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A short answer Ilana would be: 'Canonical Typology'
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.smg.surrey.ac.uk/approaches/canonical-typology/">https://www.smg.surrey.ac.uk/approaches/canonical-typology/</a><br>
With pedagogical implications.<br>
<br>
Yes, a great discussion topic; and I think Daniel Ross's post in
particular has much food for thought!<br>
David<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 22/3/2022 13:11, Ilana Mushin wrote:<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Great
discussion topic! I’m intrigued by the focus on finding the
best examples of transitive constructions, usually with two
nominal arguments. These are hard to find ‘in the wild’, as
clauses in everyday talk tends to involve intransitive (or
lesser transitive) constructions with at least one zero or
pronominal argument (DuBois’ preferred argument structure).
To what purpose should we be trying to find the extreme ends
of what is possible grammatically, if this is not something
that speakers themselves appear to be concerned with in
their daily uses of language (which is where
grammaticalization takes place)?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Ilana<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">-- <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Ilana Mushin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Professor of
Linguistics<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Deputy Head of
School<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black">President,
Australian Linguistic Society<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><img style="width:.6041in;height:.8125in" id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:part1.ilqRCUvg.CF0XbaCR@anu.edu.au" alt="/var/folders/lv/m77kqy0n4x1_rcd3pk0j2n900000gq/T/com.microsoft.Outlook/WebArchiveCopyPasteTempFiles/il.pb.png" class="" width="58" height="78">Co-Editor, <i>Interactional
Linguistics</i> (<a href="https://aus01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Furldefense.com%2Fv3%2F__https%3A%2Fbenjamins.com%2Fcatalog%2Fil__%3B!!NVzLfOphnbDXSw!XIVG-R7E5WzAx0G3QYgTrakJEOa6L2OdXXKg1Lg7jusPiNeWF9btUHYhJlpCXsRdPeQ%24&data=04%7C01%7Cdavid.nash%40anu.edu.au%7C1a06b893bb4d41cd475f08da0ba96937%7Ce37d725cab5c46249ae5f0533e486437%7C0%7C0%7C637835120128376133%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000&sdata=Y8JkBii6UCeRoR3psdTbRkqX983miIprorq9SQ0QhOY%3D&reserved=0" originalsrc="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/benjamins.com/catalog/il__;!!NVzLfOphnbDXSw!XIVG-R7E5WzAx0G3QYgTrakJEOa6L2OdXXKg1Lg7jusPiNeWF9btUHYhJlpCXsRdPeQ$" shash="DL0Y8zg0YCeEdtedqHqU7sCBNjUs2Xfi6dkknfUYesbP2Gb5a327+9Rjs2cGV9uxNUtwurQJjqrYRptrwHVhBx0OcfQhiNBxjKgdPOtCI2/UyulfgLpYg/UgKMH15T9eXGTdu1gCJsypprSfg9mNAClrTYLwD7MOBkeP7t3H5gM=" title="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://benjamins.com/catalog/il__
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black" lang="EN-US"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">School
of Languages and Cultures</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">University
of Queensland</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">St
Lucia, QLD 4072.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Ph: (07) 3365
6810<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black">CRICOS Provider
No: 00025B</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Apple
Chancery";color:black">I acknowledge the Jagera
and Turrbal peoples on whose land I live and work.
Their sovereignty was never ceded.</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Lingtyp
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org"><lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org></a> on
behalf of Felicity Meakins <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:f.meakins@uq.edu.au"><f.meakins@uq.edu.au></a><br>
<b>Date: </b>Tuesday, 22 March 2022 at 11:36 am<br>
<b>To: </b>Spreng, Bettina
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bettina.spreng@usask.ca"><bettina.spreng@usask.ca></a>, JOO, Ian [Student]
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ian.joo@connect.polyu.hk"><ian.joo@connect.polyu.hk></a>,
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org"><lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org></a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [Lingtyp] On policing linguistic
examples<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Yes
although I think the Hopper and Thomason argument would be
about the relative animacy of the A and O roles
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Lingtyp
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org"><lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org></a> on
behalf of "Spreng, Bettina"
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bettina.spreng@usask.ca"><bettina.spreng@usask.ca></a><br>
<b>Date: </b>Tuesday, 22 March 2022 at 10:51 am<br>
<b>To: </b>"JOO, Ian [Student]"
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ian.joo@connect.polyu.hk"><ian.joo@connect.polyu.hk></a>,
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">"lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org"</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org"><lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org></a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [Lingtyp] On policing linguistic
examples</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">I think it’s definitely worth considering.
