LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.08.20 (05) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

======================================================================
 L O W L A N D S - L * 20.AUG.2002 (05) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
 Web Site: <http://www.lowlands-l.net> Email: admin at lowlands-l.net
 Rules & Guidelines: <http://www.lowlands-l.net/rules.htm>
 Posting Address: <lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org>
 Server Manual: <http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html>
 Archive: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html>
=======================================================================
 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian L=Limburgish
 LS=Low Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
=======================================================================

From: <burgdal32 at mac.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.08.01 (02) [E]

> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Language varieties

> Mike,
>
> Some further comparison reveals that there is actually some method to
> the apparent madness:
>
> M.Ger. = Modern German
> Berlin = Berlin dialect
> O.Ger. = Old (High) German
> N.Sax. = Modern Northern Saxon (phonemic)*
> O.Sax. = Old Saxon
> M.Eng. = Modern Standard English
> O.Eng. = Old English
I can bring in the Westflemish variants:
  uus   muus   luus uut doôf boôm koôp loôf hloôf
> M.Ger. Berlin O.Ger.  N.Sax.  O.Sax. Scots  M.Eng.  O.Eng.
> Haus   Haus   hûs     huuz    hûs    hoose  house   hûs
> Maus   Maus   mûs     muuz    mûs    moose  mouse   mûs
> Laus   Laus   lûs     luuz    lûs    loose  louse   lûs
> aus    aus    ûZ      uut     ût     oot    out     uut
> taub   doof   toub    douB    dôf    deef   deaf    dêaf
> Baum   Boom   boum    boum    bâm    beam   beam    bêam
> kauf-  koof-  kouf(-) köüp-** kôp(-) chape  cheap   cêap(-)
> lauf-  loof- (h)louf- loup-   hlôp-  lowp   leap    hlêap-
> glaub- jloob- giloub- glöüB-  gilôB- beleve believe belêf-
>
> *  B = [v] ~ [b] (written as a crossed b in O.Sax.)
> ** un-umlauted _koup-_ is used in some dialects

Luc Vanbrabant
Oekene

-----------

From: <burgdal32 at mac.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.08.01 (02) [E]

> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Language varieties
>
> Mike,
>
> The language varieties in and around Berlin (< Slavic *_brlo_ 'swamp')
> can "at best" be called "Missingsch," i.e., German dialects with
> Lowlands Saxon (Low German) substrates.  Originally, Mercian
> (_märkische_) Lowlands Saxon, i.e., southeastern, varieties were spoken
> there and still are pretty much around this Missingsch/German enclave in
> which German pressure became especially strong when Berlin became the
> national capital.  It must also be born in mind that, to start with, the
> Mercian varieties are strongly German influenced, and some of them may
> be considered (partly) Central German.  They have some typically eastern
> (probably Slavic-based) features, such as g- > j- before front vowels
> (e.g., _jejeben_ [je'je:bm=] 'given').

In Westflemish there are some remains of the same thing:
D behangen WFL bejang'
D gunnen   WFL jeun'
D gunst    WFL junste
D ja hij...WFL jaaj...
And i also think of words like
genever/jenever
uilenspiegel/ulenspiejel

==================================END===================================
 You have received this because your account has been subscribed upon
 request. To unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l"
 as message text from the same account to
 <listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org> or sign off at
 <http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html>.
=======================================================================
 * Please submit postings to <lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org>.
 * Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
 * Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
 * Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l") are
   to be sent to <listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org> or at
   <http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html>.
 * Please use only Plain Text format, not Rich Text (HTML) or any other
   type of format, in your submissions
=======================================================================