<html>

<head>

<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">

<style type="text/css" style="display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;} </style>

</head>

<body dir="ltr">

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

Hi Jocelyne, </div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

It seems to me that in your examples, although the term "génie" is inherently positive, the addition of "à la con" or "de mes fesses" renders it negative. I think this works with any word.</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

In fact "de mes fesses" in my view can also imply a sense of usurpation, i.e. the person is not a true "x". E.g. "ouais, un copain de mes fesses" "a friend of my ass", means that the person is not a good friend. </div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

But "Espèce de copain" doesn't work at all unless you're making a joke. </div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

(Which I would have thought was the same in English, "you friend!" jokingly accusing someone to be a friend; or "you genius" in the same way; but maybe not.)</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

Cheers and many thanks for these interesting discussions, </div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

Maïa</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">

<br>

</div>

<div>

<div id="Signature">

<div>

<div></div>

<div></div>

<div></div>

<div id="divtagdefaultwrapper" dir="ltr" style="font-size:12pt; color:#000000; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif">

<div id="divtagdefaultwrapper" dir="ltr" style="font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0); font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,EmojiFont,"Apple Color Emoji","Segoe UI Emoji",NotoColorEmoji,"Segoe UI Symbol","Android Emoji",EmojiSymbols">

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span id="ms-rterangepaste-start"></span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">Dr Maïa Ponsonnet</span><br style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:small">

<span style="font-size:small">Senior Lecturer, Discipline of Linguistics</span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">Graduate Research Coordinator, School of Social Sciences</span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">Building M257, Room 2.36</span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">The University of Western Australia</span><br style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:small">

<span style="font-size:small">35 Stirling Hwy, </span><span style="font-size:small">Perth, WA (6009), </span><span style="font-size:small">Australia</span><br style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:small">

<span style="font-size:small">P.  +61 (0) 8 6488 2870 - </span><span style="font-size:small">M.  +61 (0) 468 571 030</span></p>

<span style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:small"></span></div>

<div id="divtagdefaultwrapper" dir="ltr" style="font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<font face="Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, Apple Color Emoji, Segoe UI Emoji, NotoColorEmoji, Segoe UI Symbol, Android Emoji, EmojiSymbols"><span id="ms-rterangepaste-end"></span></font><br>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,EmojiFont,"Apple Color Emoji","Segoe UI Emoji",NotoColorEmoji,"Segoe UI Symbol","Android Emoji",EmojiSymbols">

</p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

<div>

<div id="appendonsend"></div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<hr tabindex="-1" style="display:inline-block; width:98%">

<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Lingtyp <lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org> on behalf of MM Jocelyne Fernandez <mmjocelynefern@gmail.com><br>

<b>Sent:</b> Friday, 17 December 2021 12:53 PM<br>

<b>To:</b> lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org <lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org><br>

<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] Grammatical marking of insults (?)</font>

<div> </div>

</div>

<div>

<p>@Maia, Paolo, Riccardo</p>

<p>Of course, when you start looking for insult of colloquial language, counter-examples are numerous.</p>

<p>As for French, I would not assert that "espèce de" can never be used with a positive substantive – provided it is immediately followed by another expression that contradicts it, e.g.</p>

<p>    - Espèce de (petit) génie à la con! <br>

</p>

<p>       ≈         (small)  crummy genius!</p>

<p>- Espèce de génie de mes fesses!</p>

<p>      ≈         genius of my buttocks!<br>

</p>

<p>(Sorry for the over-familiarity, but such expressions can be found in spontaneous corpora, either ironical or referring to a previous co-text.)</p>

<p>Maybe it is a further argument for considering  that "espèce de" is a lexical construction.</p>

<p>    Best wishes from Quartier Latin</p>

<p>    MMJocelyne Fernandez</p>

<p><br>

</p>

<div class="x_moz-cite-prefix">Le 15/12/2021 à 12:17, Volker Gast a écrit :<br>

</div>

<blockquote type="cite">

<p>If you need some type of theoretical framework for this study, you could use Jonathan Culpeper's work on impoliteness, see for instance this paper on 'impoliteness strategies':</p>

