>>> life. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> Tamar & Yves > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>>> For more options, visit this group at > >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>> For more options, visit this group at > >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "Info-CHILDES" group. > > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marilyn.vihman at york.ac.uk Mon May 9 09:33:47 2011 From: marilyn.vihman at york.ac.uk (marilyn vihman) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 12:33:47 +0300 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Just to add a word to this discussion: There is certainly no evidence that bilingualism in early childhood leads to real language delay - although the vocabulary size of bilingual children tends to be smaller in each language, while still being larger if the two are put together (see studies by Barbara Pearson, inter alia). How could we possibly demonstrate that bilingualism leads to delay? Each child is different in rate of language learning; there is no way to know whether a child exposed to two languages would have learned more quickly if exposed to only one - but since bilingual children often have vocabularies of a very respectable size by age two (500 words or more in production, with a correspondingly good start on producing combinations), there is definitely no overall tendency for language delay - based on the many case studies published to date. The question of the best advice for a multilingual family whose child IS seriously delayed (by which I mean very few words as late as 2.5 years and no word combinations) is something else again: I think the experts are divided on this one, but common sense suggests that consistent home use of just one language may be helpful for a child who happens to have difficulty with language learning. One small bit of anecdotal evidence: I have just met the family of a child exposed to three languages from the start (English as the interparental language, Estonian from the mother and Spanish from the father), who had a number of clearly identifiable words at 9 months - which is remarkably early for any child, monolingual or not. This single example is enough to illustrate at least that real precocity in lang. dev. is not incompatible with multiple-language exposure. (Should we believe that this child was 'delayed' and would have had 10-20 words already at age 7-8 mos? I know of no reason to think so!) -marilyn vihman On 9 May 2011, at 12:04, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear Christophe, > Thank you so much for your reply. As you stated "how environment can > trigger autism but > environment seems not to be the origin of this "impairment" seems > not but no research proves this. Some say Genetics, some say > Genetics + environment, some other says Vaccine, Some say > environment. I have recently read an article that state all of us > can be placed on this spectrum one way or another but with low > percentage. You know there is no agreement yet on whether Science is > Fact or Hypothesis. > > As researchers, we cannot give advice to risk kids' health even if > we have enough evidence that there are many bilingual kids that are > healthy. > > What is agreed here is that early bilingualism would lead to > language delay (either expressive or comprehension) and this could > be dangerous for a possible autistic child. and we will not learn > some autistic symptoms until ages of two or even five and even ten. > > In science we are working with probability. No one can here claim > that all ideas stated early in this list are true for 100% and when > it comes to health (mentally and cognitively) we are even cautious > with even minimum percents (saying 10 % percent). > Of course, by saying these I mean to be of help not ignoring some > probable facts. > > Best regards, > Parisa > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 12:06 PM, Christophe dos Santos > wrote: > Dear Parisa, > > I have read a lot of papers recently that seems to show that Autism is > strongly based on genetic origin (not only one gene but a pool of > genetic alterations can cause autism). > It is not clear however ". > > A general article about autism (but a simple search will give you a > lot more information about genetic issues linked with autism) : > http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/autism-and-genetics-a-breakthrough-that-sheds-light-on-a-medical-mystery-1996221.html > > Best, > > Christophe dos Santos > Universit? Fran?ois Rabelais, Tours > > 2011/5/9 parisa Daftarifard : > > Dear Aliyah, > > > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is > not being > > bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) > but is > > about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the > one Edith > > explained) one language is dominant and functional. > > > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from > zero (one > > month forward) would exist very much or not. Usually one language is > > functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. > Turkish or > > Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say > not all of > > them because I have no research at hand), through my individual > questioning > > parents, are interacted in one language first and the second > language is not > > dominant or interactional in early stages. > > > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but > when we > > approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be > very cautious > > about claims and result of research. > > > > Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age > two. If we > > expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more > than one > > language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of > autistic > > bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. > > > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start > speaking at > > the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. > expressive > > language is very important to mental health. I have seen those > kids with > > language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves > some times > > they show aggressive behavior. > > > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about > > purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language > while we are > > not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > > > Best, > > Parisa Daftarifard > > > > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN > > wrote: > >> > >> Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > >> 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and > some of > >> us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be > so quick in > >> saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. > And remember > >> most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French > speakers) > >> and write a lot of papers... > >> So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do > with their > >> children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural > society. > >> I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE > take your > >> time and don't follow ONE advice. > >> Best, > >> Aliyah from Paris > >> Le 9 mai 2011 ? 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a ?crit : > >> > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true > >> bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, > developmental > >> delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent > psychology > >> suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed > to other > >> languages. I can send you some books off list. > >> > >> Best, > >> Parisa > >> > >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade > wrote: > >>> > >>> Dear Tamar and Yves, > >>> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to > your > >>> second question about how early should you expose your child to > his many > >>> languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my > reading of > >>> the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an > of itself is > >>> not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by > >>> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > >>> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > >>> > >>> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Hello all, > >>>> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each > one of > >>>> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English > between > >>>> us) and to a 4th one outside. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what > language > >>>> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to > all 4 > >>>> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years > of his > >>>> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > >>>> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English) > (4)) > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden > on him, > >>>> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the > answer, but > >>>> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific > issues > >>>> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication > on > >>>> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby > to those > >>>> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years > of his > >>>> life. