[Lexicog] new idiom

[Hayim Sheynin]

Fritz,
   
  May be I used a wrong word when I wrote: "It is also not negative." Probably better would be to tell: It is not pejorative. Why? Because it describes a real life situation about nearly 50% percent of families of Judeo-Christian world. The same was in Roman Empire and frequently in Muslim world. I know that the wifes of both Mao tze Dun and Chai Kang Chek were bossy women. However in Muslim world it occurs rarer than in Judeo-Christian society, because there the wives are always in danger that the husband will take another wife. And the law of divorce in Muslim practice is very simple. If husband doesn't want to continue to live with a wife. He is taking her to kadi and pronounces divorce formula. The wife returns to the house of her father. That's it. 
   
  Hayim
   
  P.S. I think we deviate from our direct goals on this forum. Don't you think so?

David Tuggy <david_tuggy at sil.org> wrote:
          My dad used to say that a little incompatibility wasn't such a bad thing in a marriage, especially if he had the income and she had the pattibility.

Do German, Polish, Russian, etc., have anything parallel to the English "battle-axe" for a certain kind of woman?

--David T

Fritz Goerling wrote:       v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}        st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }        Dear Hayim,
  
  Thanks for your explanation of the Slavic ideal woman. I am familiar with the Hebrew ideal. I just wonder why you say “Hebrew ideal woman”. Does Proverbs 31:10-30 not talk about the ideal “wife”? 
  I am surprised to hear that in Russian, if a husband is “under the boot” of his wife, that is *not* negative. In German we make many jokes about such a marriage, about both spouses, but especially about the man. In West Africa where I have worked for about 25 years, a good wife is a submissive one.
  As you talk about criteria of attractiveness of women in a fairly generalized way, here is one criterion about the attractiveness of men which I have heard widely in West Africa: “No matter how ugly a man is, what counts is that he has a full wallet.”;-)
  
  Le Chaim,
  
  Fritz
  
          Dear Fritz,

    

    This is usually positive description of woman who knows how to appeciate herself and who would fulfill her goals even if they are difficult. This is a Slavic ideal of a woman in difference, let say, to Hebrew ideal woman (diligent, industrious [read laborious] and wise) as it described in Proverbs 31:10-30, even there there is verse 17, where it is said, "She girds herself with strength and performs her tasks with vigor" and in verse 25 "She is clothed with strength and splendor." In the verse 30 it is said that beauty and grace are rather not important, because they are deceptive and illusory, which older people know that this is true. However most of men, both Hebrew [read Jewish] or Gentiles, are attracted to beautiful women rather than the industrious or wise ones.  

    

    For bossy woman, who rules over her husband in Russian there is an idiom ! that was already cited by my Polish colleague. They say in Russian "On u neyo pod sapogom", i.e. he is under her boot. This is also not negative. This is just a frequent situation recurrent when a woman has stronger mind or character than her husband. 

    

    Cheers,

    

    Hayim Y. Sheynin

Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling at sil.org> wrote:

            Hayim,

    Is this boy baba a positive or negative term? ‘Strong’ and ‘bossy’ do not go together for me.  A ‘strong woman’ sounds positive to me, while ‘bossy’ does not. So if this boy baba is not a ‘Kampfhenne’ (= fighting hen), a German term for a ‘malicious woman with a fierce temper; a vixen’, what is it?

  Fritz

    Another idiom describing a very strong and bossy woman in Russian is "boy baba" (here is boy not like in English 'boy', and not Tom boy girl, but 'a battle', and there is non-idiomatic parallel to this expression 'boevaya zhenstchina" ) so the literary meaning can be translated approximately as 'warrior woman'. This is a metafor and has nothing to do with war or battle.

Hayim Y. Sheynin


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