LL-L "Etymology" 2005.11.25 (01) [E]

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Fri Nov 25 21:00:13 UTC 2005 

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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
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L O W L A N D S - L * 25 November 2005 * Volume 01
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From: "jonny" <jonny.meibohm at arcor.de>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2005.11.22 (01) [E/LS/German]

Dear assembly,

thanks to all of you for your answers.

Sandy:
> In Scots we have "stirk" meaning a bullock or a heifer - usually a
> bullock. A heifer would be a "stot", if I'm understanding these farmyard
> terms correctly.
Obviously our dialect of LS is closer to female meaning.

Ben:
> For Jonny, though no doubt at all he knows this too, there is the English
>
> 'stirk' = yearling ox or cow. Anglo Saxon 'stirc' = calf.
No, dear Ben, I didn't. Just too simple-minded for that. But I had made
another attempt in the same topic long times ago and didn't get any answer.

Ron:
> Folks, Heiko was told that not the wren but the kinglet (NL goudhaantje)
> is the smallest bird.  Its the genus _Regulus_.
Who, the hell, could have done that ;-)??? They're even the smallest
songbirds in the whole world.
But- no idea about their LS-names.

Ron again:
> Low Saxon _kweyne_ 'young cow' (I think).  Cat, cow, monarch ... What's
> the difference?
He- hesst _Queene_  weller ne ennig leest, du Drieber ;-)! But- three cheers
for the litle difference!

Jo:
> In the former mails I didn't recognize stärke, stork at all, but a
> 'stierke'
> is common Flemish for a yearling ox. Maybe the -k(e) is an diminutival
> affix
Interesting- an ox again. Not female, but neither male, at all!

> A 'var' or 'varing' is a 'young bull' and a 'vaars' is a 'yearling cow'.
> Bestaan die in het Afrikaans?
'Vaars' we have as 'Färse', again female without any gender doubts like with
an ox ;-)!

Allerbest Greutens and friendly regards

Johannes "Jonny" Meibohm

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From: "heather rendall" <HeatherRendall at compuserve.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2005.11.23 (03) [A/E]

Message text written by INTERNET:lowlands-l at LOWLANDS-L.NET
>So obviously there was an area that people referred to as "Cleveland"
and probably still is,<

There is/was a type of horse known as Cleveland bays - farmhorses I think
like Shires & Suffolk Punches....... so it must have been a known area
before the reorganisation.

Heather

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From: "Jacqueline Bungenberg de Jong" <Dutchmatters at comcast.net>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2005.11.23 (03) [A/E]

Dear Lowlanders, Let's talk turkey!
 Today is Thanksgiving. In commemoration of that first meal of thanksgiving
in 1621, which the Pilgrims shared with representatives of the local Indian
tribes, Lowlanders scattered about the United States will don bib and tucker
and sidle up to the groaning board to partake of the traditional roast
turkey, a Babylonian mix-up of a bird.   What happened to the
“huexolotlin”,
who in his manifestation of the trickster-god Tezcatlipoca was an important
part of the Aztec religion, should not happen to a dog. On his downward
slide from the Pantheon to the roasting pan, he would not only lose his
sacred status, but his name as well.

