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<div dir="ltr">As to in between cases, I always tried to tell my students that the important thing was to understand why they are in between cases, not to resolve them. </div>
<div dir="ltr">Hartmut </div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
<blockquote type="cite">Den 21. feb. 2022 kl. 13.20 skrev Greville Corbett <g.corbett@surrey.ac.uk>:<br>
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<div dir="ltr"> Many thanks, Eltan, for this interesting turn.
<div class=""><br class="">
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<div class="">A sobering question is “In ten years time, how many people in this linguistics class are going to care about the definition of phoneme, clitic or right node raising?" If the proportion is small, then a linguistics class can be invaluable in getting
over messages which <i class="">will</i> matter in ten years time, such as: <br class="">
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<ul class="">
<li class="">beware of arguments from authority</li><li class="">respect the data</li><li class="">don’t guess when you can measure</li><li class="">beyond what we think we know there’s a seething mass of uncertainly and ignorance out there</li><li class="">when we hit the ‘in-between’ cases, we don’t throw our toys out of the pram, but we try to understand the apparently clear cases better</li><li class=""><i class="">“... </i><span style="font-style: normal;" class="">the intensity of the conviction that a hypothesis is true has no bearing on whether it is true or not</span>.” (Peter Medawar: <i class="">Advice to a Young Scientist</i> 1979 p.
39)</li></ul>
<div class="">Very best, Grev</div>
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<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On 20 Feb 2022, at 11:45, Eitan Grossman <<a href="mailto:eitan.grossman@mail.huji.ac.il" class="">eitan.grossman@mail.huji.ac.il</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div dir="ltr" class="">Hi all,
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<div class="">I want to connect to the tangential issue that Martin and Peter raised about textbooks. I'm glad to see some discussion here of pedagogy, which concerns a lot of us in our everyday lives.</div>
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</div>
<div class=""><font face="arial, sans-serif" class="">In my experience, teaching terms and concepts in linguistics tends to take one of two forms: (i) either choose a simple definition and hope or plan to complicate it for students down the line, perhaps mentioning
that things are more complicated, or (ii) presenting a variety of definitions from the outset, showing the messiness of the field. This is not new, of course - there is a very old poem composed in Middle English about the multiple definitions of the phoneme
from the 1935 2nd <span style="" class="">International Congress of Phonetic Sciences, see below for the poem.*</span></font></div>
<div class=""><span style="font-family: NimbusRomanNo9L; font-size: 11pt;" class=""><br class="">
</span></div>
<div class="">Again, in my experience, both approaches have advantages and disadvantages. Students often feel more secure in their learning when presented with something clear that they know how to apply. On the other hand, under this approach, it is not certain
that students will ever be presented with the terminological and conceptual messiness that actually characterizes linguistics, at least not until an advanced degree, and this seems to me to be a lost opportunity for intellectual exploration. In general, I
think we tend to follow our habits and temperaments and perhaps to replicate (or revolt against) what our various teachers did.</div>
<br class="gmail-Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">In either case, it seems important to be clear to ourselves about what practice we are following, and to communicate to students that this is a conscious choice, and recognizing that whatever choice we make, it is an imperfect one (not unlike
life itself).</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I realize that this is a tangential issue, unrelated to clitics per se, so if it is something people want to discuss on another thread (or not), that might be better.<br clear="all" class="">
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<div class="">Eitan</div>
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<div class=""><font face="arial, sans-serif" class="">*From a letter from Jakobson to Trubetzkoy: <span style="" class="">“After the farewell banquet, all kinds of diversions were organized; that is, some members of the congress made jocular speeches, sang
songs, and the like. Every time the word<span class="gmail-Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span style="font-style: italic;" class="">phoneme<span class="gmail-Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span style="" class="">turned up, it aroused an outburst
of universal laughter. Horn composed a poem in Middle English on the themes of the congress. It ended in the following couplet:</span></font></div>
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<p class=""><font face="arial, sans-serif" class="">wat is phonemes, wat is sunds? </font></p>
<p class=""><font face="arial, sans-serif" class="">twelf men haf twelf difinitiuns.</font></p>
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