<span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">L O W L A N D S - L - 28 April 2007 - Volume 09</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">=========================================================================</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">From: </span><span id="_user_roger.thijs@euro-support.be" style="color: rgb(121, 6, 25); font-family: arial,sans-serif;">"Roger Thijs, Euro-Support, Inc." <<a href="mailto:roger.thijs@euro-support.be">
roger.thijs@euro-support.be</a>></span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Subject: LL-L "Grammar" 2007.04.29 (01) [D/E]</span><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><em style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><font size="2"><span class="q">From: Frank <
<a href="mailto:frank.verhoft@skynet.be" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">frank.verhoft@skynet.be</a>><br>Subject: Grammar<br></span>....;<span class="q"><br>Theo
replied:<br><<<Dativus.<<<<br>Ik ben (nog) niet geheel
overtuigd, Theo :-). <br>Ik vind het heel bizar dat 'den' slechts voorkomt in
Hollandse namen als Den<br>Haag en Den Bosh (etc.), exact volgens het Brabantse
patroon. Op enkele<br>steenworpen van Den Haag ligt _De_ Lierde, _De_ Rotte etc.
Waarom is er daar <br>dan geen 'dativus'?<br>Beste groetjes,<br>Frank
Verhoft</span></font></em>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">I'm wundering whether "den" is not rather euphonical originally,
transformed later into a case by grammaticians.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">As old device for Flanders, I leaned in primary school
"Vlaanderen <strong>de</strong> Leeuw".</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">The "lion" is mostly referred to as "Robert of Béthune", the later Count of
Flanders.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">A magazine of the Flemish group in France "Cercle Michel De Swaen" is
entitled:</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">"La Flandre <strong>au</strong> Lion - Vlaanderen <strong>den</strong>
Leeuw"</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">So they clearly use a dative contextually.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Actually the device is best known as coming from the book "De Leeuw van
Vlaanderen" by Hendrik Conscience, romantizing a battle between Flanders and
some counties in the North of France with the King of France in 1302.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">"... klom het geroep: Vlaenderen <strong>den</strong> Leeuw! Wat walsch is
valsch is!", p. 345 in the 2002 reedition of the first print of
<strong>1838</strong> in original "Commission" orthography.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Could be a dative.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Historically though in the <strong>contemporary</strong> chronicle by van
Veltem (Spiegel Historiael), the "lion of the battle" was in the coat of arms of
de Renesse (from Zeeland, cf <a href="http://www.renesseaanzee.nl/" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">http://www.renesseaanzee.nl/</a>):</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">XXV 31ff Van Brabant sprac doe her Godevard:</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Die ridder, die draecht den <strong>lupart</strong></div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">dats die gene, dat secgic die,</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">daer ic mi meest af ontsie.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Hets mijn her Jan van Rinesse.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">In die wereldt en esser niet sesse</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">om gaens wijt ende breet</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">die bet van orloghe weet.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">(Then Godfried of Brabant said: I'm most afraid of the knight with the lion
in his coat of arms. It's Sir Jan of Renesse. In the whole world one cannot find
six people, who know more than him on warring.)</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">(Brabant and Hainaut, as well as the Flemish town of Ghent, were
fighting at the French side)</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">XXVI 50ff </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Een ridder daer te desen stride</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">mijn here Jan van Renesse</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">las den sinen oec een lesse:</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">dat si hem niet lieten dorbreken.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">ende haer biechte souden spreken.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">'Ende sijt nu niet vervart</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">bodelt al man ende pard</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">'Vlaendren <strong>ende </strong>leu!', es onse gecri</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Since the nobility of King of France was clearly humiliated, the battle of
1302 was referred to in songs all over Europe. Here is one from England:</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Alas thou seli Fraunce! for the may thunche shome</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">That ane fewe fullaris maketh ou so tome:</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Sixti thousent on a day hue maden foot lome,</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"><font size="2"><font size="3">With eorl ant [with]
knyht.</font><br><br></font>However it was a Pyrrhic Victory on that July 11th
of1302. In 1305 Flanders had to sign the desastrous treaty of Athis-sur-Orge,
killing the Flemish dream for independency.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Flanders had been assigned to France in 843 (Treaty of Verdun).
It acquired though some territory at the German side of the river Schelde (The
land of Aalst, and the "Vier Ambachten", the latter originally islands in the
river). In 1526 (Treaty of Madrid) Flanders got rid of its dependency from the
French crown and became part of Habsburgian Germany.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">In the romantic 19th century the battle of 1302 was glorified in several
publications, including one in Belgian Dutch of the time by Hendrik Conscience.
It was a best-seller and many elements from that book were used in the Flemish
language battle (for getting Dutch recognized as official language in Belgium).
July 11th became an official holiday in Flanders.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Those romantic symbols are nowadays used in Northern France by people
trying to define a regional identity.</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Flanders replaced its old arms (red blue yellow) by a black lion on
gold arounf the end of the 12th century. It may also have been present in some
form on the battlefield in 1302. (The count of Flanders, Gwij of Dampierre,
nor his son Robert of Bethune though, participated at the battle).</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;"> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Regards,</div>
<div style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">Roger</div><br style="font-family: arial,sans-serif;">