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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Matthew,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">The construction
that I'm interested in here (which does not seem to differ
significantly across
the genealogical boundary between Austronesian and
non-Austronesian) does not
seem to be a prototypical case of any familiar construction —
which is what
makes it interesting to me.<span style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Much
of the
discussion has focused on the differences between it and
Philippine instrumental
voice constructions, which I am not denying.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">But you can
hardly say that we're dealing here with a prototypical
applicative either.<span style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>What's
crucial is that in most or all of the
languages under consideration, the instrument NP cannot occur in
post-verbal
position, which is where you'd expect it to be in an applicative
construction
in an SVO language.<span style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Thus,
for the
corresponding prefix <i>k-</i> in Austronesian Biak, van Heuvel
(2006:420)
writes that "</span>it seems to be used only when this
instrument is
topical"<span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"> <span lang="EN-US">—
which is
kind of the opposite of how things work in many familiar
applicative
constructions.<span style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Call it
what you like (topic,
subject, whatever), but the grammatical functions and
behaviour associated with
the instrument NP are very different not only from those of
the corresponding
NPs in clauses without instrumental verbal marking, but also
from those of instrument
NPs in other languages with an instrumental applicative
marker.</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">As your
Hatam example suggests, there is also an affinity between the
construction in
question and serial verb constructions.<span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Peel
off the morphology and what you've got is a garden-variety
Mainland Southeast Asian
language SVC construction along the lines of TAKE STICK HIT
SNAKE.<span style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Alternatively,
transform your Hatam
inflectional forms to periphrastic and you get the corresponding
construction
in isolating Papuan Malay</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
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<td style="width:31.15pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">sa</span></p>
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<td style="width:37.95pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">ambil</span></p>
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<td style="width:33.75pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">kayu</span></p>
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<td style="width:30.0pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">sa</span></p>
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<td style="width:34.3pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">pake</span></p>
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<td style="width:.55in;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">pukul</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">ular</span></p>
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<td style="width:31.15pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">1SG</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">take</span></p>
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<td style="width:33.75pt;border-top:none;border-left:
none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid
windowtext 1.0pt; mso-border-top-alt:solid windowtext
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5.4pt" width="45" valign="top">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">stick</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">1SG</span></p>
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<td style="width:34.3pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">use</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">hit</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">snake</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">'I hit the
snake with a stick'</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">where <i>pake</i>
'use' is the periphrastic counterpart of the instrumental verbal
prefix in
Hatam, Biak, etc.<span style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>(This
construction is
unavailable in other varieties of Malay, which suggests that it
is due to
substrate influence from the local New Guinea languages.)</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">I would conclude
that the construction in question bears certain family
resemblances to instrumental
voice constructions, applicatives, and serial verb
constructions, but is not a
prototypical instance of any of these.<span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Given
its recurrence in (at least) three genealogically unrelated
families of
languages (Austronesian, East Bird's Head, and isolate Hatam),
what this
discussion seems to me to be suggesting is that the construction
in question merits
a term all to its own, so that its relationship to other
constructions can be
productively discussed.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">David</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-ansi-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><br>
</span></p>
<p>
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 22/02/2022 21:20, Matthew Dryer
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:163423D9-5911-486B-927D-B85EFACC0472@buffalo.edu">
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<p class="MsoNormal">David,<span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New
Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Preverbal position in an SVO language seems
to me to be a very weak factor as a subject property. There
are two additional overlapping considerations that would
normally be considered relevant. First, is the noun phrase in
question in the same preverbal position as subjects? And
second, does the S/A lack subject properties that it normally
has.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Without these two additional
considerations, it would seem that one would have to say that
<i>what</i> in English <i>What is John eating?</i> is
subject-like, since it is a preverbal constituent in an SVO
language. But it does not occur in the same preverbal position
as subjects and the subject does not lack its normal subject
properties. The same could be said about <i>rice</i> in <i>It
is rice that John is eating</i>.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">You ask why some of us are talking about
applicatives in their responses. One reason is that you cite
Hatam, Sougb, Moskona, and Meyah as instances of what you are
characterizing as constructions like Philippine instrumental
voice. But these seem much more like canonical applicatives
and quite unlike Philippine instrumental voice.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In the following example from Hatam, for
example,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<table class="MsoTableGrid"
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<td style="border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in 5.4pt
0in 5.4pt" valign="top">
<p class="MsoNormal"><i>Ni-ba<o:p></o:p></i></p>
</td>
<td style="border:solid windowtext
1.0pt;border-left:none;padding:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt"
valign="top">
<p class="MsoNormal"><i>tom<o:p></o:p></i></p>
</td>
<td style="border:solid windowtext
1.0pt;border-left:none;padding:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt"
valign="top">
<p class="MsoNormal"><i>ni-bi-bui<o:p></o:p></i></p>
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<td style="border:solid windowtext
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<p class="MsoNormal"><i>wou.<o:p></o:p></i></p>
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valign="top">
<p class="MsoNormal">1<span
style="position:relative;top:-1.0pt;mso-text-raise:1.0pt">EXC-use<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<td
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid
windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext
1.0pt;padding:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt" valign="top">
<p class="MsoNormal">stick<o:p></o:p></p>
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<td
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid
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<p class="MsoNormal">1EXC-INS-hit<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">snake<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p style="margin:0in"><span
style="font-family:Times;color:white">We used a stick to hit
the snake.
