6.1606, Misc: Oronyms, Lumpenproletariat, Sound Change

[The Linguist List]

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LINGUIST List:  Vol-6-1606. Mon Nov 13 1995. ISSN: 1068-4875. Lines:  166
 
Subject: 6.1606, Misc: Oronyms, Lumpenproletariat, Sound Change
 
Moderators: Anthony Rodrigues Aristar: Texas A&M U. <aristar at tam2000.tamu.edu>
            Helen Dry: Eastern Michigan U. <hdry at emunix.emich.edu>
 
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---------------------------------Directory-----------------------------------
1)
Date:  Thu, 09 Nov 1995 13:16:29 +0200
From:  druuskan at cc.helsinki.fi (Deborah D K Ruuskanen)
Subject:  Re: 6.1488, Oronyms: Bilingual Oronyms
 
2)
Date:  Mon, 13 Nov 1995 11:38:11 CST
From:  Chris DeSantis
<CCDESANTIS%CHQ2.TRL%CHQ1%OFF31%UTL01N%XFER%UTLVAX%YVAX%WPGATE at yvax.byu.
edu>
Subject:  Lumpenproletariat -Reply
 
3)
Date:  Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:57:44 EST
From:  karlgren at BLOOMFIELD.CS.NYU.EDU (Jussi Karlgren)
Subject:  6.1603, Qs: Sound Change, A Nat. Amer. Lang...
 
---------------------------------Messages------------------------------------
1)
Date:  Thu, 09 Nov 1995 13:16:29 +0200
From:  druuskan at cc.helsinki.fi (Deborah D K Ruuskanen)
Subject:  Re: 6.1488, Oronyms: Bilingual Oronyms
 
Rereading the oronyms summary, it occurred to me that we use two
bilingual oronyms in our (bilingual) family quite often.  These are
two names of a couple of gnomes who have lived in our house since my
daughter was five, viz.
 
	Finnish		English
 
	Aino (female)	I know
	Jussi (male)	You see
 
My daughter is particularly found of calling upon Aino.
 
Anybody out there got any more bilingual oronyms?
Cheers,
	kela
-
Deborah D. Kela Ruuskanen     \  You cannot teach a Man anything,
Leankuja 1, FIN-01420 Vantaa  \    you can only help him find it
druuskan at cc.helsinki.fi       \    within himself.      Galileo
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2)
Date:  Mon, 13 Nov 1995 11:38:11 CST
From:  Chris DeSantis
<CCDESANTIS%CHQ2.TRL%CHQ1%OFF31%UTL01N%XFER%UTLVAX%YVAX%WPGATE at yvax.byu.
edu>
Subject:  Lumpenproletariat -Reply
 
 
I believe the reference in question is simply wrong.  Every
source I have checked indicates that the Lumpen- is strictly
German and _is_ related to the term for "rag", i.e. the ragged
(worthless) proletariat.
 
I bhfad uainn go le/ir an drochrud...
- ---------------------------------------------/\------
Christopher C. DeSantis                     /\|==|/\
ccdesantis%TRL%cob%wpgate at yvax.byu.edu     |()|[]|()|
(with apologies for the long address)      |()|==|()|
                                           |()|[]|()|
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3)
Date:  Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:57:44 EST
From:  karlgren at BLOOMFIELD.CS.NYU.EDU (Jussi Karlgren)
Subject:  6.1603, Qs: Sound Change, A Nat. Amer. Lang...
 
The Linguist List writes:
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> LINGUIST List:  Vol-6-1603. Sun Nov 12 1995. ISSN: 1068-4875. Lines:  135
> ---------------------------------Messages------------------------------------
> 1)
> Date:  Sun, 12 Nov 1995 08:17:24 EST
> From:  amr at CS.Wayne.EDU (Alexis Manaster Ramer)
> Subject:  Query: Possible Sound Change Interactions
>
> I am trying to collect cases where two sound changes A and B
> interact as follows: we find A in a whole group of dialects or
> related languages, and B only in a subset of those, yet where both
> A and B apply, B must have applied first.
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> LINGUIST List: Vol-6-1603.
 
 
A:
 
in finnish, most dialects have illative case as a vowel lengthening
in the last syllable:
 
sauna   -> saunaan
auto    -> autoon
 
historically, this has been saunaCan, where C most often has been h.
(still is, in some dialects.)
 
 
  -------
 
most or all dialects have had their long vowels diphtongized ("turned")
as follows:
 
ee -> ie
oo -> uo
o"o" -> y"o
 
B:
 
and savonian dialects have this in
 
aa-> ua
a"a" ->ia"
 
as well, so that
 
"saab" (the car) is "suappi" in savonian.
 
- ------
 
B before A:
 
in savonian "saunaan" is not *"saunuan".
 
the vowel turning is savonian in origin and has spread westward
from savo. the consonant loss came from the west after this
happened. apparently there are western dialects where the
order of change is the opposite, so that there are such
illative diphtongs to be found.
 
 
See the following for details:
 
\item
Martti Rapola. 1923. P\"a\"apainottomiin tavuihin kehittyneiden
pitkien vokaalien
k\"asittely suomen it\"amurteissa. {\it Suomi} V:2. Helsinki: Suomen
Kirjallisuuden Seura.
 
 
J
 
-
Jussi Karlgren                                             karlgren at cs.nyu.edu
Visiting Researcher, Computer Science                  715 Bwy # 704, NYU, NYC
vox: (212) 998-3496 fax: (212) 995-4123             URL: http://sics.se/~jussi
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