<div dir="ltr"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Hi David and Aigul, </font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><span lang="EN-GB" style="">I'd consider the 1sg use for the<span style="background-image:initial;background-position:initial;background-size:initial;background-repeat:initial;background-origin:initial;background-clip:initial"> protagonist of a story a feature of what </span>Wolfson
(1978) calls<span style="background-image:initial;background-position:initial;background-size:initial;background-repeat:initial;background-origin:initial;background-clip:initial"> </span>“</span>performed
narratives”. For Papuan Malay, Kluge (2014) also describes a related use of 2<sup style="">nd</sup>
person pronouns <span style="color:black">where they function to mark “a sudden
emotional impetus”. </span>This is an example of what Longacre (1983) describes
as person shift a narrative peak. Saliba-Logea (Oceanic, PNG) shows the same
phenomenon: a shift to 2<sup style="">nd</sup> person pronouns when referring to a 3<sup style="">rd</sup>
person character in a narrative, e.g. when introducing climactic events. I am
not aware of other languages of New Guinea doing this, but I have seen similar examples
with 1<sup style="">st</sup> or 2<sup style="">nd</sup> person, e.g. in Goemai (<a href="http://www.ethnologue.com/show_lang_family.asp?code=ank" style=""><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration-line:none">Chadic</span></a>),
<span lang="EN-GB" style="">Kɔnni</span><span lang="EN-GB" style=""> (Gur), and Dogrib
(Athabaskan). This is also related to the narrative imperatives (the <span style="background-image:initial;background-position:initial;background-size:initial;background-repeat:initial;background-origin:initial;background-clip:initial">“abruptness” use </span>Agul
mentioned) </span>found in Slavic, some other Balkan languages, North-Eastern
Neo-Aramaic and Arabic among others (references in Margetts 2015). </font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif"> </font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif">In most cases these pronominal uses are basically stylistic, rhetorical
devices but in some languages these uses constitute grammatically distinct constructions.
E.g. in Saliba-Logea the 2<sup>nd</sup> person is co-referential with a lexical
NP which can take a determiner and this combo of markers is not grammatically sanctioned
in contexts other than narrative peak. </font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif"> </font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Regards, <br>
Anna</font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif"> </font></span></p>
<p class="gmail-MsoBibliography" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Kluge,
Angela. 2015. A grammar of Papuan Malay. <i>Wacana: Journal of the Humanities
of Indonesia</i> 16(1). 211–232. </font></span></p>
<p class="gmail-MsoBibliography" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Longacre, Robert E. 1983. <i>The grammar of discourse</i>. New
York: Plenum.</font></span></p>
<p class="gmail-MsoBibliography" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Margetts, Anna. 2015. Person shift at narrative peak. <i style="">Language</i>
91(4). 755–805.</font></span></p>
<p class="gmail-MsoBibliography" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style=""><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Wolfson, Nessa. 1978. A feature of performed narrative: The
conversational historical present. <i style="">Language in society</i> 7(02). 215–237.</font></span></p></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, 12 Nov 2021 at 22:13, David Gil <<a href="mailto:gil@shh.mpg.de">gil@shh.mpg.de</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p>Dear all,</p>
<p>In Papuan Malay, there is a curious use of 1SG pronouns to denote
the protagonist of a narrative which is actually (as I understand
it, at least) about a fictitious 3rd person protagonist. So for
example, a story about the monkey-men who live in the mountains
might go something like "So one day, I started climbing the
mountain ... and then, suddenly, I saw a group of men with tails
... and then they shouted at me and chased me away ..." etc. My
interpretation of this usage of the 1SG pronoun (though I could be
wrong) is that it's "merely" some kind of stylistic convention to
denote a prototypical unknown protagonist.<br>
</p>
<p>Unlike the other examples discussed so far in this thread, there
is nothing grammatically unusual about this kind of "dummy
discourse 1SG pronoun usage"; what's odd about the construction is
purely semantic — presumably, nobody is meant to believe that the
narrator literally did all of the things reported on themselves.
Still, the construction shares with the other examples discussed
the property of making use of a 1SG pronoun to denote a referent
other than the speaker.</p>
<p>A comparative comment: Has anybody observed a similar "dummy
discourse" usage of the 1SG pronoun in other languages of New
Guinea? Papuan Malay differs from other Malay/Indonesian dialects
in that it does not exhibit pronoun avoidance; in other
Malay/Indonesian dialects, the same story would be more likely to
be told making use of a conventionalized character name, such as,
for example, "Yong Dolah" in parts of Riau province in Sumatra.</p>
<p>David</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<div>On 12/11/2021 03:19, Aigul Zakirova
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Dear colleagues,<br>
I am wondering whether you know of any languages in which a
finite 1SG verb form (e.g. non-past) is also used in modal
contexts (e.g. optative or deontic) with subjects which are not
1SG. I am asking because I came across such a use in languages I
work on, Meadow Mari and Hill Mari (Uralic). <br>
<br>
In the examples below a non-past 1SG form is combined with <i>əl’e</i>, a
form of the verb 'to be', to yield an optative reading. In other
types of optative utterances əl’e is also used, so
əl’e is not very interesting; what interests me is the use of
the non-past 1SG form. <br>
<br>
Meadow Mari<br>
erla jür lij-am əl’-e!<br>
tomorrow rain become-NPST.1SG be-AOR.3SG<br>
‘If only it rained tomorrow!’<br>
<br>
Meadow Mari<br>
maksim erla tol-am əl’-e<br>
Maksim tomorrow arrive-NPST.1SG be-AOR.3SG<br>
‘If only Maksim (person's name) arrived tomorrow!’<br>
<br>
To put it more broadly, if you have encountered cases where a
certain "petrified" person-number verb form is used in atypical
contexts which are distant from the original form's meaning, I
am also interested in such cases. What comes to my mind is <br>
-formal coincidence or resemblance between indicative and
imperative 2PL forms <br>
-use of imperatives in Russian to convey abruptness (А он как
побеги!) or in conditional / concessive clauses (Сделай он это,
все было бы по-другому) <br>
But maybe there is something else on the matter?<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
Aigul Zakirova</div>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
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<pre cols="72">--
David Gil
Senior Scientist (Associate)
Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution
Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology
Deutscher Platz 6, Leipzig, 04103, Germany
Email: <a href="mailto:gil@shh.mpg.de" target="_blank">gil@shh.mpg.de</a>
Mobile Phone (Israel): +972-526117713
Mobile Phone (Indonesia): +62-81344082091
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