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> Tamar & Yves > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the > Google > >>>> Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com > . > >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>>> For more options, visit this group at > >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the > Google Groups > >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. > >>> To post to this group, send email to info- > childes at googlegroups.com. > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > >>> For more options, visit this group at > >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > "Info-CHILDES" group. > > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > > > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . Marilyn M. Vihman Professor, Language and Linguistic Science V/C/210, 2nd Floor, Block C, Vanbrugh College University of York Heslington York YO10 5DD tel 01904 433612 fax 01904 432673 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tamarmr at gmail.com Mon May 9 10:18:59 2011 From: tamarmr at gmail.com (Tamar & Yves) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 03:18:59 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear beachjade, Thanks for the referals. In our case, multiligualism is a necessity, so what's left is to find out how to supprt our son's acuisition of those 4 languages more easily. This is why we find your referal to studies on the psychological aspects of it so helpful. Thanks again, Tamar & Yves On 9 ???, 02:25, beachjade wrote: > Dear Tamar and Yves, > > There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second > question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. > ?In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the > literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not > a risk factor in development. ?This is echoed by > > http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf > > http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm > > On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: > > > > > Hello all, > > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > > life. > > > Thanks, > > Tamar & Yves > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "Info-CHILDES" group. > > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en.-???? ???? ?????- > > -???? ???? ?????- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu Mon May 9 10:58:20 2011 From: natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu (Natalia Rakhlin) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 06:58:20 -0400 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, The alleged link between vaccines and autism has been thoroughly investigated by high-quality peer-reviewed studies on thousands of children in a number of different countries, which found no evidence of any such link. A good review of these studies (with citations) is in a recent article in Current Opinion in Pediatrics (Landrigan, P. J. (2010). What causes autism? Exploring the environmental contribution; Current Opinion in Pediatrics, 22(2), pp. 219-225). Although we do not know yet what causes autism (genetic factors, yes - but these alone are not sufficient to explain it in totality), we do know pretty definitively that vaccines or parenting style do not cause autism. Lancet famously retracted the 12-year-old article that claimed to have found a vaccination-autism link because the data in it were fabricated. The article I mentioned reviews the genetics studies of autism and probes other potential environmental causes, which all involve very early (prenatal) exposure to neurotoxins, such as lead, methylmercury, DDT, etc., whose effects on humans have not been studied well enough, but which plausibly may cause injury to developing brain. Like others who responded to this query, I am not aware of any study that suggested that early exposure to multiple languages is linked to autism. Sincerely, Natalia Natalia Rakhlin Child Study Center Yale University 230 South Frontage Road New Haven, CT 06519-1124 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From arieh.sherris at gmail.com Mon May 9 13:20:36 2011 From: arieh.sherris at gmail.com (Ari Sherris) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 16:20:36 +0300 Subject: CAL Digest on myths related to raising bilingual children Message-ID: The Center for Applied Linguistics (Washington, DC) has a CAL Digest (2006) on myths related to raising bilingual children that was written by two Georgetown Researcher. The digest is in English and Spanish at http://www.cal.org/resources/digest/raising-bilingual-children.html -- Arieh (Ari) Sherris, PhD King Abdullah University of Science and Technology Building 18, Room 3238 Kingldom of Saudi Arabia My Google pages: https://sites.google.com/site/arisherris/ Website: http://www.kaust.edu.sa Recent publications for language teachers: Sherris (2010). Coaching Language Teachers. http://www.cal.org/resources/digest/coachinglangteachers.html Sherris (2008) Integrated Content and Language Instruction. http://www.cal.org/resources/digest/integratedcontent.html Sherris, A., Bauder, T., Hillyard, L. (2007). An Insider's Guide to SIOP Coaching. http://calstore.cal.org/store/detail.aspx?ID=337 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com Mon May 9 13:30:43 2011 From: aliyah.morgenstern at gmail.com (Aliyah MORGENSTERN) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 15:30:43 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, There is a lot of literature on "healthy" early bilingualism, I won't quote all my famous friends and colleagues, all specialists know them. As Tamar and Yves have just written, in their case, early trilingualism is a NECESSITY, as is bilingualism for millions of children whose parents speak different native languages. I believe health is extremely important, but what do you call health? Do you think Tunisian mothers married to French fathers who don't speak French at all when they arrive in France should NOT SPEAK to their child at all? I wouldn't have communicated with my American mother who arrived in France (with my father and myself) when I was three months old if she had not spoken English to me. The relational/affective implications are as important as the health implications you are mentioning. I am particularly sensitive to this issue since in France, the Senate issued a document a few years ago telling teachers to influence "foreign" parents to speak FRENCH to their children at home so that the children wouldn't be "delayed". It could be a real tragedy when parents speak very poor French (and even if they have a good command of their second language, shouldn't they speak their native language to their own children?) , and the implications for deaf children who are prevented from being bilingual and learning a sign language are serious. So, even though I am absolutely not a specialist of the clinical dimension, I think one should take all the risks into account, including risks of not creating a healthy relationship with your own parent, or the risk of not having any command of language at all (deaf children for example). Best regards, Aliyah Le 9 mai 2011 ? 10:21, parisa Daftarifard a ?crit : > Dear Aliyah, > > Thank you for your reply and comment. What I am cautious about is not being bilingual (I speak two languages and understand three languages) but is about early bilingualism. Many early bilingualism (for example the one Edith explained) one language is dominant and functional. > > I think we need research to see if multilingual interaction from zero (one month forward) would exist very much or not. Usually one language is functional not two languages. This is the case we have in Iran. Turkish or Armenia all are bilingual but kids from zero are mostly (if I say not all of them because I have no research at hand), through my individual questioning parents, are interacted in one language first and the second language is not dominant or interactional in early stages. > > from educational perspective, bilingualism brings many chances but when we approach the issue from the clinical perspective we need to be very cautious about claims and result of research. > > Many cognitive problems like autism may not show itself till age two. If we expose our kid when we are not even aware of his health to more than one language, our kids are at risk. Unless you have an evidence of autistic bilingual who benefit multiple exposures. > > Moreover, do you think who is more healthy: the kid who start speaking at the age two or the one who starts at the age of four or five. expressive language is very important to mental health. I have seen those kids with language delay that are angry when they cannot express themselves some times they show aggressive behavior. > > Natural exposure is not what we argue about here. I am talking about purposefully confusing kid with many functionally used language while we are not sure that this kid is completely OK. > > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Aliyah MORGENSTERN wrote: > Dear Parisa, dear Tamar and Yves, > > 3/4th of the world is at least bilingual, if not multilingual and some of us have been exposed to 2 , 3, 4 languages from birth. Don't be so quick in saying it provokes more language delay than being monolingual. And remember most monolinguals are native English speakers (and native French speakers) and write a lot of papers... > So lets take our time before we stress parents about what to do with their children when they are lucky enough to live in a multicultural society. > I'm sure more specialists of multilingualism will answer. PLEASE take your time and don't follow ONE advice. > Best, > Aliyah from Paris > > Le 9 mai 2011 ? 