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<font face="Arial Unicode MS">Dear Giorgio,<br>
are you sure that the two 'da's' have the same etymological background?
To my knowledge, the ABL da stems from 'de ab' (Latin ABL), whereas the
ALL da stems from 'de ad' (Latin ALL). Hence, we would not have to deal
with the grammaticalization path ABL>ALL, but with a merger of two
originally distinct forms (and functions) into one form. The
distribution de + a(d) > da with animate objectives and solely a(d)
with inanimates seems rather typical (if you take into account the use
of ABL>PART cases to indicate partial affection of animate
'patients' (see the frequent path [ABL>]PART/GEN to indicate an
animate Spilt). <br>
Best wishes,<br>
Wolfgang <br>
</font><br>
Giorgio Iemmolo schrieb:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid4646D39B.2010904@gmail.com">
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Dear linguists,<br>
<br>
I write you again about Gallosiculo dialects. In these dialects and in
Central Italian Dialect (Umbria), I found the preposition "da", an
ablative marker (separation, motion from) to mark datives and human
direct object . In Italian, this preposition is also used as an
allative with human nouns and animate definite nouns, like :"Vado <i>
da</i> Maria" "I go to Mary" but, with inanimate nouns, the
allative preposition "a" is used: "Vado <i>a</i> casa" "I go home"
<br>
I think that in these dialects, the pathway of grammaticalization of
preposition "da" could be: ABLATIVE>ALLATIVE>INDIRECT OBJECT
(animate)>DIRECT OBJECT (human). I have many examples of allative
preposition used to mark indirect object/differential object marking. <br>
Instead, I don't find any example of use of ablative adpositions with
allative-sense with animate nouns, as "da" in Italian. <br>
Does anyone knows a language that use an ablative adposition to express
allative with animate nouns? (it could be very good to find a similar
example of grammaticalization as above mentioned!)<br>
<br>
I will appreciate any suggestion.<br>
<br>
Best wishes<br>
<br>
Giorgio
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<div class="Section1">
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">----------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(0, 112, 192);">Prof.
Dr. Wolfgang Schulze<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">----------------------------------------------------------
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><i style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: red;">Primary
contact: <span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Institut
für Allgemeine &
Typologische Sprachwissenschaft <span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Dept. II
/ F 13 <span style=""> </span><span style=""> </span><span
style=""> </span><span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität
München<span style=""> </span><span
style=""> </span><span style=""> </span><span
style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Geschwister-Scholl-Platz
1<span style=""> </span><span
style=""> </span><span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">D-80539
München<span style=""> </span><span
style=""> </span><span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Tel.:
0049-(0)89-2180-2486 (Secretary)<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><span
style=""> </span>0049-(0)89-2180-5343
(Office)<span style=""> </span><span
style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Fax:<span
style=""> </span>0049-(0)89-2180-5345<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Email: </span><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><a
href="mailto:W.Schulze@lrz.uni-muenchen.de"><span lang="EN-US" style="">W.Schulze@lrz.uni-muenchen.de</span></a></span><span
lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><span
style=""> </span><span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Web: </span><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><a
href="http://www.als.lmu/de/mitarbeiter/index.php"><span lang="EN-US"
style="">http://www.als.lmu/de/mitarbeiter/index.php</span></a></span><span
lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><span
style=""> </span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">----------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><i style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: red;">Second
contact:<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Katedra
Germanistiký<span style=""> </span><span style=""> </span><span
style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Fakulta
humanitných vied<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Univerzita
Mateja Béla / Banská Bystrica<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Tajovského
40<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">SK-97401
Banská Bystrica<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Tel:
(00421)-(0)48-4465108<span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Fax:
(00421)-(0)48-4465512<span style=""> </span><span style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Email: </span><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><a
href="mailto:Schulze@fhv.umb.sk"><span lang="EN-US" style="">Schulze@fhv.umb.sk</span></a></span><span
lang="EN-US"
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><span
style="">
</span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">Web: <a
href="http://www.fhv.umb.sk/app/user.php?user=schulze">http://www.fhv.umb.sk/app/user.php?user=schulze</a></span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";"><span
style=""> </span><span style=""> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif";">----------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style=""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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