<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">I did a quick-and-dirty search over older (pre-1933) grammars (written in English) and there are many grammars from at least the 1850s and on which do use the term and concept agreement, e.g.<div><br></div><div><div><br></div><div>* O'Donovan, J. (1845) A Grammar of the Irish Language. Dublin: Hodges and Smith.</div><div><br></div><div>"Of the Agreement of the Article with its Substantive, and of its Collocation"</div><div><br></div><div>"Of the Collocation and Agreement of Pronouns with their Antecedents"</div><div><br></div><div>"Of the Agreement of a Verb with its Nominative Case"</div><div><br></div><div>...</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>* Davies, J. (1851) A Tahitian and English dictionary, with introductory remarks on the Polynesian language, and a short grammar of the Tahitian dialect. Tahiti: London Missionary Society.</div><div><br></div><div>"The rules of syntax are usually comprised under those of concord or agreement of words, and those of government or dependence of words; many of the English rules of concord and government will not apply to the Tahitian dialect, but the following observations may be of some use."</div><div><br></div><div>"There is nothing inherent in the verb, (a few of the reduplicates only excepted) to signify persons numbers non gender, and consequently the rules about their concord or agreement with the verb have no place in Tahitian."</div><div><br></div><div>...</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>* Buckner, H. F. & G. Herrod. (1860) Grammar of the Maskwke, or Creek Language. Marion, Alabama: Domestic and Indian Mission Board of the Southern Baptists Convention.</div><div><br></div><div>"The part of Grammar called Syntax has reference to the agreement and government of words; and of their proper arrangement in sentences.</div><div>Agreement is nothing more than the obedience which one word pays to the law of the governing word ; as, in English, a verb agrees with its nominal live case, because the nominative case governs the verb.</div><div>Government in language consists in the power which one Word has over another, according to tho laws which are founded upon tho established use of the best speakers or writers of the language."</div></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Pada tanggal Jum, 26 Jun 2020 pukul 12.07 Martin Haspelmath <<a href="mailto:haspelmath@shh.mpg.de">haspelmath@shh.mpg.de</a>> menulis:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
Yes, Nigel, but as you know: In the 16th-17th century, English was
irrelevant because Latin was the language of scholarship in Europe.<br>
<br>
In the 18th century, English was irrelevant because French was the
language of scholarship.<br>
<br>
In the 19th century, English was irrelevant because German was the
primary language of linguistics (it was Karl Ferdinand Becker, for
example, who made the distinction between "subject" and "object"
popular).<br>
<br>
So looking at the OED gives a wrong impression – it appears to
project the current supremacy of English back into the past.
(Apparently, the established Latin term "concord" needed to be
explained to English readers.)<br>
<br>
That's one of the reasons why we should call out common language
"Globish". There's no real continuity with "English".<br>
<br>
Martin<br>
<br>
<div>Am 26.06.20 um 11:58 schrieb Nigel
Vincent:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)">
But the term 'agreement' has been around in writings about
grammar for centuries. Here is the relevant entry from the OED:</div>
<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
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<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)">
<div>
<h3><span><strong>6.</strong></span> <em>Grammar</em>. The
fact or condition of agreeing in number, gender, case,
person, etc., with another element in the sentence or
clause. Cf.
<a rel="38345" href="https://www.oed.com/view/Entry/38345#eid8665709" target="_blank"><span><span>concord</span>
<span>n.<sup>1</sup></span> 6</span></a>.</h3>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div><span><span>1549 </span> <span>W. Lily</span> <em><a rel="2004814">Shorte Introd.
Gram.</a></em> (new ed.) To Rdr. sig. Aiii</span>
Lette hym passe to the Concordes, to knowe the
<span>agreement</span> of partes amonge theim selues.</div>
<div><span><span>1669 </span> <span>J. Milton</span> <em><a rel="0000014">Accedence</a></em>
41</span> The
<span>agreement</span> of words together in Number,
Gender, Case, and Person, which is call'd Concord.</div>
<div><span><span>1787 </span> <span>H. Blair</span> <em><a rel="2167050">Lect. Rhetoric</a></em>
(ed. 3) I. viii. 200</span> When I say, in Latin,
‘Formosa fortis viri uxor’, it is only the
<span>agreement</span>, in gender, number, and case, of
the adjective ‘formosa’..with the substantive ‘uxor’..that
declares the meaning.</div>
<div><span><span>1879 </span> <span>J. A. H. Murray</span>
in <em><a rel="2178421">Trans.