05:11, parisa Daftarifard a ?crit : > >> Language delay is much more dangerous than loosing time for true bilingualism. There are many risk factors like being autistic, developmental delay and global delay in terms of cognition. I think recent psychology suggests for learning one language first and then being exposed to other languages. I can send you some books off list. >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 3:55 AM, beachjade wrote: >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your second question about how early should you expose your child to his many languages. In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is not a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> Hello all, >> Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> >> Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> >> We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> >> We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> life. >> >> Thanks, >> Tamar & Yves >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hkasuya at gmail.com Mon May 9 14:10:30 2011 From: hkasuya at gmail.com (Hiroko Kasuya) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 23:10:30 +0900 Subject: JSLS2011 Call for Participation Message-ID: Call for Participation in the 13th Annual International Conference of the Japanese Society for Language Sciences (JSLS2011) The annual conference of the Japanese Society for Language Sciences will be held on June 25 and 26, 2011, at Kansai University in Osaka. Dr. Niko Besnier of the University of Amsterdam and Dr. Yasuhiro Katagiri of Future University Hakodate will deliver a plenary lecture. In addition, there will be a symposium, conducted in English, entitled "Reconsidering communicative competence: Findings and suggestions from fieldwork/empirical research" by Dr. Zane Goebel (LaTrobe University) , Dr. Akira Takada (Kyoto University), and Dr. Misao Okada (Hokusei Gakuen University). The deadline for pre-registration has already started. The deadline is June 1 (Wednesday) for presenters, and June 12th for general participation. For more information, please visit the conference website: http://www.jslsweb.sakura.ne.jp/jsls2011/wiki.cgi (Please note that the call for papers has closed.) Inquiries may be sent to the conference chair, Keiko IKEDA: keikoike at ipcku.kansai-u.ac.jp -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From miquel.serra at ub.edu Mon May 9 15:20:22 2011 From: miquel.serra at ub.edu (Miquel Serra) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 17:20:22 +0200 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <5E4B6534-8E49-4001-B50E-D98E66B2CEFE@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Parisa Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a desire of parents or politicians (and academics). Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional and has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant language. Miquel Serra U Barcelona, Catalonia -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 9 17:06:13 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 20:36:13 +0330 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <4DC80636.5040203@ub.edu> Message-ID: Dear Miquel and all, I understand that the concept is very important to you and many parents and sometimes a must in certain situation. I guess what I explained creates a little bit misunderstanding. What I said was that 1. Some children are at risk of many problems which leads to language delay (these problems would not show themselves very early) 2. We are not sure that who are those children 3. early simultaneous bilingualism might compound the situation for these kids for unknown reasons 4. Expressive and fluent and creative language development in many instances of bilingualism (based on experiences and papers) would requires more time than usual kids unless one language is dominant and functional and the other just environmental. what I have seen is based on clinical study. although we do not have many reports on language delay and bilingualism or autism, we cannot ignore some instances we see around. We are facing with *an innocent child* who is supposed to learn *an instrument* through which he develops his cognition, ways of expression, feeling and many other things. Some children, for unknown reasons, have language delay. many bilinguals (most of them) will start speaking fluently and creatively later than their own age. Some of the children have autistic signs and many language and cognitive impairments. Who can say any formula for these situations? All are mystery to us What I am suggesting is that we as parents should create the situation for the kid so that he learns one language functionally first and then moves to another language. You may disagree! And I agree to disagree... I have seen many bilinguals who *have problems* and their parents became concerned about their problems. because of the same situation you explained: mother was Iranian, Father English speaker, country Arab. The kid didn't speak at the age of three! What the doctor suggested was to stop speaking other languages but one that is mostly dominant. Let's say that the kid has other factors as well.... How would you claim that you can distinguish these kids from the rest when they are one month?! I hope I express my meaning. I have seen many instances like this. My son was exposed to English through TV and my interaction, his environment and father's interaction was Persian. His language development is very slow, even we thought that he might have had serious problems. I stopped English. Many instances like these exist that have not developed into papers. finding no paper about similar situation in an ISI journal cannot stop a researcher to ignore many other instances that assure the risk. When it comes to *clinical situation*, we decide based on few instances. I hope more research to be done regarding the benefits of bilingualism on true early bilingualism or simultaneous bilingualism which would clearly explain what the situation is. It would be great if we can learn about ideas of other specialists as well like psychologists, cognitive psychologists, those who are working with problematic children. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:50 PM, Miquel Serra wrote: > Dear Parisa > Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) > adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a desire > of parents or politicians (and academics). > Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project > depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional and > has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the > children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant language. > Miquel Serra > U Barcelona, Catalonia > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From elenan at ualberta.ca Mon May 9 17:17:04 2011 From: elenan at ualberta.ca (Elena Nicoladis) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 11:17:04 -0600 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear colleagues, On the question of autism, keeping in mind Eve Clark's point that anecdotes are never data, we have some videotaped observations of three children with autism who were exposed to two languages (two French & English, one Tagalog & English). They varied considerably in terms of how much they could use language. The highest functioning child could use both languages fluently and even to tell stories, the lowest functioning child simply repeated words on occasion (in both French and English) and the third child was somewhere in the middle, but using both languages approximately equally well. All of these children had fairly equal exposure to both languages. Keeping in mind that we have no comparison to typically developing children, were these results generalizable to a larger population, they would suggest that autism affects language(s) at some sort of constant rate. So, bilingualism would not be seen as a "burden" on children with autism. Adults count languages and often assume that the higher the number to be acquired, the harder the task. I'm not convinced that children count languages-- they seem to be learning appropriate behaviour for contexts in which they regularly find themselves. Language choice is part of appropriate behaviour for a context. Elena Quoting "parisa Daftarifard" : > Dear Miquel and all, > > I understand that the concept is very important to you and many parents and > sometimes a must in certain situation. I guess what I explained creates a > little bit misunderstanding. > > What I said was that > 1. Some children are at risk of many problems which leads to language delay > (these problems would not show themselves very early) > 2. We are not sure that who are those children > 3. early simultaneous bilingualism might compound the situation for these > kids for unknown reasons > 4. Expressive and fluent and creative language development in many > instances of bilingualism (based on experiences and papers) would requires > more time than usual kids unless one language is dominant and functional and > the other just environmental. > > what I have seen is based on clinical study. although we do not have many > reports on language delay and bilingualism or autism, we cannot ignore some > instances we see around. > > We are facing with *an innocent child* who is supposed to learn *an > instrument* through which he develops his cognition, ways of expression, > feeling and many other things. Some children, for unknown reasons, have > language delay. many bilinguals (most of them) will start speaking fluently > and creatively later than their own age. Some of the children have autistic > signs and many language and cognitive impairments. Who can say any formula > for these situations? All are mystery to us > > What I am suggesting is that we as parents should create the situation for > the kid so that he learns one language functionally first and then moves to > another language. You may disagree! And I agree to disagree... > > I have seen many bilinguals who *have problems* and their parents became > concerned about their problems. because of the same situation you > explained: mother was Iranian, Father English speaker, country Arab. The kid > didn't speak at the age of three! What the doctor suggested was to stop > speaking other languages but one that is mostly dominant. Let's say that the > kid has other factors as well.... How would you claim that you can > distinguish these kids from the rest when they are one month?! I hope I > express my meaning. > > I have seen many instances like this. My son was exposed to English through > TV and my interaction, his environment and father's interaction was Persian. > His language development is very slow, even we thought that he might have > had serious problems. I stopped English. Many instances like these exist > that have not developed into papers. finding no paper about similar > situation in an ISI journal cannot stop a researcher to ignore many other > instances that assure the risk. > > When it comes to *clinical situation*, we decide based on few instances. I > hope more research to be done regarding the benefits of bilingualism on true > early bilingualism or simultaneous bilingualism which would clearly explain > what the situation is. > > It would be great