Prototypically transitive verbs can be used quite
differently.
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">Hit a ball, a tree, anything that maybe isn’t a
woman?
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">Chop wood, cut bread, kiss a woman?</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">Some violent words can be used in the hunting
context. In Inuit languages, we often use</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">Killing or shooting a polar bear. There is
nothing problematic about that.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">So often, I change genders in examples because
they are so stereotyical. So, this goes beyond the
indigenous stereotypes but stereotypes in general.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">John kissed Mary.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">Mary likes John.
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">John gives Mary a book.
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">With females being receivers, or receptacles,
subjects of psych verbs, etc.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">It goes beyond the indigenous context but that
is a particularly sensitive one.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">Once you pay attention, it’s quite blatant.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Dr.
Bettina Spreng</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Assistant
Professor, Department of Linguistics</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">College
of Arts & Sciences | University of Saskatchewan</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">P: (306)
966-1440</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Arts
Building, Room 911</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">9 Campus
Drive, Saskatoon, SK S7N 5A5</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"> Lingtyp
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org"><lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org></a>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>JOO, Ian [Student]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 21, 2022 6:05 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] On policing linguistic
examples</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
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2.0pt">
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<span style="color:#9C6500" lang="EN-CA">CAUTION:</span><span style="color:black" lang="EN-CA"> External to USask.
Verify sender and use caution with links and attachments.
Forward suspicious emails to
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA"><a href="mailto:phishing@usask.ca" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">phishing@usask.ca</span></a></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<div>
<div name="messageBodySection">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">Is “hug” and
“carry” as transtive as “hit”, though?<br>
According to Hopper and Thompson (1980), one of the
factors of transitivity is the affectedness of the
patient.<br>
Hugging or carrying someone does not affect them as
much as hitting does.<br>
Also “hug” is not so basic a word as “hit” is, which
is in the Swadesh List or the Leipzig-Jakarta List.<br>
Of course, hitting someone is a bad thing to do. But I
don’t think linguists should avoid certain sentences
because they depict something morally bad.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA"><br>
Regards, </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">Ian</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div name="messageReplySection">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">On 22. Mar 2022,
00:54 +0100, Felicity Meakins <<a href="mailto:f.meakins@uq.edu.au" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">f.meakins@uq.edu.au</a>>,
wrote:</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid windowtext
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">Hi all,</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">We also comment on this in our field
methods textbook (p. 129) and use a reflection from
Torres Strait Islander linguist Al Harvey about this
issue to illustrate how it can affect communities:</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="p1" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">Meakins, F.,
Green, J., & Turpin, M. (2018).
<i>Understanding linguistic fieldwork</i>. London:
Routledge.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA">“</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">One of the problems with publishing
some of the sentences made up by linguists is that
they become instantiations of culture and may
perpetuate negative stereotypes about often already
marginalised people. For example, grammars are full
of sen- tences exemplifying transitivity using verbs
that denote violence. ‘Hit’ is a classic transitive
verb, but so is ‘hug’ or ‘carry’. When you construct
sentences for elicita- tion, avoid topics that refer
to violence, sex, alcohol, drugs (including
smoking), child abuse or neglect, as these may upset
people down the track. Also bear in mind that
descendants of the speakers may read the grammar in
years to come, or may be an audience member in a
presentation using data you collected. Imagine that
you are trying to re-construct your language and the
only verb in the corpus is ‘hit’!</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">Perpetuating
negative stereotypes of communities – Al Harvey</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span lang="EN-CA">My name
is Al Harvey, I am of Saibai Island descent and am
currently work- ing on a project to preserve,
document and protect the Top Western Torres Strait
Island dialect of Kalaw Kawaw Ya (KKY).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:36.0pt"><span lang="EN-CA">Today KKY, like many other Australian
Indigenous languages, is endan- gered. The loss of
languages is more than just the loss of spoken word.
