Idiom comprehension in L2 learners
Phillip Hamrick
philliphamrick at gmail.com
Mon Jun 9 14:00:23 UTC 2014
Thanks, Marylin!
On Friday, June 6, 2014 2:02:59 PM UTC-4, nip... at uoregon.edu wrote:
>
> It is true that individuals who are learning a second language (L2)
> often struggle to understand the idioms of the L2 (Liu, 2008). This is
> because idioms do not translate easily from one language to another and are
> culturally specific. For example, a literal translation of the French idiom*
> avoir le cafard* (to have the cockroach) would not make sense to the
> English-speaking person whose L2 is French until the individual learns that
> the expression means to be bored and depressed (Delp, 2013) or* down in
> the dumps* (Cousin, 1989). Conversely, a literal translation of* down in
> the dumps* might confuse the native French speaker who is learning
> English as an L2. This is in contrast to proverbs, which are more easily
> translated from one language to another. For example, the following proverb
> is Russian, but we all understand it instantly:
>
> “The church is near but the road is all ice. The tavern is far, but I’ll
> walk very carefully.” That’s just the nature of different types of
> figurative expressions (and human beings).
>
> Marilyn Nippold
>
> University of Oregon
>
> USA
>
> *From:* info-c... at googlegroups.com <javascript:> [
> mailto:in... at googlegroups.com <javascript:>]* On Behalf Of* Gordon, Peter
> *Sent:* Friday, June 06, 2014 7:39 AM
> *To:* info-c... at googlegroups.com <javascript:>
> *Subject:* Re: Nelson update on Idiom comprehension in child language
>
> One interesting observation that I've heard is that people who are (late)
> L2 learners will have problems in using and understanding idioms in the
> non-native language. This appears to be true in speakers who have perfect
> phonology and grammar and might be otherwise indistinguishable from native
> speakers. It suggests that the acquisition of idioms is somehow linked to
> mechanisms that differentiate between L1 and L2 processing.
>
> Peter Gordon
>
> On Fri, Jun 6, 2014 at 9:34 AM, Keith Nelson <*k1n at psu.edu* <javascript:>>
> wrote:
>
> HI all. Here is the specific reference on the the intervention study
> (also discussed in the JSLHR research paper) with ASD children for
> idioms. Best regards, Keith N
>
>
> *Whyte, E. M., Nelson, K. E, & Khan, K. S. (2013). Learning of
> idiomatic language expressions in a group
> intervention for children with autism,** Autism,** 17, 449-464.*
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From:* Keith Nelson* <*k1n at psu.edu* <javascript:>>
> Date: Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 11:44 AM
> Subject: Re: Idiom comprehension in child language
> To: *info-childes at googlegroups.com* <javascript:>, Keith Nelson <
> *keithnelsonart at gmail.com* <javascript:>>
>
> Hi all. I m attaching a JSLHR paper just out from our lab that reviews
> lit and presents an intervention study on idiom comprehension. Cheers,
> Keith
>
> On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 9:44 AM, Tom Roeper <*roeper at linguist.umass.edu*
> <javascript:>> wrote:
>
> Hi folks--
>
> just to mention a couple of things--an example I just heard:
>
> "I know a shortcut"
>
> "well, I know a shorter cut"
>
> and cases like "you're a slowpoke, but I'm a fastpoke".
>
> I wrote a paper on idioms with Zvi Penner that appears
>
> in the volume for Jüregen Weisenborn by Mouton--it
>
> relates to complex sentences.
>
> Work by Ellen Winner on Metaphor seems pertinent
>
> to children's comprehension of them. A child with
>
> a stomache who said"
>
> "there's a fireengine in my stomach"
>
> or a child with a stuffed nose who said:
>
> "there's paint in my nose".
>
> Deviations from compositionality can still be logically
>
> motivated.
>
> Tom Roeper
>
> On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 5:09 AM, Mehmet ÖZCAN <*mehozcan20 at gmail.com*
> <javascript:>> wrote:
>
> Dear Hüseyin,
>
> (I answer all of the questions you posed me personally here
> thinking that other colleagues might want to comment on them as well)
>
> · (Concerning your question about the location of data
> collection) The location you are going to collect the data depends
> totally on the location of the study carried out by Gokmen and her student
> (as you mentioned) to find out the words determined as “prototype words”;
> watermelon which is found to be 8th item on the list in Ankara may
> be the first or third in Urfa or Adana; or orange the first in
> Mediterranean Region, if you are going to construct your sentences
> depending on their list. In a nutshell, prototypicality is idiosyncratic
> and a common sense of prototypicality occurs when the personal senses of
> prototypicalities overlap to the sufficient extent.
>
> · One problem with the hypothesis: As far as I understood,
> you assume that idiomatic expressions are processed within the framework of
> compositionality theory: the meaning of a phrase or a larger linguistic
> unit can be grasped by knowing the meaning/function of each element the
> whole unit contains. This may be the case in most cases, especially when it
> comes to accessing the literal meaning. As you know, Compositionality
> Theory has been criticized for not being able to explain the processing of
> pragmatics in the expressions. Thus, you may revise your assumptions.
>
> · Another thing to concentrate on may be the
> prototypicality of the idiomatic expression (among other idiomatic
> expressions) itself rather than the expressions’ containing prototypical
> elements. You know, *some birds are birder than other birds*. Some
> idiomatic expressions may have some prototypical features structurally or
> regarding other qualities.
>
> · Integrating infant directed speech to this study would be
> too much to my understanding. You will have to carry out longitudinal
> observations to measure the exposition of a child to idiomatic expressions
> or the words in the list determined by the previous studies.
>
> I am looking forward to hearing about the findings of your
> demanding study. Good luck in all ways.
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 20, 2014 12:56:54 AM UTC+3, *huy... at gmail.com* wrote:
>
> Dear all,
>
> First of all, I would like to express my excitement about posting my first
> question in this group (Of course, after reading the older posts).
>
> I have been reading about Prototype Theory of Eleanor Rosch, which is the
> point of departure for my M.A thesis, within the frame of child language
> development. Then I suddenly found myself trying to design steps for (an)
> experiment(s) in idiom comprehension. I am partly aware of the literature
> in figurative language processing (thanks to the comprehensive chapter by
> Gibbs and Colston in
> *http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/book/9780123693747*
> <http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/book/9780123693747>). So my
> questions are as follows:
>
> · What is the direction of research in idiom comprehension in child
> language?
>
> · Could you suggest me some seminal works in idiom comprehension,
> or more generally figurative language?
>
> · Is there anyone to help me revise my experimental design?
>
> · What kind of an effect could prototypicality of concepts in
> idioms have on children's comprehension? (Feel free to share your criticism
> or advice, if you prefer to look at this research question from another
> perspective.)
>
> · A third research field having just popped into my mind is child
> directed speech. In what way can I integrate it into my research?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Huseyin
>
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> Tom Roeper
> Dept of Lingiustics
> UMass South College
> Amherst, Mass. 01003 ISA
> *413 256 0390*
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> Peter Gordon, Associate Professor
>
> Biobehavioral Sciences Department, Box 180
>
> Teachers College, Columbia University
>
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>
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