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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear Bingfu,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>thanks a lot for your
answer. Yes, I noticed that there were typos in the original mail.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The higher degree of
adjective-like properties of ordinals as opposed to cardinals is quite wide-spread.
For instance, in my native German, only the cardinal ONE behaves like an
adjective (agreement in case and gender) whereas the bulk of the cardinals is indeclinable.
However, all and each ordinal has to agree in gender, case and number with its
so-called head noun. Note that in German, cardinals and ordinals precede the
noun.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>More or less the same
picture can be found in other SAE-like languages such as Italian (ONE is like an
adjective, from TWO upwards cardinals remain uninflected whereas [ideally] all
ordinals inflect for gender and number according to the agreement rules; in
addition, Italian cardinals precede the noun whereas ordinals may be positioned
pre-nominally [= preferred position] as well as post-nominally [= marked
position under very particular conditions] – and thus behave
syntactically a bit more like Italian adjectives which are normally in
post-nominal position).<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I am pretty sure that you’ll
encounter many such cases throughout (“Indo-“)<st1:place w:st="on">Europe</st1:place>.
Have a look at Romance, Germanic, Celtic for that matter (as you already know
the Slavic data). By the way, I forgot to tell you that in our project on the
Grammar of Ordinaly at the <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">university</st1:PlaceType>
of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Bremen</st1:PlaceName></st1:place>, there are two
more people involved, viz. my assistant-to-be Maxim Gorshenin and at Stockholm
University, Ljuba Veselinova with whom I have been working on ordinals for
quite some time.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Please keep in touch and
let us know what you have found out about ordinals in the languages of the area
you are scrutinizing.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Best wishes.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thomas<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Prof. Dr. Thomas Stolz<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Universität Bremen<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>FB 10: Linguistik<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>PF 330 440<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>D-28 334 Bremen/Germany <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>Von:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">bingfu Lu</st1:PersonName> [mailto:lubingfu@yahoo.com] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Gesendet:</span></b> Montag, 20. August 2007
17:02<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>An:</span></b> Thomas Stolz; Linguistic
Typology; Renping Jiang<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Betreff:</span></b> Re: AW: word order of
cardinals</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>Dear Thomas,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>Sorry, there is two typos in my previous posting:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>The title of the posting should be ¡°word order of <font color=red><span
style='color:red'>ordinals</span></font>¡±, not ¡°cardinals¡±.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>We want to know the possible counterexample and relevant literature and
data in other languages.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>In addition, in some languages, <font color=red><span style='color:red'>ordinals</span></font>
morphologically belong to adjectives, such as Russian. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>In Russian, ordinals are more adjective-like than cardinals in the sense
that all ordinals are morphologically adjective but not all cardinals. What we
really want to know is that is there any other languages than Slavic where
ordinals are more adjective-like than cardinals.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>Thanks for your information of the literature, which is most important
and helpful to our investigation!</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>What you said about the particularity of number ¡®one¡¯ (even if
ordinals precede the noun, the cardinal ONE may follow the noun) is totally
consistent with our data. Many languages in China behaves like Maltese in this
aspect. Renping may tell you which languages. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>Best<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
7.5pt'>Bingfu <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
<br>
<b><i><span style='font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>Thomas Stolz
<stolz@UNI-BREMEN.DE></span></i></b> wrote: <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear colleagues,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>at the <u1:place u2:st="on"><u1:PlaceType u2:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">university</u1:PlaceType></st1:PlaceType> of
<u1:PlaceName u2:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Bremen</u1:PlaceName></u1:place></st1:PlaceName></st1:place>,
we are currently conducting a large-scale crosslinguistic study of the grammar
of ordinal numerals. We also look at word-order issues and word-class
membership problems of numerals. First of all, cardinal numerals behave like
adjectives in loads of languages ¨C especially Indo-European ones. However,
this is often true only of a certain sub-set of the cardinals (lower cardinals
as opposed to higher ones, digits as opposed to decimal values, etc.). Thus,
there is a difference between Latvian and Lithuanian on the one hand and Greek
on the other: Latvian and Lithuanian treat most of their numerals as adjectives
when it comes to agreement while Greek has agreement only for numerals
including the digits 1, 3 and 4. Details can be found in the work by Hurford, Veselinova
