<span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">L O W L A N D S - L - 07 March 2007 - Volume 02</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
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<span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">From: </span><span id="_user_arthurobin2002@yahoo.com" style="color: rgb(121, 6, 25); font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Arthur Jones <<a href="mailto:arthurobin2002@yahoo.com">
arthurobin2002@yahoo.com</a>></span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.03.07 (01) [A/D/E]</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.03.07 (02) [D/E/Go]</div><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;" class="q"> <div><br>
Heather Rendall wrote:<br><br><From: <span style="color: rgb(0, 104, 28);">"<a href="mailto:heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk
</a>"</span><span style="font-weight: normal;"> <<a href="mailto:heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk</a></span><br><Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica"
2007.03.05 (01) [E]<br></div> <div>Arthur Jones writes:</div> <div>"Unfortunately, samey-thingy with our Heather's story about clock/bell. Sorry, Heather. Would that you were right. "</div> <div>Perhaps
you might like to check in the OED and Partridges Origins and also
Eggers Sprachgeschichte on early loan words from Irish into German.</div> <div>I don't sit here and make them up!</div> <div>Heather<br><br></div></span> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Hi
Heather, and it was not aimed at the Celtic to Germanic transfer! The
era was full of trade-offs flying in both directions. See, e.g., Peter
H. Green, Language and Culture in Ancient Germanic Civilizations,
separate chapters discussing mutual loans from and into Celtic,
Germanic, Slavice, Romance. </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">I
was referring solely to the assumed recent development of timekeeping
equipment. Goes back a lot further than many believe, as did the
etymologies involved. Yes, the Celts had words for cloak, bell, etc.,
---as their other Indo-European cousins had words derived from common
sources or roots--- but that does not necessarily lead us to the
conclusion that those words (klokke, Glocke, clock, etc.) were spread
by Irish priests of the 8th or 9th centuries (many of whom were Welsh,
Scots, and Breton). And, despite the fact that Bishop Wulfila, in his
translation of the Bible from Greek to Gothic, used only "skilla" for a
bell (cf. NHD "schellen"), several place names in Eastern Romania and
the Crimea suggest that bells (or ringing clocks?) had a "clok" element
in that language long before Celts were an important superstrate
influence on their early Germanic. </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Your
tale of development, very interesting though it is, carries on the
baggage of too many assumptions without presenting further evidence for
each step of the journey. </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">I have no doubt
that you do your research thoroughly and well. You have indeed provided
many insights and much wisdom to the Lowlands-L group, and command much
respect among all of us. It would be even more helpful, however, if you
were to give us the occasional URL or other reference site to accompany
your contributions.</div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Gee, I hope it's clear this time, Heather! Absolutely no offense intended, and apologies are in order if I have offended you.
</div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div> <div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Arthur<br><font color="#ff0000">ARTHUR A. JONES</font><br><br>----------<br><br>From: <span id="_user_obiterdictum@mail.ru" style="color: rgb(0, 104, 28);">
Obiter Dictum <<a href="mailto:obiterdictum@mail.ru">obiterdictum@mail.ru</a>></span><span style="font-weight: normal;" class="lg"></span> <br>Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.03.07 (01) [A/D/E]<br><br></div>
<span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Elsie het geskryf:</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">> - Die kwajongens het skotvry uit die skoolhoof se kantoor gestap nadat hy
</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">> hulle oor die gevare van vrugtestelery gewaarsku het.</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
> - Toe is die saak van die rol geskrap en die hoenderdief skotvry daar weg!</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">> -Moenie dink jy is skotvry nie; m?re kan jy my help gras sny!
</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Dankie Elsie, ek store altyd jou en Mark se voorbeelde. :-)</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Мarcel het geskryf:</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
> "According to ATF, the Scots (the inhabitants of Scotland) are the same as</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">> the Scythians; as he explains to us, the argument that confirms this is that
</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">> the Scythians bred skot (`cattle' in Russian) [NC 2:252].</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
></span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">> A A Zaliznyak, 'Linguistics according to A. T. Fomenko',</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
> Uspekhi Mat. Nauk 55:2 162-188, 2000"</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">></span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
> I do wish mr Fomenko a lot of *Uspekhi*.</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Marcel... skot (cattle' in Russian). Right. To the point. In terms of manure management. Bullshit!.
</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">I do wish Fomenko the Skatologist lots of the same :-)</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Groete,</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Vlad Lee.</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
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