<div style="text-align: center; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">=========================================================================<br>L O W L A N D S - L - 16 April 2008 - Volume 04<br style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">
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=========================================================================<br></div><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From: </span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="HcCDpe"><span class="EP8xU" style="color: rgb(0, 104, 28);"><a href="mailto:heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk">heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk</a></span> <span class="lDACoc"><<a href="mailto:heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk">heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk</a>></span></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Subject: </span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="HcCDpe">LL-L "Phonology" 2008.04.16 (02) [E]<br></span><p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
From <a href="mailto:heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk" target="_blank">heatherrendall@tiscali.co.uk</a></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Paul wrote: I've certainly heard it, but always put it down to simple grammatical/lexical error.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">I agree with Paul! As the large majority of British English speakers
have not had their language consistently or clearly or
fundamentally explained to them i.e. they have not been taught to
examine it at school / college, their understanding and use is based
primarily on what they have heard, with a smattering of old grammar
chestnuts which still seem to be half taught/ absorbed and half
understood</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">i.e. you and I - there seems to be an overwhelming feeling
throughout the UK media that 'you and me' is wrong 100% of the time and
that at all times ' you and I' should be used. this leads to EVEN RADIO
4's Today programme presenters saying " between you and I" "for you
and I" GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Even more of a GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR is the inability to use
'less/fewer' correctly. 'Fewer' appears to be on the way out, as more
and more journalists / media presenters are happy to use 'less' for
both singular and plural. So instead of 'Less cake, fewer slices' they
say 'less cake, less slices'.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Some people can be terribly sensitive about their own language and
are often unjustifiably critical about their own standards. They feel
acutely that they MUST produce "grammatically correct English" if they
are not to be judged negatively. Unfortunately this can often lead them
into misapplying half understood grammar in the belief that using it
adds cachet and correctness to their language - in fact quite the
reverse! The paramount example here is 'whom', which some people add -
at random it sometimes seems - to their speech and writing - usually
quite in the wrong place! "I wrote to the man, whom replied to me
immediately" ??????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">I have fought the school of thought for the last 40 years that says
no-one speaks their mother tongue incorrectly: they all speak their own
language perfectly. This has led to teachers not daring to either
correct incorrect grammar or explain why it is incorrect and what
should be said.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Bought/brought are common examples of errors that when explained -
even to adults - gets the reply: "Well I never! BRing / BRought Buy /
Bought it's quite simple when it's explained like that!" and from
then on they get it right!</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Here endeth the sermon! :-)</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">love</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Heather</p><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">----------</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<font style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" size="2"><span style="font-size: 11pt;">From: R. F. Hahn <<a href="mailto:sassisch@yahoo.com" target="_blank">sassisch@yahoo.com</a>> <br>
Subject: Language learning<br><br>Hi, Heather!<br><br>GRRRRRRR ... indeed! Never mind giving "sermons"! It's good for the "soul." Here comes the baritone part of the chorus.<br><br>Your observations tally with mine, also what you said about "it's quite simple when it's explained like that!" I hear this phrase a lot.<br>
<br>I suspect that decades, even centuries, of atrocious language teaching methods have been culturally internalized. People have an idea of language learning as involving a vast, amorphous mass of unconnected pieces of information and rules. It tends to make them shy away from anything like that, and it gets even worse when "foreign" is involved, "weird" sounds, scripts, etc. Although teaching methods have been vastly improved in many quarters, most people are not over the fears of the past. It did not help that in the 1960s and 1970s educators decided to "revolutionize" teaching by throwing out anything systematic and theoretical ("rote learning") and emphasizing "fun" to a degree that classes were turned into sideshow entertainment. What most people have not caught on to in the meantime is that learning of systems and enjoyment are not incompatible with each other, that learning of <b>systems</b> is so much more efficient than amassing snippets of information in a haphazard fashion. Alas, "grammar" is still a bit of a dirty word.<br>
<br>And there is the factor of fear and insufficient confidence conflicting with a need for status and economic betterment. Oftentimes the very self-conscious end up overcompensating or simply winging it the best they can, often faking the sound of good education. Sometimes I can see how they suffer, and my heart goes out to them. Things could be so much less stressful if only ...<br>
<br>I see a very similar situation in computer skills learning, and especially in anything approaching computer programming (which involves a type of language proficiency also). Confident and experienced people try to get the large picture first, acquire key rules and then have a relatively easy time figuring out the system and thus the details. Timid people try to learn details first, and most of them drown in the flood of them, perhaps never to get to a point at which they can see the large picture.<br>
<br>So that was my sermon.<br><br>Regards,<br>Reinhard/Ron</span></font><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">