LL-L "Grammar" 2003.03.04 (07) [E/German]

[Lowlands-L]

Oops! Again with the correct title ... RFH
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From: Global Moose Translations <globalmoose at t-online.de>
Subject: LL-L "Grammar" 2003.03.04 (02) [E]

Ed wrote:

> >I strongly assume that the use of "me" as a subject has to do with Norman
> >influences in Britain. The French would never answer "Who's there" with
> >"Je!", after all, it's always "moi" (even Miss Piggy knows that). Also,
"ma
> >femme et je" for "my wife and me" is an absolute no-no.
>
> I'm still waiting for other, more learned persons to weigh in on
> this.

Thanks a lot, Ed. I am as "learned" as they come, but I also have a sense of
humour. Those things are NOT mutually exclusive, as proven by many who
frequent this list. And I quite enjoy playing the devil's advocate - even if
it sometimes brings out the worst in people.

Gabriele Kahn

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From: Gary Taylor <gary_taylor_98 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Grammar

Hi Ed and everyone else

I've just had a quick look through an Old and Middle
English reader and couldn't find any examples of 'me'
being used in the subject position when in combination
with another pronoun. Also from Sandy's examples from
Shakespeare there didn't seem to be any occurances.

Maybe it's a modern development in Britain, which has
occured since the language on your side of the pond
had already developed a norm - possibly via Scots from
Gaelic (? maybe someone could give examples from
earlier Scots texts ?) If it has thus developed then
it's been fairly well established throughout the land,
including the London area, for a long time. 'My wife
and I' sounds affected to me. I think I said before
that my mother used to correct me, but "me 'n' me
sister" still use this form. I should imagine that in
a couple of generations it could well be an accepted
form even in editorial circles.

(And now an attempt in German so as not to exclude
others - sorry in advance for mistakes, and sorry that
it's not another Lowland language, but it's the only
other language that I'm halfway decent at!)

Ich habe gerade durch ein Lesebuch für Alt- und
Mittelenglische Literatur geblättert und könnte keinen
Beispiele von 'me' als Subjekt finden.

Vielleicht ist sie eine moderne Entwicklung in
Großbritannien, die vorgekommen ist, nachdem eine
amerikanische Norm gefestigt wurde - vielleicht unter
schottischem Einfluss. Wenn ja dann ist diese Form
ziemlich gut im ganzen Land und sogar seit lange Zeit
gefestigt worden. 'My wife and I' klingt für mich
affektiert. Meine Mutter hatte mich früher korrigiert
aber 'mich' und meine Schwester verwenden 'me' immer
noch. Ich könnte mir vorstelle, dass in einen paar
Generationen diese Form auch in Lektoratskreisen
akzeptiert wird.

Gary

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