if we can learn about ideas of other specialists as well > like psychologists, cognitive psychologists, those who are working with > problematic children. > > > Best, > Parisa > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:50 PM, Miquel Serra wrote: > >> Dear Parisa >> Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) >> adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a desire >> of parents or politicians (and academics). >> Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project >> depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional and >> has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the >> children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant language. >> Miquel Serra >> U Barcelona, Catalonia >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> > > > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > *************************************** Elena Nicoladis, PhD Department of Psychology University of Alberta P2-17 Biological Sciences Bdg. Edmonton AB T6G 2E9 CANADA "Since all the sciences, and especially psychology, are still immersed in such tremendous realms of the uncertain and the unknown, the best that any individual scientist, especially any psychologist, can do seems to be to follow his own gleam and his own bent, however inadequate they may be. In the end, the only sure criterion is to have fun." E. C. Tolman, 1959 *************************************** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From barriere.isa at gmail.com Mon May 9 18:07:52 2011 From: barriere.isa at gmail.com (isa barriere) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:07:52 -0400 Subject: multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <20110509111704.193181hulkijjm34@webmail.ualberta.ca> Message-ID: Dear all, Just an addendum to Elena's message. I will not repeat the points made by my expert colleaguges, re: multilingualism not being a risk in itself. With respect to Autism Spectrum Disorders, there is a very interesting article (and thesis) by Kremer-Sadlik (see reference below). It cleraly shows that depriving children with ASD of multilingualism when they have to function in a multilingual social context is actually detrimental in that it increases their social isolation etc. Kremer-Sadlik, T. (2005) To Be or Not to Be Bilingual: Autistic Children from Multilingual Families. Cohen, K.T.McAlister, K. Rolstad & J. MacSwan (Eds.) ISB4: Proceedings of the *4th International **Symposium on Bilingualism. * With respect to ther sources of langauge delays, there has been many publications on a) the fact that bilingualism does not cause SLI and that SLI children benefit from bilingualism (Sharon's work, Paradis'work etc) and b) a few studies re: the fact that bilingualism has no detrimental effect on children with Down Syndrome etc (by Trudeau etc)... Best, Isabelle Barriere, PhD On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 1:17 PM, Elena Nicoladis wrote: > Dear colleagues, > On the question of autism, keeping in mind Eve Clark's point that anecdotes > are never data, we have some videotaped observations of three children with > autism who were exposed to two languages (two French & English, one Tagalog > & English). They varied considerably in terms of how much they could use > language. The highest functioning child could use both languages fluently > and even to tell stories, the lowest functioning child simply repeated words > on occasion (in both French and English) and the third child was somewhere > in the middle, but using both languages approximately equally well. All of > these > children had fairly equal exposure to both languages. > > Keeping in mind that we have no comparison to typically developing > children, were these results generalizable to a larger population, they > would suggest that autism affects language(s) at some sort of constant rate. > So, bilingualism would not be seen as a "burden" on children with autism. > > Adults count languages and often assume that the higher the number to be > acquired, the harder the task. I'm not convinced that children count > languages-- they seem to be learning appropriate behaviour for contexts in > which they regularly find themselves. Language choice is part of appropriate > behaviour for a context. > > Elena > > > Quoting "parisa Daftarifard" : > > Dear Miquel and all, >> >> I understand that the concept is very important to you and many parents >> and >> sometimes a must in certain situation. I guess what I explained creates a >> little bit misunderstanding. >> >> What I said was that >> 1. Some children are at risk of many problems which leads to language >> delay >> (these problems would not show themselves very early) >> 2. We are not sure that who are those children >> 3. early simultaneous bilingualism might compound the situation for these >> kids for unknown reasons >> 4. Expressive and fluent and creative language development in many >> instances of bilingualism (based on experiences and papers) would requires >> more time than usual kids unless one language is dominant and functional >> and >> the other just environmental. >> >> what I have seen is based on clinical study. although we do not have many >> reports on language delay and bilingualism or autism, we cannot ignore >> some >> instances we see around. >> >> We are facing with *an innocent child* who is supposed to learn *an >> instrument* through which he develops his cognition, ways of expression, >> feeling and many other things. Some children, for unknown reasons, have >> language delay. many bilinguals (most of them) will start speaking >> fluently >> and creatively later than their own age. Some of the children have >> autistic >> signs and many language and cognitive impairments. Who can say any formula >> for these situations? All are mystery to us >> >> What I am suggesting is that we as parents should create the situation for >> the kid so that he learns one language functionally first and then moves >> to >> another language. You may disagree! And I agree to disagree... >> >> I have seen many bilinguals who *have problems* and their parents became >> concerned about their problems. because of the same situation you >> explained: mother was Iranian, Father English speaker, country Arab. The >> kid >> didn't speak at the age of three! What the doctor suggested was to stop >> speaking other languages but one that is mostly dominant. Let's say that >> the >> kid has other factors as well.... How would you claim that you can >> distinguish these kids from the rest when they are one month?! I hope I >> express my meaning. >> >> I have seen many instances like this. My son was exposed to English >> through >> TV and my interaction, his environment and father's interaction was >> Persian. >> His language development is very slow, even we thought that he might have >> had serious problems. I stopped English. Many instances like these exist >> that have not developed into papers. finding no paper about similar >> situation in an ISI journal cannot stop a researcher to ignore many other >> instances that assure the risk. >> >> When it comes to *clinical situation*, we decide based on few instances. I >> hope more research to be done regarding the benefits of bilingualism on >> true >> early bilingualism or simultaneous bilingualism which would clearly >> explain >> what the situation is. >> >> It would be great if we can learn about ideas of other specialists as >> well >> like psychologists, cognitive psychologists, those who are working with >> problematic children. >> >> >> Best, >> Parisa >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:50 PM, Miquel Serra wrote: >> >> Dear Parisa >>> Bilingulism is both, a situation to which a family has to (functionally) >>> adapt and a project for the children to fullfill. It is not (only) a >>> desire >>> of parents or politicians (and academics). >>> Adaptation depends on many factors and circumstances. And a project >>> depends on long distance goals and means for them. If one is fucntional >>> and >>> has clear goals, there is no problem. But it is more important for the >>> children to admire a culture than to be pressed to learn a distant >>> language. >>> Miquel Serra >>> U Barcelona, Catalonia >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Info-CHILDES" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Parisa Daftarifard >> Phd Student of TEFL >> Islamic Azad University of Science and Research >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Info-CHILDES" group. >> To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. >> >> >> > > > *************************************** > Elena Nicoladis, PhD > Department of Psychology > University of Alberta > P2-17 Biological Sciences Bdg. > Edmonton AB > T6G 2E9 > CANADA > > "Since all the sciences, and especially psychology, are still immersed in > such tremendous realms of the uncertain and the unknown, the best that any > individual scientist, especially any psychologist, can do seems to be to > follow his own gleam and his own bent, however inadequate they may be. In > the end, the only sure criterion is to have fun." > E. C. Tolman, 1959 > *************************************** > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lofa4 at hotmail.com Mon May 9 19:58:31 2011 From: lofa4 at hotmail.com (lofa) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 21:58:31 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: <013cc2fb-e517-4e50-9ae6-f7c65124fe25@m10g2000yqd.