<div dir="auto">Hi Christian,<div dir="auto">Thanks for your thoughtful post. </div><div dir="auto"> I would argue for including punctuation, because it may be significant as a representation of prosody, or it may serve as its near equivalent, either of which is meaningful. The current glossing conventions seem to carry the implicit assumption that language is purely segmental.</div><div dir="auto"> You can even gloss the punctuation. For example, in Discourse Functional Transcription (DFT), a comma signals "continuing" <span style="font-family:sans-serif">intonation</span>, while a period signals "final" intonation.</div><div dir="auto">Best,</div><div dir="auto">Jack<br><br><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature" dir="auto">==============================<br>John W. Du Bois<br>Professor of Linguistics <br>University of California, Santa Barbara<br>Santa Barbara, California 93106<br>USA<br><a href="mailto:dubois@ucsb.edu">dubois@ucsb.edu</a></div></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 25, 2020, 4:15 AM Christian Lehmann <<a href="mailto:christian.lehmann@uni-erfurt.de">christian.lehmann@uni-erfurt.de</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p> </p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
Dear colleagues,</p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">here is a little methodological problem which
some
may dismiss as trivial but which needs to be solved if we c</span><span lang="en-US">are
for</span><span lang="en-US"> standardiz</span><span lang="en-US">ing</span><span lang="en-US">
linguistic methodology. It concerns the orthographic
representation
of linguistic data, </span><span lang="en-US">esp. such</span><span lang="en-US">
a</span><span lang="en-US">s</span><span lang="en-US"> are
provided
with an interlinear gloss.</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">In the past decades, it has become customary in
linguistic publications to omit punctuation in data which are
f</span><span lang="en-US">ormat</span><span lang="en-US">ted as
examples and provided by a gloss, like this:</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<br>
</p>
<table width="100%" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">
<colgroup><col width="21*"> <col width="30*"> <col width="22*">
<col width="54*"> <col width="41*"> <col width="53*"> <col width="34*"> </colgroup><tbody>
<tr valign="top">
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="8%">
<p lang="en-US"> quo</p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="12%">
<p lang="en-US"> usque</p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="9%">
<p lang="en-US"> tandem</p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="21%">
<p lang="en-US"> abutere</p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="16%">
<p lang="en-US"> Catilina</p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="21%">
<p lang="en-US"> patientia</p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="13%">
<p lang="en-US"> nostra</p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr valign="top">
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="8%">
<p lang="en-US"> <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">whither</font></p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="12%">
<p lang="en-US"> <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">continually</font></p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="9%">
<p lang="en-US"> <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">finally</font></p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="21%">
<p lang="en-US"> <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">abuse:FUT:<a href="http://MID.2.SG" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">MID.2.SG</a></font></p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="16%">
<p lang="en-US"> <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">Catilina:<a href="http://VOC.SG" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">VOC.SG</a></font></p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="21%">
<p lang="en-US"> <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">patience(F):<a href="http://ABL.SG" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">ABL.SG</a> </font> </p>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="13%">
<p lang="en-US"> <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">our:<a href="http://F.ABL.SG" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">F.ABL.SG</a></font></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="7" style="border:none;padding:0cm" width="100%" valign="top">
<p lang="en-US"> “ <font style="font-size:11pt" size="2">How far will you continue to abuse our
patience, Catiline?” (Cic. <i>Cat</i>. I, 1)</font></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">The example is actually taken from a text; and
there it is, of course, provided with </span><span lang="en-US">initial</span><span lang="en-US">
c</span><span lang="en-US">apitalization</span><span lang="en-US">,
with comma</span><span lang="en-US">s</span><span lang="en-US">
in
between and with a final q</span><span lang="en-US">uestion mark</span><span lang="en-US">.