<p><a class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.researchgate.net%2Fpublication%2F300633947_Impoliteness_Strategies&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136900891580%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=cVZcjt%2F86Qr6NaLXNpu8Itvnv9%2BoGAyFNbkdgP48ERE%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/300633947_Impoliteness_Strategies" shash="GLwULUObetMJ+pFmmxbNHY8MnZUgPOp3k9L/Sq8bWDbo8ashkSl/wKXgY5iB+uyOMKU5+OS4X+SqwkXLDA8ooCaNMWP5jCKmanSqc1ZPESZRM2ocx4aUHhx6dtSbQ4oh4idiTwMGn3312VsHmQV+cYwx75KJUAcntK7Sb8l0Xzs=">https://www.researchgate.net/publication/300633947_Impoliteness_Strategies</a></p>

<p>Culpeper distinguishes eleven types of insults in Section 8 on 'impoliteness triggers' (referring to his own earlier work from 2011). He extended Brown/Levinston-style politeness theory to impoliteness -- communicative actions intended to damage someone's

 (positive) face.</p>

<p>I doubt that languages have grammaticalized ways of expressing, for instance, positive impoliteness, in the same way as they encode positive politeness (e.g. in the V/T-forms of European languages). Perhaps you could consider the use of T-forms in a V-context

 as impolite (and potentially offensive). I wouldn't regard the types of structures found in 'personalized negative vocatives' (Culpeper's term) "grammaticalized". I think they rather belong in the lexicon, but that's obviously a matter of definition.</p>

<p>Volker<br>

</p>

<p><br>

</p>

<div class="x_moz-cite-prefix">On 15.12.21 11:39, Riccardo Giomi wrote:<br>

</div>

<blockquote type="cite">

<div dir="ltr">

<div>Dear all,</div>

<div><br>

</div>

<div>Thank you very much for a nice set of data and references. This will be extremely useful.

<br>

</div>

<div><br>

</div>

<div>I will reply to some of you privately, asking for further comments/data/references. In the mean time, any further feedback is of course more than welcome!</div>

<div><br>

</div>

<div>@Maia & Paolo: I agree with Paolo that <i>pezzo di / espèce de</i> are not grammaticalized, although not for the reason he mentions. After all the working hypothesis is precisely that languages can have grammaticalized means of marking a speech act as

 an insult, so, according to this hypothesis, the fact that <i>pezzo di X</i> never occurs with positively connotated epithets does not entail that the construction is not grammaticalized.</div>

<div>A different type of argument for regarding these as lexical constructions is the fact that premodifying adjectives must agree with

pezzo and not with the epithet (and I guess the same goes for French espèce), cf.

<i>brutt<u>o</u> pezzo di cretina</i>, as opposed to *<i>brutt<u>a</u> pezzo di cretina</i>. This suggests that

<i>pezzo </i>is the head of the construction; if it had been a grammaticalized element, I suppose agreement would have been with the epithet. At any rate, these nouns are not really reserved for marking a speech act as an insult -- they can also occur in other

 types of speech act, e.g. declarative <i>Quel pezzo di X mi ha rubato la bici </i>

(roughly, 'That dirty X stole my bike').</div>

<div><br>

</div>

<div>Best wishes to all,</div>

<div>Riccardo<br>

</div>

</div>

<br>

<div class="x_gmail_quote">

<div dir="ltr" class="x_gmail_attr">Paolo Ramat <<a href="mailto:paoram@unipv.it" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">paoram@unipv.it</a>> escreveu no dia quarta, 15/12/2021 à(s) 11:03:<br>

</div>

<blockquote class="x_gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px

            0.8ex; border-left:1px solid

            rgb(204,204,204); padding-left:1ex">

<div dir="ltr">In Italian too <i>pezzo di X  </i>'espèce de X' , as in <i>pezzo di idiota

</i>and the very insulting, derogating<i> (</i>but very much used)<i> pezzo di merda, </i>appears  just in derogating expressions: you will never hear <i> *pezzo di  genio,

</i>nor<i> *pezzo di benefattore !  </i>This is, I think, an argument for not considering  the construct

'pezzo di X ' as belonging to the grammar (Maia).

<div><br>

</div>

<div>Paolo</div>

<div><br clear="all">

<div>

<div dir="ltr">

<div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34)">Prof. Dr. Paolo Ramat</span>

<div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)">

<div>Accademia Nazionale dei Lincei, Socio corrispondente<br>

<div>'Academia Europaea'</div>

<div>'Societas Linguistica Europaea', Honorary Member</div>

</div>

<div>

<div>Università di Pavia (retired)</div>

<div>Istituto Universitario di Studi Superiori (IUSS Pavia) (retired)</div>

</div>

<div><br>

</div>

</div>

<div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)">piazzetta Arduino 11 - I 27100 Pavia</div>