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: Dear Tamar & Yves, I was just wondering how long you were planning to remain in the country with the 4th language? how well do you speak that 4th language yourself? Why didn't you name that 4th language, what's so secret about it, do you like the culture there? Your perception of languages may affect the way your child will relate to them. And does your son look to you like he's bothered by the present linguistic diversity now, like he's not reacting like you'd expect him to? You certainly do not have to reply, but it might help to ask yourself those questions. I see kids with language delays in France, and true that most of them are from bi- & tri-lingual families (I'd say 80%), but most of those families have to deal with situations and most of the mothers did not go to college (the mother's education matters in case of language delays) and some only speak French so well. Most of the time, there is some kind of cultural gap between France and their cultures. I think the issue is not bilingualism, it is biligualism in those situations. I side with those who say that a kid needs his parents to communicate with him as much as possible, in the language that they feel is the most authentic for them. Kind regards, V?ronique -------------------------------------------------- From: "Tamar & Yves" Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 12:18 PM To: "Info-CHILDES" Subject: Re: a question about multilingual babies > Dear beachjade, > Thanks for the referals. In our case, multiligualism is a necessity, > so what's left is to find out how to supprt our son's acuisition of > those 4 languages more easily. > > This is why we find your referal to studies on the psychological > aspects of it so helpful. > > Thanks again, > Tamar & Yves > > On 9 ???, 02:25, beachjade wrote: >> Dear Tamar and Yves, >> >> There is a recent paper by Janet Werker that may be relevant to your >> second >> question about how early should you expose your child to his many >> languages. >> In contrast to an earlier response to your post, my reading of the >> literature suggests that bilingualism/multilingualism in an of itself is >> not >> a risk factor in development. This is echoed by >> >> http://www.lsadc.org/info/pdf_files/Bilingual.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/journals/pspi/pspi_10_3.pdf >> >> http://www.psychologicalscience.org/media/releases/2010/werker.cfm >> >> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Tamar & Yves wrote: >> >> >> >> > Hello all, >> > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of >> > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between >> > us) and to a 4th one outside. >> >> > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language >> > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 >> > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his >> > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's >> > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) >> >> > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, >> > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. >> >> > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but >> > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues >> > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on >> > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those >> > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his >> > life. >> >> > Thanks, >> > Tamar & Yves >> >> > -- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > Groups >> > "Info-CHILDES" group. >> > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> > For more options, visit this group at >> >http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en.-???? ???? ?????- >> >> -???? ???? ?????- > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From macw at cmu.edu Mon May 9 20:54:33 2011 From: macw at cmu.edu (Brian MacWhinney) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 22:54:33 +0200 Subject: posting from Joanne Message-ID: Here is note from Joanne Paradis that she is having trouble posting. So I am sending it for her. -- Brian MacWhinney Dear colleagues I would like to add my voice to the majority of you who have strongly supported early bilingualism in your comments. My professional experience as a researcher of early bilingualism and language disorders, as well as my experience as a mother of two bilingual-from-birth children, lead me to to unequivocally support early bilingualism. In particular, there is no research evidence that children with language delay and disorders - even autism - have their condition exacerbated by bilingualism; existing research suggests the contrary. In addition, there are numerous reasons based on family and societal context that point to bilingualism as the best or only choice for children with language disorders. Fred Genesee, Martha Crago and I have dealt with many of the issues that have come forward in this discussion in the second edition of our book: Dual language development and disorders. A link to the book and a Q&A with the authors is below. (I hope you will forgive this "self-promotion"). Paradis, J., Genesee, F., & Crago, M. (2010). Dual language development and disorders: A handbook on bilingualism and second language learning (2nd Edition). Baltimore, MD: Brookes. http://www.brookespublishing.com/store/books/paradis-70588/index.htm -Johanne **************************************************************************************************** Johanne Paradis | Associate Professor | Department of Linguistics 4-46 Assiniboia Hall | University of Alberta | Edmonton, AB | T6G 2E7 | Canada tel: 1 (780) 492-0805 | fax: 1 (780) 492-0806 | http://www.ualberta.ca/~jparadis/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From natalija.radivojevic at gmail.com Mon May 9 21:22:52 2011 From: natalija.radivojevic at gmail.com (Natalija Radivojevic) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:22:52 -0700 Subject: MacArthur CDI-adaptation in Croatian language Message-ID: Dear all, I'm sorry for bugging some of you again with the same question, but I need help in locating Dr. Melita Kovacevic, author of the CDI adaptation in Croatian or anyone else who could provide us information about this inventory, it's standardisation, psychometric characteristics, and availability of the test for further research. I am a PhD student and I am currently involved in the project in the area of bilingualism. I am currently at Arizona State University on Short Term Scientific Mission and I am working with Dr. Restrepo on the development of the basic frame for bilingual Serbian-English assessment for children aged 2 to 3 years. We are informed that adaptation in Croatian is available, but we haven't been able to locate the author Dr. Melita Kovacevic. We tried with two of her e-mail addresses, but have had no success yet. If you have any information about how we could get in touch with Dr. Melita Kovacevic or any other person that could provide us these information, please let us know. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From eclark at stanford.edu Mon May 9 21:45:24 2011 From: eclark at stanford.edu (Eve V. Clark) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:45:24 -0700 Subject: MacArthur CDI-adaptation in Croatian language In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Melita Kovacevic, Department of Speech & Language Pathology, University of Zagreb melita.kovacevic at public.srce.hr melita.kovacevic at unizg.hr www.labpolin.org/eunm-cdi/program.pdf No address in the IASCL address list On May 9, 2011, at 2:22 PM, Natalija Radivojevic wrote: > Dear all, > > I'm sorry for bugging some of you again with the same question, but I > need help in locating Dr. Melita Kovacevic, author of the CDI > adaptation in Croatian or anyone else who could provide us information > about this inventory, it's standardisation, psychometric > characteristics, and availability of the test for further research. > > I am a PhD student and I am currently involved in the project in the > area of bilingualism. I am currently at Arizona State University on > Short Term Scientific Mission and I am working with Dr. Restrepo on > the development of the basic frame for bilingual Serbian-English > assessment for children aged 2 to 3 years. > > We are informed that adaptation in Croatian is available, but we > haven't been able to locate the author Dr. Melita Kovacevic. We tried > with two of her e-mail addresses, but have had no success yet. > > If you have any information about how we could get in touch with Dr. > Melita Kovacevic or any other person that could provide us these > information, please let us know. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Tue May 10 10:07:02 2011 From: k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk (Katie Alcock) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 03:07:02 -0700 Subject: Language acquisition in sub-Saharan Africa Message-ID: I've tried to post this message twice so here's hoping it goes through this time... I'm writing a review chapter on this topic and I'm keen to make sure I don't miss those hard-to-find articles. If you have anything, or know of anything, that you feel should be included, particularly if it's not published in a widely-available journal (conference papers, PhD theses, articles in press, that kind of thing), please do get in touch (preferably off list if you can work out how to do that...) I'm excluding languages of European origin (I haven't had to make a decision about Arabic yet as I haven't found any papers on children in the region acquiring Arabic). Thanks very much Katie k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Katie Alcock, DPhil, CPsychol Lecturer Department of Psychology University of Lancaster Fylde College Lancaster LA1 4YF Tel 01524 593833 Fax 01524 593744 Web http://www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/people/KatieAlcock.