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<div>Thank you for the kind follow-up. Usability has been very much on my mind. Even with genuine interest, getting people to actually participate is really difficult. A linguist who has been helping me found he couldn't recall the wiki markup to use after a one-week hiatus, so I have just rewritten the entry page. It now looks like this:</div><div><br></div><div>*****</div><div><br></div><div><!--Instructions are to the left. Type your entry information to the right on the appropriate lines. Delete any line you do not want.<br>Pronunciation: Enter pronunciation between slash marks-->/pronunciation/<br><br><!--Alternate spelling. Some words have multiple spellings. Enter as many as desired, using brackets-->[[alternate spelling 1]], [[alternating spelling 2]]<br><!--Definition. Each definition can have multiple sample sentences and sentence translations. Each definition starts with a pound sign, and each sample sentence and sentence translation starts with a colon.<br>Definition-->#My definition.<br><!--Sample sentence-->:This is a sample sentence in Lushootseed.<br><!--Sentence translation-->:This is the English translation of my sample sentence.<br><br><!--Usage note. To add a usage note, enter it after the pipe | character.-->{{EN usage note|This is a usage note.}}<br><!--See also. To add a reference, enter it after the pipe | character.-->{{EN see also|Reference word}}<br><!--Source materials. Show where you found this word. To see a list of sources we have, see Category:Sources.--></div><div><br></div>*****<div><br></div><div>I don't expect people to figure it out the first time, particularly the sources, which have abbreviations so all of the proper citation data is automatically generated, but I hope this is easy enough to follow that people will get it after a couple of times.</div><div><br></div><div>One of my next steps is to figure out how to take data from an Excel spreadsheet, text file, etc. and import it into the wiki. That will facilitate data entry even more.</div><div><br></div><div>Also, I have not yet tackled the verbs. English and other language versions of Wiktionary have paradigm generators, so that you simply enter the verb, state the verb type and all forms automatically get webpages stating the conjugation type and referring back to the main entry. This is true also for nouns (singular, plural) and adjectives (comparative, superlative). That, of course, requires plotting all of the paradigms.</div><div><br></div><div>This can be seen in action at, for example, <a href="https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/andare">https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/andare</a>. Click on the edit button and you can see how the Italian regular and irregular forms are handled.</div><div><br></div><div>For Lushootseed, I think we calculated that with various prefixes, there should be less than 120 forms (which is about the Latin count, I think), which is a reasonable count. It's nice to have one page for every form so people can look up whatever form they have at hand, but if you have a language with hundreds of forms per verb, then you might have to consider whether you want to pare it down to keep your database small (though obviously Wikipedia and Wiktionary are huge).</div><div><br></div><div>The main page for the wiki software is <a href="https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki">https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki</a>, which includes FAQs, extensions and all kinds of other information. The instructions are sometimes lacking in clarity; if there is interest, a do-it manual could be written up. Also, I am willing to host one more language as a pilot (I have a five-year hosting plan) so I can better document the process if someone wants to go that route. </div><div><br></div><div>Ben Barrett</div><div>La Conner, WA</div><div><br></div><div>Learn Ainu! <a href="https://sites.google.com/site/aynuitak1/videos">https://sites.google.com/site/aynuitak1/videos</a></div><div><br></div><div><div><div>On Apr 27, 2014, at 4:59 PM, Wayne Leman <<a href="mailto:wayne.leman@gmail.com">wayne.leman@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">
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<div>Thanks for starting the new thread, Ben. It really is an important topic.
We were just combining too many things in one topic thread. I actually happen to
believe that Fieldworks is a great program (and it specializes in lexical
relationships which must be done for good lexical work). I just question whether
FW is the best program for mother tongue speakers of a language to use,
especially if they don't have Fieldworks consultants on-scene to help.</div>
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<div>Thanks for mentioning the Wiki approach. I'd like to see examples of how it
has worked for native speakers of languages. I'd like to know how intuitive and
user-friendly it is for them.</div>
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<div>I think that one of the greatest areas of development for dictionaries is
for native speakers to do the research themselves. We who are linguists (that
includes me) have often gotten in the way of native speakers being able to
uncover the wealth of information about their own language. Ron Moe has
developed an exciting technique for native speakers to explore the lexicon of
their own language in a short period of time using semantic associations. We
linguists get excited about dictionary software that works for us, but often we
don't tune in to how native speakers can best record the lexical patterns of
their own language.</div>
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<div>Well, I'd better stop or else I'll be combining too many topics in your new
thread!</div>
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<div>Wayne</div>
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<div><b>From:</b> <a title="benjaminbarrett85@gmail.com" href="mailto:benjaminbarrett85@gmail.com">Benjamin Barrett</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, April 27, 2014 1:50 PM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a title="lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com" href="mailto:lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com">lexicographylist@yahoogroups.com</a>
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<div><b>Subject:</b> [Lexicog] Dictionary software</div></div></div>
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<div id="ygrp-text"><p>Wayne Leman says to not talk about software in Natalie's thread, so I'm
starting a new one :)<br><br>When I realized the potential that the Wiki
Foundation's software has, I jumped at it. I realize now I should explore other
options before I get too far into my project.<br><br>The wiki software (free to
download and use) makes it easy to add words even for people who don't like
computers, allows multiple people to work simultaneously, can be accessed
instantly by community members with a smartphone/tablet/computer and has a lot
of features that can be customized. You can upload PDFs, graphics, sound files,
videos and anything else you want (though that requires
customization).<br><br>Although the customizations can take a lot of work, the
basic installation on a PC/Mac or on many hosts is very easy. Among the
customizations I have is a Lushootseed keyboard that enables anyone to type in
Lushootseed regardless of their system, and security settings requiring people
to e-mail me to create an account. I think you can even limit who can view the
actual pages online.<br><br>Another compelling feature is that the Wiki
Foundation has a vested interest in keeping its software relevant in a
fast-paced world of software change, so I expect support will continue on into
the future as long as Wikipedia is still around.<br><br>I haven't yet tried to
export the data, so I can't address that issue, but I think it can be done
relatively easily. <br><br>Other than the time it takes if you want to customize
your wiki, the only downside I can think of is the unstructured nature of wikis,
but you can also create templates that guide the user. A particularly fancy
example for creating the fictitious word "affff" can be seen at
<a href="https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=afffff&action=edit&editintro=User:Yair_rand/usenec">https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=afffff&action=edit&editintro=User:Yair_rand/usenec</a>
(for viewing only, please don't click "save page"!)<br><br>WeSay also looks
interesting.<br><br>Has anyone explored the pros and cons of these various
software options in detail?<br><br>Ben Barrett<br>La Conner, WA<br><br>Learn
Ainu! <a href="https://sites.google.com/site/aynuitak1/videos">https://sites.google.com/site/aynuitak1/videos</a></p></div><!-- end group email --></div></div></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
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