LL-L "Etymology" 2002.05.02 (04) [D/E]

[Lowlands-L]

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From: "Abramoff" <abramoff at zeelandnet.nl>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2002.05.02 (02) [E]

fassen zou ook misschien ook kunnen inhouden "snappen" of "begrijpen"

[David Abramoff]

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

I wrote:

> In German, "fast" as in "fixed," "secured," "firm," "stable," "sound,"
> is _fest_.  English "to fasten" comes from "fast": "to make
> secure/stable."  In German this would be something like _befestigen_,
> _festmachen_, etc., in Dutch _bevestigen_, also _vestigen_ (< German?),
> but 'fast', 'secured', 'stable' is _vast_ in Dutch, which gives words
> such as _vastbijten_, _vasteland_, etc.
>
> Thus, in German there is _fest_ and there is _fassen_ 'to seize'.  I
> don't have a German etymological dictionary here at the moment, but I
> assume they do not come from the same source.  I assume that _fassen_
> had the Middle High German form *_fazzen_ and goes back to the Old High
> German root *_fat-_.  (Remember: German _-ss_ < _-tt-_)
>
> In Low Saxon (Low German), 'fast' (as in 'secured') is /fast-/ _fast_
> [fast] (probably spelled _vast_ in the Netherlands), also denoting
> 'strong', 'unmoving', 'immobile', etc.  (E.g., _Sitt fast!_ ("Sit
> fast!") 'Keep sitting!', 'Don't get up!')  You get derivations such as
> _fastbacken_ ("to stick fast") 'to be/get stuck', _fastbinden_ ~
> _fastbinnen_ ("to bind fast") 'to fasten by tying', _fastmaken_ ("to
> make fast") 'to fasten', 'to fix', 'to secure', 'to make (a
> date/agreement)', _fastnehmen_ ("to take fast") 'to arrest',
> _faststellen_ ("to stand/put fast") 'to make immobile', 'to determine',
> _fastholden_ ~ _fastholen_ 'to hold fast', 'to keep hold (of)', also
> _Fastland_ ("firm land") 'mainland'.
>
> German (/fas-/) _fassen_ 'to seize' has the Low Saxon equivalent
> (/faat-/) _faten_ ['fQ:tn=] (probably spelled *_vaten_ ~ *_voaten_ ~
> *_vaotn_, etc., in the Netherlands).  (It can be a weak verb [ik faat,
> du faatst, he faatt, wi faatt ~ faten] or a strong verb [with [ø(:)] or
> [9(:)], ik fööt, du föttst, he fött, wi föött ~ föten].)  In certain
> dialects, especially in the extreme northwest, you also get the noun
> _Faat_ [fQ:t] (probably spelled *_vaat_ ~ *_voat_ ~ _vaot_ in the
> Netherlands) 'grip', 'hold'.  A derivation is _faatkriegen_ ~ _Faat
> kriegen_ 'to get hold (of)', 'to seize', 'to catch'.

Dutch also has the noun _vast_ for 'grip', 'hold'.

I am now wondering if German _Fass_ [fas], Yiddish _fas_, Low Saxon (Low
German) _Fatt_ [fat] (probably spelled *_vat_ in the Netherlands) -
plural _Fatten_ ['fatn=] ~ _Fööt_ [fø:t] ~ [fœ:t] - and Dutch and
Afrikaans _vat_ 'vat', 'barrel' are related to the above.  A vat *holds*
(German _fassen_, Low Saxon _faten_) or *catches* its contents, or one
*holds*, *catches* or *keeps* something in vats.

This raises a question about the English cognate _vat_.  According to
various dictionaries, _vat_ is directly derived from Old English _fæt_
or _fœt_ 'vessel', 'cask'.  Then why is it not *_fat_ *[fæt] ~ *[fat]
but _vat_ [væt] ~ [vat], given that Old English /f-/ usually ended up as
/f-/ in Modern English?  _Vat_ is said to be attested only since the
12th century.  Could it not be that Old English _fæt_ ~ _fœt_
predictively developed into _fat_ but that this form only survived in
some Southern English dialects (being given as a southern alternative
form in the _Oxford Dictionary_) but that in most English dialects it
came to be replaced by the Dutch or Low Saxon loan _vat_, probably at
first as a *written* loan, pronounced as written with [v]?  Bear in mind
that already in the 12th century there was much trading between the
British Isles and the Low Countries (which includes what is nowadays
Northern Germany).  That was the time when Low Saxon served as the
_lingua franca_ of the Hanseatic Trading League.  What in most Low Saxon
dialects is pronounced as initial [f] (at least nowadays) used to be
written as _v-_ in those days (before Germanization), hence _vat_
[fat].  Also bear in mind that much of the trading of the Hanseatic
League would have been done and measured in _vat_ (pl. _vat(t)en_ ~
_vote(n)_) and that this would have been one of the more frequently
occurring words in business documents of that time (also _tonnen_ ~
_tunnen_ 'barrels', e.g., _Hemborger tunnen_ 'Hamburg barrels/tons' as
specific measure).  Note also _fat_ in Norwegian, defined as
_tønneformet beholder_ 'barrel-shaped container' in Dano-Norwegian
(Bokmål) and as _tønneforma kar_ 'barrel-shaped vat' in Nynorsk, also
Swedish _fat_, Icelandic _fat_ (< Danish?).

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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