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From brunilda at gmail.com Tue May 10 19:35:51 2011 From: brunilda at gmail.com (Bruno) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 12:35:51 -0700 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hmmm, as for references, some of the best names in research of bilingualism have already been put forward. You know, my two cents, from reading the literature, investigating first language acquisition, having been raised simultaneous bilingual, and multilingual sequentially, and having a multilingual situation at home now, is that your child will be most fluent in whatever language they speak in most of the time. That will ALMOST ALWAYS be (in my opinion), the community language (seemingly the 4th language you're not mentioning). That is, the language of their peers (friends and foes alike :-) ). Your child will have varying degrees of fluency in the other languages, and will most likely be able to understand those languages almost perfectly if he/she keeps hearing them, even if the child ends up being quite unable to produce languages 1, 2, and 3. Moreover, I am afraid how much exposure your child gets before going to school may not matter as much, since attrition and loss at a very early age can happen in a matter of mere months. I would humbly put forth the following suggestion: you and your partner need to establish some clear goals for your child in terms of language proficiency. You will likely have to consider where you will be throughout your child's childhood, as well as how important each language is likely to be in the future FROM YOUR CHILD's perspective. If it is absolutely essential, or even highly desirable, that your child SPEAK languages 1, 2, or 3 (I am not sure about English in your case), then that will require a lot of effort on your part. In particular, it will require exposing your child to contexts where his/ her speaking those languages is communicationally, socially, and emotionally adequate (that is, for example, travel abroad to family, play dates with friends who do not speak their community language, etc.) HARD to do, not impossible. Bruno Estigarribia UNC-Chapel Hill On May 8, 1:48?pm, "Tamar & Yves" wrote: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From fromm at andrew.cmu.edu Wed May 11 01:27:12 2011 From: fromm at andrew.cmu.edu (Davida S Fromm) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 21:27:12 -0400 Subject: multilingualism Message-ID: Just to add a few comments on multilingualism: First, I agree with most of what's been said by others about children having no difficulty whatsoever learning more than one language from early on. I think the arguments and evidence on difference and delay, etc., are complex and demand more discussion than possible in emails. But the bottom line is that even where there may be initial differences across children with distinct exposure to language X, the differences are usually subtle, and in the end the differences get neutralized. I also agree with others that this is contingent, of course, on the child continuing to be exposed to the languages in question. (A child can't learn a language s/he is not hearing.) But what I wanted to bring up is that it is about time we turned these issues on their head. The discussions need to turn to how the MONOLINGUAL child is at a disadvantage, not the bilingual/multilingual child. Just to list some areas where this is true: 1. Easiest and most obvious: The monolingual ends up with only one language, the bilingual with two or more. In my mind, that is reason enough to bring up a child bilingually, if one has that option. Others in this discussion have already commented on the very considerable social, political, economic, cultural, etc. advantages of knowing more than one language, advantages that are on top of the linguistic advantages. 2. The facility and fluency with which a child growing up bilingually speaks those languages can rarely be gained by someone starting the second language at a later stage in life. Is there a single adult among us who began a language in adolescence or adulthood that would not have preferred to learn that language in childhood? We are doing a disservice to our children making them wait to learn a second language. 3. As mentioned by others, the bilingual child gains metalinguistic awareness earlier than monolingual children [i.e., one could say a monolingual child is "delayed" in metalinguistic awareness]. 4. The bilingual child is opened to distinct ways of viewing and thinking about the world according to the "packaging" offered by the language ? crosslinguistic differences have been shown to affect what we pay attention to, similarity judgments, and the like, as well as more down-to-earth matters such as how violent a jury might view the actions of a defendant in a trial to be (e.g., Luna Filipovic's work). 5. There is considerable evidence on bilingual advantages on executive function tasks ? sometimes they're faster, sometimes better/more accurate on such tasks. Again, the implication is that the monolingual is at a disadvantage. It is clear that a bilingual is not two monolinguals in one head. Poor monolingual. I think it often helps to draw analogies: Who has a richer experience as a musician ? the person who can play 2 or 3 or more instruments well, or the person who can only play one? If a drummer can bring enhanced sensitivities for rhythm to how s/he plays the guitar, does this make him/her a worse guitar player than one who can only play the guitar, or does it mean the "mono-guitar" player may be lacking some richness that can only be gained by being "multi-musical"? Ginny Gathercole Professor, School of Psychology Co-Director, ESRC Centre for Research on Bilingualism in Theory and Practice Bangor University Wales -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu Thu May 12 20:22:19 2011 From: natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu (Natalia Rakhlin) Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 16:22:19 -0400 Subject: job announcement Message-ID: Dear colleagues, Here is a job posting from Yale University. Please, pass it along to anyone who may be interested. For more information about the lab, please go to our website: www.yale.edu/eglab/index.html Thank you, Natalia Rakhlin Natalia Rakhlin Child Study Center Yale University 230 South Frontage Road New Haven, CT 06519-1124 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Arabic_job_Yale.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 31121 bytes Desc: not available URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 16 03:29:51 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 06:59:51 +0330 Subject: acquiring "or question" Message-ID: Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Mon May 16 08:53:38 2011 From: k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk (Alcock, Katie) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 09:53:38 +0100 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I assume that this has a fairly strong relationship to phonological short term memory, the recency effect and the primacy effect, all of which are fairly well covered in the literature. Katie Alcock From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto:info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard Sent: 16 May 2011 04:30 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: acquiring "or question" Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 16 08:57:09 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 12:27:09 +0330 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: <8D843A98A995F54E874111C9C6DADFE003B827FE@exchange-be7.lancs.local> Message-ID: Thank ou Katie, What if the kid just repeat the question? Best, Parisa On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Alcock, Katie wrote: > I assume that this has a fairly strong relationship to phonological short > term memory, the recency effect and the primacy effect, all of which are > fairly well covered in the literature. > > > > Katie Alcock > > > > > > *From:* info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto: > info-childes at googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *parisa Daftarifard > *Sent:* 16 May 2011 04:30 > *To:* info-childes at googlegroups.com > *Subject:* acquiring "or question" > > > > Dear List members, > > > > "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When > you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely > yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the > first option or choose the second option. > > > > > > Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific > topic. > > > > I appreciate your help in advance. > > Best, > > Parisa Daftarifard > > -- > > Parisa Daftarifard > > Phd Student of TEFL > > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk Mon May 16 09:02:31 2011 From: k.j.alcock at lancaster.ac.uk (Alcock, Katie) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 10:02:31 +0100 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: That's not unique to "or" questions, though, is it - children repeat a fair proportion of what they hear, verbatim (or as close as they can get), regardless of what type of input it is, but (though you'd have to look this up) probably more when they realise a response is required i.e. when it's a question. From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto:info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard Sent: 16 May 2011 09:57 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: Re: acquiring "or question" Thank ou Katie, What if the kid just repeat the question? Best, Parisa On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Alcock, Katie wrote: I assume that this has a fairly strong relationship to phonological short term memory, the recency effect and the primacy effect, all of which are fairly well covered in the literature. Katie Alcock From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [mailto:info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard Sent: 16 May 2011 04:30 To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: acquiring "or question" Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu Mon May 16 03:47:35 2011 From: natalia.rakhlin at yale.edu (Natalia Rakhlin) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 23:47:35 -0400 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Parisa, There is some work on children's interpretation of disjunction by Stephen Crain and his colleagues. For example, there was a BU proceedings paper (in 2001, I believe) by Chierchia, Crain, Guasti, Gualmini and Meroni on the acquisition of disjunction. There was another BU paper on this topic by Goro, Minai and Crain in 2005. I am not familiar with any review articles, though. Best, Natalia On May 15, 2011, at 11:29 PM, parisa Daftarifard wrote: > Dear List members, > > "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. > > > Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. > > I