<br>Laura<br>
We looked at errors produced by 3-year-olds with typical language on
a picture description task and did find gender errors.<br>
The reference is:<br>
Eisenberg, S., Guo, L., & Germezi, M., How grammatical are
three-year-olds? Language, Speech, and Hearing Services in Schools,
43, 36-52, January 2012.<br>
Sarita Eisenberg<br><br>On Saturday, June 16, 2012 6:31:22 PM UTC-4, Esther wrote:<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;"><div style="word-wrap:break-word">Dear Laura,<div><br></div><div>I can only report anecdotal errors in French data.<br><div>We haven't made any specific study on this topic in our data of French typical children (the Paris corpus) but I do have anecdotical evidence of pronoun and determiner "errors" in gender. You might not consider it as being the same issue (in the case of determiner, mostly grammatical gender, in the case of pronouns referential or personal gender). I must say that grammatical gender errors in French exist and are quite impressive when we find them and also fun to analyze since the developmental pattern could be similar to past tense with irregular verbs in English ("la fleur" feminine flower instead of masculine, "un poule" - masculine chicken instead of feminine).</div><div><br></div><div>As far as personal pronouns are concerned, we have noticed that children mostly produce non standard "proto-uses" of "proto-forms" when they are in the filler syllable stage with fillers closer to "il" instead of "elle" or the reverse... When the full pronoun stage is reached with no more fillers, there are still some odd gender reversals...</div><div>Older children (3 or 4) get mixed up when they are trying to refer to two different characters or persons in the same speech turn: "elle la mange" (she eats her) speaking of the wolf eating the little girl, instead of "IL la mange" (he eats her) with the added complexity of subject and object and semantic roles of eater and "eatee"...</div><div><br></div><div>As far as I know these errors are not consistent at all during the time that they occur. I think it is interesting to study whether and when they are repaired by adults.</div><div><br></div><div>I'm sorry if this is really too vague...and of course since we only have spontaneous data, the occurrences will be really scarce, we could only make qualitative analyses. But I'm sure we have them. And actually, I myself continue to make that type of "error". I can remember a whole data session when I kept referring to the child as she when it was a he... Maybe under the influence of scientific papers on language acquisition. I'm sure I've heard adults get mixed up as well. I think there are a lot of different factors (cognitive overload, semantic complexity, number of referents, prototypical gender for certain roles or functions which influence certain automatisms...).</div><div><br></div><div>As far as the psychotic and autistic children I have worked with are concerned, I have not filmed them, so can only speak from direct experience with no data, but the errors were much more systematic when they existed.</div><div><br></div><div>I think you could compare this phenomenon to pronominal reversal (3rd or 2nd person instead of first person) in typical and autistic children. There is more literature on that, especially in English and it might inspire you, but you have probably already thought of it.</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Aliyah </div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Aliyah Morgenstern</div><div>Professor of Linguistics</div><div>Sorbonne Nouvelle University</div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>Le 16 juin 2012 à 23:31, Laura Snow a écrit :</div><br><blockquote type="cite"><span style="border-collapse:separate;font-family:Helvetica;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:-webkit-auto;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;font-size:medium"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US"><div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif">Dear all,</span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif"> </span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif">I’m trying to determine whether typically developing children ever make errors in pronoun gender (e.g., reverse “he” and “she”), and if so,</span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif"> </span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.5in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;line-height:17px;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:18px;font-family:Cambria,serif"><span>1.<span style="font:normal normal normal 7pt/normal 'Times New Roman'"> <span> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:18px;font-family:Cambria,serif">at what point in their language development (and for how long) do these errors occur?</span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.5in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;line-height:17px;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:18px;font-family:Cambria,serif"><span>2.<span style="font:normal normal normal 7pt/normal 'Times New Roman'"> <span> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:18px;font-family:Cambria,serif">are these errors consistent or intermittent during the time that they occur?</span></div><p style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:10pt;margin-left:0.5in;line-height:17px;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:18px;font-family:Cambria,serif"><span>3.<span style="font:normal normal normal 7pt/normal 'Times New Roman'"> <span> </span></span></span></span><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:18px;font-family:Cambria,serif">Do the errors occur mainly in cases of long-distance reference or also with relatively simple utterances (e.g., pointing to a girl and saying, “He has it”)</span></p><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif">In my clinical experiences, I have seen many children with autism who make errors in pronoun gender, and many kids with language disorders (as well as younger, typically developing kids) who make errors in pronoun case (e.g., “her have it”). I can’t say that I’ve ever seen a child make a pronoun gender error who did NOT have autism, but I’m having trouble finding anything in the literature to back up that blanket statement.</span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif"> </span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif">I’m mainly interested in finding formal studies of children learning English, but evidence that is anecdotal and/or from other languages would also be useful!</span></div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Laura Snow, Ph.D., CCC-SLP</div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">University of Washington</div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Center on Human Development and Disability</div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Seattle, WA</div><div style="margin-top:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </div></div><div><br></div>--<span> </span><br>You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group.<br>To post to this group, send email to<span> </span><a href="mailto:info-childes@googlegroups.com" style="color:blue;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">info-childes@googlegroups.<wbr>com</a>.<br>To unsubscribe from this group, send email to<span> </span><a href="mailto:info-childes+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com" style="color:blue;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">info-childes+unsubscribe@<wbr>googlegroups.com</a>.<br>For more options, visit this group at<span> </span><a href="http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en" style="color:blue;text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">http://groups.google.com/<wbr>group/info-childes?hl=en</a>.<br></div></span></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></blockquote>
<p></p>
-- <br />
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Info-CHILDES" group.<br />
To view this discussion on the web visit <a href="https://groups.google.com/d/msg/info-childes/-/vKJ-yQiFfI8J">https://groups.google.com/d/msg/info-childes/-/vKJ-yQiFfI8J</a>.<br />
To post to this group, send email to info-childes@googlegroups.com.<br />
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to info-childes+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.<br />
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/info-childes?hl=en.<br />