<div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)">##39 0382 27027</div>

<div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)">347 044 98 44</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

<br>

</div>

</div>

<br>

<div class="x_gmail_quote">

<div dir="ltr" class="x_gmail_attr">Il giorno mer 15 dic 2021 alle ore 07:48 Nigel Vincent <<a href="mailto:nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">nigel.vincent@manchester.ac.uk</a>> ha scritto:<br>

</div>

<blockquote class="x_gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px

                0.8ex; border-left:1px solid

                rgb(204,204,204); padding-left:1ex">

<div dir="ltr">

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Maia is of course right that the English 'you X' is a way of insulting people but that depends on X being an insult. The same construction can be used to praise: 'you genius', 'you darling', etc.</div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Nigel</div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147Signature">

<div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">Professor Nigel Vincent, FBA MAE<br>

Professor Emeritus of General & Romance Linguistics<br>

The University of Manchester</div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma; font-size:13px">

<div><br>

</div>

<div>Linguistics & English Language<br>

School of Arts, Languages and Cultures<br>

</div>

<div><span style="white-space:pre-wrap"></span>The University of Manchester</div>

<div><span style="white-space:pre-wrap"></span><br>

</div>

<div><br>

</div>

<div><br>

</div>

<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.research.manchester.ac.uk%2Fportal%2Fen%2Fresearchers%2Fnigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136900891580%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=kqwRSP3KGR9vpQwQCde2gbu2OwvMXmt%2FOJWilOI2FDs%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html" shash="swy8NHBOjYIdA3jbasMuMiJwbZXC05AuGam5uGNQD1gRoePLnKHX2JBpEKli1txOSEiSZgkY89Z9sFy3kJL9tAx2M8xis4akpJp9tXjmONFyCA4gMGnfPQT7XRYJdmbkhm/4DZdUYV+JFH4Kf96n79dDDQA2v/c7IAI1uSWrS8k=" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.research.manchester.ac.uk/portal/en/researchers/nigel-vincent(f973a991-8ece-453e-abc5-3ca198c869dc).html</a></div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

<hr style="display:inline-block; width:98%">

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr">

<font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Lingtyp <<a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>> on behalf

 of Maia Ponsonnet <<a href="mailto:maia.ponsonnet@uwa.edu.au" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">maia.ponsonnet@uwa.edu.au</a>><br>

<b>Sent:</b> 15 December 2021 1:54 AM<br>

<b>To:</b> Jussi Ylikoski <<a href="mailto:jussi.ylikoski@oulu.fi" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">jussi.ylikoski@oulu.fi</a>>;

<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">

lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a> <<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>><br>

<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] Grammatical marking of insults (?)</font>

<div> </div>

</div>

<div dir="ltr">

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Hello, </div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Doesn't the English "you idiot" (you [insult]) qualify as an example? </div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Copula-free adposition is not standard in English predication, and it seems largely limited to second person sing and derogatory adjectives? </div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

 </div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

French has "espèce d'idiot" - not sure whether it qualifies as grammatical or lexical. </div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

 </div>

<div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Cheers, Maïa</div>

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_Signature">

<div>

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_divtagdefaultwrapper" dir="ltr" style="font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0); font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif">

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_divtagdefaultwrapper" dir="ltr" style="">

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_ms-rterangepaste-start"></span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">Dr Maïa Ponsonnet</span><br style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:small">

<span style="font-size:small">Senior Lecturer, Discipline of Linguistics</span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">Graduate Research Coordinator, School of Social Sciences</span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">Building M257, Room 2.36</span></p>

<p style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:16px">

<span style="font-size:small">The University of Western Australia</span><br style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:small">

<span style="font-size:small">35 Stirling Hwy, </span><span style="font-size:small">Perth, WA (6009), </span><span style="font-size:small">Australia</span><br style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:small">

<span style="font-size:small">P.  +61 (0) 8 6488 2870 - </span><span style="font-size:small">M.  +61 (0) 468 571 030</span></p>

<span style="font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif,serif,EmojiFont; font-size:small"></span></div>

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_divtagdefaultwrapper" dir="ltr" style="font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<font face="Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif,

                                EmojiFont, Apple Color Emoji, Segoe UI

                                Emoji, NotoColorEmoji, Segoe UI Symbol,

                                Android Emoji, EmojiSymbols"><span id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_ms-rterangepaste-end"></span></font><br>

<p style=""></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

<div>

<div style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<hr style="display:inline-block; width:98%">