appreciate your help in advance. > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. Natalia Rakhlin Child Study Center Yale University 230 South Frontage Road New Haven, CT 06519-1124 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From KNelson at gc.cuny.edu Mon May 16 13:51:27 2011 From: KNelson at gc.cuny.edu (Nelson, Katherine) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 09:51:27 -0400 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Parisa, There is a now dated review of studies of "or" comprehension and production in the following: French, L. A. and K. Nelson (1985). Young children's understanding of relational terms: Some ifs, ors and buts. New York, Springer-Verlag. The conclusion there is that the disjunctive "or" is understood and used by children of 4 and 5 years but not younger, and that prior to this age it may be used as a conjunctive equivalent to "and". Thus most 2 year olds would not be expected to consistently reply to "or" questions appropriately. This source also noted that many studies of the comprehension of "or" indicated that this was not achieved until a much later age, but the argument in French and Nelson was that these studies conflated the natural language use of "or" with the formal logic understanding of the term. I have not kept up with this line of research so cannot provide any more recent sources. Katherine ________________________________ From: info-childes at googlegroups.com [info-childes at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard [pdaftaryfard at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2011 11:29 PM To: info-childes at googlegroups.com Subject: acquiring "or question" Dear List members, "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the first option or choose the second option. Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific topic. I appreciate your help in advance. Best, Parisa Daftarifard -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Mon May 16 16:08:00 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 19:38:00 +0330 Subject: acquiring "or question" In-Reply-To: <5D45CB1E13D80E4C8B05AEDC079CE7F217E74D2BC3@MAILBOX.gc.cuny.edu> Message-ID: Dear Natalia and Katherine, Thank you so much for your information. I hope to find more review . It is interesting point that not younger than 4 can understand or question. Best, Parisa On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Nelson, Katherine wrote: > Parisa, > There is a now dated review of studies of "or" comprehension and production > in the following: > > French, L. A. and K. Nelson (1985). *Young children's understanding of > relational terms: Some ifs, ors and buts*. New York, Springer-Verlag. > > The conclusion there is that the disjunctive "or" is understood and used by > children of 4 and 5 years but not younger, and that prior to this age it may > be used as a conjunctive equivalent to "and". Thus most 2 year olds would > not be expected to consistently reply to "or" questions appropriately. > > > > This source also noted that many studies of the comprehension of "or" > indicated that this was not achieved until a much later age, but the > argument in French and Nelson was that these studies conflated the natural > language use of "or" with the formal logic understanding of the term. > > > > I have not kept up with this line of research so cannot provide any more > recent sources. > > > > Katherine > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* info-childes at googlegroups.com [info-childes at googlegroups.com] On > Behalf Of parisa Daftarifard [pdaftaryfard at gmail.com] > *Sent:* Sunday, May 15, 2011 11:29 PM > > *To:* info-childes at googlegroups.com > *Subject:* acquiring "or question" > > Dear List members, > > "Or question" seem to be a difficult part of learning first language. When > you ask a kid of two years old whose language is not developed completely > yet an alternative question, he or she may repeat the question, choose the > first option or choose the second option. > > > Is there any review of the literature you may refer us to on the specific > topic. > > I appreciate your help in advance. > Best, > Parisa Daftarifard > -- > Parisa Daftarifard > Phd Student of TEFL > Islamic Azad University of Science and Research > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. > -- Parisa Daftarifard Phd Student of TEFL Islamic Azad University of Science and Research -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pdaftaryfard at gmail.com Fri May 20 07:40:54 2011 From: pdaftaryfard at gmail.com (parisa Daftarifard) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 11:10:54 +0330 Subject: Sorry for Cross-posting Message-ID: Dear List Members, Greetings, I apologize for cross-posting in this list. This lady is in dire need of English native speaker's idea. She asked me for help. She should be very much grateful for the precious time you may spend answering her questions Again I apologize for cross-posting. Also we should highly appreciate your kind concern and attention beforehand. Best, Parisa . --- On *Fri, 5/20/11, Maryam Esmaeili * wrote: From: Maryam Esmaeili Subject: Please help me Dear List members Greetings, I apologize for crossposting this request. For My MA thesis I am working on a topic regarding interlanguage pragmatics assessment. To do this I need to have *English Native* Speakers? idea through the questionnaire to which the link is given below. I should highly appreciate you if you kindly as Native English Speaker of English help me with this survey and answer the questions of this questionnaire. http://www.kwiksurveys.com?s=NKEHOI_1117d6e All participants will remain anonymous and no personal information will be collected. Your answer will provide us with invaluable information crucial for the completion of our investigation. I should highly appreciate your kind cooperation in advance. Best, Maryam MA Student, Shahrekord University -----Inline Attachment Follows----- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yrose at mun.ca Fri May 20 18:54:03 2011 From: yrose at mun.ca (Yvan Rose) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 14:54:03 -0400 Subject: New version of Phon available Message-ID: Dear Info-CHILDES and PhonBank list members, We are pleased to announce the release of Phon 1.5, which offers a vast array of improvements over all previous versions of the application. Please see the Release notes (link below) for a highlight of the most important changes. Brief description Phon is a software program that greatly facilitates a number of tasks required for the analysis of phonological development. Phon supports multimedia data linkage, unit segmentation, multiple-blind transcription, automatic labeling of data, and systematic comparisons between target (model) and actual (produced) phonological forms. All of these functions are accessible through a user-friendly graphical interface. Databases managed within Phon can also be queried using a powerful search interface. This software program works on Mac OS X, Windows and Unix/Linux platforms, is fully compliant with the CHILDES/TalkBank XML format, and supports Unicode font encoding. Phon is being made freely available to the community as open-source software. It meets specific needs related to the study of first language phonological development (including babbling), second language acquisition, and speech disorders. Phon facilitates data exchange among researchers and the construction of a shared PhonBank database, which supports research in all areas of phonological development. Important links Links to Phon: http://childes.psy.cmu.edu/phon/ http://phon.ling.mun.ca/phonwiki/ Release notes: http://phon.ling.mun.ca/phontrac/wiki/phon1_5/ReleaseNotes Links to the PhonBank corpora: -Corpora in CHAT format: http://childes.psy.cmu.edu/data/PhonBank/ -Corpora in Phon format: http://childes.psy.cmu.edu/data/PhonBank-Phon/ Discussion group: Phon users are encouraged to subscribe to the discussion group (no Gmail account required to subscribe): http://groups.google.com/group/phon -To join the group, click on the ?Apply for group membership? and follow the instructions. -Group's email address (for message posting): phon at googlegroups.com Acknowledgments Funding: Current development of Phon and PhonBank is supported by the National Institute of Health. Earlier development of Phon was funded by grants from National Science Foundation, Canada Fund for Innovation, Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council of Canada, Petro-Canada Fund for Young Innovators, and the Office of the Vice-President (Research) and the Faculty of Arts at Memorial University of Newfoundland. Special thanks: While it is impossible to name everyone who ended up being involved in one way or another in this project, we owe special thanks to a wonderful group of early adopters and beta testers, without whom it would have been much more difficult to produce the current software. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From alicia.chang at gmail.com Thu May 26 14:28:05 2011 From: alicia.chang at gmail.com (Alicia Chang) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 10:28:05 -0400 Subject: Postdoctoral position at the University of Delaware Message-ID: *Postdoctoral Fellowship* * * *Dr. Roberta M. Golinkoff* * * *UNIVERSITY OF DELAWARE* *School of Education* *Newark, Delaware* * * We are currently accepting applications for a post-doctoral fellowship on an NIH-funded project focusing on preschoolers? knowledge of geometric shapes. The project examines the relationship between what children know about shapes and their mathematical knowledge upon school entry. Ideally, the applicant would be an expert in the area of early mathematical or spatial development and have an interest in cognitive development. Applicants would be expected to have strong research training, extensive statistical experience, and a Ph.D. in developmental psychology or a closely related area. Experience in using an eye-tracker would be welcomed, and excellent writing skills are a must. Funding is available for one year with full, excellent benefits*.