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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Dear Tom,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">thanks for this nice digest. However, on the spot, I’d like to make two comments.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">You can have sequentiality in simple clauses if you just consider items like Germ.
<i>dann</i> ‘then’. Speakers can just use this in reaction to some verbal exchange in which it has ben discussed how to act in some particular situation. A speaker may then (ditto!) say:
<i>Dann laß es uns doch so machen</i>. (translating probably as sth. like ‘Well, then let us proceed in this way’). This might be equivalent to “In diesem Fall / Wenn die Sache so ist,….” ‘If this is the case… (let us do so and so)’, and here
<i>dann</i> might be argued to be sth. like a discourse connective to link up a verbal (re)action with what has been the topic of the verbal exchange. However, it is a simple clause. Note that it works not only with directive (hortative) speech acts (as above),
but also with a (superficially) declarative like <i>Dann machen wir es so</i>, literally ’Then we (will) do it this way’, but implying, of course, an indirect hortative (or even imperative) speech act (depending on the “power relations” between the interlocutors
at the given point of discourse).<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I haven’t quite understood why you refer to Macedonian aorist (it would be same for Bulgarian). This is simply a delimitative
aspect for the past domain. Can it be used to refer to future events?<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">And, by the way, why do you mention Russian (probably entire North Slavic) perfective present here? Do present tense forms of pfv. stems refer to past
events? They may do so, indeed, if unlimited and irregular repetition (habituals) is what you have in mind. But in this case temporal reference seems to be just suspended, the only thing that counts is the boundedness of each particular occurrence of the denoted
situation type (i.e. the lexical meaning of the verb). Is this what you have asked for?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Björn.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Lingtyp <lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tom Koss<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, December 7, 2022 11:55 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Lingtyp list <lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] R: Non-present lexemes<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">Dear all, </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">many, many thanks for all the responses! I really appreciate it. I hope you forgive me that I cannot
respond to every contributor personally. </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">A few summarizing observations: this phenomenon seems to be much more widespread than I would have
assumed, especially in Indo-European and Uralic languages. Also, non-present semantics seems to be associated mostly with adverbs and particles, while verbal paradigms referring to the non-present are much rarer, the only examples for the latter being the
recency/remoteness markers of Piraha, the Macedonian aorist and the perfective aspect in Russian.
</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">Within the group of adverbs, I could make out three different types with more or less equal frequencies:
adverbs indicating a short relative distance from the present ('recent past and near future'), adverbs indicating a great relative distance from the present ('remote past and remote future'), and adverbs indicating an absolute, in most cases intermediate distance
from the present ('yesterday and tomorrow', or even 'day before yesterday and day after tomorrow'). For some adverbs, one of the two temporal interpretations (past or future) is more typical or considered to be ‘the correct one’ by prescriptivists.
</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">The fact that any clausal connective encoding some kind of sequentiality can, by definition, only
refer to the non-present is something I hadn’t thought about, so thanks for drawing my attention to it. I maybe should have added to my definition that I am mainly looking for non-present semantics within simple clauses.
</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">Many thanks again! Please feel free to provide me with further examples in case something else
comes to your mind. </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">All best,</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm;background:white;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE">Tom</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:black;mso-fareast-language:NL-BE"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From:</span></b><span style="color:black"> Lingtyp <<a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org">lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>> on behalf of Raffaele Simone <<a href="mailto:raffaele.simone@uniroma3.it">raffaele.simone@uniroma3.it</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, December 4, 2022 5:03 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> David Gil <<a href="mailto:gil@shh.mpg.de">gil@shh.mpg.de</a>>; <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">
lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a> <<a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Lingtyp] R: Non-present lexemes</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:12.0pt;background:#FFEB9C"><b><span lang="IT" style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#9C6500">CAUTION:</span></b><span lang="IT" style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black"> This email originated from outside of the organization. Do
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="IT"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT" style="font-size:14.0pt">Dear friends,</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:14.0pt">the Italian adverb<i> ora</i> “now” means both “quite recently in the past” and “shortly”.</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="1">
<li class="xmsolistparagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo1"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:14.0pt">Ne abbiamo parlato ora</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:14.0pt">We talked about it an instant ago</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="2" type="1">
<li class="xmsolistparagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo2"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:14.0pt">Ne parleremo ora</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="xmsolistparagraph"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:14.0pt">We shall talk about it in a moment</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:14.0pt">Best,</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:14.0pt">Raffaele</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">==============</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Emeritus Professor, Università Roma Tre</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Hon C Lund University</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Membre de l'Académie Royale de Belgique</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Chevalier de l'Ordre des Arts et des Lettres de France</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Accademico (corrispondente) della Crusca</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Prix de l'Institut de France-Fondation Bonnefous 2022</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">===============</span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Attività e pubblicazioni // Activity and publications
<a href="https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Funiroma3.academia.edu%2FRaffaeleSimone&data=05%7C01%7Ctom.koss%40uantwerpen.be%7Cb429efa4eff2415035e208dad696db03%7C792e08fb2d544a8eaf72202548136ef6%7C0%7C0%7C638058242037736669%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=NEVBVJ0AmpFZjueZOuUMJXTEklGNVSOyEyVOc8Rjjgg%3D&reserved=0">
http://uniroma3.academia.edu/RaffaeleSimone</a></span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT" style="font-size:14.0pt"> </span><span lang="IT"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="xmsonormal"><b><span lang="IT">Da:</span></b><span lang="IT"> Lingtyp <<a href="mailto:lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org">lingtyp-bounces@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>>
<b>Per conto di </b>David Gil<br>
<b>Inviato:</b> venerdì 2 dicembre 2022 20:07<br>
<b>A:</b> <a href="mailto:lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org">lingtyp@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>
<b>Oggetto:</b> Re: [Lingtyp] Non-present lexemes<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="IT"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="IT">Dear all,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="IT">In English, 'this evening', uttered at around 3 or 4 am, can, with a bit of effort, be understood as referring to either the previous evening or the following evening, depending on context, but not to the present time.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="IT">In Hebrew, a similar but less marginal (ie. much more common) pattern is evident with
<i>halayla</i> (DEF:night), which, when uttered during daytime, can refer to either the preceding night ('last night') or the following night ('tonight'), but obviously not to the present.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="IT">The generalization seems to be that English <i>this </i>/ Hebrew
<i>ha=</i> plus part-of-day expression refers to the nearest appropriate part of day to the time of speech, with no inherent specification of relative (past, present or future) time. (With an added complication for English, which, instead of
<i>#this night</i>, has either <i>last night</i> or <i>tonight </i>for past and future respectively.)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="IT">David<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="IT"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<pre><span lang="IT">-- <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">David Gil<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT"> <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">Senior Scientist (Associate)<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">Deutscher Platz 6, Leipzig, 04103, Germany<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT"> <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">Email: <a href="mailto:gil@shh.mpg.de">gil@shh.mpg.de</a><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">Mobile Phone (Israel): +972-526117713<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT">Mobile Phone (Indonesia): +62-082113720302<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="IT"> <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
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