LL-L: "Statistics" LOWLANDS-L, 03.AUG.2001 (01) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 03.AUG.2001 (01) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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 A=Afrikaans, Ap=Appalachian, D=Dutch, E=English, F=Frisian, L=Limburgish
 LS=Low Saxon (Low German), S=Scots, Sh=Shetlandic, Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Stistics

Sorry, this issue got away from me too soon.  The first author was Mathieu van
Woerkom, not I, and the subject line was "Statistics."

Reinhard/Ron

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From: Mathieu. van Woerkom <Mathieu.vanWoerkom at student.kun.nl>
Subject: statistics

about a month ago, Ian wrote:

>I was wondering if any of you knew the number of speakers for each lowlands
>language, or at least where to find them.

I don't know the exact statistics, and I certainly do't know where to find
them. I do know a couple of statisctics for sure:

1. In the Dutch province of Limburg (1,200,000 inhabitants) approximately 75%
speaks Limburgisch. This percentage is higher in the south (city of
Maastricht/Mestreech: 80%) and somewhat lower in the north and the city of
Heerlen/Haelder (old mining city).
2. Among the Limburgisch students of the University of Nijmegen (Gelderland),
65% speaks Limburgisch.
3. In the province of Friesland (625,000 inhabitants), approximately 350,000
people speak Frisian.

I don't know the amount of people who speak Frisian or Limburgisch outside
their own province.

Regards,
Mathieu

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Statistics

Dear Lowlanders,

For the number Low Saxon speakers there are only "guestimates," since, like
Scots in Scotland, Low Saxon use is apparently not included in the census.
(Remember that the language was officially recognized only recently and before
that was widely seen as a group of German and Dutch dialects.)

Some people seem to have tried to go about estimating the number of speakers
in a halfway scientific manner, but the estimates are all over the place,
probably influenced by the estimators' political agendas as well as by the
vagueness of defining "proficiency."  Factoring into it is also the fact that
in Germany there is this unfortunate category "Low German" (_Niederdeutsch_,
_Platt(deutsch)_), a catch-all label for Low Saxon and Limburgish dialects --
thus dialects of two languages, where the Low Saxon ones predominate -- that
happen to be used within the borders of Germany.

So, the estimates in Germany I have been aware of range from 7 million to a
handful (thus virtual extinction).  The truth, no doubt, lies somewhere in
between.  I assume the highest figures include people who claim to be
proficient but merely understand the language fairly well and manage to read
and write it themselves only poorly and in a mode approaching Missingsch
(i.e., German on Low Saxon substrates).  (Occasionally I receive email
messages in these modes, with _wie_ instead of _wo(ans)_ 'how', _wer_ instead
of _(wo)keen_ 'who', _wo_ instead of _(wo)neem_ or _waar_ 'where', _niemand_
instead of _nüms_ or _keeneen_ 'nobody', etc.)

Henk Bloemhoff et al. offer a perhaps more scientific estimate of about one
and three quarter million speakers of Low Saxon in the Eastern Netherlands.
http://www.geocities.com/sassisch/rhahn/low-saxon/lowsax-nl.htm
http://members1.chello.nl/~w.vanwoerkom/nedersaksischnl.htm

These are the first-language speaker figures given in the _Ethnologue_
(http://www.sil.org/ethnologue/ethnologue.html), also to be taken with a
couple of grains of salt:

Afrikaans:        6,381,000   (1989)
Appalachian:    (not listed, contained in English)
Dutch:           20,000,000+  (1988)
English:        341,000,000   (1999)
Frisian:
        Eastern (Sater):        1,500-2,000 (1977)
        Northern:               (no estimates available)
        West(erlauwers):        730,000 (1976)
Limburgish:     (not listed)
Low Saxon:      (no estimates available)
        Plautdietsch: 400,000 (150,000 habitually, 1978)
Scots:           100,000   (1999)
        Lallans:        60,000
        Doric:          30,000
        Ulster Scots:   10,000
Zeelandic:      (not listed)

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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