Philol. Soc.</a></em> 619</span> In the English
‘the men push the stone,’ we have neither formal
expression of the destination [of the action] nor formal
<span>agreement</span> of verb and subject.</div>
<div><span><span>1979 </span> <em><a rel="0005579">Amer. Speech 1976</a></em> <strong>
51</strong> 134</span> Of the nine problems covered,
subject-verb <span>agreement</span> receives a thorough
treatment.</div>
<div><span><span>2004 </span> <span>H. Barber</span> et
al. in M. Carreiras & C. Clifton
<em><a rel="2167052">On-line
Study Sentence Comprehension</a></em> xv. 315</span>
<span>Agreement</span> in gender between nouns and
adjectives is mandatory in Spanish.</div>
</div>
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<div style="font-family:Tahoma;font-size:13px">
<div style="font-family:Tahoma;font-size:13px">Professor Nigel Vincent,
FBA MAE<br>
Professor Emeritus of General &
Romance Linguistics<br>
The University of Manchester</div>
<div style="font-family:Tahoma;font-size:13px">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Linguistics & English Language<br>
School of Arts, Languages and Cultures<br>
</div>
<div><span style="white-space:pre-wrap"></span>The
University of Manchester</div>
<div><span style="white-space:pre-wrap"></span><br>
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<a href="https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html" target="_blank">https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html</a></div>
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<div id="gmail-m_3741315472662122339divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font style="font-size:11pt" face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000"><b>From:</b>
Lingtyp <a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank"><lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org></a> on
behalf of Martin Haspelmath <a href="mailto:haspelmath@shh.mpg.de" target="_blank"><haspelmath@shh.mpg.de></a><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, June 26, 2020 11:43 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>
<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank"><lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] languages of scholarship</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div>Maybe if you're Danish (like Hartmut and Nigel), or were
otherwise raised in some small (and rich) European country, then
understanding many of these languages is kind of natural.<br>
<br>
But somehow asking *all linguists* to be like this seems
Eurocentric to me. Korean/Chinese linguists (like Ian Joo) or
African linguists will simply not have the chance to encounter
so many languages in which other linguists have written relevant
work. (In Africa, even big languages like Hausa and Yoruba are
rarely used for academic purposes, it seems.)<br>
<br>
On the other hand, it's also ethnocentric to only cite work by
American linguists and somehow assume that there is nothing else
of relevance.<br>
<br>
So what's the solution? I think it must be (i) practical
universalism (only use English/Globish), combined with (ii)
awareness of the parochialism of English-language traditions.<br>
<br>
As an example of the latter, consider the term "agreement": As I
realized only after reading Cysouw (2011) (<a href="https://epub.ub.uni-muenchen.de/17668/1/thli.2011.011.pdf" target="_blank">https://epub.ub.uni-muenchen.de/17668/1/thli.2011.011.pdf</a>),
this term did not exist in linguistics before Bloomfield (1933),
and the relevant concepts didn't exist earlier either. Same with
"grammatical relation" (due to Chomsky 1965), "focus" (due to
Chomsky 1970), and quite a few other terms. Natural as these
terms seem to us, they may not be the results of scientific
discoveries that we made, but mostly due to the spread of the
English language (and the influence of a few linguists working
at rich U.S. universities).<br>
<br>
Universalism and parochialism are in a certain tension, but I
think we really need to adopt both at the same time if we want
to progress in our scientific understanding of language(s).<br>
<br>
Martin<br>
<br>
<div>Am 26.06.20 um 11:22 schrieb
Hartmut Haberland:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="FR">Et si l'article porte sur le
grec moderne, il doit souvent se référer à la tradition
grammaticale grecque (Tzartzanos) ou française (Roussel,
Mirambel).