and my own. For the latter see:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='margin-left:2.0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;text-indent:-2.0cm'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:navy'>Stolz, Thomas. </span></font><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>2001. </span></font><font
size=2><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>d?„Ordinalia ¨C Linguistisches
Neuland. Ein Typologenblick auf die Beziehung zwischen Kardinalia und Ordinalia
und die Sonderstellung von EINS und ERSTER.¡°, in <i><span style='font-style:
italic'>Was ich noch sagen wollte¡ </span></i></span></font><i><font size=2><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;font-style:italic'>A multilingual
Festschrift for Norbert Boretzky on occasion of his 65<sup>th</sup> birthday</span></font></i><font
size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'>, herausgegeben von Birgit
Igla & Thomas Stolz (= Studia Typologica 2). <u1:place u2:st="on"><u1:State u2:st="on"><st1:State
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Berlin</u1:State></u1:place></st1:place></st1:State>:
Akademie-Verlag, 507-530. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='margin-left:2.0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;text-indent:-2.0cm'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:navy'>Stolz, Thomas. 2002. </span></font><font size=2><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'>„Is ‚one¡® still ‚one¡®
in ‚tewnty-one¡®? On agreement and government properties of cardinal
numerals in the languages of Europe.¡°, <i><span style='font-style:italic'>Sprachtypologie
und Universalienforschung</span></i> <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>55</span></b>,
354-402. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='margin-left:2.0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;text-indent:-2.0cm'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='margin-left:2.0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;text-indent:-2.0cm'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'>STOLZ, Thomas
& VESELINOVA, Ljuba. 2005.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='margin-left:2.0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;text-indent:-2.0cm'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'>
„Ordinal numerals.¡°, in: <i><span style='font-style:italic'>The World
Atlas of Language Structures</span></i>, edited by Martin Haspelmath, Matthew
S. Dryer, David Gil & Bernard Comrie. <u1:City u2:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Oxford</u1:City></st1:City>:
<u1:place u2:st="on"><u1:PlaceName u2:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Oxford</u1:PlaceName></st1:PlaceName> <u1:PlaceType u2:st="on"><st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">University</u1:PlaceType></u1:place></st1:PlaceType></st1:place>
Press, 218-221.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='margin-left:2.0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;text-indent:-2.0cm'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='margin-left:2.0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-align:justify;text-indent:-2.0cm'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Please note that there
are also interesting problems on the micro-level: even if ordinals precede the
noun, the cardinal ONE may follow the noun (this is the case in Maltese, for
instance). <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Good luck with the
project and keep me informed<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thomas Stolz<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Prof. Dr. Thomas Stolz<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Universität Bremen<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>FB 10: Linguistik<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>PF 330 440<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>D-28 334 Bremen/Germany<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>Von:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Discussion List
for ALT [mailto:LINGTYP@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>Im Auftrag von </span></b><st1:PersonName w:st="on">bingfu Lu</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Gesendet:</span></b> Samstag, 18. August 2007
17:16<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>An:</span></b>
LINGTYP@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Betreff:</span></b> word order of cardinals</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Dear colleagues,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>One colleague of mine is investigating the word order of ordinal
numerals. Based on her database of 112 languages in China, she got the
following implicational universal: If ordinal numeral precedes the head noun,
cardinal numerals does as well. Her data as shown below:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Ord-N & Card-N 53<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>N-Ord & N-Card 52<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>N-Ord & Card-N 15<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>N-Ord & N-Card 0<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>(some languages has two order, therefore, the total numbers of
languages above is larger than 112).?We want to know the possible
counterexample and relevant literature and data in other languages.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>In addition, in some languages, cardinals morphologically belongs to
adjectives, such as Russian.?We also need to know other languages where
cardinals morphologically as adjectives.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Replies to this inquiry can be send to my colleague Renping Jiang (<a
href="mailto:renpingjiang@126.com">renpingjiang@126.com</a>) and me.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>If correspondents is enough, we will make a summary.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Bingfu Lu<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Institute of Linguistics<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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