LL-L "Language attitudes" 2002.11.28 (03) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 28.NOV.2002 (03) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
 L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic
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From: Helge Tietz <helgetietz at yahoo.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language attitudes" 2002.11.26 (01) [E]

I am reading this discussion about Dutch attitudes
towards the "Germans" with astonishment and amusement,
fact is that though my family had always German
passports we never had any unfriendly or
discriminating response from the Dutch people by
simply speaking our Low Saxon dialect from the
Rendsborg district, most Dutch people thought we spoke
some remote Flemish dialect and I never had the
feeling of ill-treatment. Living now in the
Netherlands I observe that still a lot of German
speakers come over and speak German without asking
whether the Dutch person speaks German and that annoys
a lot of Dutch people and me too, if I get ask in
German without the person asking me whether I speak it
I just don´t answer though, of course, I speak fluent
German, I do the same in Denmark, but imaging a Dutch
or Dane would go to Germany and speaks Dutch or Danish
to everyone, the Germans would simply think he/she is
insane. I have the feeling that this attitude is
growing towards English speakers as well because a lot
of Dutch people get tired of their chauvinism and
disrespect towards the Dutch language. Face it, this
attitude is partly necessary to keep the Dutch
language alive, otherwise there is a chance of Dutch
sharing the same fate as Irish, Breton, North-Frisian,
Sorbian,..... If this Dutch behaviour is regarded as
unfair, rude and chauvinst then we might just as well
stop the Lowlands web-site but I think we all agree
that we want to help the smaller Lowlandic languages
such as Low Saxon, Frisian, Appalachian and Scots to
survive for as long as it is possible and in compare
to English and German Dutch is a small language as
well.

I am worried about the fact that most of the African
nations have adopted the colonial languages as
official languages, though I understand the
practicality of this I am fearing that in one or two
generations the majority of Africans have a colonial
language as their mother tongue and the indigenous
languages are forgotten, what a loss of knowledge and
history that would be. A solution to this could be bi-
or trilinguality, something not impossible, Luxembourg
is indeed practising that and Letzebuergsch is still
the mother tongue of all Luxembourgers but their own
national state simply helped tremendously, in the same
way Faroese and Icelandic are well and alive though
they have even a smaller numbers of inhabitants. It
helps in Iceland and the Faroese that they are very
remote and not flooded by tourists, one still meets a
lot of monoglot Faroese or Icelandic speakers. I hope
the African people take the same pride in their native
languages as the Letzebuergers, the Icelanders and
Faroese do, only then their languages can survive.

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language attitudes

Thanks for sharing your own experiences and feelings (above), Helge.

I hardly think anyone would have any doubts about what appears to be
chauvinism (in part based on ignorance, in my opinion) on the part of
speakers of English (and also speakers of other the relatively powerful
beighboring languages French and German).

This notwithstanding, how do you explain the apparent contradiction between
Dutch anger about such chauvinism and the oft-voiced frustration among
Dutch-learning foreigners that Dutch speakers won't let them practise, tend
to switch to English, German or French, oftentimes basically ignoring the
other person's serious attempts at using Dutch?

I have heard from many Americans that they love visiting Amsterdam, "because
it's fun, and people are fairly friendly and always speak English."  This
news is spreading, and so many people arrive in Amsterdam and elsewhere in
the Netherlands with this passed-on knowledge or expectation.

Are these English speakers living in a dream world, or are Dutch people
complaining about a bed they made for themselves?

(Yes, I *am* playing the devil's advocate here, am endorsing neither
linguistic chauvinism nor linguistic inferiority complex behavior.)

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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