Many of us have </span><span lang="en-US">gotten </span><span lang="en-US">accustomed
to omitting these things in formatted examples. My own
guidelines for
interlinear glosses</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">(</span><font style="font-size:11pt" size="2"><span lang="en-US"><a href="http://christianlehmann.eu/ling/ling_meth/ling_description/grammaticography/gloss/" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">christianlehmann.eu/ling/ling_meth/ling_description/grammaticography/gloss/</a>)
</span></font>
</p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">also recommend t</span><span lang="en-US">he
omission</span><span lang="en-US">. The practice seems
inevitable for
a representation of a piece of text which is not in orthography
but
in some m</span><span lang="en-US">ore</span><span lang="en-US">
form</span><span lang="en-US">al representation</span><span lang="en-US">,
say phonetic or morphophonemic. Here I am talking about </span><span lang="en-US"><b>orthographic
representations</b></span><span lang="en-US">.</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">There are s</span><span lang="en-US">ome</span><span lang="en-US">
reasons for the practice of omitting punctuation and </span><span lang="en-US">sentence-</span><span lang="en-US">initial
</span><span lang="en-US">c</span><span lang="en-US">apitalization</span><span lang="en-US">
in glossed examples:</span></p>
<ol>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> <span lang="en-US">These orthographic marks m</span><span lang="en-US">ay</span><span lang="en-US"> not figure in the
original source:</span></p>
</li>
</ol>
<ol>
<ol type="a">
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> There is no published orthographic
version which would need to be cited literally; it is just a
transcription of a recording. Omission of punctuation
signals this.</p>
</li>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> The quoted stretch of text is not
(necessarily) a sentence, be it in its original context, be
it in the language system.</p>
</li>
</ol>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> These orthographic marks would confuse the
mapping of symbols structuring the interlinear gloss onto the
original text line:</p>
<ol type="a">
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> <span lang="en-US">Punctuation
symbols like ‘.’, ‘:’ have a special function in glosses
which they do not have in a </span><span lang="en-US">fully
orthographic</span><span lang="en-US"> text line. </span><span lang="en-US">Others </span><span lang="en-US">like ‘,’
</span><span lang="en-US">and ‘!’</span><span lang="en-US">
are inadmissible in the gloss. If </span><span lang="en-US">such symbols</span><span lang="en-US">
appeared in the original text line, they would map on
nothing </span><span lang="en-US">in the gloss line</span><span lang="en-US">.</span></p>
</li>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> Punctuation symbols like ‘-’ should
have the same function in the original text and in the
gloss.</p>
</li>
</ol>
</li>
</ol>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">(Ad (1b): We are not talking about examples
which
are just s</span><span lang="en-US">yntagmas below clause level</span><span lang="en-US">.
In </span><span lang="en-US">some </span><span lang="en-US">linguistic
publications, </span><span lang="en-US">such e</span><span lang="en-US">xamples
</span><span lang="en-US">are</span><span lang="en-US"> </span><span lang="en-US">provided
with a final full stop, too. This is plainly u</span><span lang="en-US">nthinking</span><span lang="en-US">.)</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">Here are some reasons for abandoning the b</span><span lang="en-US">an
on</span><span lang="en-US"> punctuation and initial c</span><span lang="en-US">apitalization</span><span lang="en-US">:</span></p>
<ol>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> <span lang="en-US">It makes the language e</span><span lang="en-US">xemplifi</span><span lang="en-US">ed appear as
one which lacks an orthography, thus dangerously e</span><span lang="en-US">vok</span><span lang="en-US">ing the attitude
towards „an idiom which does not even have a grammar“.</span></p>
</li>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> Punctuation, of course, fulfills a sensible
function in established orthographies: it reflects the
syntactic or prosodic structure of a piece of text. Omitting
it from an example renders this less easily intelligible.</p>
</li>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> <span lang="en-US">Whenever a linguistic
example is, in fact, quoted from a text noted in established
orthography, the quotation should be f</span><span lang="en-US">aithful</span><span lang="en-US">, including
the punctuation.</span></p>
</li>
<li>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US"> <span lang="en-US">Current practice allows for
exceptions to the principle of suppression of punctuation:
at least question marks are c</span><span lang="en-US">ommon</span><span lang="en-US">ly set.</span></p>
</li>
</ol>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
<span lang="en-US">You may know of more reasons for or against the
practice of suppression of punctuation and of initial c</span><span lang="en-US">apitalization</span><span lang="en-US">
in linguistic examples, or </span><span lang="en-US">you </span><span lang="en-US">may
be able to invalidate some of the above. I </span><span lang="en-US">would
be grateful for some discussion which helps</span><span lang="en-US">
to bring this closer to a recommendation that most of us could
share
and that would have a chance to find its way into style sheets.</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%" lang="en-US">
Christian</p>
<p>
</p>
<div>-- <br>
<p style="font-size:90%">Prof. em. Dr. Christian Lehmann<br>
Rudolfstr. 4<br>
99092 Erfurt<br>
<span style="font-variant:small-caps">Deutschland</span></p>
<table style="font-size:80%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>Tel.:</td>
<td>+49/361/2113417</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>E-Post:</td>
<td><a href="mailto:christianw_lehmann@arcor.de" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">christianw_lehmann@arcor.de</a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>Web:</td>
<td><a href="https://www.christianlehmann.eu" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://www.christianlehmann.eu</a></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
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