It has always been explained to me that languages
are a reflection of a peo- ple’s soul and way of
living in the world. Speakers and descendants of a
language have a role to play in the preservation and
maintenance of that language but so too do people
who work with those languages, including linguists.
It’s important that linguists are cognisant of the
role they play in acting as a facilitator in the
preservation of languages. Linguists also need to be
aware that language data gathered is presented in a
way that reflects the good faith in which it was
given. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:36.0pt"><span lang="EN-CA">I was at a linguistics workshop
recently where the presenters offered sen- tences
from an Aboriginal language. One of the sentences
presented in the targeted language translated into
English as ‘The man hit the woman’. For the purpose
of the exercise it seemed to me to be an unnecessary
display of a negative stereotype in a forum of
predominately non-Indigenous linguists.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:36.0pt"><span lang="EN-CA">Thinking of language data beyond
something to be scientifically analysed and being
cognisant that the language you’re working with
comes from the soul of a people would surely go some
way to avoiding such unnecessary representations.”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">Regards,
Felicity</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA">
</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Lingtyp <</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA"><a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</span></a></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">>
on behalf of Hagay Schurr <</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA"><a href="mailto:hschurr@gradcenter.cuny.edu" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">hschurr@gradcenter.cuny.edu</span></a></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">><br>
<b>Date:</b> Saturday, 19 March 2022 at 4:19 am<br>
<b>To:</b> "</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA"><a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</span></a></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">"
<</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA"><a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</span></a></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Lingtyp] On policing linguistic
examples</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="elementtoproof" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Dear Sebastian, </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="elementtoproof" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="elementtoproof" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">I'm only aware of the debate
around LSA guidelines in the early 2000's,
including, among others, Postal's (2003,
187) reply :</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span class="elementtoproof1"><span style="font-family:"Times New
Roman",serif;color:black" lang="EN-CA">"it is arbitrary and
discriminatory to try policing them only
with respect to one or more favored
victim groups, the policing code is
necessarily incompatible with the
principle of free speech, and, finally,
it is in any event not possible to
actually codify usage conditions that
genuinely pick out all and only the
offensive. Given all this, codes like
the LSA guidelines are in part harmful
and in part useless." (Postal 2003,
187).</span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Postal's
paper will lead you to some relevant publications
that defends policing to some extent.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span class="elementtoproof1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Best,</span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span class="elementtoproof1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA">Hagay</span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-CA"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><span class="elementtoproof1"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#222222;background:white" lang="EN-CA">Postal, P. M. (2003). Policing the
content of linguistic examples. <i>Language</i>, <i>79</i>(1),
182-188.</span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg">
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<span style="color:black">Lingtyp <</span><a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><span style="color:black">> on behalf of
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<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL]Lingtyp Digest, Vol
90, Issue 21</span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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Today's Topics:<br>
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1. Reference for violence (hit, kill) in
articles in linguistics<br>
needed (Sebastian Nordhoff)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2022 12:51:15 +0100<br>
From: Sebastian Nordhoff <<a href="mailto:sebastian.nordhoff@glottotopia.de" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">sebastian.nordhoff@glottotopia.de</a>><br>
To: "<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>"<br>
<<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>><br>
Subject: [Lingtyp] Reference for violence (hit,
kill) in articles in<br>
linguistics needed<br>
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:7a23c27d-4cc4-e57b-37c6-ac5570a6d144@glottotopia.de" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">7a23c27d-4cc4-e57b-37c6-ac5570a6d144@glottotopia.de</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8;
format=flowed<br>
<br>
Dear all,<br>
I have occasionally been part in discussions
where the frequent use of<br>
violent concepts such as 'hit' or 'kill' in
linguistics is mentioned and<br>
sometimes criticized.<br>
<br>
I believe there is some research article
providing empirical evidence<br>
for linguistic articles being unnecessarily
"violent", but I am unable<br>
to locate it. Could the list members help me?<br>
<br>
Best wishes<br>
Sebastian<br>
<br>
PS: I am aware that 'hit' and 'kill' have a
number of semantic<br>
properties which make them very suitable for a
number of research questions.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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End of Lingtyp Digest, Vol 90, Issue 21<br>
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