* *Responsibilities:* Data analysis, writing up results for presentation and publication, literature reviews, designing and assisting in the conduct of follow-up studies, grant writing, and collaborative participation with our research team. *Materials:* Please submit a CV, cover letter with statement of research interests, letters of recommendation, and evidence of scholarly publications to Alicia Chang at aliciac at udel.edu . -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bhuvana.linguistics at gmail.com Sat May 28 20:47:08 2011 From: bhuvana.linguistics at gmail.com (Bhuvana Narasimhan) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 13:47:08 -0700 Subject: Psycholinguistics Courses at the Linguistic Institute, July 7 - Aug 2, 2011 Message-ID: Subject: Psycholinguistics Courses at the Linguistic Institute, July 7 - Aug 2, 2011 (**apologies for any cross-postings**) The University of Colorado is offering a fantastic opportunity for people interested in Psycholinguistics to be brought up to date with the latest developments and trends in 4 short weeks. This is part of the Linguistic Institute 2011 in Boulder (see below), which offers an unusually wide range of Psycholinguistics courses by renowned researchers. Course offerings cover a range of topics: - language acquisition (infant speech perception, information structure development, learnability theory, sign language development, the emergence of phonology, etc.); - adult language processing (neural mechanisms of language comprehension, grammatical ?illusions?, studying language processing using eye-tracking, processing phonological structure and phonetic variation, etc.); - computational psycholinguistics and information-theoretic approaches; - the creation of new languages (development of pidgins and creoles). In addition to providing a comprehensive introduction to the relevant concepts and scientific literature, many of the courses (as well as several Institute workshops) provide experience with state-of-the-art tools-of-the-trade. Detailed course descriptions can be found here: https://verbs.colorado.edu/LSA2011/courses-areas.html A list of Institute workshops can be found here: https://verbs.colorado.edu/LSA2011/events-calendar.html#workshop These courses are open to anyone, and you can register as an affiliate if you do not need transfer credit. The courses meet twice a week, so it would be possible to take a full load of 4 courses by attending just two days a week. It is an extraordinary networking opportunity, with small classes and lots of institute-wide events. ============================================================================= The Linguistic Institute 2011 will take place July 7-August 2 on the campus of the University of Colorado at Boulder, with major sponsorship by the Linguistic Society of America and the university. Courses are being taught by over 100 outstanding international visiting faculty members. In addition, more than 20 affiliated workshops and conference meetings will be held during Institute 2011. The theme of the 2011 Linguistic Institute is Language in the World, and the focus is on interdisciplinary, empirically based approaches to language. In keeping with this theme, a large suite of courses target language documentation and description, as well as processes of language endangerment and appropriate responses. The Institute not only continues a vital tradition in the field but also showcases the outstanding research and teaching activities at the University of Colorado at Boulder. The 79 one-credit hour courses include many courses on sociolinguistics, field methods, typology, syntactic/ semantic/pragmatic theory, cognitive science and computational linguistics. Online registration is open through July 5th at the Institute website: https://verbs.colorado.edu/LSA2011/index.html. CAMPUS HOUSING RESERVATIONS CAN BE MADE THROUGH JUNE 13, 2011. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en. From natasha.ringblom at slav.su.se Mon May 30 09:43:06 2011 From: natasha.ringblom at slav.su.se (Natasha Ringblom) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 11:43:06 +0200 Subject: a question about multilingual babies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tamar and Yves! Your question has generated a great deal of discussion among my students of bilingualism at the University of Uppsala. Thanks a lot for raising this issue. Below I attach one of the answers of my students (Olof Pettersson - olofmartinhenry at gmail.com) who did a great job going through all the previous answers and comments and at the same time adding a new perspective. Hope it will be interesting for you to read and perhaps - even help making your decision. Best, Natasha Ringblom Dear Tamar and Yves, I would like to begin by stating that while I don't think your situation is as complicated as some of the earlier responses make it out to be, I would say that it is far from without complexity. Most research on bilingualism seems to focus on bilingual children rather than tri- or quadrilingual, as is the case with your child. This is what potentially could make things a little complicated. I feel the need to point out that I do not agree with those who claim that bilingual first language acquisition could be disadvantageous to the mental development of children, causing language delay or even autism. Given the state of the world, where bilingualism (i. e. a situation where children have been exposed to more than one language since before they can produce utterances) has a clear statistical majority over monolingualism, it seems absurd to claim that multiple language acquisition could be the cause of impairment of the cognitive abilities of a child. Many of the earlier responses have already mentioned this statistical majority, so I feel that not much more needs to be added about that. Now, something that seems rather crucial to mention, that I haven't seen in any of the responses so far, is the notion of a ?critical period? for acquisition of language. Most researchers agree that such a period exists, based on evidence that the neurological maturation of the brain causes it to lose its initial plasticity. Such a development has been proven to exist in many other species, and is typically linked to some art-specific skill (like flight for birds). In the case of humans, this is supposed to lead to easier language acquisition before this process is finished. Now, there is little consensus among the scientific community as to what age range this period actually applies to. The originally propositioned end age of 13 has been abandoned, and many researchers are now speaking of different critical periods for different sections of language acquisition (i. e. phonology, morphology, syntax etc.). One thing that most linguists researching early bilingualism however seem to agree on is that the early years and months are ideal for learning more than one language with native-like control as ultimate attainment as goal. Thus I would agree with Bruno (10/5 2011) that it is important that you make out clear goals for your child, based on which language you deem to be most likely to be the most instrumental to him in his future. This brings me to your question about what language his nursery should be in. Also here you should take into account what the future might hold for your son, because the language(s) he learns there is likely to be a strong candidate for becoming his dominant language, especially if it is the same language as spoken by the society in which he grows up, or also if it is one of the languages he hears at home. As Lofa (9/5 2011) writes, and I agree, the country of residence and your own attitudes towards the different languages play huge roles in shaping the prerequisites for your son's language choices. Every little thing that can be associated with the respective languages is going to be picked up by him, because in the state of neurologically optimized language-learning he currently is, he is sensitive to all available input. When choosing what language you want him to be surrounded by the most, it is also important to keep in mind that complete multilingualism is very hard to attain. Most often, multilingual children will end up with a complete abstract linguistic system, with domain-based proficiency in each of their different languages. This means that whichever language your son is most likely to hear in for example the kitchen, is the language he will most frequently use about kitchen items or activities. Keeping all these things in mind, together with the answers given earlier, I hope you feel that you are better equipped to make good choices for your son. I hope I was able to add something useful. Olof Pettersson, linguistics student at the University of Uppsala, Sweden Olof Pettersson - olofmartinhenry at gmail.com 8 maj 2011 kl. 19.48 skrev Tamar & Yves: > Hello all, > Our 10 months old son is exposed to 3 languages at home ( each one of > us is speaking to him his mother- tongue, and we speak English between > us) and to a 4th one outside. > > > Soon he will be starting Nursery, and we were wondering what language > it should be in. Is it better to expose him simultaneously to all 4 > languages or should we do it gradually over the first few years of his > life (It's possible to sign him up to a nursery in my husnband's > mother tongue (2)/ english (3)/ bi lingual (enviroment+English)(4)) > > > We don't want language acquisition to be too much of a burden on him, > and not sure how many languages he can learn at once. > > > We are aware of the large number of factors affecting the answer, but > does anyone know or refer us to research done on the specific issues > of (i) number of languages babies can learn and its implication on > their emotional state; and (ii) Is it better to expose a baby to those > languages simultaneously or gradually over the first few years of his > life. > > Thanks, > Tamar & Yves > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. > To post to this group, send email to info-childes at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group. 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