In Bardi (bcj, Nyulnyulan) the usual greeting is "anggi jawal" - lit 'what news', but I've also been greeted with "janabooroongan arr mindan?" (where are you going?), only when passing on the street though, but still in the sense of a greeting, not a direct interrogative. In this language it's kind of rude to ask a lot of direct questions, so the literal 'where are you going' question is usually asked by making a statement, e.g. 'you're going to the shop now?' I'd argue in these cases that the appellative notion comes from the intonation. These days people also say 'gorna mooyoon' "Good morning", which is calqued from English.<div>
Claire<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 2, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Wolfgang Schulze <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:W.Schulze@lrz.uni-muenchen.de">W.Schulze@lrz.uni-muenchen.de</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000066">
Dear all,<br>
just to add one comment: David has labeled the "mau [pergi] ke
mana"-type a "greeting". If we assume that a 'greeting' entails a an
appellative, addressing function ['wish' etc.] such as Bavarian
[gryes eana go:t], Engl. 'hallo', Lat. 'salve(te)', Russ.
zdravstvujte, Classical Arabic a-s-sal:amu \alaykum/-ka/-ki etc. it
would be difficult to subsume the mau ke mana-formula under this
type. Actually, I do not know whether mau ke mana etc. are
accompanied by an additional/preceding deictic or 'addressing'
gesture or phrase/lexeme, but I guess that it would be odd to use
the phrase without indicating some kind of attentional attitude
towards the addressee. I'm left with the impression that the
function of the mau ke mana-type rather is that of 'handing over the
power of speaking' to the addressee. The question mode adds the
notion of curiosity and interest of the speaker also symbolizing
the speaker's 'ignorance'. The addressee is thus put into a position
that allows them to construe themselves as being temporarily
superior to the speaker (by 'answering' the question). <br>
<br>
The event image used in the corresponding formula may dwell upon
various source domains most of them ending up in target domains that
share the feature [state/condition] etc. In fact, the
metaphorization of motion verbs seems to be a very common paradigm,
as illustrated by both David's and Paolo's examples. It's a
fascinating stuff when looking for the origin of such expressions.
For instance, in French the expression "comment vas-tu" has (to my
knowledge!) originally been used in reference towards 'bathroom'
(and its precursors), meaning: "What does your 'going to the toilet'
tell [us] about your health'? Such allusions to the state of health
are very common, compare Syrian Arabic shlo:nak 'how is your
color?', meaning 'how is the color of your face?'. I wonder which is
the type of motion event the mau ke mana-type has developed from.<br>
<br>
Best wishes,<br>
Wolfgang <br>
<br>
Am 02.06.2011 15:45, schrieb Paolo Ramat:
<div><div></div><div class="h5"><blockquote type="cite">French "comment vas-tu ?" and "comment ça va?" ,
Germ. "wie geht's dir ?" are the most familiar cases of movement
verbs used in greetings (vs. Span. "còmo estàs?" [accents are not
correct in e-mail characters and the inverted interrogative sign
is also missing] It. "come stai?" , lit. 'how do you stay?')
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Prof.Paolo Ramat
<br>
Istituto Universitario di Studi Superiori (IUSS )
<br>
Direttore del Centro "Lingue d'Europa: tipologia, storia e
sociolinguistica" (LETiSS)
<br>
Viale Lungo Ticino Sforza 56
<br>
27100 Pavia
<br>
tel. <a href="tel:%2B%2B390382375811" value="+390382375811" target="_blank">++390382375811</a>
<br>
fax <a href="tel:%2B%2B390382375899" value="+390382375899" target="_blank">++390382375899</a>
<br>
-----Messaggio originale----- From: David Gil
<br>
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 1:24 PM
<br>
To: <a href="mailto:LINGTYP@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG" target="_blank">LINGTYP@LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG</a>
<br>
Subject: query: Where are you going?
<br>
<br>
Dear all,
<br>
<br>
One of the most common greetings in many languages of mainland and
<br>
insular Southeast Asia is a phrase whose literal meaning is "Where
are
<br>
you going?", eg. Thai /pai nai?/, Indonesian /mau ke mana?/
Crucially,
<br>
it is not necessarily meant to be taken literally, any more than
the
<br>
English "How do you do?", and the most appropriate response will
<br>
typically be something vague and non-committal, such as "just
walking"
<br>
<br>
I am interested in mapping the geographical distribution of the
"Where
<br>
are you going?" greeting. I would thus be grateful for
information from
<br>
as many languages as possible, answering the simple question:
<br>
<br>
In language(s) that you are familiar with, is "Where are you
going?" (or
<br>
an alternative "Where are you coming from?") used as a common
greeting,
<br>
without necessarily being meant to be taken literally as an
expression
<br>
of interest in the direction of the addressee's movements?
<br>
<br>
I am equally interested in negative data, asserting that your
language
<br>
does not have such a usage, as I am in data of a positive nature.
<br>
<br>
In addition to confirming the presence of this greeting thoughout
<br>
mainland and insular Southeast Asia, I am particularly interested
in
<br>
ascertaining the geographical boundaries of the greeting, to the
west in
<br>
the Indian subcontinent, to the north in China and Northeast Asia,
and
<br>
to the east and south, in New Guinea and Australia. I am also
<br>
interested to find out whether it occurs in other parts of the
world, or
<br>
whether it unique to Southeast Asia. (A recent trip to Ethiopia
<br>
suggests that it might also be found there.)
<br>
<br>
Looking forward to your responses,
<br>
<br>
Thanks,
<br>
<br>
David
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</div></div><div>-- <br>
<div>
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</span></p>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><br>-----<br>Claire Bowern<br>Associate Professor<br>Department of Linguistics<br>Yale University<br>370 Temple St<br>New Haven, CT 06511<br>North American Dialects survey: <a href="http://pantheon.yale.edu/~clb3/NorthAmericanDialects/" target="_blank">http://pantheon.yale.edu/~clb3/NorthAmericanDialects/</a><br>
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