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<DIV><SPAN class=085480917-06032008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Many
thanks, David. Although I haven't a chance to prepare the raw
data, I just made this 6-page excerpt (2MB) available for viewing/download at
this link:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=085480917-06032008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><A
href="http://www.e-multiweb.com/secure/DikDik_20071219_excerpt.pdf">http://www.e-multiweb.com/secure/DikDik_20071219_excerpt.pdf</A></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=085480917-06032008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=085480917-06032008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>The
"new-line" problem does not show up only for idioms, but for all parts of
speech. Samples of the problem in this excerpt are:</FONT>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
color=#000000><FONT size=2><FONT face=Arial>ammo (2-idm, 3-idm, 4-idm), a<SPAN
class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">ŋka
(2-p), baalo (3-idm, 4-idm), baala (2-auxv), baawo (2-idm).
</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
color=#000000><FONT size=2><FONT face=Arial><SPAN class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT><FONT><FONT color=#0000ff><SPAN
class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><SPAN
class=085480917-06032008>We would prefer these members of the \ps
Range Set to be "behaving" under the sense numbers like members of the
\de or \ge Range Sets, using "wrap-around" behaviour. While it is probably
not possible to do this for the various parts of speech, which really must be
under \ps, the category idiom seems a little more like a separate definition,
behaving like a \de member. You can see the "wrap-around" behaviour
we are hoping to
get in:</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT><FONT><FONT><SPAN
class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><SPAN
class=085480917-06032008>ammo (1-v), amo (1, 2), baalo (1, 2), baawo (1),
baa</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=429323716-06032008><SPAN class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><SPAN
class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">ŋ<SPAN
class=085480917-06032008>ja (1), babdo
(1,2)</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><SPAN class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><SPAN
class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><SPAN
class=085480917-06032008></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
color=#000000><SPAN class=fstandard><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"></SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT
face=Arial><FONT size=2>This is a display problem which I can hand-correct in an
hour or so (maybe even create a macro), but of course would prefer to have
it fixed once and for all instead of having to manually correct it each
time we export the dictionary. <SPAN class=085480917-06032008>Sorry,
I'm only an amateur and may not know correct terminology for
describing this problem.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Please
note that this is very much a DRAFT, full of other minor problems as well, some
of which we have corrected since the PDF and others we're still
addressing. So we'd really appreciate it if you do not use this in any way
other than to <SPAN class=085480917-06032008>troubleshoot</SPAN> this
issue.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><SPAN class=085480917-06032008><FONT
face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Thanks so much.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=429323716-06032008><SPAN class=085480917-06032008><FONT
face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Cheryl</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><BR></DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com] <B>On Behalf Of </B>David
Frank<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 06, 2008 8:48 AM<BR><B>To:</B>
lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Lexicog] Lexical
Relations vs. Etymology - using "idiom" in the \ps field<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV id=ygrp-text>
<P>
<DIV><FONT size=2>As I have said recently, I would discourage adding anything in
the part of speech field that is not really a part of speech label. You could
put labels like noun, verb, adj., etc., but I wouldn't put anything in the part
of speech field for entries that are more than one word. I would not use labels
like phrase or NP or idiom in the part of speech field nor anywhere else.
Crockett has already pointed out that such labels don't belong in the sense
number field either. My feeling [and the use of this term brings to mind the
other discussion we were having] is that they don't belong anywhere. But I
don't know what people are normally taught to do in the case of idioms or
phrases when using Shoebox or Toolbox and MDF, and I don't know how
the printout would look if the part of speech field were left out or left blank.
The software ought to be programmed in such a way as to give
reasonable results, or at least there ought to be a way of tricking the
software into doing what you need it to do.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>I don't use Toolbox and MDF and I am not a programmer, but I
believe there should be some Toolbox/MDF experts listening in who can tell how
to get the results you want, if the software is capable of it. Cheryl, if you
could send examples in an e-mail rather than as an attachment, you might get
some help. Show the raw Toolbox or Shoebox output with backslashes and field
codes, and then show how that is formatted with MDF, and then
reformat it the way you think it should look and ask for help getting it that
way.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>-- David Frank</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial"><B>From:</B> <A
title=cheryl.reitz@shawcable.com
href="mailto:cheryl.reitz@shawcable.com">Cheryl Reitz</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com
href="mailto:lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com">lexicographylist@<WBR>yahoogroups.<WBR>com</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 06, 2008 2:51
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [Lexicog] Lexical Relations
vs. Etymology - using "idiom" in the \ps field</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT><BR></DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2>T<SPAN class=476121607-06032008>hanks,
Crockett,</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN
class=476121607-06032008>Yes, this problem does turn up, as you surmised, with
any Data Range item under \ps other than the first \ps
item for the lexeme. There is both a new sense number listing and a
new line. There should be one or the other, but not both, I
think. If you can help us to troubleshoot this problem, we
will be most grateful as we hope to publish the first "official" version this
weekend. I have prepared a 2MB PDF file of the first few pages of our
Mabaan (a Sudan language) dictionary, which illustrates this problem. I would
have attached it but don't know the protocol here. If you (or anyone
else) wants to see this, let me know if I am allowed to attach
it to something sent out to the group. If not, please send me an e-mail
address outside the group and I will send the PDF to
you.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=+0><FONT color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=476121607-06032008>Warm greetings,</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=+0><FONT color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=476121607-06032008>Cheryl</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
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