</span><span style="font-family:Times">(Reesink 1999: 54)</span><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New
Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">the fact that <i>tom</i> 'stick' precedes
the verb for 'hit' is presumably best explained in terms of
its being the complement of
<i>ba</i> 'use' and there is no evidence that the A of 'hit'
lacks any normal subject properties. This is very different
from instrumental voice in Philippine languages.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Matthew<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Lingtyp
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org"><lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org></a> on
behalf of David Gil <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:gil@shh.mpg.de"><gil@shh.mpg.de></a><br>
<b>Date: </b>Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 7:42 AM<br>
<b>To: </b><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">"lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org"</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org"><lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org></a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [Lingtyp] query: instrument voice<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p>Dear all,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>I must confess to being a little puzzled at how the responses
to my original query seem to have focused largely on
applicatives. To cite just one example ...<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 22/02/2022 08:31, Martin Haspelmath
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal">Once we have clear definitions, we can
begin to answer David's question whether languages with
instrumental applicatives only are rare outside of
Austronesian.
<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
<p>A fair question, but not the one that was asking; I was
asking whether languages with *instrument voice* only are rare
outside of Austronesian. Actually, what I really meant to ask
is whether constructions like those in Roon and other
proximate languages are attested elsewhere in the world; that
is to say, constructions in which a verb hosts an affix
denoting an instrument whose function in the clause looks more
like a subject or topic than like a direct object or oblique.
I used the term "instrument voice" because this seemed to me
to be the most appropriate term, or, to put it differently,
the constructions i am looking at seemed to me to be more
similar to, say, a garden-variety instrument-voice
construction in Tagalog, than anything else I could think of,
including most prototypical applicative constructions. In
response to my query, Mark came through with the Tzutujil
example, and one or two others have provided potential leads
that I will be following up on soon.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>But my choice of terms led to a terminological debate, with
several of you expressing your opinions that the constructions
in question, in Roon and other New Guinea languages, are
instances of applicatives. To which I would respond with a
question: would you also characterize a Philippine-type
instrumental voice construction as an applicative?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>I wouldn't, which is why I phrased the question in the way
that I did. Note that I would still acknowledge the merits of
a sometimes-proposed analysis of Philippine voice in which,
say, the instrumental voice is analyzed compositionally as
consisting of (a) an applicative "promoting" oblique to direct
object; in combination with (b) a passive "promoting" a direct
object to subject. But under such an analysis, while an
applicative construction *forms part of* the instrument voice
construction, the instrument voice construction as a whole is
more than just an applicative. (As Mark points out, a similar
analysis is clearly called for in the case of Indonesian, in
which passive
<i>di-</i> and applicative <i>-kan</i> frequently co-occur.)
However, in the New Guinea case, there is no evidence that I
am aware of for such a compositional analysis; the prefixes
that express what I was calling instrumental voice provide no
evidence for any kind of complex internal structure. Indeed,
for this reason, constructions such as those with the Roon
<i>u-</i> prefix seem to me to offer "better" examples of
"instrument voice" than even the Philippine constructions for
which the term was originally coined.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>David<o:p></o:p></p>
<pre>-- <o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>David Gil<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre>
<pre>Senior Scientist (Associate)<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Deutscher Platz 6, Leipzig, 04103, Germany<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre>
<pre>Email: <a href="mailto:gil@shh.mpg.de" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">gil@shh.mpg.de</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Mobile Phone (Israel): +972-526117713<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Mobile Phone (Indonesia): +62-81344082091<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
David Gil
Senior Scientist (Associate)
Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution
Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology
Deutscher Platz 6, Leipzig, 04103, Germany
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gil@shh.mpg.de">gil@shh.mpg.de</a>
Mobile Phone (Israel): +972-526117713
Mobile Phone (Indonesia): +62-81344082091
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