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<div>Dear Hayim, </div> <div> Subtle!<BR><BR><B><I>Hayim Sheynin <hsheynin19444@yahoo.com></I></B> escribió:</div> <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"><!-- Network content --> <DIV id=ygrp-text> <div> <DIV>Dear Michael,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So whose husband was Cardinal Pareja?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Excuse me for this joke.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hayim Sheynin<BR><BR><B><I>Michael Nicholas <mrnicholas007@<WBR>yahoo.es></I></B> wrote:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"><!-- Network content --> <DIV id=ygrp-text> <DIV>Dear Fritz, Elton John's partner is described in the Spanish press as Elton´s husband and Elton John is also described as the husband of his partner. The word used is "marido" I think this shows that Spanish is still looking for a word One word that is often used is "pareja" which has the advantage of being used to describe a partner of either sex.<BR><BR><B><I>Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling@<WBR>sil.org></I></B> escribió: <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"><!-- Network content --> <DIV id=ygrp-text> <DIV><!-- Network content --> <DIV class=Section1> <DIV class=MsoNormal><ST1><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Micha</SPAN></FONT></ST1>el,<O></O></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV
id=ygrp-mlmsg> <DIV id=ygrp-msg> <DIV id=ygrp-text> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black">Just a couple of comments inserted in what you wrote:<O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Over here in Spain a few media people started to refer to the wife of the President of the government - presidente del gobierno - as the Primera Dama.It was quickly pointed out that Doña Sofía - is Su Majestad la Reina - Her Majesty the Queen, and as such from the point of protocol the First Lady. <FONT color=black><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black;
FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> We don’t have a King or Queen (or Emperor/Kaiser) any more in <ST1><ST1>Germany</ST1></ST1>. But the real<O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> First Lady (protocol-wise) is the wife of the federal President. Maybe the President<O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> has taken on the role of the King in <ST1><ST1>Germany</ST1></ST1>.<O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV
class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I have been told that the mayor of a major city in <ST1><ST1>Germany</ST1></ST1> is homosexual and lives with his partner. <FONT color=black><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> That is the case for the mayors of other major European cities, too. Can you imagine<O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> that to be the case in macho <ST1><ST1>Spain</ST1></ST1>?<O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">So First Lady here would be out of place. <FONT color=black><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> In <ST1><ST1>Germany</ST1></ST1> the term “Lebensgefährte” (life partner) is in now. For the partners of people <O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> (male or female) with promiscuous life-styles or who practice “serial polygamy” (divorce a
<O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> number of times in a row) the term “Lebensabschnittsgefä<WBR>hrte” (partner for <O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> a certain period of life) is en vogue. Morals have changed enormously in <ST1><ST1>Germany</ST1></ST1><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> in the last decades. <O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Queen <ST1><ST1>Victoria</ST1></ST1>'s husband was the Prine Consort.<BR><B><I><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-STYLE: italic">Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling@<WBR>sil.org></SPAN></I></B> escribió:</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial color=black><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 1pt solid"> <DIV id=ygrp-text> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><ST1><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Micha</SPAN></FONT></ST1></ST1>el,<O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><O></O>Well, when Willy Brandt was Mayor of Berlin, I am sure his wife was referred to as the First Lady.<O></O><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Today’s Mayor of Berlin does not have a spouse.
You wonder: What if the head of state is a bachelor? Good question! I can think of the late Prime Minister Sir Edward Heath, or what if Condoleeza Rice becomes the next president of the <ST1><ST1><ST1><ST1>US</ST1></ST1></ST1></ST1>? I like your suggestion of CONSORT for the relationship that exists between two people from the point of view of protocol. What if Hillary Clinton becomes the next president? How would you refer to her and to Bill?<O></O><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">As I find “escribio” in your answer, I wonder whether you are Spanish-speaking? Has First Lady been borrowed in Spanish like in German?<O></O><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><O></O>Fritz Goerling<O></O><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV> <DIV><ST1> <DIV class=MsoNormal><O></O><ST1><FONT face="Times
N!
ew Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><O></O>Micha</SPAN></FONT></ST1></ST1>el Nicholas wrote:<O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV><O></O> <DIV id=ygrp-mlmsg> <DIV id=ygrp-msg> <DIV id=ygrp-text> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Dear Fritz,<O></O><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> The expression refers to the wife of the the head of state. The state in question being a republic.The use of a word for the husband of the head of state of a republic is interesting. The question gets more ionteresting when it refers to modern organizations. How does one refer to the spouse of the Mayor of Berlin? I refer to the official role that such a person may be called upon to perform.! What happens if the head of state - republic - is a bachelor? I vote for CONSORT. A word
which states the relationship that exists between two pople from the point of view of protocol. May I suggest that we check with the office of protocol of the Federal Republic of Germany and see what they have to say?<BR><BR><B><I><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-STYLE: italic">Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling@<WBR>sil.org></SPAN></I></B> escribió:<O></O><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 1pt solid"><!-- Network content --><!-- Network content --> <DIV id=ygrp-text> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Today I had a discussion with anglophones (Americans and Brits) and Germans about the use of “First Lady” which has been borrowed from American English into German to refer to the wife of a head of state or of the federal president or of the chancellor of
<ST1><ST1><ST1><ST1><ST1><ST1>Germany</ST1></ST1></ST1></ST1></ST1></ST1>. Correctly it should be used for the wife of the federal president of <ST1><ST1><ST1><ST1><ST1><ST1>Germany</ST1></ST1></ST1></ST1></ST1></ST1>, the latter being above the chancellor in terms of protocol. However, it is also used for the wife of the chancellor. But what if the chancellor is a woman like Angela Merkel? She would not be referred to as the First Lady. And, if so, how would her husband be referred to?<O></O></SPAN></FONT><O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">As the common language on this list is English, I would like to learn how this issue is handled among anglophones. I learned today that neither the Queen nor Tony Blair’s wife are referred to as First Lady. Nor was Margaret Thatcher, who was called the “Iron
Lady”<O></O></SPAN></FONT><O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">though. The Brits in the above-mentioned discussion said that “First Lady” is an Americanism.<O></O></SPAN></FONT><O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Well, here is ! George Bush jr.’s unusual definition: “The most important job is not to be governor, or first lady in my case.”<O></O></SPAN></FONT><O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Has the Americanism “First Lady” been borrowed into other languages and how is it used?<O></O></SPAN></FONT><O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT
face=Arial color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O></O>Fritz Goerling<O></O></SPAN></FONT><O></O></DIV><O></O></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">! <O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV><O></O><!--End grou! p email --><!--End group email --> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><O></O><O></O> <O></O><O></O></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=1> </SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Verdana size=1><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">LLama Gratis a cualquier PC del Mundo.<BR>Llamadas a fijos y móviles
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