Upon their arrival in the Americas Columbus and his crew, who thought they
had discovered the “other” way to the Indies, were undoubtedly offered an
indigenous bird to eat. Being too drunk to pronounce “huexolotlin” they
decided to call it “pavo” their name for peacock. But as they liked it
very
much, they decided to take a couple of them home (there might not have been
enough gold to please the King, but at least they could show him the bird).
At that time the large fowl eaten at the parties of the European glitterati
was an African Guinea Hen, which they obtained first from Portuguese traders
and later from English traders who traded with the Portuguese. The English
traders were called “Turkey traders” because they did a lot of
business with
people from the Eastern end of the Mediterranean and therefore their birds
were called “Turkey birds”. The Turks in the mean time didn’t know
these
birds at all, but had bought similar birds from Portuguese traders in Goa.
So they said these birds came from India. When the bigger and better
American birds appeared on the European markets, people did not bother to
give them a new and appropriate name and the English also called these birds
Turkeys. Other languages incorporated them as Indian Birds, or birds from
“Calcutta”. But in India itself they did not know the bird.
Even the biologists gave the bird a scientific name which makes no sense:
Meleagris gallopavo would point at a bird that is part junglefowl, part hen
and part peacock. The original wild turkeys of Middle America had migrated
farther North and could be found all over America.  When in 1620 the
Pilgrims landed in Plymouth they were utterly amazed that the Wampanoags
showed them how hunt ……..  Turkey!!!!!.  In the mean time of course
the wild
turkeys have been hunted to near extinction and are now being reintroduced.
What arrives on our plates tonight is an artifact of modern animal
husbandry. (Tasty I might say, but fake).
Here is a list with several names collected from other turkey articles on
the web:
Mexico and South America
Aztec                huexolotlin
1st Nation languages
Mohawk         sonhatsi
Cherokee        kalagona
Europe, Africa and Asia Minor
Spanish        pavo, gallina de las Indias, gall dindi
Portuguese        peru (refers to the country)
French      cocq d’inde, dindon
Italian        tachino, “the bird”
Greek                gallopoula
Turkish        “bird from India”
Hebrew        Tarnegol hodu, “Indian chicken
Arabic         “Etiopian bird”
Farsi                buchalamun, “chameleon”
German        Truthahn, Putter ( where is that from?)
Dutch         kalkoen (Name derived from Calcutta)
Danish         kalkun
Swedish        kalkon
English        turkey
Scottish    cearc frangais
Welsh                twrki
Asia
Japan              shichimencho, “sevenfaced bird”
Korea                chilmyeonjo,    “sevenfaced bird”
Chinese         huoji, “fire chicken” (I do not know which Chinese
language)

Most of the information here comes from:
http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mturkey.html,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkey and
http://nationalzoo.si.edu/Animals/Birds/whataname.cfm
 As you can see there are many languages missing. Add your own if you want
to. My turkey is ready  to come out of the oven, so it is dinnertime. Have a
good one. Jacqueline
Let there be thanks, light, love and peace,
But please, dear Lord, no calories.

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Hi, Jacqueline!  Thanks for talking Turkey!

> German        Truthahn, Putter ( where is that from?)

Actually, it's _Puter_ for the male and _Pute_ for the female, both with
long [u] as in "cool."  _Truthahn_ (with the same [u]) has the feminine
equivalent _Truthenne_.

I believe that both of them are of onomatopoetic origin.

In Low Saxon there are many versions, among others ...

kalkuun <Kalkuun>, <Kalkuhn>
kuun <Kuun>, <Kuhn>
kuunhaan <Kuunhahn>, <Kuhnhahn> [masc.]
kuunhen <Kuunhenn>, <Kuhnhenn> [fem.]
kalkuut <Kalkuut>, <Kalkuht>
kalkuutschen-haan <Kalktuutschenhahn> [masc.]
kalkuutschen-hen <Kalktuutschenhenn> [fem.]

Doesn't this group of words come from the name of a city: Calicut (or
Calcutta), thus also with an Indian link?

Nowadays also ...
puter <Puter> [masc.]
puut ~ Pute <Puut> ~ <Pute> [fem.]

Scots:
bubbly-jock
pulley, pollie, pillie (< French _poulet_?)

Yiddish:
אינדיק indik ("little Indian")

Hindi:
पेरू perū, पीरू pīrū < Portuguese _Peru_)

Turkish:
hindi ("Indian" < *_hindi kuÅŸ_ "Indian bird"?)

I hope your Thanksgiving party and everyone else's turned out nice.  Mine
sure was, the best one so far.  Among the guest were a New Englander and
an "Old Englander" (from Boston and Salisbury respectively).

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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