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Who originally calqued from whom is of course a question for historical
linguists to answer if they can (and perhaps in this case they can do
so with some degree of certainty.) I am sure the V+O=S construction is
very firmly entrenched in Spanish at this point and not foreign in any
relevant synchronic sense I can think of. The "but" in the phrase "but
'calques'" I would object to. Seeing them as calques doesn't explain
them away.<br>
<br>
I don't know what the phrase means, "if there is a Spanish construction
that is visually the same it will attract 'calques'." I can think of a
couple of ways it could be understood, and agree with at least one of
them, but I'm confused by it.<br>
<br>
What does it mean for an object to be "imported"? <br>
<br>
Are you saying that each individual compound goes through these three
stages, that "matamoscas" (kills-flies) 'flyswatter' was once a N+A
compound and some day will be N+N? Surely not? So what are you saying?
Granted that Spanish does have all three compound types (and
others)—why or where does it help us to think of one type evolving into
another? <br>
<br>
Also, I don't get the point of the examples. Granted, techo solar is
N+A and probably best seen as a phrase rather than a compound.
Guardacoches is a 3ps V + (obj) N, whether it is a phrase or a compound
probably being somewhat moot (I would lean towards calling it a
compound; people write it both as one word [5K on Google] and as two
[1K incl hyphenated guarda-coches]). Delantero centro can be taken as
N+N (but also as N+A, or A+A -- why not?) and is likely a phrase as
opposed to a compound. What does Plaza Castilla have to do with it, or
how is its use in popular speech different from its use in other genres?<br>
<br>
Sorry if I'm being dense.<br>
<br>
--David Tuggy<br>
<br>
Michael Nicholas wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:288411.71391.qm@web23212.mail.ird.yahoo.com"
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<div>Dear David, </div>
<div>I was once told by a French lexicographer that the modern
objects in Spanish which are identified by the "para" initial
component are but "calques" from the French. I was also told that if
there is a Spanish construction that is visually the same it will
attract "calques" </div>
<div>I think compounds in Spanish - when they refer to objects that
are imported tend to go through the stages of: noun plus adjective (non
compound) verb - third person singular - plus noun and finally evolve
into noun plus noun. This can be seen modern terms So: techo solar,
guarda coches, delantero centro and even - in popular speech - Plaza
Castilla<br>
<br>
<b><i>David Tuggy <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:david_tuggy@sil.org"><david_tuggy@sil.org></a></i></b> escribió:</div>
<snip><span style="color: white;"></span>
</blockquote>
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