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr">

<font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Lingtyp <<a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>> on behalf

 of Jussi Ylikoski <<a href="mailto:jussi.ylikoski@oulu.fi" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">jussi.ylikoski@oulu.fi</a>><br>

<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, 15 December 2021 6:09 AM<br>

<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">

lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a> <<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>><br>

<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] Grammatical marking of insults (?)</font>

<div> </div>

</div>

<div dir="ltr">

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Dear Riccardo and all,</div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

D’Avis and Meibauer's paper "Du Idiot! Din idiot! Pseudo-vocative constructions and insults in German (and Swedish)" (<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.degruyter.com%2Fdocument%2Fdoi%2F10.1515%2F9783110304176.189%2Fhtml&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901047734%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=epUSlpcyYNkWhFUtxjSROG4kA%2FN7nGCx3dZOBAdPyvU%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="https://www.degruyter.com/document/doi/10.1515/9783110304176.189/html" shash="DX9NmqnNYxQU4JmpgRSjy2UOFOvyyCT79jHIJ7N7MFK46mqB2f+RFtJ02fKrTzt6fqwxPoa66FEf3EqYRh1eNZu2NZKDTItMjMdIfDo3hrBcXA1Nv3KzQH/mVFM4rh6DjHPOMwX0GER/q8qxvtzKxpPdTpAQRF7lZBHTQKP/wEA=" id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147LPNoLPOWALinkPreview" target="_blank">https://www.degruyter.com/document/doi/10.1515/9783110304176.189/html</a>)

 might be of interest; see also the thirty studies referring to this paper according to Google Scholar:

<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fscholar.google.com%2Fscholar%3Fcites%3D9645899484374998601&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901047734%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=JV3exAEmpaPp6Y9kKvjw6jPWhSGmt8GgDRXQNv4wTKk%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="https://scholar.google.com/scholar?cites=9645899484374998601" shash="rxoGlrkXduLuQoiJ/X2Xo1ZAYwJrKQjs5GbS/4TwmfaMMSXDkNdL7pTjGcaI3bSLDEv/0aKxxBMSKPo4/3K7Ke5ni5aQ7H4f/I/85u1AmlkNxhxhuRNHiwtV4wnr6CjNuPGY5bVicBOXnTV6gUPE4gAxxAguyc9tof4qPt0Tfzg=" id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147LPlnk878646" target="_blank">

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?cites=9645899484374998601</a> (and so forth).</div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Best regards,</div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

Jussi<br>

</div>

<div></div>

<br>

<div>

<div style="font-family:Tahoma,Geneva,sans-serif; font-size:10pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">

<br>

</div>

<hr style="display:inline-block; width:98%">

<div id="x_gmail-m_-7318995592525743576gmail-m_-766327169779748147x_x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr">

<font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>Frá:</b> Lingtyp <<a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>> fyrir hönd

 Sebastian Nordhoff <<a href="mailto:sebastian.nordhoff@glottotopia.de" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">sebastian.nordhoff@glottotopia.de</a>><br>

<b>Sent:</b> þriðjudagur, 14. desember 2021 22:50<br>

<b>Til:</b> <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">

lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a> <<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>><br>

<b>Efni:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] Grammatical marking of insults (?)</font>

<div> </div>

</div>

<div><font size="2"><span style="font-size:11pt">

<div>Dear Riccardo,<br>

Sinhala has several levels of politeness in imperatives (marked by <br>

affixes), one of which would be rendered as "Do X, you $#!% !!!". I once <br>

nearly got beaten up when underestimating the impact that the use of <br>

this form can have. I can look up the reference if you want to.<br>

Best wishes<br>

Sebastian<br>

<br>

On 12/14/21 19:49, Riccardo Giomi wrote:<br>

> Dear all,<br>

> <br>

> A student of mine would like to investigate the linguistic coding of <br>

> insults across languages. She is particularly interested in finding out <br>

> whether languages can have dedicated (uses of) grammatical <br>

> forms/constructions for this specific purpose. The best example I could <br>

> come up with so far is the use of the Portuguese third person reflexive <br>

> possessive adjective (determiner in Brazilian Portuguese) /seu/sua/ with <br>

> epithets which are meant as insults. An example would be<br>

> <br>

> /Cala=te, seu burro!/<br>

> <a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fshut.up.imp.2.sg%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901047734%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=OaDk%2F7hFrvRtpOBhfKwUevC8smNd3Chcubfwp7so7Kk%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://shut.up.imp.2.sg/" shash="JG45NcshqLKpygAv9+BAC1CaIFOgEnslqxVx4lLgK5dobbSVc5nV+koh2mhEy+bHYUDMJeIYD3LT+PbNKkCZHlj1u8frqezZI4egrMP/YGoBRJrTWfFMtQH5GYLmZLnA0qp4yQ34wjqleVqCA0d1y38W0+yn46rxO7gmtva+FP0=" target="_blank">