</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="EN-US">Restricting oneself to
discourses in
<i>one</i> language is myopic. Most linguists really
need to read more than just two or three languages to
keep up with the relevant literature, but how many do?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="EN-US">(Robert E. Wall said in the
famous McCawley Festschrift, “More people can make out
what it is about in French than actually read it”.)</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="EN-US">To take a concrete example:
<i>Acta Linguistica Hafniensia </i>was founded in 1939
and its first issue contained papers in German, French
and English. Today, it still calls itself an
‘international journal’, but now practically all papers
are in English, with very few exceptions. However, if
you take a random issue (51(1), May 2019), apart from
one paper specifically dealing with English, there are
references to literature in German, French, Greek,
Norwegian, and Swedish. So linguists are at least not
passively monolingual.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="EN-US">Hartmut Haberland
</span></p>
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<p><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Fra:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> Lingtyp
<a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">
<lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org></a>
<b>På vegne af </b>Nigel Vincent<br>
<b>Sendt:</b> 26. juni 2020 10:04<br>
<b>Til:</b> Wiemer, Bjoern <a href="mailto:wiemerb@uni-mainz.de" target="_blank">
<wiemerb@uni-mainz.de></a>; Gilles Authier <a href="mailto:gilles.authier@gmail.com" target="_blank">
<gilles.authier@gmail.com></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">
lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>
<b>Emne:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] languages of scholarship</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p> </p>
<div>
<p><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black">Et si l'article est sur une langue romane
mais les références jugées indispensables sont écrites
en allemand ou en danois … ?</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"> </span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Professor
Nigel Vincent, FBA MAE<br>
Professor Emeritus of General
& Romance Linguistics<br>
The University of Manchester</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Linguistics
& English Language<br>
School of Arts, Languages
and Cultures</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">The
University of Manchester</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><a href="https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html" target="_blank">https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html</a></span></p>
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<p><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"> Wiemer, Bjoern <<a href="mailto:wiemerb@uni-mainz.de" target="_blank">wiemerb@uni-mainz.de</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, June 26, 2020 9:44 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Gilles Authier <<a href="mailto:gilles.authier@gmail.com" target="_blank">gilles.authier@gmail.com</a>>;
Nigel Vincent <<a href="mailto:nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk" target="_blank">nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>
<<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> AW: [Lingtyp] languages of scholarship</span>
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<div>
<p><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="DE">Je pense que oui…
Actually, the same applies to articles on (a
language from) other language groups (e.g., Slavic)
or subgroups (e.g., Scandinavian)…</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="DE">BW</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="DE"> </span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
<p><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif" lang="DE">Von:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif" lang="DE"> Lingtyp [<a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>]
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Gilles Authier<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag, 26. Juni 2020 09:35<br>
<b>An:</b> Nigel Vincent <<a href="mailto:nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk" target="_blank">nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] languages of
scholarship</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
<p><span lang="DE"> </span></p>
<div>
<p><span lang="DE">Si l'article
est sur une langue romane et que les références
jugées indispensables sont écrites dans une langue
romane, il me semblerait devoir être rejeté, oui.</span></p>
<div>
<p><span lang="DE">GA</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span lang="DE"> </span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p><span lang="DE">On Fri, Jun
26, 2020 at 7:52 AM Nigel Vincent <<a href="mailto:nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk" target="_blank">nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk</a>>
wrote:</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black" lang="DE">A related question to
Ian's that I have sometimes thought about
concerns the languages a researcher should
be able to read in order to access relevant
scholarship. Should, for example, a paper be
rejected or revisions asked for if someone
writing in English on a general linguistic
topic has not cited relevant work written in
a language other than English?</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
</div>
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<p><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black" lang="DE">Nigel</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black" lang="DE"> </span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
</div>
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<p><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black" lang="DE"> </span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
</div>
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<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif" lang="DE">Professor
Nigel Vincent, FBA
MAE<br>
Professor Emeritus
of General &
Romance Linguistics<br>
The University of
Manchester</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif" lang="DE"> </span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif" lang="DE">Linguistics
& English
Language<br>
School of Arts,
Languages and
Cultures</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif" lang="DE">The
University of
Manchester</span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif" lang="DE"> </span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif" lang="DE"> </span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif" lang="DE"><a href="https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html" target="_blank">https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html</a></span><span lang="DE"></span></p>
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<p><span lang="DE">_______________________________________________<br>
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<br>
<pre cols="72">--
Martin Haspelmath (<a href="mailto:haspelmath@shh.mpg.de" target="_blank">haspelmath@shh.mpg.de</a>)
Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
Kahlaische Strasse 10
D-07745 Jena
&
Leipzig University
Institut fuer Anglistik
IPF 141199
D-04081 Leipzig</pre>
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<pre cols="72">--
Martin Haspelmath (<a href="mailto:haspelmath@shh.mpg.de" target="_blank">haspelmath@shh.mpg.de</a>)
Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
Kahlaische Strasse 10
D-07745 Jena
&
Leipzig University
Institut fuer Anglistik
IPF 141199
D-04081 Leipzig</pre>
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