LL-L "Language varieties" 2009.04.12 (01) [E]

[Lowlands-L List]

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L O W L A N D S - L - 12 April 2009 - Volume 01
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From: Andy Eagle <andy at scots-online.org>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2009.04.01 (01) [E]

John wrote:

I think the main point is - what do the people who speak it think it is?


I think it is probably safe to say that the majority of Scots speakers will
consider themselves speakers of a dialect of English.

As you say, there are many who talk about the Scots language but their
actions seems to indicate what they really mean is Scottish dialects (of
English). Standard English being the roof variety under which the Scottish
dialects are to found. In that scheme of things dialects have their place
and should stay there. Exactly the kind of marginalisation that leads to
dialect decay in the first place. Decay you may say. "Language has always
evolved and changed". Yes, but replacing Scots dialects with standard
English is something different. More akin to language death. Though I
suspect that some are of the belief that if standard English is  spoken with
a Scottish accent and the Scots word of the day is used then they consider
it to be a variety of the Scots language. So now with my best Highland
accent, and my Gaelic word of the day, I am proud to announce that I am a
glay vah Gaelic speaker. Now don't come at me about spelling glay vah wrong.
This Gaelic thing is a developing language there's no 'standard spelling',
I'm going for the authentic voice.

 Shetland Fudge Advert:


 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_1lCZaPWHM


 This one shows how the word 'Shaetlan' is pronounced.


I just heard a little Scots speaking girl saying 'Shetland' in a Shetland
accent. What does that <ae> in 'Shaetlan' represent that I can't hear to be
adequately represented by <e>. Simplification of <nd> to /d/ is fairly
common in many varieties of Scots.

 Lowrie sells his oo:


That was a gem.

 If you regard


your speech as a dialect, you don't need a policy, because dialect is almost

by definition just whatever you happen to speak.

Some countries have dialect policies. For example Bavaria
http://www.isb.bayern.de/isb/download.aspx?DownloadFileID=75639926d839284f848ae3084c6d5bd4(In
German) I haven't read the whole thing but apparently: "Ihr Ziel ist
es,
den bayerischen Mundarten den ihnen gebührenden Stellenwert einzuräumen und
die Verbundenheit der Schülerinnen und Schüler mit ihrer bayerischen Heimat
zu stärken gemäß Artikel 131 der Bayerischen Verfassung." which translates
roughly as "The aim is to give the Bavarian dialects their due weight and to
strengthen the pupils' bond with their Bavarian homeland according to
article 131 of the Bavarian constitution."

I'm not sure if there's a policy for Swiss German dialects but Wikipedia
tells us "The reason "Swiss German" dialects constitute a special group is
their almost unrestricted use as a spoken language in practically all
situations of daily life, whereas the use of the Alemannic dialects in the
other countries is restricted or even endangered.

The dialects of Swiss German must not be confused with Swiss Standard
German, the variety of Standard German used in Switzerland."

Roger wrote:

 The point is, I think, that many people believe that, because there are


regional variants, it is impossible that a standard form emerges. For

proving it to be wrong one just has to look at the history of French and

English.


A 'standard' form need not be as prescriptive as those of English or French.
As far as Scots goes a regularised spelling would suffice. Where particular
pronunciations cannot be predicted from the graphemic representations of the
underlying phonemes variants can be accepted.  People should follow their
native grammar. The grammatical differences between Scots dialects are not
marked enough to hinder comprehension. The oft made claim that Scots
speakers from different places speak markedly different is bogus. The
problem, if there is one at all, is unfamiliarity not unintelligibility.
When I first heard Shetland I had difficulty. I am now much more familiar
with it and only Norn words prove a problem. But even then context makes
fairly accurate guessing possible.

Andy

•

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