shut.up.IMP.2.SG</a> <<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fshut.up.imp.2.sg%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901203957%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=QiGh68aQjYiGJXFoTdzbzhPVG62KT%2B5KgkVLecDlf5Q%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://shut.up.imp.2.sg/" shash="gqIOCjMre+U4O0semQmmKb06m5oyVivWgg8uIhk1sXE1UGRT70H9h/i442EFcZ++TH/yKBEdy32YoeeusYuXT974/tpu8+Fb0GOw2xli8T99xvKr5z0dry14Z5f3uMcHoQFs1r8Pytr4WfpXIhaJ+KrIoZ9dvppgCcvHuFwHcNk=" target="_blank">http://shut.up.IMP.2.SG</a>>=2.SG.OBJ

 3.SG.REFL.POSS <br>

> <a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fdonkey.m.sg%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901203957%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=OXB1nU8%2FpyDVV37ywRUycl5yM8UNldDFN0SEkUrkcJc%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://donkey.m.sg/" shash="SwrcPBn2zIXBz+zw0UZh7h5EmmxHgbov8Fqxbw99l/wl4wfmQkSQOQbxfS/a1OkPKjymh88QWraHwo2g+Fg8pUAnK2M7OrB+X5h6gKYbGA9iDbdXZgvkdCdaSPIbsndkOqW4ccEyNobeW7OZCmv2cCsWj76idcvhPvDTTR4Hmp8=" target="_blank">

donkey.M.SG</a> <<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fdonkey.m.sg%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901360240%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=mXxOz4tSaZScIlns23tyjhfPdfYtwK%2FsIjlbKj88Tks%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://donkey.m.sg/" shash="z8T32/znywoNQE57TrJSCApjdXZ+RnP9PfgQ7rT803Ky8CEg0QkW9fld9ILo1cqu28+VUgNSM3Zr6zG4K7WkLmycU7akeECNdth6NHR4HmfKpt3QpgnMezE/ePh+9A3fx76pOZ2RJYJx4VtXVZB1sEP68LrSa9GckKqwnaAKVkk=" target="_blank">http://donkey.M.SG</a>><br>

> 'Shut up, you idiot!'<br>

> <br>

> (Where, funnily enough, the third person of the adjective/determiner is <br>

> presumably the polite form!) This is an interesting case, I think, <br>

> because as far as I can see you never use /seu/sua /in 'plain' <br>

> vocatives, nor with terms of endearment, nor, for that matter, with NPs <br>

> which are not used as invocations.<br>

> <br>

> I am wondering whether anyone is aware of a language which has some <br>

> grammaticalized form or construction that can be used in this specific <br>

> way. Note that I am not interested in, say, abusive pronouns or <br>

> honorifics or general expressions of the speaker's disappointment <br>

> ('frustrative' markers) but only in grammaticalized means of marking the <br>

> speech act as an insult.<br>

> <br>

> Many thanks in advance and best wishes to all,<br>

> Riccardo<br>

> <br>

> -- <br>

> Riccardo Giomi, Ph.D.<br>

> University of Liège<br>

> Département de langues modernes : linguistique, littérature et traduction<br>

> Research group /Linguistique contrastive et typologie des langues/<br>

> F.R.S.-FNRS Postdoctoral fellow (CR - FC 43095)<br>

> //<br>

> <br>

> _______________________________________________<br>

> Lingtyp mailing list<br>

> <a href="mailto:Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">

Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>

> <a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistserv.linguistlist.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flingtyp&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901360240%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Io74izM8CH4OvYKoJ4RF7Ed3LqaNeK%2B2XK72TZFSySA%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp" shash="WPeSZ3JzZ7z40nt368rA4/LTcqnd7i9GVZmcsT9v/5xdgGNFxjPxVR9vhMOY9kVtNSy3SLTP0+ETFyjtmZX4i4ttMdJh7Xojzd239IA9WX/EamSlm2BLQ32Fsi81oJUFSfEiw0UotA4l9osGgTZsoTpVlVGP9woLO+xFxqSZOBY=" target="_blank">

