<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=Windows-1252">
<style type="text/css" style="display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;} </style>
</head>
<body dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Sometimes "negative" = emphatic positive clauses are covert rhetorical questions without an overt interrogative element. I find this in some West African languages, highly conventionalized and indistinguishable in form from actual negation. A pain in the butt
for fieldworkers analysing texts. <br>
</div>
<div id="appendonsend"></div>
<hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%" tabindex="-1">
<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Lingtyp <lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org> on behalf of Nestor Hernandez-Green <nestorhgreen@gmail.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, January 24, 2020 1:14 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bastian Persohn <persohn.linguistics@gmail.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org <lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] Ironic negative constructions</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="auto">
<div>In some regions of Mexico, there is a negative construction with similar effects:
<div dir="auto"><br>
<div dir="auto">Casi/no/es/borracho</div>
<div dir="auto">almost/no/is/drunkard.MASC</div>
<div dir="auto">"he's a heavy drinker" (lit. he's not much of a drunkard)</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">I don't know if this has been researched yet in Spanish.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Hope this helps<br>
<br>
<div dir="auto">= Néstor Hernández-Green =<br>
Sitio web: <a href="http://goo.gl/jsw4zs">http://goo.gl/jsw4zs</a><br>
<br>
[Este mensaje puede haber sido escrito utilizando funciones de dictado en Android]</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="x_gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="x_gmail_attr">El vie., 24 de enero de 2020 11:16, Bastian Persohn <<a href="mailto:persohn.linguistics@gmail.com">persohn.linguistics@gmail.com</a>> escribió:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="x_gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex; border-left:1px #ccc solid; padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(29,33,41); font-size:14px">
Dear group members,<br>
</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(29,33,41); font-size:14px">
I am posting the below on behalf of a student of mine. Any input will be greatly appreciated, be it on similar conventionalized uses of negation and irony in other languages of the world, general thoughts, or even specific remarks regarding isiXhosa (or the
larger Nguni branch of Bantu).<br>
</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(29,33,41); font-size:14px">
Best regards,</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(29,33,41); font-size:14px">
Bastian<br>
</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(29,33,41); font-size:14px">
<br>
</p>
<blockquote class="x_gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204); padding-left:1ex">
<p style="margin-top:6px; margin-right:0px; margin-bottom:6px; font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(29,33,41); font-size:14px">
I would like some help with finding resources/getting more information on ironic negative constructions, which are a rather frequent device in isiXhosa (Bantu, South Africa). I’m not sure if they go by any other name, I found this term in Oosthuysen’s (2016)
Grammar of isiXhosa. He describes it as “The use of a grammatical negative to convey a predicate with an emphatic positive connotation”. So, these constructions read as negative statements but in actual fact mean the opposite. The prosody is different which
helps in realising that<span style="display:inline; font-family:inherit"> it’s the ironic negative. Here are some examples (numbers indicate noun classes, FV is the default final vowel morpheme):</span></p>
<div style="display:inline; font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(29,33,41); font-size:14px">
<p style="margin:0px 0px 6px; font-family:inherit"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:inherit"><i>A-ka-se-m-hle lo mntwana</i><br>
NEG-SBJ.NEG.1-still-1-pretty PROX.1 1.child<br>
'This child is so/very beautiful' (lit: 'This child is no longer beautiful') </p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:inherit"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:inherit"><i>A-ni-sa-hlafun-i</i><br>
NEG-SBJ.2PL-still-chew-NEG<br>
'You are chewing so much/so loudly' (lit: 'You are no longer chewing')<br>
</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:inherit"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:inherit"><i>A-ndi-sa-dinw-anga</i><br>
NEG-SBJ.1SG-still-be(come)_tired-NEG.PFV<br>
'I am so/very tired.' (lit: 'I am not tired anymore')<br>
</p>
<br>
<i>Be-ndi-nge-minc-e</i>
<div>REC.PST-SBJ.1SG-NEG-tense_up-PFV<br>
</div>
<div>'I was so very tense' (lit: 'I was not tensed up')<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><i>A-yi-nints-i imi-buzo ya-m</i></div>
<div>NEG-COP.4-many 4-question 4-POSS.1SG <br>
</div>
<div>'My questions are so many' (lit: 'My questions are not many')<br>
</div>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:inherit">Any input in the form of papers, books, tiny excerpt, noting that it you’ve encountered a similar thing in another language etc would be of great help.</p>
<p style="margin:6px 0px; font-family:inherit">Thanks!<br>
</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
Lingtyp mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>
<a href="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>