http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp</a><br>

> <br>

_______________________________________________<br>

Lingtyp mailing list<br>

<a href="mailto:Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>

<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistserv.linguistlist.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flingtyp&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901360240%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Io74izM8CH4OvYKoJ4RF7Ed3LqaNeK%2B2XK72TZFSySA%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp" shash="WPeSZ3JzZ7z40nt368rA4/LTcqnd7i9GVZmcsT9v/5xdgGNFxjPxVR9vhMOY9kVtNSy3SLTP0+ETFyjtmZX4i4ttMdJh7Xojzd239IA9WX/EamSlm2BLQ32Fsi81oJUFSfEiw0UotA4l9osGgTZsoTpVlVGP9woLO+xFxqSZOBY=" target="_blank">http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp</a><br>

</div>

</span></font></div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

_______________________________________________<br>

Lingtyp mailing list<br>

<a href="mailto:Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>

<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistserv.linguistlist.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flingtyp&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901360240%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Io74izM8CH4OvYKoJ4RF7Ed3LqaNeK%2B2XK72TZFSySA%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp" shash="WPeSZ3JzZ7z40nt368rA4/LTcqnd7i9GVZmcsT9v/5xdgGNFxjPxVR9vhMOY9kVtNSy3SLTP0+ETFyjtmZX4i4ttMdJh7Xojzd239IA9WX/EamSlm2BLQ32Fsi81oJUFSfEiw0UotA4l9osGgTZsoTpVlVGP9woLO+xFxqSZOBY=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp</a><br>

</blockquote>

</div>

_______________________________________________<br>

Lingtyp mailing list<br>

<a href="mailto:Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>

<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistserv.linguistlist.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flingtyp&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901516489%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=ZLGHRcyo2ICpTj9epUIohHMgWNXEzL43mxEFVVbY3qg%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp" shash="bGAKKkUaHflpuprMXkJhZ+M7TT+QHjCrNEFNgcTbGrnKKfJmhuGfNqipLXX0gyiDE9Pujue58lngO+h6Y6McFltvVuD4vSMqkXkbqUtsrlySWY3u1lVYURrhDjG/4b0kDZGt4/5hC/QQ3nj+RkhQo0AogWsq4OEOHKQ6suYYZyE=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext">http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp</a><br>

</blockquote>

</div>

<br>

<fieldset class="x_mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>

<pre class="x_moz-quote-pre">_______________________________________________

Lingtyp mailing list

<a class="x_moz-txt-link-abbreviated x_moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>

<a class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistserv.linguistlist.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flingtyp&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901516489%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=ZLGHRcyo2ICpTj9epUIohHMgWNXEzL43mxEFVVbY3qg%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp" shash="bGAKKkUaHflpuprMXkJhZ+M7TT+QHjCrNEFNgcTbGrnKKfJmhuGfNqipLXX0gyiDE9Pujue58lngO+h6Y6McFltvVuD4vSMqkXkbqUtsrlySWY3u1lVYURrhDjG/4b0kDZGt4/5hC/QQ3nj+RkhQo0AogWsq4OEOHKQ6suYYZyE=">http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp</a>

</pre>

</blockquote>

<br>

<fieldset class="x_moz-mime-attachment-header"></fieldset>

<pre class="x_moz-quote-pre">_______________________________________________

Lingtyp mailing list

<a class="x_moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">Lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>

<a class="x_moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flistserv.linguistlist.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flingtyp&data=04%7C01%7Cmaia.ponsonnet%40uwa.edu.au%7C237a5407f6484670e3ba08d9c11958d9%7C05894af0cb2846d8871674cdb46e2226%7C0%7C0%7C637753136901672684%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=O5ljRo6R4pPT7Lz%2FAH%2FsbPxbBAOhcP7XO3H3jv6%2F0YA%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp" shash="l2ii/0WHvaCB26or0VlNjF9S4YrBC37MMUpvw8hl1Yg4yU3gV4TFNO9EtwOzpDcskvRfCumZd2krNo2bgATe5xlaKwxj14ko92dNkfZ3Lga03ZXz90lEvFdbvh0P519Td0MKtYknuX/2SxoMK/l6DUl1HN2SlVlPgOic7kRb5qc=">http://listserv.linguistlist.org/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp</a>

</pre>

</blockquote>

<div class="x_moz-signature">-- <br>

Prof. M.M.Jocelyne FERNANDEZ-VEST CNRS & Université Sorbonne Nouvelle</div>

</div>

</div>

</body>

</html>